Price Of Dirt!?

[beechstreet]

My wife and I are getting ready to build in Nonthaburi, and of course we need to raise the land up about 1.5 meters (Bangkok is sinking remember?). We got a quote that seemed pretty darn high compared to the numbers discussed in this dirt thread. We just got two truck loads so they could start building our fence, and it cost 6,000 baht (gasp!)... looked like approximately 9 cubic meters of nastiness (mostly hard clay, full of trash and chunks of concrete).

What have you guys paid for dirt recently? Any suggestions on who/where to get some good old fashioned dirt? We need about 4,000 cubic meters!

Thanks!

David

(By the way, I am glad to have found this forum...!)

[Gary A]

My wife and I are getting ready to build in Nonthaburi, and of course we need to raise the land up about 1.5 meters (Bangkok is sinking remember?). We got a quote that seemed pretty darn high compared to the numbers discussed in this dirt thread. We just got two truck loads so they could start building our fence, and it cost 6,000 baht (gasp!)... looked like approximately 9 cubic meters of nastiness (mostly hard clay, full of trash and chunks of concrete).

What have you guys paid for dirt recently? Any suggestions on who/where to get some good old fashioned dirt? We need about 4,000 cubic meters!

Thanks!

David

(By the way, I am glad to have found this forum...!)

I have at least 1,500 cubic meters you can have for free. The only problem is that you have to come to Loei to pick it up.

It all depends on your location. Up country where there are irrigation projects being built (ponds) the only cost is the hauling.

[Cuban]

I'm sure you will be aware the cost for a couple of loads will be more than for your 4,000 m³ 'contract'.

But 666 Baht per cubic metre of questionable fill seems somewhat high to say the least. Ask what rate they would give for the full 4,000 m³ contract. If they start at 2 Million Baht plus you know that you are being treated as a sucker. Did your wife baulk at the quoted price?

As Gary suggests the cost is mostly fuel, there has been just over a 50% increase in fuel price since last year's prices so you could use a rough guide from my own experiance last year of about 350 Baht per 4m³ truck for fairly local haulage, with today's diesel rates (42 Baht a litre) allow for about 525(?) Baht per 4m³ truck - but this will vary with distance.

I guess a reasonable figure is in the range 500,000 - 700,000 Baht for your 4,000 m³ contract dependant on distance?

My 'contract' for was about 500 trucks in the end, the requirement was for a height increase over an irregular shaped section of land. And the per truck fee included onsite distribution and compacting the soil (local red sandy loam) with a tracked earth moving machine, not quite a grader but similar.

Employ a family member to count the trucks delivering to your site.

HTH

------------------------------------------------

PS

Don't guess the amount of soil you are getting per truck, measure the load space and estimate the % fill. I climbed into the bin and measured it. If you can commincate with the contractor attempt to get the truck filled to a higher capacity per trip - you will pay less overall. 1,000 Truck trips at 4m³ or 800 truck trips at 5m³ - you can see that it's worth the effort!

Edited June 25, 2008 by Cuban

[beechstreet]

Gary, Thanks for the offer...I've been racking my brain trying to come up with creative ways to 'Shawshank' the dirt down here... I'll have to run the numbers but I wonder how much free dirt 500,000 baht of postage would get me???

Cuban, Thanks for your additional insight. The dirt was part of a fence/wall contract that is being coordinated by a family member so we are somewhat disconnected from the specifics of the agreement...but based on what we saw & were told we started to get real nervous about the rest of the site work. The fence isn't done yet so we might have prepaid for dirt that hasn't arrived yet (I hope!). I'll keep your numbers in mind as I start to solicit bids and will report back with any updates.

If anyone else has a lead or suggestions be sure to let me know!

[Gary A]

To need that much fill, you must have a couple of rai. Have you considered putting in a pond and using that dirt?

[beechstreet]

Yeah 2.25 rai and it's pretty low...the land is an old durian grove. The trees are long gone but it's still striated by the irrigation ditches, which are always at least half full of water. So most of the site is only about .5 meter above the level of the adjacent klong. But once we fill the ditches then the land is still a solid 1.5 meters below the level of the soi.

Eventually my wife's parents will move here, as well as her uncle, so we've spent quite a bit of time master planning the site and trying to figure out the phasing of each project. We figure about 4,000 cubic meters will fill the ditches and raise the land where we plan to build our house (as well as a few areas where we would like to plant some long term trees). We'll worry about the other houses when the time comes.

We thought about a pond but decided that we would prefer a series of small ponds rather than one big one, which wouldn't supply us with a significant amount of dirt...

[maprao]

Very much depends on area and how far they have to travel. I purchased 50 trucks recently (large truck filled to different levels ) I paid 480 Baht per truck. It was in the Sakeo region.

Again employ somebody to count the trucks. I thought it was a fairly reasonable price. How big were the trucks well see attached picture.

[soundman]

Really depends on how far you have to travel from the source of the fill to the destination given the current high fuel prices.

My father in laws company would charge about 1200B per 14m3 (20 tons) truck load including about 10km's of driving per load.

So if you need 4000m3 (compacted), you'll need to order 4800m3 (20% compaction factor), or about 350 truck loads.

Another calculation based on above is around 140 truck loads to raise 1 rai by 1 metre. or about 168,000B per 1 rai 1 metre based on the earth pick up point not being over 5km's from the dlivery site.

Cheers,

Soundman.

[gregb]

Here in Rangsit on the other side of the river from Nonthaburi, I can't find it for less than 200 baht per m3. That is for 300 10 wheel truck loads...about 3000 m3.

Any body who has an idea on how to get it cheaper I am all ears. I'm happy to pay 300k for the service, but 600k is outside of budget. I have talked to alot of property developers in Bangkok, and they all pay 600k baht per rai for filling land.

Dirt is extremely expensive down here.

[Beardog]

Very much depends on area and how far they have to travel. I purchased 50 trucks recently (large truck filled to different levels ) I paid 480 Baht per truck. It was in the Sakeo region.

Again employ somebody to count the trucks. I thought it was a fairly reasonable price. How big were the trucks well see attached picture.

In Pattaya-Bang Sare same size truck 750 baht per truck all red compacted soil for building, no debris just dirt. This year 800 maybe 850 now . I checked 3 months ago at 800 & fuel has gone up.

Price included a tractor to level or grade.

[soundman]

Keeping the cost of delivery in perspective.

Running costs plus margin on ten wheel truck - about 20b - 25b per kilometre.

[missismiggins]

Wow, that is some expensive dirt!

I bought that "red" shale like stone/dirt from up in the hills of Chiang Mai, that was only 400 baht/5M/3 and that included a tractor and driver to spreadit.

1 year Earlier we were buying the stone dredged from the Ping river, that was only 280 baht 5m/3 but no tractor.

I guess a lot of it has to do with location i.e. the availability of dirt, and the distance hauled - The Ping is not 100m from me and the dredging is about 2-3km away, so we are quite lucky.

[JimmyGreaves]

Last year paid 900baht for a truck load in Hua Hin. The girlfriend tells me it's 1,200 baht + now.

Hua Hin is a building site.

[beechstreet]

Well we visited the site today and met with a guy that was referred to us by an uncle...he is going to give us an itemized bid early next week. Said he would give per truck numbers on "good" dirt and not great dirt. Also talked to a neighbor who said he would get us some phone numbers of other sources. So ideally I'll have a couple of bids to choose from. I'll keep y'all updated, and thanks for all the input!

[beechstreet]

...I have talked to alot of property developers in Bangkok, and they all pay 600k baht per rai for filling land...

Hey Greg,

When you say 600k baht per rai is that for 1 meter in depth?

[beechstreet]

Here's an update: We gathered 3 bids from separate contractors, hoping to be able to compare "apples to apples." However, each contractor offered something slightly different, so it was a bit difficult to compare the 3 bids. One promised pure topsoil, another promised the soil that is found below topsoil, another promised a layer of topsoil above a layer of crushed and compacted construction debris, claiming it would be a more stable foundation (and cheaper). Some contractors also said that grading should be done in the dry season, since dirt is more readily available (because other construction projects are starting up, and with excavation comes dirt!). Others said the rainy season is a better time to fill and grade, since the moist soil is easier to work with. So far, everyone has a different logic. The only true constant is that gas prices are rising, and the way I see it, time = inflation.

The total depth of fill needed, depending on the location on the site, ranges from 1.8 meters to 2.1 meters. The total area to be filled is 1520 square meters (almost 1 rai). In short, we are trying to raise approximately 1 rai of land by 2 meters. Because our property is in a small soi with a freshly-paved concrete street, 10-wheelers are not allowed, and thus the contractors had to take into account an increased number of trips using their 6-wheelers instead. I have heard different holding capacities of 6-wheeler trucks, ranging from 5 cubic meters per truck to 7 cubic meters per truck.

Basically, the contractor who is most likely going to get the job has offered us soil for 220 Baht/cubic meter. This is soil that is excavated from rice fields, although it is not topsoil, she claims, but the layer of soil that lies beneath the topsoil. She claims it is still fertile soil, but not recommended for serious gardening. This is okay with us, since we are mainly going to build a house and a gravel road on this fill (and a few small trees and bushes here and there).

This is the calculation for the bid:

2892 cubic meters (total compacted volume) x 1.2 (a compaction factor of 20%) x 220 Baht/cubic meter = 763,488 Baht

She estimates the job will be completed in 7 days. Another reason we are deciding to go with her is that she has previously done work for my wife's uncle before, which, in many ways, makes her more reliable/predictable than the other two contractors whom we found from either the phone book or driving around.

FYI, prices for pure topsoil range from 240 Baht/cubic meter to 300 Baht/cubic meter, depending on who we ask. Sand is 300 Baht/cubic meter. Prices for raising 1 rai of land by 1 meter (using 10-wheelers) range from 250,000 Baht to 350,000 Baht. All contractors that put together bids for us are in the Nonthaburi area.

Edited July 16, 2008 by beechstreet

[beechstreet]

Also, it might be worth noting that the 1 rai/1 meter numbers that the contractors give out are supposed to imply 1 meter of compacted soil... so they are actually trucking more than 1600 cubic meters to the site. We also found that contractors like to throw around cubic meter prices for both compacted and uncompacted soil-- it's like the classic used car salesman technique of confusion through numbers. I think as we progress on the house we are going to start making bidding contractors fill out a form, that we provide, in order for us to clearly compare their confusing prices.

[beechstreet]

Broke ground today!

[Loom]

Looks good! I've just checked the khamphaeng phet area and the going rate is Bt500 for a truck with more or less 10 cubic meters. Chiang mai is running more than twice that at around Bt700 for 5 cubic meters.

[RubbaJohnny]

Just ordered10 lorries at 400baht each

Nice alluvial soil 400Baht per truck which is c 10m3 which is almost exactly $1cubic yard

PS got lots of free housing materials steel piping etc if any members in C Rai can get here b4 the mrs throws it out.

Of course your delivery may be a facot mine is free as Ive done a lot of business with Khun Ong who I doubt pays apenny to trawl the MaeKhong.We operate on a dont ask dont tell and the odd bottle of Scotch to oil the wheels.He must be the cheapest excavator in the world if I could get him to Dublin for a holiday we could mint it tho driving his digger there could take a while

Edited August 10, 2008 by RubbaJohnny

[mikey4042]

Just joined the forum - was looking for the exact info you guys have been discussing !!

I see you paid 400baht per truck - can you help in giving me an idea how much it will cost to fill our land - i'm a little confused with all the conversion factors etc etc etc

Basically we have a piece of land in Chiang Rai, about 10 minutes from the airport, it's next to a small road and neesd raising up 1 meter to reach the road, it's currently used for rice.

I am looking to get a few contact numbers and prices and get this soil sorted to leave it for a couple of years before we start building the house.

I have had all sorts of quotes from different people, so it would be great to hear some real figures from people who have done this in the Chiang Rai region, and recently due to fuel price increases etc.

I suspect I need 1600sqm x 1.2 conversion factor (1920sqm) is this correct ?

Help !!!!!!

Many Thanks

Mike & Nat

Just ordered10 lorries at 400baht each

Nice alluvial soil 400Baht per truck which is c 10m3 which is almost exactly $1cubic yard

PS got lots of free housing materials steel piping etc if any members in C Rai can get here b4 the mrs throws it out.

Of course your delivery may be a facot mine is free as Ive done a lot of business with Khun Ong who I doubt pays apenny to trawl the MaeKhong.We operate on a dont ask dont tell and the odd bottle of Scotch to oil the wheels.He must be the cheapest excavator in the world if I could get him to Dublin for a holiday we could mint it tho driving his digger there could take a while

[Loom]

I suspect I need 1600sqm x 1.2 conversion factor (1920sqm) is this correct ?

That would give you fill for one rai 1.2 meters high. Cost would be your 1920 x 40 or Bt76800 if you can get trucks with 10 cubic meters for Bt 400 each.

You have topsoil from the rice field already. I'd recommend comparing the cost of for various grades of infill brought from the outside and to the cost of stripping the topsoil from your property, piling it up and spreading it over subsoil brought from the outside. The subsoil wouldn't cost as much as topsoil and the digging of topsoil from your property would cost a lot less than trucking almost anything in from outside.

However, this would take some explaining for your contractor. Three phases -- 1. Dig about 500 cubic meters of topsoil from your entire property and put it in piles around the property border, 2. truck in subsoil from outside ~1700-1800 cubic meters, and 3. Spread the topsoil over the subsoil fill. The contractor should quote you one price for digging, piling up and then re-spreading the topsoil; another price for fill trucked in from outside.

If that's too complicated, just have the dirt trucked in from the outside. Just be careful to end up with topsoil in the areas of your plot where you want to grow plants.

[mikey4042]

Great - Thanks for the info.

Does that seem the going rate about 400bt for a truck of soil to be delivered in Chiang Rai - seems seriously cheap for a huge truck of soil to be delivered. I am assuming from your message that I will need 192 trucks containing 10 cubic meters of soil to bring the land up 1 metre high when the land we have is one Rai (1600sqm * 1.2 compaction factor = 1920sqm) - is that true ?

I get what you mean about digging out the top soil and dumping in the cheaper soil - and replacing the top soil - it's certianly something I'll consider when speaking (or should I say my wife speaking lol) to the contractors.

Does anyone know of any reputable compaies around the Chiang Rai region that I could contact whilst we're over there to see if we can start to put togher some figures and get this sorted.

Edited August 12, 2008 by mikey4042

[Loom]

Your math looks right. The local village chief should know who to contact for this work.

[rufanuf]

I suspect I need 1600sqm x 1.2 conversion factor (1920sqm) is this correct ?

That would give you fill for one rai 1.2 meters high. Cost would be your 1920 x 40 or Bt76800 if you can get trucks with 10 cubic meters for Bt 400 each.

You have topsoil from the rice field already. I'd recommend comparing the cost of for various grades of infill brought from the outside and to the cost of stripping the topsoil from your property, piling it up and spreading it over subsoil brought from the outside. The subsoil wouldn't cost as much as topsoil and the digging of topsoil from your property would cost a lot less than trucking almost anything in from outside.

However, this would take some explaining for your contractor. Three phases -- 1. Dig about 500 cubic meters of topsoil from your entire property and put it in piles around the property border, 2. truck in subsoil from outside ~1700-1800 cubic meters, and 3. Spread the topsoil over the subsoil fill. The contractor should quote you one price for digging, piling up and then re-spreading the topsoil; another price for fill trucked in from outside.

If that's too complicated, just have the dirt trucked in from the outside. Just be careful to end up with topsoil in the areas of your plot where you want to grow plants.

Hi Loom,

I know this is an old thread...but hoping some life comes back into it...is the photo of your land? Was you digging a lake? Just interest in peoples experiences thats all.