Five Tourism Mega-projects Tabled

[george]

Five tourism mega-projects tabled

BANGKOK: -- The Tourism and Sports Ministry yesterday outlined five mega-projects that are expected to cost Bt3 billion.

The projects are part of a five-year tourism development plan starting this year.

Minister Weerasak Kowsurat said he would soon propose the plan to the Cabinet for approval.

Weerasak gave an outline of the projects to ministry officials yesterday.

The first project aims to create a "civilisation tourism route" between Thailand and Burma. It is expected to require funding of Bt40 million this year and another Bt225 million over the next two years.

The second is building eco-tourism, which is expected to consume Bt900 million to Bt1 billion.

The third is the "Thailand Riviera" project, which was initially proposed some years ago. It aims to build new tourism magnets along the Gulf of Thailand. This project will require Bt260 million this year and Bt500 million in the next two years.

The fourth is promoting the Mekong River as a new destination. It will require Bt130 million this year and another Bt420 million through 2009 and 2010.

The last project calls for the building of the Thai-Khmer cultural route. It is budgeted at Bt500 million.

The projects are intended to attract more global tourists as well as encourage domestic tourism, Weerasak said.

Apart from the mega-projects, Weerasak said the National Budget Bureau and the National Economic and Social Development Board had approved an additional Bt3.4-billion budget for marketing activities this year.

The agency had been allocated Bt4.9 billion this year but has already spent Bt2.7 billion.

Of the additional money, the ministry will allocate most, Bt1.6 billion, to the Tourism Authority of Thailand.

-- The Nation 2008-03-15

[farang prince]

George, I not sure I understand the headline. Were the four projects tabled, which means here in the West that they will die a slow death in the legislative process? Are were the four projects proposed, meaning they still have a possibility of successfully moving through the legislative process? From the article it tooks like the projects were proposed, not tabled. By the way, can't wait to go on the "civilization tourism route" from Thailand to Burma. Hehehehe. Wonder how many points on the trail will be booby-trapped by the crazies in Myannmar?

[Seneque]

Improve tourism ?.... how about a 'civilized' project to pick up trash (in national parks ... and everywhere else) ... this would definitely beautify the country and make tourists stay longer.

[george]

George, I not sure I understand the headline. Were the four projects tabled, which means here in the West that they will die a slow death in the legislative process? Are were the four projects proposed, meaning they still have a possibility of successfully moving through the legislative process? From the article it tooks like the projects were proposed, not tabled. By the way, can't wait to go on the "civilization tourism route" from Thailand to Burma. Hehehehe. Wonder how many points on the trail will be booby-trapped by the crazies in Myannmar?

Farang prince,

This was the headline that was feeded form The Nation, a bit cryptic I agree.

[sriracha john]

So they actually are going to trot this old chesnut out again.... what a crock... and what a tremendous amount of money to be siphoned and misspent...

Here's a party policy statement that will be difficult to top...

In other developments, the PPP is moving ahead with election campaigning, making more promises to the people in the hope of winning more votes with just days left before the election. The PPP vowed to make tourism a top priority, promising to boost the tourism sector with a major cash injection as well as to set up a Tourism Bank for business operators. "The coastline between Trat to Surat Thani provinces will be transformed into major tourist destinations comparable to the likes of Nice in France," said PPP member Plodprasop Suraswadi.

http://www.bangkokpost.com/breaking_news/b...s.php?id=124469

============================================================================

The PPP has also earlier stated that one of their policies is the goal to increase tourist arrivals to 45 million people per year... or a 4 fold increase from current levels...

They are basing many of their get-rick-quick scams, otherwise known as government policies, on the assumption those sort of numbers for tourist arrivals are generated... it'll be interesting to see the bookkeeping when they don't.

[sriracha john]

George, I not sure I understand the headline. Were the four projects tabled, which means here in the West that they will die a slow death in the legislative process? Are were the four projects proposed, meaning they still have a possibility of successfully moving through the legislative process? From the article it tooks like the projects were proposed, not tabled. By the way, can't wait to go on the "civilization tourism route" from Thailand to Burma. Hehehehe. Wonder how many points on the trail will be booby-trapped by the crazies in Myannmar?

It's an American connotation that "tabled" means ended or stopped... in this situation and others I've encountered here, it essentially means just the opposite in that something is proposed or to be decided upon... so I presumed it was a Brit-ism in its "incorrect" usage. Admittedly, it was always throwing me for a loop too when I first started seeing it used here in this opposite sort of way.

Edited March 15, 2008 by sriracha john

[A_Traveller]

Just to confirm the British English use of tabled in this connexion would be that the projects, in draft form have been initially proposed for consideration. As an example, in the UK Parliament, a motion {amendment} is always tabled before discussion or voting.

Regards

/edit clarify//

Edited March 15, 2008 by A_Traveller

[Samuian]

"The coastline between Trat to Surat Thani provinces will be transformed into major tourist destinations comparable to the likes of Nice in France," said PPP member Plodprasop Suraswadi.

Nice.... Cote Azur... wonder what Plodprasop got high on... and a "Tourism Bank" aren't there enough Banks already? They get their skimmers in place alright... and it's all so obvious, well of whom they have to be afraid of...? I start to envy them for their golden business opportunities, "the last one pays the bills and switches off the light!"

[Martin]

These projects make sense if there is the prospect of a rise in the spending power of a huge number of the middle-classes in China and India.

Westerners look like being too concerned about the rising cost of their food, and about being in negative equity on their houses, to be affording the ever-increasing costs of long-haul flights to Thailand.

[Gravelrash]

These projects make sense if there is the prospect of a rise in the spending power of a huge number of the middle-classes in China and India.

Westerners look like being too concerned about the rising cost of their food, and about being in negative equity on their houses, to be affording the ever-increasing costs of long-haul flights to Thailand.

The above makes sense to me. Everyone alwys assumes these things are done with the western tourist in mind. Just perhaps we are viewed as a shrinking market best left to wallow in Pattaya. Any Thai reading many forums would just see complaints about inflation, falling dollars etc reflecting customers running out of disposable income. No doubt India and China will be the wave of the future. If it is any consolation they will try all the scams on them as well.

[Johpa]

Westerners look like being too concerned about the rising cost of their food, and about being in negative equity on their houses, to be affording the ever-increasing costs of long-haul flights to Thailand.

The Bangkok elite, despite their obsessive greed, are smart enough to have been slowly moving the tourist infrastructure in this direction for several years now. Everything from the tightening of visa regulations to the opening of theme parks oriented (pardon the pun) towards more Asian sensibilities, is based upon tourism becoming far more dependent upon regional, and especially Chinese tourism, in the future.

This is a slow process, not a change that will happen overnight, but the change has been clear for several years now. Thailand will morph into the equivalent of Spain and France for Chinese vacation seekers, the islands the new Mallorca. Might want to invest in a sunscreen company to prevent the white skinned Chinese from becoming like lobster colored Brits on vacation. With airfares from Europe and North America becoming increasingly prohibitive, the Bangkok elite will indeed only receive their "quality" Farang tourists.

[Old Man River]

"The coastline between Trat to Surat Thani provinces will be transformed into major tourist destinations comparable to the likes of Nice in France," said PPP member Plodprasop Suraswadi.

Nice.... Cote Azur... wonder what Plodprasop got high on... and a "Tourism Bank" aren't there enough Banks already? They get their skimmers in place alright... and it's all so obvious, well of whom they have to be afraid of...? I start to envy them for their golden business opportunities, "the last one pays the bills and switches off the light!"

Polprasop has a history of "successful" projects. Let's not forget that he was one of the driving forces behind the Chiang Mai Night Safari Zoo.

[sriracha john]

For us in Sriracha, Ploddingsop's history is quite checkered... but I'm sure the Chinese who dine on tiger nuts like him...

Plodprasop seeks review to clear name over tiger exports

Plodprasop Suraswadi, former chief of the Royal Forestry Department, will today ask the National Counter Corruption Commission (NCCC) to review its decision to indict him for malfeasance over his involvement in the export of 100 Bengal tigers to China five years ago.

Plodprasop said he had previously exercised his authority in this manner while at the helm of the Royal Forestry Department and did not have any problem.

He insisted that his action had caused no harm to the country. He saw it as good for Thailand's relationships with China.

- The Nation

UPDATE... he wants a new job with the new government

Plodprasop 'can handle anything'

Plodprasop Suraswadi insisted yesterday that he is qualified to take any ministerial position in the new Cabinet despite the Secretariat of Prime Minister's Office recent decision to remove him as permanent secretary to the Environment and Natural Resources Ministry.

"I do not yet know which position I am going to get. The only thing I can say is that at my age, I want the chance to serve the nation. I am ready to accept any position as I am fully qualified," he told The Nation in a telephone interview.

Plodprasop actually retired from the ministry last October but the PM's Office Secretariat ordered him to be expelled in December as punishment for his part in approving the export of tigers to China in 2002 when he was director-general of the Royal Forestry Department (RFD).

Plodprasop, whose name is listed as the possible Environment and Natural Resources Minister, said he had heard about the PM's Office decision, but did not pay any attention to it.

"For me the decision is nothing to do with the law as I have a clean slate. I am protected by an amnesty issued on December 5. So, there is no reason for me to pay any heed to it," he said.

Plodprasop referred to a 2007 retroactive amnesty law which stated that criminal and disciplinary records of those who already been punished before December 5, 2007 shall be deleted.

Moreover, Article 6 indicates that the punishment shall not apply to those whose cases were terminated before December 5, which was marked as his Majesty the King's birthday. The law was issued to celebrate the His Majesty the King's 80th birthday.

According to Plodprasop, former Prime Minister Thaksin Shinawatra in 2005 instructed the Environment and Natural Resources Ministry to drop the case after a government panel to investigate claims of disciplinary violations by Plodprasop concluded that he did not violate any regulations in allowing the export of 100 tigers to China.

The panel was chaired by Khunying Dhipavadee Meksawan.

"I received an amnesty on HM the King's birthday, so any decision made after that would not apply to me," he insisted.

In 2002, Plodprasop, then director-general of the RFD, allowed Sri Racha Tiger Zoo { :D } to export 100 Bengal tigers to a private zoo on the island of Hainan.

As the tigers are protected under the Convention on International Trade in Endangered Species, exports can only be carried out between governments and only for research and education.

However on August 9, last year the National Counter Corruption Commission (NCCC) concluded that despite Dhipavadee's panel cleared Plodprasop, the NCCC found him guilty of involvement in the export of the tigers.

At that time, NCC spokesperson Klanarong Chantik, said that the commission would send its findings to Plodprasop's supervisor and call for disciplinary punishment. They were also sent to the Office of the Attorney-General to begin a criminal action.

It was believed that the decision of the PM's office was to follow the NCCC's decision.

- The Nation

[wintermute]

No doubt India and China will be the wave of the future. If it is any consolation they will try all the scams on them as well.

I think it's more likely that the Thais will be scammed by the Chinese and Indians than the other way around.

[steveromagnino]

The Bangkok elite, despite their obsessive greed, are smart enough to have been slowly moving the tourist infrastructure in this direction for several years now. Everything from the tightening of visa regulations to the opening of theme parks oriented (pardon the pun) towards more Asian sensibilities, is based upon tourism becoming far more dependent upon regional, and especially Chinese tourism, in the future.

This is a slow process, not a change that will happen overnight, but the change has been clear for several years now. Thailand will morph into the equivalent of Spain and France for Chinese vacation seekers, the islands the new Mallorca. Might want to invest in a sunscreen company to prevent the white skinned Chinese from becoming like lobster colored Brits on vacation. With airfares from Europe and North America becoming increasingly prohibitive, the Bangkok elite will indeed only receive their "quality" Farang tourists.

Lay off this 'Bangkok elite' stuff. The PPP are upcountry jao por types pure and simple.

If anything goes wrong why is there a knee jerk response to blame Bangkok elite?

No one even really knows who these elite are anyhow. First they were the army and military running the country during the coup. Then they were the people behind the army and military. Then they were the people trying to not let PPP win. And now they are also the idiots at the PPP as well?

Impressive credentials, but somewhat unfounded. We had the closest to the 'Bangkok elite' running the TAT last year, and they wanted quality over quantity. That is definitely not what this harebrained scheme is aimed at.

[jasreeve17]

No doubt India and China will be the wave of the future. If it is any consolation they will try all the scams on them as well.

I think it's more likely that the Thais will be scammed by the Chinese and Indians than the other way around.

It's an interesting point. Thais are good at scamming stupid foreigners like me, but they are not really up there with the top scammers of the World.

Another point / question. Are the Thais happy at the move from Western tourists to Chinese tourists? - if indeed this is the case, or likely to be. Obviously the first wave of 'tourists' took over the country (Taksin, Samak...), and were fully accepted (unlike Malaysia) which leads to a lot of elitism and pro Chinese thought, particularly in Bangkok.

I've noticed that around the Grand Palace we get an ever increasing quantity of Chinese tourists, and they are thoroughly disliked by the Thais I speak to. Some people will say that money is money, which is true, but the spitting, littering, lack of awareness of others and general rudeness seems to upset a lot of the local boat people / hawkers / cafe owners who've seen a lot of different types of tourists over the years.

Edited March 17, 2008 by jasreeve17

[younghusband]

The Bangkok elite, despite their obsessive greed, are smart enough to have been slowly moving the tourist infrastructure in this direction for several years now. Everything from the tightening of visa regulations to the opening of theme parks oriented (pardon the pun) towards more Asian sensibilities, is based upon tourism becoming far more dependent upon regional, and especially Chinese tourism, in the future.

This is a slow process, not a change that will happen overnight, but the change has been clear for several years now. Thailand will morph into the equivalent of Spain and France for Chinese vacation seekers, the islands the new Mallorca. Might want to invest in a sunscreen company to prevent the white skinned Chinese from becoming like lobster colored Brits on vacation. With airfares from Europe and North America becoming increasingly prohibitive, the Bangkok elite will indeed only receive their "quality" Farang tourists.

Lay off this 'Bangkok elite' stuff. The PPP are upcountry jao por types pure and simple.

If anything goes wrong why is there a knee jerk response to blame Bangkok elite?

No one even really knows who these elite are anyhow. First they were the army and military running the country during the coup. Then they were the people behind the army and military. Then they were the people trying to not let PPP win. And now they are also the idiots at the PPP as well?

Impressive credentials, but somewhat unfounded. We had the closest to the 'Bangkok elite' running the TAT last year, and they wanted quality over quantity. That is definitely not what this harebrained scheme is aimed at.

But I know exactly what Johpa means by the Bangkok elite and its obsessive greed.In your response it appears you have a fairly clear idea as well.The ambiguity you identify is the PPP leadership position.Samak is strongly identified as a Bangkok elite member by virtue of his past actions and royalist affiliations.His disgusting recent remarks on Burma accurately reflect......still, better not go there.His position reflects his feud with Prem, shrewd political opportunism on the part of Thaksin and himself, and an understanding that he is bombproof (see reference to affiliations above) on the most sensitive charge levied against Thaksin.

[wintermute]

No doubt India and China will be the wave of the future. If it is any consolation they will try all the scams on them as well.

I think it's more likely that the Thais will be scammed by the Chinese and Indians than the other way around.

It's an interesting point. Thais are good at scamming stupid foreigners like me, but they are not really up there with the top scammers of the World.

Another point / question. Are the Thais happy at the move from Western tourists to Chinese tourists? - if indeed this is the case, or likely to be. Obviously the first wave of tourists took over the country (Taksin, Samak...), and were fully accepted (unlike Malaysia) which leads to a lot of elitism and pro Chinese thought, particularly in Bangkok.

I've noticed that around the Grand Palace we get an ever increasing quantity of Chinese tourists, and they are thoroughly disliked by the Thais I speak to. Some people will say that money is money, which is true, but the spitting, littering, lack of awareness of others and general rudeness seems to upset a lot of the local boat people / hawkers / cafe owners who've seen a lot of different types of tourists over the years.

The last couple waves of Chinese immigrants in Thailand were hardly tourists. They came here due to very dim economic prospects in wartorn China at the time. They were looking primarily for entry into Thailand as entrepeneurs and middle men. They managed to succeed wildly at both in less than a hundred years time. Look at all the hi-so BKK families..i'd estimate that at least a solid 75% of them are Chinese-Thai. Unlike many of the farang on this forum I don't feel any particular animosity towards the Chinese-Thai BKK elite. They came and filled a much needed business gap in SE Asian society. The original Thais lacked business acumen plain and simple because it's just not a part of their culture.

I predict that very savvy Chinese or Chinese-Thai tour operators will end up opening their own businesses in Thailand to take advantage of the Chinese tourist influx. So that means all that tourist baht will go right back into the hands of Chinese entrepeneurs. Chinese package tour companies make a killing but you basically have to understand the market and be Chinese to succeed in it.

[Plus]

Well, I don't know who Johpa means by elite, and Samak is not "elite" in any sense, his family served the royals, fine, but that doesn't make him "elite", he simply lacks class.

[jasreeve17]

I agree with Wintermute that the Chinese have helped Thailand to grow dramatically with their undoubted business skills. Other attributes like extreme corruption are the downside.

(I strongly believe that the Chinese version of corruption is very much more extreme than the Western European version [certainly in the modern age] that I'm more used to. I know skim 10% of the top. The Chinese version might leave 10% in the pot if the pot is lucky.)

An interesting point regarding the 'first wave of Chinese tourists' is that they came here, and very successfully gained a lot of money, land and general wealth, but have now changed to be very protectionalist. For example, Mr T won't let me come here and buy land / a business, but he is very happy to take advantage of buying land and businesses in other countries which is exactly what his recent forefathers did in Thailand.

My belief is that the Chinese tendancy (whether in Tibet or Thailand) is to take over then change the rules for their benefit. If they're the majority that's ok, but if they are not it's not ok. Hence why the Tibetans hate the Chinese, and the majority of Thais dislike the Bangkok Chinese Thais.

The Chinese, and anyone else, are welcome to come and go where they please. Their take all attitude (just like the British empire had, but has know changed for the better) is not welcome.

I always liked Chinese people and culture until I moved to Asia (Mongolia about six years ago) and realised the strong empirical mechanics that drive China on. Very worrying... Now, I still like them, but worry about their motives.

Again I agree with Wintermute that the Chinese will further dominate and take over Thailand in the future. For better and worse.

Edited March 17, 2008 by jasreeve17

[jasreeve17]

Well, I don't know who Johpa means by elite, and Samak is not "elite" in any sense, his family served the royals, fine, but that doesn't make him "elite", he simply lacks class.

He lacks many things.

But you don't need class to be part of the Bangkok elite. You need money.

(This brings together the newer generations of rich Chinese businessmen and the older generation of feudal land owners, army and other. Generally a group of people that seem to hate the mass Thai population, and use the country as their personal bank account.)

[PadThaiGuy]

I would advise the Government to take a look at Pattaya, Chewang Beach, Patong Beach area.

Is this what they really want to happen to all the potential tourism sites?

[younghusband]

Well, I don't know who Johpa means by elite, and Samak is not "elite" in any sense, his family served the royals, fine, but that doesn't make him "elite", he simply lacks class.

If you don't know what "elite" means in the Thai political context perhaps it would be more circumspect not to be so definite whether Samak is part of it or not.Actually, as I suspect you know perfectly well, his record speaks for itself and when the chips are down he would always side with the old guard.As to "class", I'm not sure in turn entirely what this means: I know a few upper class Thais who by any standards are gentlemen in the old fashioned definition, courteous and sensitive to other viewpoints, conscious of their responsibilities to the less fortunate.But the distinguishing feature of many elite Thais is their colossal vulgarity: certainly Samak is a boor but I'm not sure how exceptional.It's a pity because as recently as 40 years ago beautiful Thai manners were the rule rather than the exception.

[wintermute]

Again I agree with Wintermute that the Chinese will further dominate and take over Thailand in the future. For better and worse.

Interestingly enough the most successful "outsiders" (I don't really count the Chinese as outsiders these days) are the Japanese. Their soft approach to cooperative business has netted them many profitable ventures in Thailand including a near monopoly with Toyota in the consumer vehicle market. Thailand is really a model of how Asia investment will turn out in the future. Major NE Asian countries (Japan, Korea, China) and secondary (Taiwan, Singapore) economies will come in with the big venture capitalist bucks and invest in a culture they understand and have an advantage in. This is why western investment hasn't been all that successful in Thailand. For every western corporate success story in SE Asia I can name about 5 asian ones.

[Plus]

If you don't know what "elite" means in the Thai political context perhaps it would be more circumspect not to be so definite whether Samak is part of it or not.

I don't know who Johpa meant by elites. He, and some others, have been avoiding explaining who exactly they have in mind. It seems it's a convenient boogey man, evoked for any suitable occasion. One thing they have in common - they are from Bangkok. Some say it's the money that defines them, some say it's aristocratic roots, some say class, some say elites are Chinese.

I'd say what defines them is hatred - if you don't like someone, call them Bangkok elites.

Another thing I'm certain of - in the current climate all those various "elites" are very much at odds with each other.

Again, it's up to Johpa to clarify who he meant by elites that have been screwing Western tourists for a while now. And are they really all from Bangkok.

Edited March 17, 2008 by Plus

[younghusband]

Again I agree with Wintermute that the Chinese will further dominate and take over Thailand in the future. For better and worse.

Interestingly enough the most successful "outsiders" (I don't really count the Chinese as outsiders these days) are the Japanese. Their soft approach to cooperative business has netted them many profitable ventures in Thailand including a near monopoly with Toyota in the consumer vehicle market. Thailand is really a model of how Asia investment will turn out in the future. Major NE Asian countries (Japan, Korea, China) and secondary (Taiwan, Singapore) economies will come in with the big venture capitalist bucks and invest in a culture they understand and have an advantage in. This is why western investment hasn't been all that successful in Thailand. For every western corporate success story in SE Asia I can name about 5 asian ones.

This seems quite plausible on a quick reading but in fact, as most who have experience of the Thai manafacturing and finance sectors will appreciate, is rather inaccurate and misleading.It's true that the Japanese are by far the largest investor here but the bulk of it represents comprador type arrangements for cheap manafacturing in the context of the "hollowing out" of their domestic industry.Technology transfer tends to be rather limited as does the training of Thai staff.Typically a Japanese enterprise here employs their own nationals to an extent Americans and Europeans find incredible.

It's also a fallacy to think there is a pan-Asian culture which gives regional players an advantage in Thailand.I suspect none of the Asian countries mentioned have an edge because of cultural affinity, though there are of course some Chinese connections (not by any means from all parts of China) which can provide an advantage (but in practice it's more relevant for Thais investing in China).Koreans for example haven't had a clue here or elsewhere in SE Asia.Singapore is also notoriously adrift in Thailand.The other side of the coin is that Western multinationals have done extremely well in Thailand, in some cases for over one hundred years.

Where did the notion of the Asian "soft approach to co-operative business" come from? It's news to me and I suspect also to the many Thai joint venture partners.

The part about Asians providing massive venture capital support is I'm afraid just plain silly.Does the poster understand anything about private equity. where it comes from and its (miniscule) role in Thailand and why it's likely to remain that way?

[wintermute]

This seems quite plausible on a quick reading but in fact, as most who have experience of the Thai manafacturing and finance sectors will appreciate, is rather inaccurate and misleading.It's true that the Japanese are by far the largest investor here but the bulk of it represents comprador type arrangements for cheap manafacturing in the context of the "hollowing out" of their domestic industry.Technology transfer tends to be rather limited as does the training of Thai staff.Typically a Japanese enterprise here employs their own nationals to an extent Americans and Europeans find incredible.

They are relocating factories and using Japanese engineers and management to build cars, trucks, and parts to sell to a domestic Thai industry. They are hiring their own experts in a foreign country and selling directly to the nationals of the country they are in. You mean they aren't making any money? Gee, could have fooled me. Especially with that 70%+ consumer marketshare Toyota has over the market.

It's also a fallacy to think there is a pan-Asian culture which gives regional players an advantage in Thailand.I suspect none of the Asian countries mentioned have an edge because of cultural affinity, though there are of course some Chinese connections (not by any means from all parts of China) which can provide an advantage (but in practice it's more relevant for Thais investing in China).Koreans for example haven't had a clue here or elsewhere in SE Asia.Singapore is also notoriously adrift in Thailand.The other side of the coin is that Western multinationals have done extremely well in Thailand, in some cases for over one hundred years.

I think you're behind on the times. Look at everything from IT, to sino-thai business enterprise, and government connections. It's very pan-asian these days. Singapore has always been deeply involved in Thai business deals aside from the notorious Temasek sovreign investment fund. Also, you'll have to state which western multinationals are doing "extremely well" in Thailand. I see a lot of western multinationals actually taking losses in hope for a future middle class SE asian marketshare but none that are doing blockbuster business to the extent that you say. Just go take a stroll in the supermarket sometime..which consumer brands do you see on the shelves? I see a lot more Samsung, Sony, Acer, Benq, Sharp, than western based brands.

The part about Asians providing massive venture capital support is I'm afraid just plain silly.Does the poster understand anything about private equity. where it comes from and its (miniscule) role in Thailand and why it's likely to remain that way?

If you're going to be condescending I expect you to at least back up some of your blather with facts.

Edited March 17, 2008 by wintermute

[younghusband]

Wintermute,

I wasn't saying Asian investors don't do well in Thailand nor that they are not the predominant presence.I was saying tthat the cultural advantage you cite is hugely overstated.Japanese,Korean, Taiwanese and Singaporean investors have had as frustrating an experience with Thai jv partners as any Western company.As to private equity I'm sorry if I appeared condescending but, sovereign wealth funds aside, what Asian venture capital investors do you have in mind? Greenfield businesses aren't usually funded by venture capital anyway.

[Johpa]

Well, I don't know who Johpa means by elite, and Samak is not "elite" in any sense, his family served the royals, fine, but that doesn't make him "elite", he simply lacks class.

The elite are the people who control the money, mostly now Thai-Chinese (e.g. Sophonpanich family) along with a smattering of old school high sakdina families. Most politicians around the globe are not actual members of the elite, but they do represent the various interests of the elite, and are usually rewarded one way or another for representing the elite.

One might view Thaksin as an odd example as one who was not from the elite, but eventually became powerful (wealthy enough) to challenge the elite. That test of wills is ongoing.

[Johpa]

Again, it's up to Johpa to clarify who he meant by elites that have been screwing Western tourists for a while now. And are they really all from Bangkok.

I did not mean, and I am not sure how you inferred from my original post that I was implying that the elites were screwing western tourists. I mean everyone tries to scam tourists, not just Thais. My original post was noting that the elite was aware that the future of tourism was going to be more regional than it is today with its dependency upon western tourism. It is my belief that there is a policy slowly orients tourisms towards East Asian tastes as that is where the tourist income will be largely derived in the future.