Condo Law Advise Please!

[walstib1]

I put a for sale sign on my condo balcony and the manager threatened to turn off my water if I didn't remove it. My guess is she is tryig to control all sales in the building. Sure enough she turned off the water. I went to the police; they even came to talk to her but to no avail. They said they could do nothing and I should get a lawyer and take her to court. To me this would be expensive and time consuming. I took the sign down and my water came back on. Where can I get advise on thai condo law. I should be able to put a sign up but maybe not? Any advice would be appreciated.

[bendix]

The manager is right. You can't do that.

You could, of course, put up signs on street lamps outside, but NOT outside your condo window.

[trajan]

I agree, the manager is right...dont do that....

why dont you put an ad in Thai Visa real estate classifieds, the Bangkok Post or on Craigslist, Prakard.com etc.?

[jbaldwin]

This is not an issue covered by condo law. However, the regulations of the condo should address the issue - Ask the manager for a copy.

The regulation of our condo do allow a "for sale" sign. The relevant regulation reads

"Any sign, symbol, advertising board or professional sign attached to a door, window, balcony and any other part of the outside of the building must be of an appropriate size and in a location so as not to disturb or create problems for other tennents".

[pkrv]

This is not an issue covered by condo law. However, the regulations of the condo should address the issue - Ask the manager for a copy.

The regulation of our condo do allow a "for sale" sign. The relevant regulation reads

"Any sign, symbol, advertising board or professional sign attached to a door, window, balcony and any other part of the outside of the building must be of an appropriate size and in a location so as not to disturb or create problems for other tennents".

This is correct - We are not allowed to put up signs or indeed hang up washing outside. It is to everybody’s benefit to abide by the condominium regulations. Yes advertise elsewhere, estate agents etc… you may have some internal notice board you can advertise on?

It's interesting that some on this board indicate that the juristic organisation is powerless - I am sorry but what you have gone through is actually quite a good thing . It shows how cutting off communal assets (including using lifts etc) is an effective mechanism for maintaining control in a condominium.

It sort of shatters some arguments against condominiums. And I guess if someone doesn’t pay the communal service charge the same thing would probably happen? If so that would be very reassuring news for everyone in your condominium

[midas]

This is correct - We are not allowed to put up signs or indeed hang up washing outside. It is to everybody’s benefit to abide by the condominium regulations. Yes advertise elsewhere, estate agents etc… you may have some internal notice board you can advertise on?

It's interesting that some on this board indicate that the juristic organisation is powerless - I am sorry but what you have gone through is actually quite a good thing . It shows how cutting off communal assets (including using lifts etc) is an effective mechanism for maintaining control in a condominium.

It sort of shatters some arguments against condominiums. And I guess if someone doesn’t pay the communal service charge the same thing would probably happen? If so that would be very reassuring news for everyone in your condominium

You are totally incorect pkrv in that in certainly doesnt shatter " some arguments against condominiums " in Thailand at all

You clearly dont understand why the condo law here is p*ss weak because you are confusing the duties and rights of the Juristic

Person ( nothing more than a Body Corporate Manager ) compared to a legally

empowered " Statutory Referee " - they are two different functions entirely and there is no comparision.

To give you an example if resulting from this action it became a full blown dispute by several owners, the only way to resolve it would be in

the Thai court - a costly, very long and very unpredictable result

Anyway the OP hasnt even confirmed that putting up a sign is actually against the

specific regulations of his condo building in which case the Op and other owners

could challenge this legally ? It is all far too messy and costly in Thailand

[pkrv]

This is correct - We are not allowed to put up signs or indeed hang up washing outside. It is to everybody's benefit to abide by the condominium regulations. Yes advertise elsewhere, estate agents etc… you may have some internal notice board you can advertise on?

It's interesting that some on this board indicate that the juristic organisation is powerless - I am sorry but what you have gone through is actually quite a good thing :jerk: . It shows how cutting off communal assets (including using lifts etc) is an effective mechanism for maintaining control in a condominium.

It sort of shatters some arguments against condominiums. And I guess if someone doesn't pay the communal service charge the same thing would probably happen? If so that would be very reassuring news for everyone in your condominium

You are totally incorect pkrv in that in certainly doesnt shatter " some arguments against condominiums " in Thailand at all

You clearly dont understand why the condo law here is p*ss weak because you are confusing the duties and rights of the Juristic

Person ( nothing more than a Body Corporate Manager ) compared to a legally

empowered " Statutory Referee " - they are two different functions entirely and there is no comparision.

To give you an example if resulting from this action it became a full blown dispute by several owners, the only way to resolve it would be in

the Thai court - a costly, very long and very unpredictable result

Anyway the OP hasnt even confirmed that putting up a sign is actually against the

specific regulations of his condo building in which case the Op and other owners

could challenge this legally ? It is all far too messy and costly in Thailand

midas - on the ball as usual - I wondered when you would repond - I too hope the OP does come back to us. All of the above responses are correct in their own way - I guess it is just difficult for some of us (who are not used to condominiums, they don't really exist in the UK for example) to realise SOME feedoms are curtailed. I can't just hang out washing on my balcony, and quite frankly do not relish looking at others 'smalls' (though I am sure some do and probably would not buy in our condominium as a result). I note that the police walked away - I suspect the policeman was just shown a copy of the signed and binding agreement between walstib1 and the condominium. But I do hope the OP does get back to us - I think this is a good thing (sorry walstib1 )

I do agree however that you really do need to look up your condominium regulations AND IF YOU DON'T AGREE with them don't buy. If you do agree then sign away (your water in this instance, good move IMO BTW).

[jrbkk64]

In the condo building I own a unit in they control payment of maintenance fees by cutting the water supply if someone is more than 3 months overdue. Great!!

[midas]

midas - on the ball as usual - I wondered when you would repond - I too hope the OP does come back to us. All of the above responses are correct in their own way - I guess it is just difficult for some of us (who are not used to condominiums, they don't really exist in the UK for example) to realise SOME feedoms are curtailed. I can't just hang out washing on my balcony, and quite frankly do not relish looking at others 'smalls' (though I am sure some do and probably would not buy in our condominium as a result). I note that the police walked away - I suspect the policeman was just shown a copy of the signed and binding agreement between walstib1 and the condominium. But I do hope the OP does get back to us - I think this is a good thing (sorry walstib1 )

I do agree however that you really do need to look up your condominium regulations AND IF YOU DON'T AGREE with them don't buy. If you do agree then sign away (your water in this instance, good move IMO BTW).

pkrv i am only on the ball because I feel very strongly that many condo buyers in Thailand dont

know or understand the true nature of what they are buying and are there in some ways getting " ripped off '.

It is like you think you a re buying a Rolls Royce but the engine is only a Ford.

If you read the OP's post again - he is not thinking of buying - he already owns the place and if the

regulations are silent on this - i would the sue the pants off the managers for taking kind of action.

I know of someone who lives in a building where the JP acts like the local mafia and insists on a cut of the

action regarding sales commission wherever there is a sale - and to me it sounds just like te OP's situation.

The poilceman could have just been paid off - nothing unusual about that in LOS

It stinks to high heaven ! You have no idea what happens in some condo buildings.

[richm7]

This is correct - We are not allowed to put up signs or indeed hang up washing outside. It is to everybody's benefit to abide by the condominium regulations. Yes advertise elsewhere, estate agents etc… you may have some internal notice board you can advertise on?

It's interesting that some on this board indicate that the juristic organisation is powerless - I am sorry but what you have gone through is actually quite a good thing . It shows how cutting off communal assets (including using lifts etc) is an effective mechanism for maintaining control in a condominium.

It sort of shatters some arguments against condominiums. And I guess if someone doesn't pay the communal service charge the same thing would probably happen? If so that would be very reassuring news for everyone in your condominium

You are totally incorect pkrv in that in certainly doesnt shatter " some arguments against condominiums " in Thailand at all

You clearly dont understand why the condo law here is p*ss weak because you are confusing the duties and rights of the Juristic

Person ( nothing more than a Body Corporate Manager ) compared to a legally

empowered " Statutory Referee " - they are two different functions entirely and there is no comparision.

To give you an example if resulting from this action it became a full blown dispute by several owners, the only way to resolve it would be in

the Thai court - a costly, very long and very unpredictable result

Anyway the OP hasnt even confirmed that putting up a sign is actually against the

specific regulations of his condo building in which case the Op and other owners

could challenge this legally ? It is all far too messy and costly in Thailand

You are such a rude, pompous prat Midas. Take a look at the language you used in your reply. You totally diss the poster, without any explanation - "You are totally incorect pkrv in that in certainly doesnt shatter " some arguments against condominiums " in Thailand at all" (sic). Then you rise to stratospheric pomposity with "You clearly dont understand why the condo law here is p*ss weak" (sic - again). Midas, you are stating an opinion, no more. The poster made a reasonable point in correctly suggesting that the Juristic Person has quite a bit of authority; the Juristic Person in this instance clearly exercises that authority, as more of them should. Who this bleeding "statutory referee" is you keep harping on about, I do not know since a web search is not particularly illuminating. In any condominium development, whether it be in Thailand or any western country, if one owner is being an sob it is one hel_l of a job to do much about it without heartache and resorting to law. Midas' magical "Statutory Referee", unless empowered to wield a machete indiscriminately is just as shackled as anyone else when dealing with a pillock, as Midas should know very well. If you think that the poster was "totally incorect" then explain why. Management Companies and the associated Juristic Person might be weak but that is not the fault of the law, it is the fault of the Juristic Person, the Management Company and the Board of the Co-Owners.

[midas]

You are such a rude, pompous prat Midas. Take a look at the language you used in your reply. You totally diss the poster, without any explanation - "You are totally incorect pkrv in that in certainly doesnt shatter " some arguments against condominiums " in Thailand at all" (sic). Then you rise to stratospheric pomposity with "You clearly dont understand why the condo law here is p*ss weak" (sic - again). Midas, you are stating an opinion, no more. The poster made a reasonable point in correctly suggesting that the Juristic Person has quite a bit of authority; the Juristic Person in this instance clearly exercises that authority, as more of them should. Who this bleeding "statutory referee" is you keep harping on about, I do not know since a web search is not particularly illuminating. In any condominium development, whether it be in Thailand or any western country, if one owner is being an sob it is one hel_l of a job to do much about it without heartache and resorting to law. Midas' magical "Statutory Referee", unless empowered to wield a machete indiscriminately is just as shackled as anyone else when dealing with a pillock, as Midas should know very well. If you think that the poster was "totally incorect" then explain why. Management Companies and the associated Juristic Person might be weak but that is not the fault of the law, it is the fault of the Juristic Person, the Management Company and the Board of the Co-Owners.

richm7 I could not give a rats a*se if you think I am a prat - but I feel very sorry for you because you are plain ignorant ........your last sentence proves that

Go and work it out for yourself genius

[pkrv]

I have PM'ed the OP - because at the end of the day, all we have to go on is what finally happened. However, inadvertantly I think the OP has just increased his chances of a sale ];-)

[yabaaaa]

I put a for sale sign on my condo balcony and the manager threatened to turn off my water if I didn't remove it. My guess is she is tryig to control all sales in the building. Sure enough she turned off the water. I went to the police; they even came to talk to her but to no avail. They said they could do nothing and I should get a lawyer and take her to court. To me this would be expensive and time consuming. I took the sign down and my water came back on. Where can I get advise on thai condo law. I should be able to put a sign up but maybe not? Any advice would be appreciated.

Yeah imagine a condo block all smothered in "FOR SALE" ads all on different backgrounds colours sizes and materials....... I'd bet it would look reaaaaaaaaaaaallly nice

[pkrv]

In the condo building I own a unit in they control payment of maintenance fees by cutting the water supply if someone is more than 3 months overdue. Great!!

Thanks very much for this! It caused me to go back and re-read my own contract - The relevant clause at The Park is

[Clause 22 Payment

(3) If a Co-owner is in default for two consecutive months, the manager has the power to discontinue the water, electricity and other public utilities and to prohibit the Co-owner or their dependents, including their tenants, agents or licensees, from gaining access to the Condominium or any of the Common Property, including but not limited to the parking areas, the lobby and entrance areas and the lifts, until the debt has been properly settled.]

I agree it is a heavy duty commitment from ourselves but is actually one of the core reasons why we were so happy to buy off the plan in the first place, we signed without batting an eye. IMO THIS IS GREAT STUFF.

Just as an anecdote when we fly over we go through an emergency power up procedure. The air-con (which would not function without electricity) has TOP priority, we then head out to get some groceries from the local corner shop (Central – Chidlom) to allow time for the place to cool down ];-)

[pkrv]

Just as a footnote our own clauses covering advertising are covered by:

[Clause 27. Use of private property

(16) No Co-owners may post any sign, logo, flags, banner, advertisment, poster, poles, brackets, shelves or other projections or structures on the doors, windows, balconies, walls or exterior of their Unit in such a manner that the posted materials are visible from the outside or may be viewed as being untidy and dangerous, except for any door-type nameplate in the form and size prescribed by the Condominium Juristic Person.

Edited December 17, 2008 by pkrv