Two Tourists In Pai Shot By A Police Officer

[chanman]

Already, we've determined that an execution took place. I'd guess some beligerent tourists insulted the wrong Thai guy. He may or may not have been a cop, doesn't much matter now does it. Lesson learned: drink lots of water, walk slowly and respect the local population. Funny, works just about everywhere.

can I say this?, I,am half and half ...<deleted> to any idea of kowtowing, showing respect for the culture ( which is what exactly...? )if it means backing down, do not back down from any of there cowards- none of them!

do not change anything, policeman or not,just do as a normal decent person would do and 99.9% of the time your be fine.

,most locals are a bunch of cowardly <deleted> who would,nt do anything without all their friends behind them or a gun,knife or whatever, or some high-so daddy, its pathetic! Get them on their own and they,re nothing.

one to one for people here does,nt exist, at heart I,am ashamed to say this-thais by and large ( not all of coures)are cowards, its just the typical primate mentality of a nation still with one foot in the rice paddy .They ( we) also see westeners as 'better' and so are more likely to act like a primate fool.

I hate it when i see people suggest that westeners should somehow act differently, why does,nt someone suggest that thailand grow up for a change- then we really would have something to be proud of instead of all this mindless propaganda we,re fed from day one

Are you for real?

[samsara]

The fact is there is something seriously wrong with Thai society - it is becoming more violent than other Asian societies outside the basket cases, lies, theft, corruption and other ills of society are seen as the norm in many secotrs of society - the roots of this are manifold and I support mass tourism and other cultural influences have their place.

Well what do you expect with a PM like Thaksin who was nothing but a corporate raider in this case the corporation was Thailand. Even cops aren't respecting anyone any more. No one is being responsible for what they do, just blame someone else.

Hey when a fish is rotten it's rotten at the head.

LiveSteam

exactly. thai society aint so much known for its high regard for accountability.

btw, thaksin is not some unique persona. hes just better at stealing than others. grafting is one of the foundations of business in thailand. everyone does it, not just thaksin and his cronies. of course, thaksin was a bit more forceful in carrying out his plans. guess you could almost call him western in that way. truly ahead of his time. ha

[Grifter29]

I too don't like trouble makers in any country, my own, their own or the country they are visiting as a guest! But…

We are only human, all be a bit spasticated on booze, but nobody deserves to be killed (shot, stabbed or whatever methods you prefer) for pushing someone around whether you're from Thailand, London, Manchester Afghanistan or frigging Iraq, perhaps in this situation, a bit of a pounding would have been more appropriate, but shot through the head? Hmm.

[DamianMavis]

Yep that's exactly right.

Why is it that once one idiot goes off the rails and commits murder under the cloak of authority does everyone brandish all Thais with the same brush.

It's not just one. There have been two off duty Thai Policemen that murdered foreigners fairly recently I can think of off the top of my head.

Does the US invasion of Iraq not equate starkly by comparison when it is now almost universally agreed that they had no justification to do so? I put that in the murder basket!

Thailand was an ally of the US in the invasion of Iraq.

If Thailand is such a dangerous place, someone name for me the last Thai mass/serial murderer

There are and have been many Thai serial killers.

I take it you completely missed this story from a couple of weeks ago? Lol.

http://news.monstersandcritics.com/asiapac...cle_1372754.php

or one that blew up a building full of innocent people in a major city

You do know there's a civil war going on in the South don't you?

or the last time a crazed kid(s) opened fire with automatic weapons in a school of any description.

A couple of young guys went bezerk near the Mall in Bang Na several weeks ago with AK47's. I believe they killed a police officer. Does that qualify or does it have to be a school? I could have taken my pick of the shootings in central Bangkok as common as they are.

I won't be so nice, JOMTIENBOB, you need to educate yourself and pay attention to whats going on in the country you are living in, the same could be said for a bunch of others. Ignorance is bliss eh fellas? Must be nice....

Damian

[samsara]

Yep that's exactly right.

Why is it that once one idiot goes off the rails and commits murder under the cloak of authority does everyone brandish all Thais with the same brush.

It's not just one. There have been two off duty Thai Policemen that murdered foreigners fairly recently I can think of off the top of my head.

Does the US invasion of Iraq not equate starkly by comparison when it is now almost universally agreed that they had no justification to do so? I put that in the murder basket!

Thailand was an ally of the US in the invasion of Iraq.

If Thailand is such a dangerous place, someone name for me the last Thai mass/serial murderer

There are and have been many Thai serial killers.

I take it you completely missed this story from a couple of weeks ago? Lol.

http://news.monstersandcritics.com/asiapac...cle_1372754.php

or one that blew up a building full of innocent people in a major city

You do know there's a civil war going on in the South don't you?

or the last time a crazed kid(s) opened fire with automatic weapons in a school of any description.

A couple of young guys went bezerk near the Mall in Bang Na several weeks ago with AK47's. I believe they killed a police officer. Does that qualify or does it have to be a school? I could have taken my pick of the shootings in central Bangkok as common as they are.

the general feel of thailand has changed significantly since i first arrived some 5 years ago. its only going to get worse.

lets see. you have a vastly undereducated populace who plays ritually violent video games, listens to angry music, and grows more and more drawn to western society by the day. things will get ugly before long. honestly, the main thing preventing an outbreak of major violence is the lack of access to weapons. check out the philippines to see what happens when firearms are readily available. freakin chaos. you could argue that the buddhist influence might dampen the spread of violence...but how many young thais do you who are really buddhist?

Edited January 7, 2008 by samsara

[Gary A]

MOST of theses incidents, I did say most, are the result of alcohol, screaming and scuffles. Actually I'm surprised we don't see more of this. I have seen farangs behaving badly to the point that I felt they should take a beating. I have seen Thai police take abuse that no one should have to take and the abusers are normally able to pay a fine, sober up in jail then be on their way. No one wants to see anyone shot but tempers, alcohol and guns don't mix. I wouldn't think about that in my home country much less a foreign country.

[mrdome]

can I say this?, I,am half and half ...<deleted> to any idea of kowtowing, showing respect for the culture ( which is what exactly...? )if it means backing down, do not back down from any of there cowards- none of them!

do not change anything, policeman or not,just do as a normal decent person would do and 99.9% of the time your be fine.

,most locals are a bunch of cowardly <deleted> who would,nt do anything without all their friends behind them or a gun,knife or whatever, or some high-so daddy, its pathetic! Get them on their own and they,re nothing.

one to one for people here does,nt exist, at heart I,am ashamed to say this-thais by and large ( not all of coures)are cowards, its just the typical primate mentality of a nation still with one foot in the rice paddy .They ( we) also see westeners as 'better' and so are more likely to act like a primate fool.

I hate it when i see people suggest that westeners should somehow act differently, why does,nt someone suggest that thailand grow up for a change- then we really would have something to be proud of instead of all this mindless propaganda we,re fed from day one

Lol! I guess it's true and wrong at the same time. I try to be a common sense guy in the West and I tried the same when I lived in Thailand. Of course, you respect the culture - that's one of the reasons you go there, isn't it. But I agree you don't put up with everything you are faced with,like getting ripped off (if you can help it).

But you raised a good question. What is culture? For me, it's Buddhism and respect for the Royal Family and dressing in a respectful manner and generally treating people respectfully (no touching on the head, keeping feet on the floor) and probably a few more other things. It isn't 'mai pen rai' attitude and 'falang always pay'.

"They see westeners as 'better'..." Those days are over my friend, lol. I don't want to be seen as better or higher anyway but judged by my actions.

What I see is the patron-client relationship of old being extended to foreigners who come for a limited amount of time by Thais without having to put in the traditional work that was provided by the lower ranking person throughout the year.

But there are many ways to avoid this situation, although once in a while it will be unavoidable to give in to this 'arrangement'.

"why does,nt someone suggest that thailand grow up for a change-" Some problems here: Who determines what "growing up" actually means. I also doubt you can erase centuries worth of traditions in a short amount of time.

"mindless propaganda" - What mindless propaganda? People have opinions but best to form your own.

Edited January 7, 2008 by mrdome

[Chloe82]

The old hands and folks in Asia who've seen police hassled and threatened will tell you that the police here in Thailand will draw their weapon (s) if they feel threatened. This isn't Dixon of Dock Green out here.

What's one of the main 'rules' for any expat in Thailand? Keep your cool! Don't cause a big drunken scene and draw attention to yourself, especially if you are farang!

Maybe this cop is a bad guy maybe not, it could well be that they inadvertently lit the fuse that started the whole shooting.

If you want it like home, GO HOME!

So you are advocating the end of tourism to Thailand then as i am sure tourists do not want to vist a place where police have a history of shooting tourists while they are drunk and over a stupid thing like loss of face.

As a old asia hand though I am sure you know better (just how much time have you spent in Asia and how many countries in Asia have you lived, worked or visited outside Thailand?)

Not exactly 'tourists', renting a house in the area for a number of years, sounds like the guy who got killed was one of these people who live here a short while (long time to them) think they know the score but one day (dramaticaly in this case) find out they don't.

Ahh, to peel an onion.

[meemiathai]

What I want to say about this thread is I see a lot of objective views from farangs.

[IAMSOBAD]

With all the noise coming from a supposedly drunken couple screaming and fighting...DONT you think lots of people heard and saw exactly what happened? I know there must be at least 20 eyewitnesses to this event.

What makes me sick is that they called the shot victims...FARANGS or FOREIGNERS. Why?

If the policeman was drunk...all bets are off. Its a homicide. A drunk cop has no right to get involved or draw his weapon. I hope the truth comes out and that for once we get all the facts provided to us.

HAPPY NEW YEAR.

[yumidesign]

Already, we've determined that an execution took place. I'd guess some beligerent tourists insulted the wrong Thai guy. He may or may not have been a cop, doesn't much matter now does it. Lesson learned: drink lots of water, walk slowly and respect the local population. Funny, works just about everywhere.

Too true, but, what is an off duty cop doing with a loaded revolver late at night near a pub minding other peoples business. It is telling from this saga that this is the true attitude of the police in Thailand of being above the law. Immoral and Disgusting

[jeff_gangl]

What gives?

Is there no equal justice here?

If a thai cop or no cop shoots anyone....id there no real legal route of justice?

Seems like the guy needed a beating that would neglect his ability to return and shoot anyone...

LAst night there was an incident in Pai. Not sure if this is being 'allowed' to the mainstream press or not but I will tell you the FACTS and the RUMORS

FACTS:

Last night Janurary 5th a little after Midnight a forgien tourist was shot through the mouth and died instanly by a Thai man with whoum he was earlier arguing. Witnesses earlier saw the Thai man and the Tourist arguring on the street and the Thai man drove off shouting in english 'I'LL KILL YOU'

shortly after the Tourist was eating at a resuturant and the Thai man came in and stuck a gun down the forgienners throat and shot him dead. It is also thought the forgineers girlfriend and possibly another was injured.

As for RUMORS there are two corrurent rurmors circulating:

THE OFFICAL REPORT:

There were two falang fighting and the police came to break up the fight and the falang attacked the police and the police had to shoot them in self defence.

THE STREET REPORT (From the Local Thais)

The man who shot the tourist was an Off Duty Pai Police officer who was drinking.

Both seem to concur that a Police officer shot a forgineer so we will go with that.

Also the local Thais are saying that the Police Force arrested the officer as well - but that is still in Rumor phase.

[jeff_gangl]

Visting as a guest....what the <deleted> is that?

This place takes pleads for so called guests as you say....no one deserves that.....skin the pig !!!

I too don't like trouble makers in any country, my own, their own or the country they are visiting as a guest! But…

We are only human, all be a bit spasticated on booze, but nobody deserves to be killed (shot, stabbed or whatever methods you prefer) for pushing someone around whether you're from Thailand, London, Manchester Afghanistan or frigging Iraq, perhaps in this situation, a bit of a pounding would have been more appropriate, but shot through the head? Hmm.</SPAN>

[mrdome]

Too true, but, what is an off duty cop doing with a loaded revolver late at night near a pub minding other peoples business. It is telling from this saga that this is the true attitude of the police in Thailand of being above the law. Immoral and Disgusting

When I was all new and green in Thailand and spent my first Songkran in Chiang Mai in 2001 I was invited to drink with what turned out to be a (drunk) off duty cop. At one point he showed me a - I assume loaded - gun he was packing in his pants. I made sure the rest of the evening went to his liking. (No, he paid, lol.) I remember persuading him not to use his pistol with some people next door that were annoying him (I assume he was only joking).

This is Wild West territory when it comes to things like this. I'm not condoning this type of behavior from an off duty cop but we are not going to change it, as much as we may show our disapproval. Thailand may appear familiar to us after a while but the fact is among all the countries in SE Asia it's possibly the one that is most seperated from our Western values and traditions.

I know some people won't agree with me here but imho it's upon us to realize this as much as possible and tread lightly. And no this doesn't mean agreeing with everything and not stating your point of view on some issues.

Edited January 7, 2008 by mrdome

[sibeymai]

Ho-hum....

[phukethovercraft]

"Uthai initially fled"

Cops here AND their bosses just have to be the worst liars... Amateurs.

After the cop a killed the one guy and almost killed the girl he had to run away so he could find some witnesses. I'm supprised the cop didn't put the gun in the dead guys hand and say the Canadian shot his GF and then commited suicide.

LiveSteam

Totally agree with ya! He shot himself in the torso and that didn't work, so he shot himself in the mouth. "Grow up".

Edited January 7, 2008 by phukethovercraft

[lostworm]

check out the guardian story

http://www.guardian.co.uk/international/st...2236672,00.html

[siamesekitty]

Thai police are obliged to interfere if there is trouble brewing, even if they are off duty.

[jackspratt]

Hey boys. If I'm a cop & some drunken yabbo goes for my service revolver I'll cap his @$$ before he gets a chance to assault me.

Most of what I read here says falang are great & Thai cops are not. Horsefeathers. The nadian got put down like a mad dog. Good work.

Hey big boy - thank god you are not a cop!

Come to think of it, exactly what are you?

[Galong]

check out the guardian story

http://www.guardian.co.uk/international/st...2236672,00.html

And my favorite quote from that, "The policeman, who is about 1.6m tall, was beaten to the ground by the man, a bodybuilder, and the hippy woman," said the local police chief, Wanchai Suwanririkate.

So Thai sympathizers, it seems like the 'other side' is just as racist as we are... at least that's the way I read it. Poor little innocent Thai man was defending himself against bodybuilders and hippies...

[lannarebirth]

Thai police are obliged to interfere if there is trouble brewing, even if they are off duty.

I have never ever seen a Thai policeman intercede in a Tha/Thai domestic dispute. I've seen them watch though.

[kdvsn]

check out the guardian story

http://www.guardian.co.uk/international/st...2236672,00.html

Odd that the Guardian story says that the cop was charged with premeditated murder. That doesn't seem to jibe, all accounts in this forum and int he press seem to describe a crime that occured in the heat of the moment. Being charged with a premeditated crime would imply that the police think that the shooter had a motive to kill the bodybuilder and the hippy prior to this incident.

[apetley]

check out the guardian story

http://www.guardian.co.uk/international/st...2236672,00.html

Odd that the Guardian story says that the cop was charged with premeditated murder. That doesn't seem to jibe, all accounts in this forum and int he press seem to describe a crime that occured in the heat of the moment. Being charged with a premeditated crime would imply that the police think that the shooter had a motive to kill the bodybuilder and the hippy prior to this incident.

Maybe they believe what was written in the OP. That he left the scene and later returned and carried out the shooting.

[rafval]

Thai police are obliged to interfere if there is trouble brewing, even if they are off duty.

I have never ever seen a Thai policeman intercede in a Tha/Thai domestic dispute. I've seen them watch though.

me too

the evidence seems pretty straight forward to me, the policeman ran away after whatever happened happened, I think thats a pretty clear indication that the policeman regarded his actions to be outside the law, and he has been charged with murder, seems a closed case, no point supporting the policemans position when neither himself or his fellow policemen are willing to do so

[siamesekitty]

Thai police are obliged to interfere if there is trouble brewing, even if they are off duty.

I have never ever seen a Thai policeman intercede in a Tha/Thai domestic dispute. I've seen them watch though.

me too

the evidence seems pretty straight forward to me, the policeman ran away after whatever happened happened, I think thats a pretty clear indication that the policeman regarded his actions to be outside the law, and he has been charged with murder, seems a closed case, no point supporting the policemans position when neither himself or his fellow policemen are willing to do so

In no way am I supporting the policeman's position.

I was stating a fact, that Thai policeman are required by law to investigate possible crimes/disturbances even if off-duty. This statement was in response to some posters' questions of why he was there in the first place if he was off-duty. This is a possible explanation, though not necessarily the case. And I'm certainly not saying it was the case.

[siamesekitty]

P.S. regarding the Thai/Thai domestic disputes, sadly they do not really see it as a big issue. and oftentimes the couple will just get back together after a fight, so the police are like, ok so?

*Disclaimer: this is another fact just FYI. The statement above does not indicate that I am supportive of domestic disputes, wife-beating, police inaction, etc..

[bggg]

The fact that he was drunk and aggressive and attacking people is undisputed. fact /fækt/ Pronunciation Key - Show Spelled Pronunciation[fakt] Pronunciation Key - Show IPA Pronunciation

–noun

a truth known by actual experience or observation; something known to be true:

http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/fact

I'm not sure what your point is. It's ok to to start drunken brawls in Thailand (or anywhere else for that matter) and start beating people up?

Sorry I obviously missed the information that presented these Facts !!!

A man has just learned that his Girlfriend, wife, exgirlfriend, or exwife is pregnant by another man and is having an emotional interaction with her!

It's ok to to start drunken brawls in Thailand (or anywhere else for that matter) and start beating people up?

He started beating up what people?? Are you referring to the cops account of what happened? You must have access to information not contained in this thread, please share your source.

[Atli]

We can travel all these countries if we know how to behave.

That’s the funniest statement ever on this board.

[rafval]

In no way am I supporting the policeman's position.

I was stating a fact, that Thai policeman are required by law to investigate possible crimes/disturbances even if off-duty. This statement was in response to some posters' questions of why he was there in the first place if he was off-duty. This is a possible explanation, though not necessarily the case. And I'm certainly not saying it was the case.

sorry, didnt mean to imply you were, just that as the other poster mentioned, I dont think I have ever seen a policeman here get involved in a fight until after the fight is over, and I have seen many fights where the police just stood and watched, so it seems a bit ironic that an off duty policeman would get involved, but I know what you mean

[stevemiddie]

WE should email the Thai Embassies of our respective countries to express our disgust.