Is Ram Hospital As Bad As They Say?

[Ulysses G.]

Each of us has our favorites, for our own reasons, but why put down the other guy's choice?

Tell everybody all the reasons why you like your selection, but there is no reason to rip apart a competitor if they are also doing a good job.

[bhatmasterson]

I'm curious as to what excellent service and care can be bought at C.M. Ram that's not available at a some other hospitals in the city? I would match McCormick Hospital's Dental dept. against Ram any day and come out with just as much satisfaction for a price considerably less. That's for a root canal and crown, baring no complications. Yep! I've been to both and won't be going back to Ram unless my life depends on it. They've got foreigners in this city by the nostrils and we're eating it up and happily paying the high prices.

If you like McCormick and think it's cheaper, use it, but don't paint Ram in such an unsavory light because it's not warranted, each to their own and how much they can afford.

I don't think McCormick is cheaper, I know for a fact it is cheaper for a variety of procedures than C.M.Ram. From all indications that I've seen and know to be true, McCormick Hospital is just as well managed while delivering care which is comparable to Ram.

There are plenty of posts on this topic singing the praises of C.M. Ram. I'm sure my humble opinion won't do them any damage. I've just as much right to express my thoughts as the next person. That's why it's called a public form. After all, it's all just opinion when it comes down to it.

[Ulysses G.]

Edited October 6, 2009 by Ulysses G.

[mcgriffith]

Apples to Oranges to Mangos to Pomegranates.

I humbly suggest that no one can compare his/her "root canal" at Clinic X, to Clinic Y....because each and every doctor, clinic, patient condition, etc. is different. With an emphasis on "patient condition".

"Root Canal" is not a commodity, like a can of Coca Cola. Did you get a Pro-Taper procedure, drilled through a previous enlay or crown?

Was it a second restorative root canal (yes root canals can go bad; might need a second procedure)? Or was it a simple first time procedure?

Are you young, old ? English? (Worst tooth genetics; I inherited it).

There is no fixed price on a root canal. Trying to compare these procedures, for various individuals, at various clinics, is nonsensical IMHO.

Oh and yes I have had 2 root canal procedures here in CM. One a very long and complicated procedure (5 office visits), where I thought I was going to lose a major tooth (a molar). One a more prosaic one, only 3 office visits.

And it worked out fine.

Good on Ram Dental, and all the other clinics mentioned.

I go to Grace, as I find the price/quality of care ratio exceptional. Costs were about the same as the above mentioned, but again, each and every patient will pay a different cost, based on the amount of treatment and followup required.

Hope this helps.

[chiang mai]

I'm curious as to what excellent service and care can be bought at C.M. Ram that's not available at a some other hospitals in the city? I would match McCormick Hospital's Dental dept. against Ram any day and come out with just as much satisfaction for a price considerably less. That's for a root canal and crown, baring no complications. Yep! I've been to both and won't be going back to Ram unless my life depends on it. They've got foreigners in this city by the nostrils and we're eating it up and happily paying the high prices.

If you like McCormick and think it's cheaper, use it, but don't paint Ram in such an unsavory light because it's not warranted, each to their own and how much they can afford.

I don't think McCormick is cheaper, I know for a fact it is cheaper for a variety of procedures than C.M.Ram. From all indications that I've seen and know to be true, McCormick Hospital is just as well managed while delivering care which is comparable to Ram.

There are plenty of posts on this topic singing the praises of C.M. Ram. I'm sure my humble opinion won't do them any damage. I've just as much right to express my thoughts as the next person. That's why it's called a public form. After all, it's all just opinion when it comes down to it.

I like or dislike X or Y because it is expensive/inexpensive, pleasant/unpleasant etc etc is an opinion, stating that you wouldn't go back to a particular hospital unless your life depended on it, just because it charges more than its competitors, comes across as something much more than merely an opinion, it implies there are massive and serious problems at the hospital which makes it the choice of last resort, a little unfair and misleading perhaps. Perhaps better to have simply suggested that there are less expensive alternatives, a fact that most people will readily accept and agree with.

[pjclark1]

I had a root canal done several years ago at a basic Thai style clinic. 6,000 Baht and 3 visits. If you look at the charges on-line of other clinics you will find most in this price range. For example, Fortune Dental > 6,000 - 9,000 Baht. A site showing the average cost for Thailand came out to about 9,000 Baht (4 canals - molar). Another site shows Mission Hospital in BKK > First visit - 5,050 Baht, 2nd visit - 1,500. And I've visited quite a few clinic websites and generally around 6,000 Baht is an average. So, where is this 400 Baht/visit for root canal at?

Almost anywhere that doesn't advertise on a website in English.

You don't need an English speaking dentist, but if you want one, the bill will be x5.

How many Thais do you think will pay 6,000-10,000 bht for a root canal (2 months wages). The answer is none! Thai price is 1,400bht for the entire treatment.

One poster says they are in the chair for 2 hours so 2000bht is reasonable.

How much do you think a dentist is paid out here? ...... at a guess 25-30kbht a month.

As I said earlier CM RAM would not charge a Thai the price they charge a white person. This hospital operates a dual pricing system.

[Ulysses G.]

As I said earlier CM RAM would not charge a Thai the price they charge a white person. This hospital operates a dual pricing system.

Please provide some evidence.

[PeaceBlondie]

Ram is a most excellent hospital; so is Sripat/Maharaj; perhaps also McCormick, etc. "So bad I'd never go there again" describes Sao Paulo in Hua Hin.

UG, you've set this up to fail. A great (wrongly maligned) hospital compared with a great dental clinic.

[elektrified]

I had a root canal done several years ago at a basic Thai style clinic. 6,000 Baht and 3 visits. If you look at the charges on-line of other clinics you will find most in this price range. For example, Fortune Dental > 6,000 - 9,000 Baht. A site showing the average cost for Thailand came out to about 9,000 Baht (4 canals - molar). Another site shows Mission Hospital in BKK > First visit - 5,050 Baht, 2nd visit - 1,500. And I've visited quite a few clinic websites and generally around 6,000 Baht is an average. So, where is this 400 Baht/visit for root canal at?

Almost anywhere that doesn't advertise on a website in English.

You don't need an English speaking dentist, but if you want one, the bill will be x5.

How many Thais do you think will pay 6,000-10,000 bht for a root canal (2 months wages). The answer is none! Thai price is 1,400bht for the entire treatment.

One poster says they are in the chair for 2 hours so 2000bht is reasonable.

How much do you think a dentist is paid out here? ...... at a guess 25-30kbht a month.

As I said earlier CM RAM would not charge a Thai the price they charge a white person. This hospital operates a dual pricing system.

I don't know anything about root canals because I have never had one. But I like to get my teeth cleaned by one of the more popular dentists who is frequently mentioned on this forum. Her prices are indeed much higher than other dentists I have been to in C.M. But I am willing to pay more to have her clean my teeth because I like what she does. Almost every time I have been there, I have been either the only farang there, or one of two waiting to see her. The rest of the patients were all Thais (who pulled up in much more expensive cars than I own). There are a lot of very wealthy Thais in C.M. who will pay more for dental care. So I disagree with the statement above.

I might add that I have overheard the receptionist collecting money from the patients and they were paying the same prices as me.

Edited October 7, 2009 by elektrified

[Asmerom]

'pjclark1' post='3060003' date='2009-10-07 09:24:14']

As I said earlier CM RAM would not charge a Thai the price they charge a white person. This hospital operates a dual pricing system.

Please provide some evidence.

It might be just relevant to mention I was quoted 80,000 for a gall bladder removal. Would that be the Thai price price too? Or are we just focusing on canals, bridges and crowns.

[Ulysses G.]

UG, you've set this up to fail. A great (wrongly maligned) hospital compared with a great dental clinic.

From what I had read on this forum up till now, I had thought that the complaints were about the dental clinic as well as the hospital. It seems as if, in general, that is not true. The dental clinic mostly gets good feedback.

[Ulysses G.]

As I said earlier CM RAM would not charge a Thai the price they charge a white person. This hospital operates a dual pricing system.

I'm not sure if this proves anything, but I had a Thai call the clinic using her phone and say that she thinks that she needs a root canal and how much would it be. She was quoted the same set of figures as me and it was nowhere near "1,400" baht.

[bhatmasterson]

I'm curious as to what excellent service and care can be bought at C.M. Ram that's not available at a some other hospitals in the city? I would match McCormick Hospital's Dental dept. against Ram any day and come out with just as much satisfaction for a price considerably less. That's for a root canal and crown, baring no complications. Yep! I've been to both and won't be going back to Ram unless my life depends on it. They've got foreigners in this city by the nostrils and we're eating it up and happily paying the high prices.

If you like McCormick and think it's cheaper, use it, but don't paint Ram in such an unsavory light because it's not warranted, each to their own and how much they can afford.

I don't think McCormick is cheaper, I know for a fact it is cheaper for a variety of procedures than C.M.Ram. From all indications that I've seen and know to be true, McCormick Hospital is just as well managed while delivering care which is comparable to Ram.

There are plenty of posts on this topic singing the praises of C.M. Ram. I'm sure my humble opinion won't do them any damage. I've just as much right to express my thoughts as the next person. That's why it's called a public form. After all, it's all just opinion when it comes down to it.

I like or dislike X or Y because it is expensive/inexpensive, pleasant/unpleasant etc etc is an opinion, stating that you wouldn't go back to a particular hospital unless your life depended on it, just because it charges more than its competitors, comes across as something much more than merely an opinion, it implies there are massive and serious problems at the hospital which makes it the choice of last resort, a little unfair and misleading perhaps. Perhaps better to have simply suggested that there are less expensive alternatives, a fact that most people will readily accept and agree with.

I can see how you might think I'm not a fan of C.M Ram simply because of their prices. However, if you read more closely, you will see that I've given Ram the thumbs up for being an excellent hospital for a variety of serious procedures. Hence, "If my life depended on it", C.M. Ram Is The Place I'd Go.

I assure you that my aversion to Ram has more to do with the arrogance of some of their staff, over pricing/dual pricing, and the idea that foreigners will pay more for standard service simply because Ram happens to be the better advertised hospital in Chiang Mai, especially among the expat community.

It is simply your opinion that I've implied massive and serious problems exist at Ram. It is a well known fact however, that comparable, friendly, and yes, less expensive dental service can be had at McCormick Hospital as well as a few other dental facilities around the city. I also expect that more foreigners, be they financially well off or not, would frequent these other facilities if they were as well advertised and talked about on a certain forum as C. M. Ram happens to be.

I do not agree with you that it would have been "better to suggest that there are less expensive alternatives" without adding that some of the alternatives offer comparable service, are less expensive, and heaven forbid, a more pleasant experience.

[anatta]

Ram is a most excellent hospital; so is Sripat/Maharaj; perhaps also McCormick, etc. "So bad I'd never go there again" describes Sao Paulo in Hua Hin.

UG, you've set this up to fail. A great (wrongly maligned) hospital compared with a great dental clinic.

I can't agree with the overall evaluation "most excellent".

In the dental clinic the X-ray technician was unable to position the film correctly in my mouth in spite of three attempts. I finally did it for her. (Pity about all the unnecessary radiation ...)

When my wife and I were waiting in the obstetric clinic a dog wandered in, sniffed around and padded into one of the empty consulting rooms. I asked a group of five nurses/nurse aids whether the hospital allowed dogs in. All of them simply 'melted away', leaving me to wonder if I ought to try and shoo the animal out.

Without going into detail, I would add that our experience of perinatal care left a lot be desired. The pediatric cardiologist, however, is admirable.

[PeaceBlondie]

Since my only experience at Ram amounted to a shoulder repair that later got infected and neither Ram nor Samitivej could diagnose or operate on it, I'll stop defending those as being 'excellent' hospitals. And keep going to Sripat.

[Ulysses G.]

I remember going to McCormick before they built RAM and spending hours and hours in severe pain trying to get into the emergency room with a doctor who could not speak English or diagnose Kidney Stones. RAM is certainly an "excellent" hospital compared to that.

Bumrungrad in Bangkok is reputed to be a wonderful hospital, but like all hospitals, they make all kinds of major mistakes which can be found quite easily on the internet.

I know that RAM is not the best in the world, but we are lucky to have it in Chiang Mai compared to what we had before, even if it is not up to the standard of a bunch of spoiled foreigners ( many of who could never afford a hospital this good back home).

Edited October 8, 2009 by Ulysses G.

[pjclark1]

In the dental clinic the X-ray technician was unable to position the film correctly in my mouth in spite of three attempts. I finally did it for her. (Pity about all the unnecessary radiation ...)

Ha ha, same happened to me, on attempt 3 she held the film in my mouth with her hand, and irradiated us both.

[Sparkles]

I agree, the dental clinic at Ram is great. The dentist I've visited (a woman) has a very light touch and I've never experienced any pain. In the U.S. I've had problems with dentists using a heavy-hand which wasn't evident during the treatment because of the numbing. But, the next day I felt like someone had socked me in the jaw. Not here! Plus, they're well organized at the dental clinic.

I wish I could say the same about the rest of the hospital. For anything more serious than an immunization (or dental work), I'm heading down to Bangkok to Bumrungrad.

Can never understand the fixation, with a lot of people ,about utilising the services of Bumrungrad. Granted it is the most expensive hospital in Thailand, I believe ,and does do a magnificent marketing job, especially to overseas clients. HOWEVER does it have the best Doctors and service ? that is doubtful.

While living in Bangkok, and being a long time skin cancer sufferer from my surfing days in Australia, I went for check up and was given the all clear. A matter of 2 weeks later on a rush trip back to Australia I took the opportunity to see my long time specialist and I was correctly diagnosed with a melanoma on my back.It was removed, howeve,r if it had been allowed to remain it could, and would, have been life threatening. I now have 3 monthly check ups with Dr Vachiraporn the Dermatologist at RAM and over the last 2 rr 3 years have found her to be very competant. If she ever decides to move on I am back to square one.

I am not knocking Bumrungrad but dont make the mistake, that I did ,that because they have been able to cultivate an aura of complete professionalism that it will necessarily carry through with your own particular problem. My family have had nothing but the very best care from RAM todate

[invex]

My GF worked at CM Ram for years as an accountant. No question about it, they have dual pricing. When see saw a farang name, address in foreign country or something pointing to farang, she was ordered to use a different price. Depending on the treatment, but on average, it was Thai price + 40%.

[elektrified]

I agree, the dental clinic at Ram is great. The dentist I've visited (a woman) has a very light touch and I've never experienced any pain. In the U.S. I've had problems with dentists using a heavy-hand which wasn't evident during the treatment because of the numbing. But, the next day I felt like someone had socked me in the jaw. Not here! Plus, they're well organized at the dental clinic.

I wish I could say the same about the rest of the hospital. For anything more serious than an immunization (or dental work), I'm heading down to Bangkok to Bumrungrad.

Can never understand the fixation, with a lot of people ,about utilising the services of Bumrungrad. Granted it is the most expensive hospital in Thailand, I believe ,and does do a magnificent marketing job, especially to overseas clients. HOWEVER does it have the best Doctors and service ? that is doubtful.

While living in Bangkok, and being a long time skin cancer sufferer from my surfing days in Australia, I went for check up and was given the all clear. A matter of 2 weeks later on a rush trip back to Australia I took the opportunity to see my long time specialist and I was correctly diagnosed with a melanoma on my back.It was removed, howeve,r if it had been allowed to remain it could, and would, have been life threatening. I now have 3 monthly check ups with Dr Vachiraporn the Dermatologist at RAM and over the last 2 rr 3 years have found her to be very competant. If she ever decides to move on I am back to square one.

I am not knocking Bumrungrad but dont make the mistake, that I did ,that because they have been able to cultivate an aura of complete professionalism that it will necessarily carry through with your own particular problem. My family have had nothing but the very best care from RAM todate

Fear not, if this doctor decides to move on there is another dermatologist in Chiang Mai who is excellent and is considered to be one of the best doctors in Thailand.

[PeaceBlondie]

I agree that neither Bumrungrad nor Chiang Mai Ram is the only excellent hospital in Thailand.

[Sparkles]

I agree that neither Bumrungrad nor Chiang Mai Ram is the only excellent hospital in Thailand.

[uptheos]

I don't have any particular hospital.

I usually take time and seek out a doctor via word of mouth or the excellent information available on this forum. If surgery is indicated, I try to go to the cheapest place the surgeon uses.

In my 12 years here I have had three in-patient surgeries / investigations.

2 operations at Sripat and 1 investigation (colon/gastroscopy) at Rajavej.

I was satisfied with the price and outcome in all three cases

The criteria was the doctor.

I am currently seeing Dr Channakan (orthpod) for a foot problem and if I go ahead with surgery, I feel confident in him. I found him through this forum and although I saw Dr Paiyaboon at Ram first, I felt Dr Channakan was much more specific regarding what he could and could not do.

I guess if I suffered a heart attack or stroke and had to be admitted in an emergency, I'd probably like to go to Ram.