Exit Poll Results Show PPP Wins

[blaze]

Looking right now whoever gets into power will be overseeing an utterly and maybe irreconcialably divided people and making sure their half (or 40% of 70%) gets what they want and the others lose out. A recipe for chaos in all likelihood. Any chance now for a voice of reason? When a country is as polarised as Thailand now is (and has been for a couple of years) there is a need for great stateman or two to put differences aside and try to bring harmony. If the respected representatives of the people on both sides continue to throw allegations and accusations against each other what chance is there of those that support them calming down. One wonders if maybe there is someone on each side who can just for one minute rise above the mud slinging and say hey we have to work this out together and bash their own side into line, not to mention actually set an example fo the ordinary parson. I have to say although not a fan of his I would personally have a lot of admiration for Mr. Thaksin if he were to actually call on the PPP to form a true government of national unity with a set agenda and not one full of the politcal whore parties and I would also think maybe old Chuan Leekpai should be thinking along these lines too. The alternatives do not look nice but in all reality that is what we will probably end up with.

I agree hammered- but doubt that anyone could pull the divergent sides together. The problem as I see it is that two basic ingredients essential to the functioning of democracy are sadly missing here: the first is a recognition that those who didn't vote for the winning side gladly acknowledge that the genius of the system lies not in their getting their way, but in the majority getting its way- bounded of course by the limits established in the constitution. That in itself should guarantee that while varying visions on what's best for the nation continue to exist, all work together to support the government- or at the very least- not to seek to scuttle it at first opportunity.

The second precondition that is lacking is trust in the 'checks and balances'- in the various courts, the EC, the senate, even the police.

How we got to this point can be argued forever- some will say there was trust till the TRT years- others will say that there never has been an independent system of checks in this country- nor will there ever be one since independent principles fly in the face of the paternalistic nature of the society at every level.

Until the people are willing to accept a slow and painful period of political maturing- which will include corruption at the top, obsequious judges who know on which side their bread is buttered, crony politics- and understand that all of those people work for the citizenry- and not the other way around; until they demand transparency in all proceecdings relating to government- until they demand that local mps hold the party to its promises- then the situation will continue I fear-

Until this commitment to make the country a democracy- exists at the street level- then I hold out no hope.

But for that to happen the public must come to believe that the country belongs to them: not to the military, not to the elected government- not to past heros- but to all- and most importantly, equally to all- the citizens of the nation

The most dangerous thing about this coup, (I'm repeating myself, I know) is that it was bloodless- it was relatively harmless- there will be, as you suggest Hammered, a period now of incompetence, stalemate, infighting, disharmony and mutual distrust unseen even in the heyday of the PAD/TRT.

And here's a scary thought: who stands to gain the most from such a mess? - as always, it is those who would pull the society totally apart- in this case, the southern insurrectionists. (Nobody else really wants to see the country torn apart, do they?).

And in the mind of much of the Bangkok public, another coup will be seen- once again- as 'the lesser of two evils'.

[Abrak]

Looking right now whoever gets into power will be overseeing an utterly and maybe irreconcialably divided people and making sure their half (or 40% of 70%) gets what they want and the others lose out. A recipe for chaos in all likelihood. Any chance now for a voice of reason? When a country is as polarised as Thailand now is (and has been for a couple of years) there is a need for great stateman or two to put differences aside and try to bring harmony. If the respected representatives of the people on both sides continue to throw allegations and accusations against each other what chance is there of those that support them calming down. One wonders if maybe there is someone on each side who can just for one minute rise above the mud slinging and say hey we have to work this out together and bash their own side into line, not to mention actually set an example fo the ordinary parson. I have to say although not a fan of his I would personally have a lot of admiration for Mr. Thaksin if he were to actually call on the PPP to form a true government of national unity with a set agenda and not one full of the politcal whore parties and I would also think maybe old Chuan Leekpai should be thinking along these lines too. The alternatives do not look nice but in all reality that is what we will probably end up with.

I think it is a very interesting question - what can possibly be done to get past the current impasse.

As I see it there are two issues.

1. Thaksin. The Democrats need to give their desire to persecute/prosecute him and he should give up his desire to return to Thailand/political life. He should be conveniently forgotten in exile.

2. We need a government of national reconciliation. The mostly likely leader - Banharn - as a bridge between the two sides.

Is any of this going to happen? No...

[ando]

Supreme Court to rule whether PPP a nominee

The Supreme Court has scheduled next week to rule on whether three election related cases merit the judicial review.

In the first case, the high court will hand down the ruling on January 15 in the litigation raised by Democrat candidate Chaiwat Sinsuwong.

Chaiwat contends four legal issues - whether the People Power Party is qualified for the race as a nominee of the disbanded Thai Rak Thai party, whether People Power leader Samak Sundaravej is a proxy in the race, whether the advance voting is valid and whether the distribution of video CDs featuring former prime minister Thaksin Shinwatra is illegal.

Full article here:

http://www.nationmultimedia.com/breakingne...newsid=30061051

"I believe the Democrat allegation is that the PPP is a nominee for the "TRT". Not, that Samak is a nominee for Thaksin. There is a profound difference when these things come before a court of law.

Unless the prosecution can show that the TRT still actually exists, (eg: minutes of meetings, bank accounts, membership lists, etc..), I cant see how they can prove a case. Maybe the whole thing is a political scam to scare the wavering smaller parties into the Democrats camp?"

Samak was charged with acting as Thaksin's nominee.

Samak was charged with acting as Thaksin's nominee.

Show me a quote from a reliable source that says what you do and I will believe you. I haven't read anything that says the allegations are that Samak was a nominee of "Thaksin". Just who or what Samak is alleged to be a nominee for is not absolutely clear in the above quoted news item, however the inference strongly indicates that the allegation is he was a nominee for the now defunct TRT rather than for Thaksin.

Samak has been around the political game in Thailand for a long time and I believe he has a law degree. While he has openly admitted he is a nominee for Thaksin, I cant recall ever reading anything that quoted him as saying he was a nominee for the outlawed TRT. I suspect he may have a legal ace up his sleeve there.

I don't want to get too hung up on legal technicalities here as I am sure the lawyers will do a good job of that anyway.

However I would like to say that the whole process of military takeovers, banning whole political parties and trying to ban new parties or party leaders on the grounds of being a nominee for a banned party, is absolutely farcical compared to normal functioning democracies. Thailand's political process has to be the great laughing stocks of the democratic world at the moment.

[ChiangMaiAmerican]

If English isn't your native language you may not understand what proxy means.

From Princeton University Wordnet:

Noun (n) proxy, placeholder, procurator (a person authorized to act for another)

http://wordnet.princeton.edu/perl/webwn?s=proxy

From the Merriam Webster online dictionary:

Proxy

2 a: authority or power to act for another

3: a person authorized to act for another

Until I came to Thailand I never heard nominee used in the manner it is used here. It may be in the UK but in the US proxy is the more common term.

http://www.m-w.com/dictionary/proxy

Edited January 6, 2008 by ChiangMaiAmerican

[ChiangMaiAmerican]

"In their court challenge, the Democrats accuse Samak Sundaravej, who openly professed his loyalty to Mr Thaksin, of being a "nominee" for the former leader."

Is this clear enough? Is the Financial Times reliable enough?

http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/4a9f0b9a-ba69-11...00779fd2ac.html

Edited January 6, 2008 by ChiangMaiAmerican

[ando]

Looking right now whoever gets into power will be overseeing an utterly and maybe irreconcialably divided people and making sure their half (or 40% of 70%) gets what they want and the others lose out. A recipe for chaos in all likelihood. Any chance now for a voice of reason? When a country is as polarised as Thailand now is (and has been for a couple of years) there is a need for great stateman or two to put differences aside and try to bring harmony. If the respected representatives of the people on both sides continue to throw allegations and accusations against each other what chance is there of those that support them calming down. One wonders if maybe there is someone on each side who can just for one minute rise above the mud slinging and say hey we have to work this out together and bash their own side into line, not to mention actually set an example fo the ordinary parson. I have to say although not a fan of his I would personally have a lot of admiration for Mr. Thaksin if he were to actually call on the PPP to form a true government of national unity with a set agenda and not one full of the politcal whore parties and I would also think maybe old Chuan Leekpai should be thinking along these lines too. The alternatives do not look nice but in all reality that is what we will probably end up with.

I think it is a very interesting question - what can possibly be done to get past the current impasse.

As I see it there are two issues.

1. Thaksin. The Democrats need to give their desire to persecute/prosecute him and he should give up his desire to return to Thailand/political life. He should be conveniently forgotten in exile.

2. We need a government of national reconciliation. The mostly likely leader - Banharn - as a bridge between the two sides.

Is any of this going to happen? No...

When things grind to a halt, as they no doubt will, no matter which party snatches power this time round, the military (backed by the elite class) will simply move in and once again attempt to set things up so as to get their preferred political party into power under the guise of democratic elections.

The trouble for the elite ruling class and the military is that the poor peasant class is becoming better educated and better informed. They are starting to realize that they actually have a say in how the government will treat them.

Thailand is on the verge of a revolution of sorts I think. Though I don't believe it will be a revolution under arms by the peasants, but rather a recognition by the elite ruling class and the military that suppression of the peasants by military force and political tricks will no longer work.

I think one more coup that nobody wants should do it. The countries political and legal system the way it is being abused at the moment is an absolute laughing stock around the world and I think even the most insular and xenophobic Thai elite would realize that. Those with the power are doing little more than just holding back the tide for the moment. Once they realize that Thailand and indeed the world around them has changed I think they will retreat to dig into their family financial bunkers and let go of their ambitions to suppress and control the peasant class majority. That will be the signal for a true democracy in Thailand. There are some other significant events that are expected in the not too distant future that would curtail the militaries authority also. But we are not allowed to talk about them here.

[ChiangMaiAmerican]

Just to set the record straight I believe much needs to be done for the poor in Thailand. But handing out loans a majority of which will never be repaid isn't the answer. Vietnam has made tremendous progress in reducing poverty so much so they they are now held up as an example. It wasn't done by passing out loans to buy loyalty. It was done by providing a quality education and public works assistance that benefited the entire community. Vietnam's poverty rate is now below that of Thailand. The economy there is booming. Thailand could accomplish the same thing. But buying loyalty and then handing crumbs to the peasants to maintain their loyalty isn't going to get the job done.

[Abrak]

When things grind to a halt, as they no doubt will, no matter which party snatches power this time round, the military (backed by the elite class) will simply move in and once again attempt to set things up so as to get their preferred political party into power under the guise of democratic elections.

The trouble for the elite ruling class and the military is that the poor peasant class is becoming better educated and better informed. They are starting to realize that they actually have a say in how the government will treat them.

Thailand is on the verge of a revolution of sorts I think. Though I don't believe it will be a revolution under arms by the peasants, but rather a recognition by the elite ruling class and the military that suppression of the peasants by military force and political tricks will no longer work.

I think one more coup that nobody wants should do it. The countries political and legal system the way it is being abused at the moment is an absolute laughing stock around the world and I think even the most insular and xenophobic Thai elite would realize that. Those with the power are doing little more than just holding back the tide for the moment. Once they realize that Thailand and indeed the world around them has changed I think they will retreat to dig into their family financial bunkers and let go of their ambitions to suppress and control the peasant class majority. That will be the signal for a true democracy in Thailand. There are some other significant events that are expected in the not too distant future that would curtail the militaries authority also. But we are not allowed to talk about them here.

I honestly dont think things are that simple.

The Democrats did ok in the election by default. How could any rational person think that Samak and his clowns were capable of running the country?

If they are forced into power either by the military or some slight of hand by the judiciary most people will see it for the joke that it will be.

By the way I notice that the Democrats have been remarkably quiet....

[ando]

"In their court challenge, the Democrats accuse Samak Sundaravej, who openly professed his loyalty to Mr Thaksin, of being a "nominee" for the former leader."

Is this clear enough? Is the Financial Times reliable enough?

http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/4a9f0b9a-ba69-11...00779fd2ac.html

"Is this clear enough? Is the Financial Times reliable enough?"

Well No, not really. I am not convinced they didn't get a little confused and muddled like you and confuse Thaksins great persona with that of the now extinct TRT. After all they are a financial orientated media on the other side of the planet. You wouldn't happen to have a link to a Thai political media comment would you? The local media tend to choose their words more carefully on these kinds of critical issues.

Though I do appreciate the time you must have spent searching through the internet to find this one article to justify your claim.

[ray08]

When things grind to a halt, as they no doubt will, no matter which party snatches power this time round, the military (backed by the elite class) will simply move in and once again attempt to set things up so as to get their preferred political party into power under the guise of democratic elections.

The trouble for the elite ruling class and the military is that the poor peasant class is becoming better educated and better informed. They are starting to realize that they actually have a say in how the government will treat them.

Thailand is on the verge of a revolution of sorts I think. Though I don't believe it will be a revolution under arms by the peasants, but rather a recognition by the elite ruling class and the military that suppression of the peasants by military force and political tricks will no longer work.

I think one more coup that nobody wants should do it. The countries political and legal system the way it is being abused at the moment is an absolute laughing stock around the world and I think even the most insular and xenophobic Thai elite would realize that. Those with the power are doing little more than just holding back the tide for the moment. Once they realize that Thailand and indeed the world around them has changed I think they will retreat to dig into their family financial bunkers and let go of their ambitions to suppress and control the peasant class majority. That will be the signal for a true democracy in Thailand. There are some other significant events that are expected in the not too distant future that would curtail the militaries authority also. But we are not allowed to talk about them here.

I honestly dont think things are that simple.

The Democrats did ok in the election by default. How could any rational person think that Samak and his clowns were capable of running the country?

If they are forced into power either by the military or some slight of hand by the judiciary most people will see it for the joke that it will be.

By the way I notice that the Democrats have been remarkably quiet....

The PPP are being flogged to death , even if they form a government it would be very weak now , whilst if the Democrats form a government it would be a weak default one as well , i think whatever happens there will have to be a fresh round of Elections in the near future , hopefully with no yellow and red cards , the answer is independant Overseas observers to keep everyone honest , I don,t beleive only the PPP are the ones doing monkey business ( if Red Cards are correct )

[Abrak]

Just to set the record straight I believe much needs to be done for the poor in Thailand. But handing out loans a majority of which will never be repaid isn't the answer. Vietnam has made tremendous progress in reducing poverty so much so they they are now held up as an example. It wasn't done by passing out loans to buy loyalty. It was done by providing a quality education and public works assistance that benefited the entire community. Vietnam's poverty rate is now below that of Thailand. The economy there is booming. Thailand could accomplish the same thing. But buying loyalty and then handing crumbs to the peasants to maintain their loyalty isn't going to get the job done.

Vietnam received over US$20bn of foreign direct investment last year despite having skilled wages higher than Thailand. So no wonder it is booming. If Thailand cant sort out its politics it is off the map as far as FDI is concerned for the foreseeable future.

[ChiangMaiAmerican]

After all they are a financial orientated media on the other side of the planet.

With their own correspondent based in Bangkok who knows how to ask questions. If Samak were personally being accused of being a proxy for TRT the other charge that PPP is a proxy for TRT would appear to be redundant. We will know the answer soon enough. The court date isn't that far off.

[Abrak]

Strangely enough it is the foreign media that has so associated PPP with Thaksin in their reporting of the election. Samak warned Thaksin to stay away from politics.

What is clear though is that an election means nothing if you disenfranchise the plurality of the voters....

[ChiangMaiAmerican]

"But as Sunday's vote has shown, Thaksin remains a powerful force in Thai politics. The leader of People Power, Samak Sundaravej, spoke openly during campaigning of being a proxy for the former prime minister, and vowed he would bring Thaksin back to Thailand if he took office. In an interview on CNN on Sunday, he repeated his pledge to lift the court order that disbanded Thai Rak Thai and rescind the military order that banned Thaksin and 110 senior Thai Rak Thai officials from political activity."

I believe there are tapes of interviews that will be hard to refute.

http://canberra.yourguide.com.au/news/loca...ty/1152892.html

Edited January 6, 2008 by ChiangMaiAmerican

[Abrak]

What exactly happens if PPP is banned?

[ando]

When things grind to a halt, as they no doubt will, no matter which party snatches power this time round, the military (backed by the elite class) will simply move in and once again attempt to set things up so as to get their preferred political party into power under the guise of democratic elections.

The trouble for the elite ruling class and the military is that the poor peasant class is becoming better educated and better informed. They are starting to realize that they actually have a say in how the government will treat them.

Thailand is on the verge of a revolution of sorts I think. Though I don't believe it will be a revolution under arms by the peasants, but rather a recognition by the elite ruling class and the military that suppression of the peasants by military force and political tricks will no longer work.

I think one more coup that nobody wants should do it. The countries political and legal system the way it is being abused at the moment is an absolute laughing stock around the world and I think even the most insular and xenophobic Thai elite would realize that. Those with the power are doing little more than just holding back the tide for the moment. Once they realize that Thailand and indeed the world around them has changed I think they will retreat to dig into their family financial bunkers and let go of their ambitions to suppress and control the peasant class majority. That will be the signal for a true democracy in Thailand. There are some other significant events that are expected in the not too distant future that would curtail the militaries authority also. But we are not allowed to talk about them here.

I honestly dont think things are that simple.

The Democrats did ok in the election by default. How could any rational person think that Samak and his clowns were capable of running the country?

If they are forced into power either by the military or some slight of hand by the judiciary most people will see it for the joke that it will be.

By the way I notice that the Democrats have been remarkably quiet....

"I honestly dont think things are that simple."

On the contrary, while I dont think the process will be simple, the concept is.

History is full of of one line notations that don't fully describe the arduous transition of political systems.

You can make it as complicated as you like by hypothisizing all kinds of possible scenarios. But the one I stated is the one I believe to be the most likely. In fact I believe it will be the only end result sooner or later, even if it does take more than one more coup to turn the elite away from their current archaic mindset.

Re the Democrats performance in this last election. Sure they did OK. But so they should have too as the junta all but served it to them on a plate. I actually think it was a disappointing result for the Democrats and the junta given the circumstances.

As for Samak, I find it hard to like the guy even though I don't know all that much about him. He just seems to lack political charisma. And my impression is that most Thai voters probably felt the same way. But as most political commentators have pointed out, the vote for PPP was basically a vote for the continuation of TRT policies and a vote against the junta. I actually like Abasit much more than Samak as a potential leader.

Arr, but politics is the business of ethical prostitutes and I think as time passes and history unfolds, the democrats will be smart enough to move their focus away from the elite class, the military and the urban vote more towards the rural poor where the numbers to gain government are, under a democratic system. If the Democrats have to rely on military coups and questionable court rulings to gain political power then they are no more than puppets of the elite themselves. The Democrats have the potential to make Thai politics a real democratic process if they choose to. And sooner or later they will have no choice.

[thaigene2]

There are so many so called Puyai are out there, when in truth, they should either be incarcerated for crimes against both the state and it,s citizens or in certain well publicised cases, have already gone to serve their Karma in the hel_l they deserve and have rightly earned.

Pity the poor less fortunates who get / are serving years detention in multiples for what are in comparison " minor offences "

Not forgetting all those who have lost their lives for evil. indiscriminate objectives we are all familiar with.

marshbags

Finally, Marshbags, you post something right on the money. Maybe there's hope for you yet?

[ando]

"But as Sunday's vote has shown, Thaksin remains a powerful force in Thai politics. The leader of People Power, Samak Sundaravej, spoke openly during campaigning of being a proxy for the former prime minister, and vowed he would bring Thaksin back to Thailand if he took office. In an interview on CNN on Sunday, he repeated his pledge to lift the court order that disbanded Thai Rak Thai and rescind the military order that banned Thaksin and 110 senior Thai Rak Thai officials from political activity."

I believe there are tapes of interviews that will be hard to refute.

http://canberra.yourguide.com.au/news/loca...ty/1152892.html

Yes the people voted for PPP partly because it represented the political ideology of Thaksin and further that it promised to give him a fair go in court. (Well, as fair as Thai courts can be depending on which party is in power at the time;-).

The people of Thailand are certainly not fools and they (on both side of politics ) know well that majority of charges and findings against Thaksin were cocked up for purely political reasons by a military junta that seized power from him under force of arms. This facade of pretending that the courts are politically unbiased is really one of the major stumbling blocks with true democracy in Thailand. The UK government wont accept the juntas extradition order against Thaksin because they can see what an unfair system it is. Thailands political and judicial system is really something of a standing joke around the developed world. Anyone from a western background here that cant see that has to have their head in the sand. Its like a bunch of 10 year old kids taking over the school. The people of Thailand deserve better.

[Tony Clifton]

It had to be done to a single man previously, but if this PPP crazyness goes on, seems like half a country will need to have something whispered in it's ear.

[Ricardo]

Kudeb Saikrajang, a People Power Party spokesman, said the party was confident that it could go ahead with setting up a coalition government.

"We are waiting for its results. We believe we can go ahead with launching our coalition government. We are also confident that the EC is investigating fairly," the spokesman said.

- AFP

Who said the EC is above playing politics?

Well a PPP-spokesman says they are being fair.

"Election commissioner Sodsri Satayatham yesterday threatened to delay the MP certification process and postpone the convening of parliament, if, as she suspected, the People Power party (PPP) organises a rally in Bangkok to put pressure on election officials. "

"She warned that if protesters rallied at the EC headquarters to pressure its officials, the commission would close its office.

So why do the PPP want to pressure the EC unfairly, with a mob in the street outside their office ?

With officials unable to carry out their tasks, parliament would not be able to convene, she said.

The law requires that a minimum of 95% of the total 480 House seats must be filled before parliament can convene."

http://www.bangkokpost.com/News/06Jan2008_news01.php

Note, there was no mention of any safety issue for the EC commissioners.

You don't think a mob in the street, outside their office, would be a safety issue ?

Its quite obviously a tit for tat threat to silence public disapproval of the ECs actions. Very unprofessional to threaten to hold the country to ransom at this time when they should be getting on with their job in the public interest.

And this is the fault of the EC, who do their job fairly, not the PPP for organising the mob ?

I fear this is a sign of things to come - under a PPP-coalition government.

[Ricardo]

Sorry - double-post, due to tech problem.

Edited January 6, 2008 by Ricardo

[marshbags]

There are so many so called Puyai are out there, when in truth, they should either be incarcerated for crimes against both the state and it,s citizens or in certain well publicised cases, have already gone to serve their Karma in the hel_l they deserve and have rightly earned.

Pity the poor less fortunates who get / are serving years detention in multiples for what are in comparison " minor offences "

Not forgetting all those who have lost their lives for evil. indiscriminate objectives we are all familiar with.

marshbags

Finally, Marshbags, you post something right on the money. Maybe there's hope for you yet?

O.K. tg i,ll bite just this once instead of just thinking personal, uncomplimentary things about your posts and constant mischief making.

I reciprocate your comments, at last you post something that isn,t favourable to the PPP / TRT and their ilk and just maybe you are mellowing and fed up of the same old denials of the who,s accountable for what in the run up to the election, accountable for the chaos and division within the country which thanks to the PPP and the exiled one,s guidance, is widening.

It all started long before the Military intervened and well you know it, by the way, so why you use them to fire your venom at is beyond me.

Well not really, you poor, misunderstanding the truth poster.

I should save your condescending remarks for someone who may be receptive to them and not waste your time on my behalf.

Me, i post what i think and wether it,s to your liking or not counts for zero.

Carry on, by all means as i will not respond further.

marshbags

Oh by the way, i nearly forgot, stay coollllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllll

Edited January 6, 2008 by marshbags

[thaigene2]

Actually Marshbags I was serious regarding the fact that I agree with you that the poor people aren't treated the same as the rich - Thaksin and all the others elites out there (pro or anti TRT). And theya re the ones who always suffer.

May I now continue to post my other condescending remarks anyway?

[jackspratt]

Common knowledge that the majority of people in Issan couldn't care less who is in government - they only cheer for whoever gives them the most money in the short term. Talk to them about anything past the end of the current weather season & they get that distracted, far away look on their faces.

TRT & PPP have this "Issan" attitude worked out to an art form & if they were "simply relying on their constituents to vote them in" they know they wouldn't have a chance.

Common knowledge where, Soundman? In Kabin, which is not part of Issan?

I do live here, and amongst my extended family and those around us they think a bit more than who gives them the money - because quite frankly, all the major parties do so. While I don't agree with their PPP/TRT choice, I have no doubt they have given it some thought - based on self interest.

For your edification and education it is currently the dry season, so the looks on their faces are engaged and interested. How very superior of you to hypothesize otherwise

My my. Touched on a raw nerve there did we?

Did I ever accuse you of not living here (congratulations on a splendid choice of country BTW) or not knowing the season? I think not.

May I suggest that after you have looked into the root of the problem as in your statement "I have no doubt they have given it some thought - based on self interest" - you may find that the average citizen living in the North East of Thailand doesn't think past the short term financial gain.

Do you see them voting for parties with policies that embrace educational benefits or "real" macro economic fiscal policies. That is easy, I will answer it for you - no, they have no idea the choices were even there.

They only vote for parties that provide a neet little hand out on election day, give opportunities for easy loans (they sure understand these) that in their minds they think they don't have to pay back if the going becomes a little tough & vote for whatever party the local gumnan, poo yai, or nayok instructs them to vote for.

Now, while you are getting on your high horse & lecturing me on superiorty issues, it may be wise to actually take a step back, have a little look (just a peek should suffice) at the whole situation with an open mind without any pre-formed biases & make a clear and rational judgement as to the situation with the buyable vote in Issan, and how this leaves Thailand's future shaky all because of the greed and avarice of one meglomaniac.

Cheers & wish you the best of health in the new year.

Soundman.

Can't help yourself, Soundman? Still condescending to the voters of Issan and me!

If you took the time to read my post, and had the intellect to comprehend it, you would see I am not a Thaksin/PPP fan, ergo I do not agree with the choice by my (extended) family to vote for the prick. However, it appears they did make a considered choice before doing do, based as I said, on economic self interest.

Which in my experience, is in line with most economically deprived populations around the world.

If only they had your intelligence and insight, enabling them to make the right decisions in favour of Thailand, rather than themselves and their families.

And finally, are you really so naive to believe that Issan is the only area where vote buying occurred?

Happy new year to you too

[Meerkat]

...seems like half a country will need to have something whispered in it's ear.

Agreed, although probably not in the way you thought:

"Let the people have whomsoever the people want."

(Personally I fear that Samak could be awful as PM, but were it my country, I'd prefer a bad elected PM over an appointed one).

[thaigene2]

Yeah, I find this suggestion (by a minority thankfully) that the people of "Issan" are just plain stupid and will vote for anyone who hands them 200 or 500 baht or rice whiskey -- is just repulsive. But there it is, over and over again.

Why not the South? Why not the North? Why Issan? They are all just as poor. I'll tell you why, it's becuase the Nation and others kept spinning that well-rehearsed yarn for weeks ahead of the election (say things often enough it becomes 'truth' in the minds of the many).

Others above had a go at someone who suggested the Chinese-Thais are dirty players, and was roundly abused -- are you guys as bad suggesting Thai-Lao people are stupid and greedy?? - If so, then I have the right to respond to your flaming by saying, on behalf of my Thai-Lao wife and her family, <deleted>> you!!

Edited January 6, 2008 by thaigene2

[mbkudu]

"In a democracy the poor will have more power than the rich because there are more of them, and the will of the majority is supreme."

Aristotle

[thaigene2]

"In a democracy the poor will have more power than the rich because there are more of them, and the will of the majority is supreme."

Aristotle

Except in Thailand. Because "This is Thailand." Xe xe.

[Tony Clifton]

"In a democracy the poor will have more power than the rich because there are more of them, and the will of the majority is supreme."

Aristotle

Except in Thailand. Because "This is Thailand." Xe xe.

Surely you meant Chiland/Xiailand.

[sriracha john]

Thaksin niece joins the fray

Chinnicha Wongsawat, a 26-year-old niece of ousted prime minister Thaksin Shinawatra (TRT Banned #1), will be contesting the general election in Chiang Mai.

Even though 100 million baht in her bank accounts has been frozen - the Assets Examination Committee suspects the money was part of the proceeds from the sale of Shin Corp to Singapore's Temasek Holdings - Chinnicha said it would not affect her campaign.

*above issue is covered here*:

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/index.php?sh...p;#entry1630511

AEC Freezes Thaksin's Assets, Proceeds From Shin Corp Sale

Additionally, she might not need it so much anyway as Money & Banking Magazine listed her as 64th on Thailand's 500 Richest People list with 760 million baht, while her siblings Chayapha and Yoschanant had 645 million baht and 636 million baht, respectively.

"I think it is a different issue. Politics is politics, while the case is in the justice system. Therefore it should not be linked," she said.

Chinnicha says she has no need to make people understand the controversial case, adding she has talked to voters as a candidate who wants to serve the country.

Chinnicha is the daughter of Thaksin's younger sister, former TRT MP Yaowapa Wongsawat (TRT Banned #13).

She has been known as businesswoman but when her mother was banned from politics, she decided to quit business and enter politics.

Chinnicha denies she is a nominee of Yaowapa and claims that being a niece of Thaksin will not give her an advantage.

His niece... his lawyer.... and now... his sister-in-law....

People's Power Party Ready for Election Race

The People's Power Party shrugged off any allegations of being representatives of the now-defunct Thai Rak Thai Party, and said it is ready to fight head-on in the South.

Apart from its Southern candidates, the PPP also disclosed the names of 32 female contenders – 17 of them former MPs or related to former Thai Rak Thai executives who were banned from the December 23 election.

Among the female candidates are Karuna Chidchob, the wife of former Buriram MP, Newin Chidchob (TRT Banned #6), and Sriyada Shinawatra, who is the sister-in-law of deposed Premier Thaksin Shinawatra (TRT Banned #1).

- Thailand Outlook

========================================================================

The sis-in-law of Thaksin didn't fair so well last time out, the 2006 elections, when she lost by nearly a 4 to 1 margin to......

uhmm... errrr... ahhhh......

no one running.

From the the thaivisa thread:

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/index.php?sh...mp;#entry703743

I Will Not Resign: Thaksin

Thai Rak Thai flops in Phuket poll

PHUKET: -- Thai Rak Thai Party (TRT) candidate Dr Sriyada Palimapan has failed in her bid to be elected Member of Parliament for Phuket District 1.

Dr Sriyada garnered a total of 11,910 votes, but these were far outweighed by the 41,903 “no votes” cast by voters in District 1.

--Phuket Gazette 2006-03-03

==========================================================================

Here's a photo of the cosmetic dentist who wants to be MP:

Sriyada Shinawatra

As an update to Chinchilla's virginal *meaning first-time* race into politics, she won:

Newly elected People Power Party MP Chinnicha Wongsawat, left, waves to people from a motorcade to thank Chiang Mai voters for their support. She is the daughter of Yaowapa, sister of former prime minister Thaksin Shinawatra.

The Nation

She is also the daughter of Somchai, yet another Thaksin family member, who is in line to become Justice Minister in the PPP Cabinet.

Can any of our Phuket residents confirm whether or not the dentist who is the other Thaksin family member also got elected down there???

Edited January 7, 2008 by sriracha john