Us Taxes/ Thai Spouse

[hellohello]

A question for Americans w/ Thai spouses.

How do you handle your US income taxes when your married to non American Citizen?

I get this mesg. “The social security number(SSN) or individual taxpayer identification number(ITIN) must be in a valid range and all digits must be numeric”

My spouse dose not have a number or want one at this time… heck we haven’t even set foot on US soil. yes---we are legally married.

Signed confused HH

[lopburi3]

In that case you are filing as single (or whatever they call it).

Many of use with a Thai wife who do not work obtain an ITIN number and elect (in writing) to be jointly taxed in order to file as married and take advantage of the exemptions.

If she changes her mind you fill out the ITIN form/sign a statement and file with your tax return.

[thaihome]

Been filing joint returns with my wife for almost 7 years now. Got the ITIN in 2000. Back then you applied seperatly and had to have it before filing.

TH

[hellohello]

How long did it take to get this ITIN?

Looks like I'll file single... but Im not. hence my confusion. THANKS ALOT YOU GUYS!

[lopburi3]

The laws have changed so now you apply at the same time you submit your tax forms so if she is willing, and signs that she agrees to be taxed on another sheet of paper, you could do. The form is down loadable I am quite sure - think I found with a quick Google a few weeks ago. Full instructions are on the form.

[richard10365]

I live off my U.S. Army pension. I am married with one son. My wife has her ITIN number and for this tax filing season, I applied for my son's ITIN number. My pension is equal to about 50,000 Thai baht a month, therefore, the IRS doesn't consider it a lot of money.

With that said, after claiming my wife and son as dependents, I get back all the taxes I paid for the 2006 tax season.

If you do pay US federal taxes, it is worth it to do all the paperwork to get the ITIN number.

Edited March 25, 2007 by richard10365

[lanny]

If you are married, you cannot file as SINGLE -- you either file maried joint, married separate, or (if you have dependent children) head of household. Single is for people who are not married.

You can get the necessary forms on the IRS web site: www.irs.gov

Your wife signs the application for an ITIN and you send that, with the return, to IRS in Philadelphia (not Dallas or Austin as you would otherwise.) This adds a week or two to the time it takes IRS to process your return.

If you want to claim your son as a dependent, you must get him a social security number; ITINs are for qualified persons who are not otherwise eligible for a SSN. To claim your son as a dependent, he must be either a US citizen or a resident of the US, Canada, or Mexico. If he is Thai, and not a US citizen, you cannot claim an exemption on your return. You should go to the US Embassy, get your son a US passport, and apply for a Social Security Number for him. Then, you can claim him.

But, before you get your wife an ITIN, you should be sure that filing jointly is your best option. Once you make the election for her to be taxed as a US resident, you cannot switch back and forth each year. You can revoke the election once but, after that, if you want to elect again, you must apply to IRS for permission (also for permission to revoke again.)

If your wife has income of her own, or is she has prospects of family money or property, electing to include her can be costly over time. In addition, leaving her status as non-resident alien give you some flexibility in arranging your financial affairs that are not available to joint filers.

[hellohello]

Ok- So we need the number. i've got the forms. http://www.irs.gov/pub/irs-pdf/fw7.pdf

What's the advantage of the status as a non-resident alien?

thanks....

[richard10365]

Ok- So we need the number. i've got the forms. http://www.irs.gov/pub/irs-pdf/fw7.pdf

What's the advantage of the status as a non-resident alien?

thanks....

Sometimes it depends on the state you come from. As a California non-resident, none of my U.S. Army pension is taxable, therefore, my state contributions are returned to me at the end of the year.

[Gary A]

Sorry guys but it wasn't as easy as it sounded, at least for me it wasn't. I still use a US CPA for my financial affairs. To file a joint return with a foreign wife, she needs a Taxpayer Identification Number (TIN). We filled out that form and sent it to the CPA. NOT acceptable! I had to go to the US Embassy in Bangkok to have the marriage certified and other legalities. It really wasn't too bad because the Embassy people pretty much took me by the hand and led me through the hoops.

[PeaceBlondie]

Lanny is right, of course. If you are married, you cannot file as single (and it's highly unlikely that you could file as head of household, but that's another thousand words to explain). So, you choose between:

Married Filing Jointly

Married Filing Separate

The other details regarding alien spouses are beyond my expertise; I think Lanny's right, as always.

[TerryLH]

"Sometimes it depends on the state you come from. As a California non-resident, none of my U.S. Army pension is taxable, therefore, my state contributions are returned to me at the end of the year."

Why are you even having anything deducted?

As long as you live outside CA you don't have to file there. If you live out of the country, you don't have to file state tax forms in any state.

[richard10365]

There are situations where Nonresidents do have to pay California state taxes. The California tax laws are complicated. You should read up on it if you have been ignoring your California state tax obligations. You might be setting yourself up for failure. According to the California Franchise Tax Board (FTB)

You are required to file a Nonresident or Part-Year Resident Income Tax Return (Long of Short Form 540NR) with California if you have income from California sources, such as, rental income, income from the sale of property, or partnership income in 2006 and you are:

Single with a total income from all sources of $13,713 or more

Married with joint income from all sources of $27,426 or more.

For more information on California taxes check out http://www.ftb.ca.gov/

As far as my deductions go, I'm really not sure how to stop deductions to state taxes. My income shows up on my 1099R. Since $10 are deducted each month, I file a state tax form to get all that money back.

[thaihome]

... If you live out of the country, you don't have to file state tax forms in any state.

This can be problematic if you maintain any connection such a driver’s license or bank account in a state that has income tax. Even states less aggressive than Calif. can go after you if you renew a drivers licenses or receive interest from a bank account. Best thing is to use one of the mail forwarding outfits in Florida or Texas where there is no state income tax or, if you are able to, cut all ties to the US.

[TerryLH]

I forgot to mention I was talking about a local government pension. The other sources don't apply to me, so I have no knowledge of them.

CA sent me a letter two years running asking why I had income but hadn't filed. The first year they got a very polite reply. The second year, polite, but not as polite as the year before. That was about 10 years ago and I haven't heard anything else from them.

On my fed tax forms I claim Thailand as my home of record.

Terry

[hellohello]

“If you are able to, cut all ties to the US.”

Can you explain this better?

Also, looks like I will file for the 1st year with a foreign address giving up my res. in California too, got any good tips that a first timer should know?

Also is it possible/recommended to use Turbo Tax?

[richard10365]

I think filing electronically would be a good idea.

If your living off a pension, open a savings account with Bangkok Bank and have your pension sent to Bangkok Bank, NY. It will then be automatically deposited in your account in Thailand.

If your married, get your wife an Internation Taxpayer Identification Number (ITIN) from the IRS. If you and your Thai wife have a child here in Thailand, you can get him or her an ITIN as well. The form for an ITIN is a W7. When you apply for an ITIN you must send in your tax return with it. The following year after that you can file electronically with your wife's or children's ITIN.

File your taxes by April 15th to avoid late fees.

Depending on your situation, you may or may not be required to file taxes. There are many factors to consider such as when you left (before or after the 2006 tax Year) and sources of income (taxes, dividends, interest from banks and others). The best thing to do is research it yourself on the irs website and the tax website for the state you came from.

Pretending it doesn't exist or thinking you don't have an tax obligation will not make your filing requirements go away if you do indeed have to file a tax return.

If your not sure, email the state where you come from and ask.

Edited March 31, 2007 by richard10365