Philippine Or Filipinos Speaking English

[junkofdavid2]

There have been numerous rants and raves about Filipino teachers (and other professions) in Thailand and the way the speak English. As I've been assigned and worked in Manila for many years in the past, I always maintained that they really can't be generalized as they're not a "homogeneous" society and different Filipinos have very different backgrounds from each other. Anyway, I found this interesting article which some of you may find interesting; albeit from Wikipedia which is not considered a "mainstream" source. However, it seems to pretty accurately sum up what I learned from living in Manila all those years. Anyway, enjoy reading it.

However (to the mods especially), I hope that this does not become yet another "rant and rave" thread on Filipinos (we've got so many of that already); but rather, comments about the article with respect to maybe Filipinos you've met. Also, if we are put in a situation where we must deal with or hire Filipinos, the article might help us understand a certain person's background for aid in our own personal selection/decision process.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Philippine_English

For those who wish to rant and/or rave, please do not post on this thread; and instead redirect your posts to another existing thread here: http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/Rants-Raves-...rs-t200461.html

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Edited August 10, 2009 by junkofdavid2

[SMEEERE]

Never met one yet that dosent have an american accent, rubs off on the kids, too, funny,

[gwynt]

Never met one yet that dosent have an american accent, rubs off on the kids, too, funny,

I have worked with many flippers and a lot of them speak better Engish than many Yanks I have worked with

[garro]

I have worked with a mixed bunch over the years. I have spent a lot of time with them through my work as a teacher and as a nurse in Ireland, UK, and Saudi; I even shared a flat in Oxford with two Fillipina . Some have had excellent English. I hate to say it but quite a few that I met in nursing had dangerously bad English considering the profession we were in. For teaching English I would say most are better than the Thai English teachers anyway. I work with one girl now who is very good.

[rgs2001uk]

Never met one yet that dosent have an american accent, rubs off on the kids, too, funny,

Ever heard Arroyo speak English?

Wouldnt call it American, more like, sorry forum rules prohibit me from commenting further.

Even the educated Fillipinas can draw their own conclusions.

[MrHammer]

I like the way they speak, it sounds funny, but still understandable unlike Thaiglish.

[garro]

The fact is that if you compare a Filipino with a Thai then the Filipino will normally come out looking very well in regards to English language proficiency; if you compare them with a native speaker then of course they are going to come out the loser. The problem in Thailand is that many schools cannot afford to keep on spending big bucks on teachers from native-English speaking countries; especially as so many of these turn out to be useless teachers. Instead they need to sell the Filipino teacher to the parents; it makes the school lose face to admit that their English programme is staffed by foreigners who did not learn English as a mother-tongue so they make high claims - understandable I suppose. I have never been to the Philippines, but I have met plenty abroad; all of them were proud of their own languages and made no claims of being native English speakers.

I think the problem with the recurrent argument about the standard of Filipino's English is a bit nuts, because we are comparing them unfairly. As people speaking it as a second language they are very good.

[junkofdavid2]

Actually, some Filipinos do speak excellent English (as their first language in fact), but these ones come from the upper-classed; and would normally not be willing to accept the "non-white" salary offered in most primary and secondary schools and private institutes in Thailand (may be a different story at top universities, however).

Therefore, these schools, for the same salary, would be better off hiring Caucasian teachers because of the extra "advertising value" they bring to the school.

Therefore, it's actually ironic that oftentimes (even in the Philippines!), it's the Filipinos who did not have English as a first language who do become English "teachers";

..and it's the Filipinos who do have English as a first language who do not become English teachers... and instead become investment bankers, advertising executives, and the like.

Sadly, in Manila, the upper-classed Filipino kids (who speak excellent English, and as a first language) often poke fun at and circulate jokes amongst themselves about the bad accents of their "only middle-classed" English teachers; and use it as a way to look down on their own teachers.

However, there is still value in hiring these "only middle-classed" teachers with "lacking" accents and pronunciation because they teach the upper-classed kids proper grammar. Note that the upper-classed kids speak English similar to the way American native speakers would... complete with slang, idioms, and often with disregard for "proper" grammatical rules.

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Edited August 11, 2009 by junkofdavid2

[SMEEERE]

Never met one yet that dosent have an american accent, rubs off on the kids, too, funny,

I have worked with many flippers and a lot of them speak better Engish than many Yanks I have worked with

That wouldnt be difficult now would it

[garro]

Actually, some Filipinos do speak excellent English (as their first language in fact), but these ones come from the upper-classed; and would normally not be willing to accept the "non-white" salary offered in most primary and secondary schools and private institutes in Thailand (may be a different story at top universities, however).

Therefore, these schools, for the same salary, would be better off hiring Caucasian teachers because of the extra "advertising value" they bring to the school.

Therefore, it's actually ironic that oftentimes (even in the Philippines!), it's the Filipinos who did not have English as a first language who do become English "teachers";

..and it's the Filipinos who do have English as a first language who do not become English teachers... and instead become investment bankers, advertising executives, and the like.

Sadly, in Manila, the upper-classed Filipino kids (who speak excellent English, and as a first language) often poke fun at and circulate jokes amongst themselves about the bad accents of their "only middle-classed" English teachers; and use it as a way to look down on their own teachers.

However, there is still value in hiring these "only middle-classed" teachers with "lacking" accents and pronunciation because they teach the upper-classed kids proper grammar. Note that the upper-classed kids speak English similar to the way American native speakers would... complete with slang, idioms, and often with disregard for "proper" grammatical rules.

.

It seems that most countries do indeed have small groups of people who meet the criteria for native-English speakers; although I have never yet met one. India in particular has quite a few famous native English-speakers; such as Salmun Rushdie who went to a British upper-class school in India and university in Cambridge. The thing is though, these people are quite rare and do tend to be from the very privileged classes and. as you say, unlikely to be teaching in Thailand. All the Filipinos that I have ever met spoke English as a second-language.

[Travel2003]

Never met one yet that dosent have an american accent, rubs off on the kids, too, funny,

I have over the years worked with more than 1000 people from the PH.

Just a few take on an American accent.

They have, as most other countries, a very distinctive accent, which make them easy recognize.

Needless to say maybe, but they are the most superior nation in this region regarding English skills.

Guess we all know where this country is on that list.

Oh, and some of the so called western English teachers in this country.

Where did they find them???

[garro]

Never met one yet that dosent have an american accent, rubs off on the kids, too, funny,

I have over the years worked with more than 1000 people from the PH.

Just a few take on an American accent.

They have, as most other countries, a very distinctive accent, which make them easy recognize.

Needless to say maybe, but they are the most superior nation in this region regarding English skills.

Guess we all know where this country is on that list.

Oh, and some of the so called western English teachers in this country.

Where did they find them???

Wow, another pop at the western ESL teacher. How original. You should take your show on the road; really you should .

[MrHammer]

The fact is that if you compare a Filipino with a Thai then the Filipino will normally come out looking very well in regards to English language proficiency; if you compare them with a native speaker then of course they are going to come out the loser. The problem in Thailand is that many schools cannot afford to keep on spending big bucks on teachers from native-English speaking countries; especially as so many of these turn out to be useless teachers. Instead they need to sell the Filipino teacher to the parents; it makes the school lose face to admit that their English programme is staffed by foreigners who did not learn English as a mother-tongue so they make high claims - understandable I suppose. I have never been to the Philippines, but I have met plenty abroad; all of them were proud of their own languages and made no claims of being native English speakers.

I think the problem with the recurrent argument about the standard of Filipino's English is a bit nuts, because we are comparing them unfairly. As people speaking it as a second language they are very good.

That made me laugh!

[garro]

The fact is that if you compare a Filipino with a Thai then the Filipino will normally come out looking very well in regards to English language proficiency; if you compare them with a native speaker then of course they are going to come out the loser. The problem in Thailand is that many schools cannot afford to keep on spending big bucks on teachers from native-English speaking countries; especially as so many of these turn out to be useless teachers. Instead they need to sell the Filipino teacher to the parents; it makes the school lose face to admit that their English programme is staffed by foreigners who did not learn English as a mother-tongue so they make high claims - understandable I suppose. I have never been to the Philippines, but I have met plenty abroad; all of them were proud of their own languages and made no claims of being native English speakers.

I think the problem with the recurrent argument about the standard of Filipino's English is a bit nuts, because we are comparing them unfairly. As people speaking it as a second language they are very good.

That made me laugh!

Well, I don't about you but my school thinks the 680,000THB a month they pay me is big bucks!Especially when they can get a non-native speaker for 360THB every month.

Edited August 11, 2009 by garro

[Groongthep]

Well, I don't about you but my school thinks the 680,000THB a month they pay me is big bucks!Especially when they can get a non-native speaker for 360THB every month.

Are you sure you typed that right? 680,000TBH is 14,217 Euros or 20,178 US dollars a month. That is remarkably good pay for any kind of teacher anywhere.

[PeaceBlondie]

Mr. Garro shows that we Texans have no patent on exaggeration. Also, Brits have no patent on irony.

I see a parallel here. Violeta Chamorro did not teach school. 'Mark' Abitit never taught ESL. Jeb Bush and Marta Segun (former First Lady of Mexico) taught ESL in Mexico. But when Marta phoned me, we spoke Spanish.

[garro]

Well, I don't about you but my school thinks the 680,000THB a month they pay me is big bucks!Especially when they can get a non-native speaker for 360THB every month.

Are you sure you typed that right? 680,000TBH is 14,217 Euros or 20,178 US dollars a month. That is remarkably good pay for any kind of teacher anywhere.

It was just me being sarcastic; if I was earning that amount of money I would only post on the Platinum Thaivisa forum where you need to pay $50 every time you start a thread and $10 just to reply to it.

[junkofdavid2]

India in particular has quite a few famous native English-speakers; such as Salmun Rushdie who went to a British upper-class school in India and university in Cambridge. The thing is though, these people are quite rare...

Hmmm... that's interesting.

Similarly, the upper-classed Filipino kids come from upper-classed schools formerly run by American Catholic priests in the Philippines; e.g. Ateneo Manila University (Jesuit) and De La Salle Manila (The Christian Brothers). Not to be confused with the Ateneo and De La Salle "branches" in the Philippine provinces.

[markg]

We recently employed, for the 1st time, two Filipina women to teach ESL kindergarten and Pre-kindy.

Hard working and professional, producing good, interesting and fun lessons. They are also punctual and smartly dressed, in short, everything that is required in a Thai school for ESL.

They have a slight accent. I can tell they aren't English or American but i 'm not sure the Thai can tell where they come from just by listening to them.

Grammatically, they speak pretty well, though tenses are sometimes incorrectly used.

Written work is pretty good, but not perfect.

They;d have no problem teaching in our school up to about P4 year groups.

They are no trouble at all and i enjoy working with them.

I'm also happy to say that they earn 'nearly' as much as a native speaker. Parity of pay is a whole new argument, and it's the school's decision, not mine. They earn about 4k baht a month less than a native speaker which they seem happy with.

I find their accent has a very slightly nasal Spanish tone to it, but it never obscures the meaning of what they are trying to say, nor does the listener strain to understand it. I have no problems with the way they speak at all.