Moving To Bankok. Fair Pay For Us Project Manager?

[Soutpeel]

If you think it's a salary, good on ya. To me it sounds like a freelance relationship. Are you working every day for example? Are you paid for holidays? What happens if you're sick? Is a month 22 days or 31 days? Do you get paid if you're not called to work? If the want to get rid of you, what severance rights do you have?

Anyway, US$750 after tax based is around 25,000 a day. Extrapolate that to a regular salary and you're talking 520,000 take home per month, or around 750k before tax. It's a good income, but not spectacular. And it's certainly not unusual for other expats like us on regular contracts with all the associated benefits mentioned above.

Actually it was + US$ 750 a day, 750 a day was cited as being an average type day rate, as regards freelanch, I would define this a someone who works for multiple companies on short term basis, typically through their own company and takes care of their own taxes, which is not the case in the examples given, indivduals are working on long term contracts with one company, typically 4 years + so per my definition.... not freelance.

Take home based on the your examples ie THB 750k is actually after tax, not gross based on average dayrate.

As regards the number of days again this varies could be 22 day month could be 31 depends on what is going on and needs to be done.

Granted you dont get paid if you are not in work, and of course its a contract position, if the contract gets cancelled, you are out of a job, and suppose severance per Thai law could be applicable, never had to test this one.

So if we do the arithmatic...based on a 22 day month as a minimum, on average a person in these circumstances would be taking home around US$198k a year minimum after tax, with some extra days worked, could be looking at US$ 240-250k after tax, which in just about any country in the world is not bad money.

Having worked both contract and staff (with all the supposed benefits) personally for me I prefer the contract route, very simple arrangement, you work, you get paid the agreed to dayrate...

Suppose the next question would be what happens if you get sick and cant work ?.....Fully comp medical provided, with a clause by which a dayrate of X number of pounds a day will be paid to offset loss of income, while hospitalised, for upto a period of 3 months

Edited October 9, 2008 by Soutpeel

[floridaguy]

UPDATE

Flew up to Michigan to meet with the CEO this past weekend. He offered me the following (all USD):

$75000/yr base salary

$3000/month living expenses

$20000/yr guarenteed 1st year bonus. A friend, the VP of sales, says that $50000-60000 year end bonuses are typical

2 return trips per year to the US

Relocation paid there and return trip

Standard expense account, personal assistant, mobile phone, company car (no mention of personal driver).

This constitutes a guarenteed minimum of $131,000/yr USD, plus benefits and perks. This job has evolved to be the Director of Asian Operations. I report to the VP of Foreign Operations and to the CEO directly. I will be establishing operations in Thailand, finding and leasing an office, and hiring 20-30 local staff members.

I accepted the position. I am leaving for Bangkok in 4 weeks. I feel that this was an opportunity I could not pass up. I am direct in line to succeed the current VP. My friend, the VP of Sales, whom I have been friends with since we were 10 years old, has told me that they are looking to replace the VP in Asia, and I could possibly have the job in 2-3 years. He is tired of being in Asia, and wants to return to the US.

I know that this is a great package. I am happy with it. I now need to determine the best way to save money on Thai and US income taxes, to establish and maintain my status as a Thai national, and brush up on my mothers native language.

Any advice on saving taxes? A local income paid in the US of my base salary + bonus, and the $36000/yr living expenses paid in Thailand? What would be the best options?

If you think it's a salary, good on ya. To me it sounds like a freelance relationship. Are you working every day for example? Are you paid for holidays? What happens if you're sick? Is a month 22 days or 31 days? Do you get paid if you're not called to work? If the want to get rid of you, what severance rights do you have?

Anyway, US$750 after tax based is around 25,000 a day. Extrapolate that to a regular salary and you're talking 520,000 take home per month, or around 750k before tax. It's a good income, but not spectacular. And it's certainly not unusual for other expats like us on regular contracts with all the associated benefits mentioned above.

Actually it was + US$ 750 a day, 750 a day was cited as being an average type day rate, as regards freelanch, I would define this a someone who works for multiple companies on short term basis, typically through their own company and takes care of their own taxes, which is not the case in the examples given, indivduals are working on long term contracts with one company, typically 4 years + so per my definition.... not freelance.

Take home based on the your examples ie THB 750k is actually after tax, not gross based on average dayrate.

As regards the number of days again this varies could be 22 day month could be 31 depends on what is going on and needs to be done.

Granted you dont get paid if you are not in work, and of course its a contract position, if the contract gets cancelled, you are out of a job, and suppose severance per Thai law could be applicable, never had to test this one.

So if we do the arithmatic...based on a 22 day month as a minimum, on average a person in these circumstances would be taking home around US$198k a year minimum after tax, with some extra days worked, could be looking at US$ 240-250k after tax, which in just about any country in the world is not bad money.

Having worked both contract and staff (with all the supposed benefits) personally for me I prefer the contract route, very simple arrangement, you work, you get paid the agreed to dayrate...

Suppose the next question would be what happens if you get sick and cant work ?.....Fully comp medical provided, with a clause by which a dayrate of X number of pounds a day will be paid to offset loss of income, while hospitalised, for upto a period of 3 months

[manjara]

When I was on an expat deal, I was on around 500k a month plus accommodation (70k) and 4 flights a year. They ended the expat deal and I was offered 250k to go local, which I refused and continued as an independant contractor.

Now I have my own Thai company and pay myself around 150k a month. My wife works for the company as well and I pay her around 70k. After tax we take home around 180k and that is more than enough to live on in Thailand, with 2 kids in International school and a 2 bed apartment in Sathorn. School is by far the biggest expense.

I work around 6 months of the year on contracts, less if possible.

[PattayaParent]

Congratulations Floridaguy, it sounds a reasonable deal, especially if you can maximise bonuses.

Suggest you see if you can get your living expenses paid local in Thailand to pay tax on that, and the remainder of your salary (and later bonus) paid in US. If you need more than the living allowance each month (and you likely will) you can transfer some in.

[thaihome]

Tax wise there are two routes you can follow.

Split Salary: You declare the living allowance as Thai income and pay Thai tax on it. The salary and bonus are paid offshore and Thailand does not know about it. This is common practice, but it is technically illegal the Thai Revenue Dept does try to sniff this out. For US taxes you declare all the income and will pay taxes on the amount over the 87K foreign income exclusion plus some more for the housing exclusion.

Full disclosure: All your income, salary, living allowance, bonus, home leave, etc is declared Thai income and you pay Thai Tax on it. The US part stays the same, except now you can take foreign tax credits on the Thai Tax you paid on the income over the 87k. This is the legal way to go.

Under either method, You could still end up paying more tax (Thai and US) then you would if you were working in the US at that pay. Most companies do a tax equalization program that give you money (taxable of course) to make up the difference.

You should negotiate the living allowance as a Baht amount so you are not subject to FX fluctuations with it. That should be paid into a Thai bank account. Your USD salary and bonus can be paid in USD into a US bank account and still be considered foreign income.

As you are setting up the operations in Thailand you need to get some good tax advice for yourself and the company or branch office you will be setting up. The two are interrelated as how the company is set up will impact how you get paid. This can get very complicated, get help.

TH

Edited December 16, 2008 by thaihome

[floridaguy]

Thaihome, thank you very much. That was the best explanation so far of the tax implications of my salary. I usually get the generic "split your income to save tax" explanation. My company is a little new to the foreign operations arena, and I feel I will have to educate them on the income situation.

I am leaving in 3 weeks for Bangkok. I am afraid there won't be enough time to consult with a tax advisor here in the States before I leave. Are there good reputable advisors in Bangkok that can help me with the concept of offshore/split income, without violating his own ethics?

Thanks

Tax wise there are two routes you can follow.

Split Salary: You declare the living allowance as Thai income and pay Thai tax on it. The salary and bonus are paid offshore and Thailand does not know about it. This is common practice, but it is technically illegal the Thai Revenue Dept does try to sniff this out. For US taxes you declare all the income and will pay taxes on the amount over the 87K foreign income exclusion plus some more for the housing exclusion.

Full disclosure: All your income, salary, living allowance, bonus, home leave, etc is declared Thai income and you pay Thai Tax on it. The US part stays the same, except now you can take foreign tax credits on the Thai Tax you paid on the income over the 87k. This is the legal way to go.

Under either method, You could still end up paying more tax (Thai and US) then you would if you were working in the US at that pay. Most companies do a tax equalization program that give you money (taxable of course) to make up the difference.

You should negotiate the living allowance as a Baht amount so you are not subject to FX fluctuations with it. That should be paid into a Thai bank account. Your USD salary and bonus can be paid in USD into a US bank account and still be considered foreign income.

As you are setting up the operations in Thailand you need to get some good tax advice for yourself and the company or branch office you will be setting up. The two are interrelated as how the company is set up will impact how you get paid. This can get very complicated, get help.

TH

[thaihome]

I don't know any personally as we have an in-house tax dept that looks at the corporate wide strategy. Suggest you contact one of the big 4 accounting firm, all have offices in Bangkok. You are going to need that anyway setting up the office.

TH

[Tinkelbell]

'Floridaguy',

Congrates! It's nice to know.... you finally got what you were after.

I hope you'll be very happy in LOS.

From a Thai living in Tampa, FL.

[floridaguy]

'Floridaguy',

Congrates! It's nice to know.... you finally got what you were after.

I hope you'll be very happy in LOS.

From a Thai living in Tampa, FL.

Hey, I am in Tampa also. New Tampa, about a mile south of Wesley Chapel. I think I saw that you lived here also. Funny, asking questions on a Thai forum, and getting answers from my backyard. I appreciate the sentiment. I can't wait to go to Thailand. I have located my brother in Ban Pong. I also have a family friend ready to pick me up from the airport to take me to another family friend's house that is now empty for me to stay in temporarily. I feel like I have found my family after 36 years of being away.

Thank you everyone for your advice. I hope that I can contribute in a meaningful way over the next several years as someone new to Thailand and hope that my experiences are unique enough to help someone else.

[Tinkelbell]

quoted from 'floridaguy"

.............."Hey, I am in Tampa also. New Tampa, about a mile south of Wesley Chapel. I think I saw that you lived here also. Funny, asking questions on a Thai forum, and getting answers from my backyard. I appreciate the sentiment. I can't wait to go to Thailand. I have located my brother in Ban Pong. I also have a family friend ready to pick me up from the airport to take me to another family friend's house that is now empty for me to stay in temporarily. I feel like I have found my family after 36 years of being away.

Thank you everyone for your advice. I hope that I can contribute in a meaningful way over the next several years as someone new to Thailand and hope that my experiences are unique enough to help someone else. ......"

................................................................................

.

XMAS comes early for you.

You got what you want and now on the way to live in the place you've always dreamed of.

That's quite nice that you got everyone (in TL) line up to help you in this transition.

Yup, we're practically a close neighbor, my subdivision is right across 'Heritage Isle' golf course on 'Cross Creek Blvd'.

Feel free to PM me.

I was intrigued by......".I feel like I have found my family after 36 years of being away". May I ask.. were you born in TL or had you spent time there in your youth ?

Good luck in your new life in LOS.

Tink