Rates For Editing English Language Text.

[samran]

I have someone who we subcontracted some English editing work to – he specializes in editing listed company’s annual reports, websites, analyst presentations etc. Stuff that was orginially drafted by Thais buts needed a bit of work before it is presentable.

Anyway, he’s the type of person who basically said ‘pay me what you think is fair’.

Basically he did about 2 days work fully editing an entire annual report which neared 100 odd pages – and did an excellent job. Farang native speaker by the way.

Does anyone know the going rate for such work?

Cheers

Samran

[andy1308]

Samran - my company does pretty much the same work although two-days work for 100 pages sounds petty fast. I edited a 66-page annual report a few months ago and it took twice as long. Perhaps I am just slow?

We charge in the region of 1,000 baht per page for a complete Thai-to-English translation and native English copy edit but we're a company and not an individual. And we're not the cheapest company offering this kind of service either.

Depending on the quality of the original Thai translation, and also what it would have cost commerically to get this work done, I reckon 10,000 - 15,000 baht would seem about right for his work - maybe a little more if you're feeling generous.

[samran]

Samran - my company does pretty much the same work although two-days work for 100 pages sounds petty fast. I edited a 66-page annual report a few months ago and it took twice as long. Perhaps I am just slow?

We charge in the region of 1,000 baht per page for a complete Thai-to-English translation and native English copy edit but we're a company and not an individual. And we're not the cheapest company offering this kind of service either.

Depending on the quality of the original Thai translation, and also what it would have cost commerically to get this work done, I reckon 10,000 - 15,000 baht would seem about right for his work - maybe a little more if you're feeling generous.

thanks for that andy.

The person (American) in question while speaking Thai extremely well (lived here for 20+ years) didn't do any translation, and the written text was done by a Thai's who's English is pretty good, but not 'native'. So that probably explains the speed.

Regardless, I think the rate sounds about - unless you think otherwise...

Cheers

Samran.

[photojourn]

Two days for 100 pages sounds pretty fast to me also.

It indicates to me that either the original material was pretty clean to start with, or the editor put a lot of hours into it over the two days.

I charge Bt 4,000 a day but that is text editing, grammar and punctuation only. No translation. If the copy was pretty clean I guess two to three days sounds about right so I think your in the right range at Bt 10,000 to Bt 15,000.

[PeaceBlondie]

I cannot list his website on here, but my friend (a ThaiVisa member)charges TWO CENTS ($0.02) per word, as I recall. He is American, very good, experienced, and works fast from English texts written by Thais.

[elkangorito]

In the recent past, I have edited/checked several documents for a Thai university student (neighbour) & a couple of documents for businesses. On all occassions I have done this for free (stupid me). The Thai university student achieved "A's" with regard to his submitted thesis (my editing work).

As a general rule, it takes me about 6 to 8 hours to fully edit a 50 to 60 page document, which has been written in reasonably good English by a Thai. It takes me a lot longer if the standard of English is worse.

In the case of the commercial (business) documents, they related somewhat to my field of engineering & as such, I basically had to re-design the whole document. It was about 4 pages but took me about 2 hours to do a rush job (there was a deadline). Strangely, none of my Thai colleagues who are also English teachers, seemed to understand my frustration about being placed in such a tedious situation.

Anyway, thanks for the advice about pricing such a service. I shall tentatively make these costs aware to all those who seem to think that this service is "easy".

Edited April 29, 2008 by elkangorito

[photojourn]

I cannot list his website on here, but my friend (a ThaiVisa member)charges a penny a word, as I recall. He is American, very good, experienced, and works fast from English texts written by Thais.

I can never understand how people charge like this. Is that based on:

1. the number of words supplied in the original document?

2. the number of words in the final document?

3. The number of words added minus the number of words removed?

In all seriousness you could start with a 1,000 word text comprising mostly gibberish and after spending many hours on it be left with 500 mostly different words that concisely captures the meaning.

Per hour/day rates are to me the only way to charge as it accurately reflects the the skill required and the quality of the original text. Many authors are lazy with their original text when they know that it is going to be passed to an editor to tighten/clean up.

[Ray1167]

Where would one begin looking for work in this field ? It sounds like quite a simple way to make some additional money. I am English , semi retired and living in Bangkok at present. Thanks in advance

[andy1308]

Where would one begin looking for work in this field ? It sounds like quite a simple way to make some additional money. I am English , semi retired and living in Bangkok at present. Thanks in advance

Simple? Perhaps, but even to me as someone with 16+ years experience in editing and publishing it's not easy work.

I would suggest one starting point would be to approach some of the English language publishing companies here in Thailand. Quite often they have articles translated into Thai that need editing and, in many cases, rewriting. The Annual Reports market would be pretty difficult to break into; there are three or four big players that handle most of that work. Those companies also supply global Investor Relations and PR services, produce digital editions of the Annual Reports, etc, so it's not something a freelance can do easily.

The most important things for me, as someone who has employed English rewriters in the past (but I am not looking right now, before anyone asks), is previous experience and competence. I would need someone who I can trust to produce excellent copy without the need for me to still give it the once-over. I've only worked with one person so far here who I can say that about.

[PeaceBlondie]

I cannot list his website on here, but my friend (a ThaiVisa member)charges TWO CENTS ($0.02) per word, as I recall. He is American, very good, experienced, and works fast from English texts written by Thais.

I can never understand how people charge like this. Is that based on:

1. the number of words supplied in the original document?

2. the number of words in the final document?

3. The number of words added minus the number of words removed?

In all seriousness you could start with a 1,000 word text comprising mostly gibberish and after spending many hours on it be left with 500 mostly different words that concisely captures the meaning.

Per hour/day rates are to me the only way to charge as it accurately reflects the the skill required and the quality of the original text. Many authors are lazy with their original text when they know that it is going to be passed to an editor to tighten/clean up.

1. words in the original document

You take what you receive, count the words electronically, fix as needed, and show that you are many times better than the author.

Per hour makes sense if you can get it, but how do they know how well you utilize your time? I would tell a repeat customer that next time, they will pay at least 50% more unless they give me a better manuscript to edit.

Somewhat like teaching English, you cannot simply do editing work because your Mum taught you Cockney or Hillbilly. Your grammar, punctuation, spelling, and sense of proper idiomatic usage must be 99.99% perfect.

[samran]

interesting debate we've started - good for the TV search engine me thinks!!

Thanks for all the responses (but don't let that stop the discussion). Thanks also to PB for the PM you sent. Mucho gracias, my friend.

For the record, we agreed upon 10K. All up it was 80-90 pages of work (a bit less than I put into the OP), plus a bit of project management. Estimate was 9-10 hours of work at short notice. As I said, output was excellent, as this person works in banking and does this stuff on the side -and value was added in quering statements etc that were in the report, so it required a good degree of financial literacy as well.

[andy1308]

I cannot list his website on here, but my friend (a ThaiVisa member)charges TWO CENTS ($0.02) per word, as I recall. He is American, very good, experienced, and works fast from English texts written by Thais.

I can never understand how people charge like this. Is that based on:

1. the number of words supplied in the original document?

2. the number of words in the final document?

3. The number of words added minus the number of words removed?

In all seriousness you could start with a 1,000 word text comprising mostly gibberish and after spending many hours on it be left with 500 mostly different words that concisely captures the meaning.

Per hour/day rates are to me the only way to charge as it accurately reflects the the skill required and the quality of the original text. Many authors are lazy with their original text when they know that it is going to be passed to an editor to tighten/clean up.

1. words in the original document

You take what you receive, count the words electronically, fix as needed, and show that you are many times better than the author.

Per hour makes sense if you can get it, but how do they know how well you utilize your time? I would tell a repeat customer that next time, they will pay at least 50% more unless they give me a better manuscript to edit.

Somewhat like teaching English, you cannot simply do editing work because your Mum taught you Cockney or Hillbilly. Your grammar, punctuation, spelling, and sense of proper idiomatic usage must be 99.99% perfect.

... and style. That was my biggest problem. Every publication has its own style (or should have) and it takes time for writers to understand that.

[steveromagnino]

Samran

I have a guy that would be good at putting together the actual presentation, and also brushing up the text stuff as well, American born Chinese.....them Chinese, they might have small eyes, but those eyes are good at details aye.

My guess is the consulting work he does nets him probably somewhere around 150-300k a month, breaking that into work days, that's about somewhere between 7k - 15k a day. And he is doing a fair bit more most of the time getting a dump of data and working it into a story) compared to what you are asking for.

I'd say 10k for 2 days is pretty decent money, but you aren't probably overpaying if the guy is decent.

Takes some skill to proof financial documents etc, there is a reason it is so obtuse sometimes.

GOod thread.

[photojourn]

>> Where would one begin looking for work in this field ? It sounds like quite a simple way to make some additional money. I am English , semi retired and living in Bangkok at present. Thanks in advance <<

This is typical of the attitude that many people have. Just because you are a native-English speaker doesn't make you an editor, a proofreader, or an English language teacher. Journalists spend years learning their craft before they get moved to the editing tables, the same as professional English language teachers study the and meet professional standards.

PeaceBlondie is spot on when he says: "Somewhat like teaching English, you cannot simply do editing work because your Mum taught you Cockney or Hillbilly. Your grammar, punctuation, spelling, and sense of proper idiomatic usage must be 99.99% perfect."

The problem is that people who take the attitude that because they can speak English they are "qualified" to edit (or teach) are the one's who try to fill in their spare time editing or teaching for Chang money rates and lower both the standards and rates for professionals in each field.

[steveromagnino]

The problem is that people who take the attitude that because they can speak English they are "qualified" to edit (or teach) are the one's who try to fill in their spare time editing or teaching for Chang money rates and lower both the standards and rates for professionals in each field.

I'd say that's similar to most professions, which explains why most architecture, teaching, writing and business processes are &lt;deleted&gt; the world over.

But for sure, Thailand is a magnet for people whose only marketable skill seems to be a slight grasp of the english language. And many Thai businesses aren't adept enough to recognise just how slight that grasp is.

[photojourn]

If anyone needs an example of poorly presented English text they need look no further than the product and supplier descriptions in the new Thaivisa food section. With examples such as the following I doubt if anyone has bothered editing this material before it was thrown up on the web.

So typical of many Asian firms. Spend a lot of money on a project and them scrimp and save when it comes to the the proofing, editing and English language text or promotional material and then wonder why they fail to get their message across.

Whoever wrote these probably thinks he or she is fluent in the English language too.

>>Chicken Burger 125 gram 1/4 pound made from finely ground chicken breast select herbs and spices a chicken lovers paradise just add your favorite salads and sauces and you're on your way. Easy to cook and a convenient fast prepared meal

Whole 22Kg Australian Lamb Spit Roast delivered to your door with the spit and the cook ideal for all those special occasions will feed up to 35 people the Lamb is slowly roasted on a electric spit over volcanic rock the taste is absolutely exceptional you will impress all your family and friends for an all up cost of only bt12500 delivered (Bangkok area only at this stage!!!) Or if you want to buy a whole lamb email us and we will give a good price.<<

Without dwelling on the capitalisation, punctuation and grammar, I wonder how the cooks feel about being delivered all over Bangkok? And all those exclamation marks?

[photojourn]

This was written by someone who boasted at having attended an Ivy League College and who claims to be the holder of a PhD.

>>Ever since the investiture and elevation of Her Majesty Queen Sirikit to the highest rank of queenship alongside His Majesty the King more than 50 years ago, Her Majesty has tirelessly engaged in countless projects to improve the lives of her regional poor.<<

This was written by professional journalist and editor.

>>Since her marriage to His Majesty King Bhumibol Adulyadej and investiture as Queen more than 50 years ago, Her Majesty Queen Sirikit of Thailand has undertaken countless projects aimed at improving the lives of Thailand's poor.<<

A queenship? I know of warships, sailing ships, sunken ships and perhaps even ghost ships, but a queenship?

Just because you can speak English and just because you went to an Ivy League college and have a PhD doesn't make you a writer or an editor.

[photojourn]

Just to keep this topic alive and because it's relevant I was contacted by an advertiser recently who was looking for someone with excellent English language writing and internet research skills. However when contacted his budget was Bt8,000-10,000 per month for a 40-hour week "or else I'll fail."

Seems like a project destined to failure then. Thai nationals with moderate to good English writing skills get around BT15,000 -20,000 month, yet this fellow wants native English speaking writers for half of this.

Seems someone got on the plane without doing their research properly. I don't know why anyone would bother leaving their home country to spend 40-hours a week working for Bt 62.50 (less than US$1.90) per hour using their own equipment.

[andy1308]

That's crazy. 8,000 baht? Our office maid gets more than that !!!

Yes - for around 18,000 - 20,000 baht you will get a Thai national journalist/writer with reasonable English writing skills, however in my experience you still need to copy edit their work to make it read well to a native English reader. Even paying more does not guarantee quality.

Photojourn's advertiser is doomed to failure.