Is Realistic To Find A Job With A Western Salary In Thailand?

[ballzafire]

Personally i think if you want to stay here and earn western wages then you really need to think outside the box a little .Theres multiple oportunities here to make money but you need to do things different to the Thais . At the end of the day though its getting more expensive to stay here and the things that set you back heree can take up most your time and you have to aks yourself am i really better off here or not. Here on Samui it seams like prices have gone up 3 times what they were 3 years ago.Its not the bargain place it used to be .

Can you give us some examples?

[loganberry]

It is possible to get what you are looking for, but it will be 1000% harder and very discouraging to find it within your desired time frame. Most people that have western-based salaries and/or expat packages have either been transferred here, recruited through a search firm locally or abroad, or took the leap and started here by taking a low salary and networking their way into better jobs with companies that have better compensation programs.

I don't think it is very far fetched to claim that if you are already here, your best chance of finding a expat-style job is by NETWORKING. Make some decent friends at the bar, attend an embassy or chamber of commerce event once or twice, go to dinner with your friends' friends every time you are invited, don't pass up any social activities when it comes to meeting new people, and even ask for an informational interview with HR or MD at a target company here. You can get a lot of advice and direction from an informal interview over lunch with someone at a company in a related sector. When I first came here, I did that with the HR Director at Colgate and Accor Hotels. I got a lot of information about the barriers to employment in my field and how to adjust my search.

I never thought it would be true here but the business community is not all too complex, at least in Bangkok. All of my jobs here have been from networking. When I say networking, I don't necessarily mean going to chamber of commerce and embassy events every month, but just making successful contacts with friends and their friends and so on. My first job actually came through a bar owner in Bangkok that had a friend as MD at Company X. Second job came from my friend recommending I contact the Director at Company Y and I had an offer in hand within a month.

Keep your chin up and be dedicated. If you have a real specialization, start getting your resumes in the hands of some of the 100s of search firms in Bangkok. Didn't read your whole message, but if you let me know what your specialization is or target job... I can PM you the details of some recruiters spread across Bangkok in your field.

Hope it helps!~

Edited November 15, 2009 by loganberry

[loganberry]

The only way to get a western salary in Thailand is to start your own service company selling services to the Western world. Unless you have some skill that no other expat has, it's not likely you will find a western salary here....why would anyone pay you a western salary when you can get below a western salary hiring local or an expat who doesn't demand a western salary.

Absolute <deleted>,

.....plenty of expats working here on Western salaries ++ in Thailand...

To answer the OP's question: It is very very difficult to get a decent paying job in Thailand, but not impossible and generally on a word of mouth basis/referral basis...I wouldnt bother with job advertisements etc etc as chances are you will get no where.

I half agree with Soutpeel on this as I beleive he's in the O&G business same as me so yes you can get expat salaries fairly easily.

But in IT when Thais can do the job cheaper probably not so easy unless you can get sent from head office of an expat company.

Did the guy mention he was looking for an IT job? Sorry, I am too lazy to read the whole topic.... or posting for that matter.

IT jobs are a little difficult to find, but it depend on just what kind of IT job. There are plenty of IT jobs dealing with the banking sector here in ERP implementation. One may wish to look into the contractor relationship between IBM Singapore and Kasikorn Bank. IBM has been taking care of much of their IT needs for a while and has numerous expat employees working at Kasikorn's main building as contractors from IBM.

[William Osborne]

I'm a thicky and I have a western salary in Bangkok. Have done for 10 years and hired locally.

I find that hard to believe...if you were sent on assignment from the western office you would get the western salary and expat package...if you approached the local office of the same organization to do the same work they would pay you a local salary; I've seen it happen here and other parts of the world...it's a trap that lures those that will do anything for local employment...don't give the bastards the satisfaction, I say...

unless, of course, one is in the oil and gas business and has 'contacts'...

I can show you my work history and bank statement. Locally hired and reckon I earn more than most. 4 different companies, started on 70k.

Curious ? 70,000 k what ? baht/pounds/ dollars x day/month

[ballzafire]

I agree - it's not impossible to get a western salary, but it's not too likely, unless you're an international school teacher at a top school.

What? I still believe that the biggest chunk of people making western salaries are international school teachers. There are hundreds and hundreds of them.

You call 60-80K baht per month a "western salary" for their level of qualification?

Sorry, but what is your reference country for this assertion?

[tutsiwarrior]

I'm a thicky and I have a western salary in Bangkok. Have done for 10 years and hired locally.

I find that hard to believe...if you were sent on assignment from the western office you would get the western salary and expat package...if you approached the local office of the same organization to do the same work they would pay you a local salary; I've seen it happen here and other parts of the world...it's a trap that lures those that will do anything for local employment...don't give the bastards the satisfaction, I say...

unless, of course, one is in the oil and gas business and has 'contacts'...

I can show you my work history and bank statement. Locally hired and reckon I earn more than most. 4 different companies, started on 70k.

Curious ? 70,000 k what ? baht/pounds/ dollars x day/month

yeah...sorta wondered meself...the minimum for senior expat staff on assignment around here would be around 400k baht per month plus package to include international school fees if on family status with children...nobody that I know would mobilize for less...

[tonititan]

I agree - it's not impossible to get a western salary, but it's not too likely, unless you're an international school teacher at a top school.

What? I still believe that the biggest chunk of people making western salaries are international school teachers. There are hundreds and hundreds of them.

You call 60-80K baht per month a "western salary" for their level of qualification?

Sorry, but what is your reference country for this assertion?

No, actually a don't call 60-80K baht per month a "western salary." You came up with that number. The schools I'm referring to pay teachers between 100,000-200,000 baht/month, depending on experience and position, PLUS often a housing allowance (or housing provided), a relocation stipend, excellent health insurance, flights back home every year, bonuses, travel funds, etc. I don't know what schools YOU are referring to that pay only 60,000 baht/month, but they're certainly not the top schools.

[tonititan]

yeah...sorta wondered meself...the minimum for senior expat staff on assignment around here would be around 400k baht per month plus package to include international school fees if on family status with children...nobody that I know would mobilize for less...

Nobody you know would come work here for less than about 140,000 USD/86,000 pounds per year? Seriously?

Actually, your comment made me think of a good point in this discussion. I think the term "western salary" is subjective. For most people, 40-70,000 USD/24-42,000 pounds is a decent western salary. Maybe for you that's peanuts, but you have to realize that your salary puts you in the minority. I wasn't trying to say that international teachers make MORE than people in other fields. I'm not that blind. I think the real question is how many people make approximately the same salary here in Bangkok as they did in their respective western countries? I was trying to say earlier that I think one of the professions that has the largest number of ex-pats making their own personal western salary is international school teachers (at the best schools). I know that personally, I make more here than my former "western salary."

Perhaps you might look down on the "measly" salary of international school teachers. Please keep in mind that if there weren't so many teachers willing to come over here for the adventure and the culture (not just for the money), many business people wouldn't be able to bring your families over here. Would you send your 10 year old who only speaks English to a Thai school? No, you wouldn't, because you care about your kids and know it's not the best thing for their education. (And I don't literally mean YOU. I don't even know if you have kids. I mean "you" as in other ex-pats). So, it seems that teachers are enabling you to come here, still be with your family, and make 400,000 baht/month. You're welcome.

[IMA_FARANG]

Can you find a good job with a western salary in Thailand?

Frankly, probably not. But it could be possible if:

Can you provide a service that the Thais cannot, at a price a Thai or foriegn company can't afford to pass up?

I you really can do that, either because of your unique talents or combination of talents and also you can sell those talents to your proposed company....you've got a job.

That is the same in every country...not just Thailand.

It would certainly help to speak Thai well enough so you could occupy a managerial slot supervising Thai workers.

I personally have know of Farangs in telecommunications (my racket) who have been brought into Thailand to take a job that for some reason a Thai couldn't hold...usually because the Farang had some experience with some teclecommunications system or equipment that no Thai technician had. In one case the Farang was here for 1 or 2 years, while he/she trained a Thai staff into tha job. When the Thai staff was trained the Farang stayed on as a manager for the system...as a supervisor/consultant to the Thai staff.

If you can find a job, at a lower salary than you want, it would be wise to take it....and make yourself so valuable to the company that when you asked for a raise they couldn't really refuse.

But frankly, the chances are few, and you need to be in the right place at the right time.

The other option...is to take a job outside of Thailand, return once or twice a year on vacation...build a life here so that at some point you can retire here.

[quiksilva]

We employ locals to develop our in house software and would never consider paying western salaries in what we consider to be a cost centre, especially during times when most firms are trying to control costs as much as practically possible.

Why not go into business for yourself? Develop software and sell it.

You get to use your skills and eventually your remuneration could be considerably higher. If you need extra manpower to get the job done, there's plenty of skilled programmers available in Thailand, and they don't cost the earth. Software Park on Chaeng Wattana would be where I'd start.

[juanmedin]

First, thanks to everyone for their point of view and advise.

I've read every post (of course) and while I can't reply each of them, here are the replies to the suggestions:

About selling IT Thai services in Farang-land. I can clearly see the economic benefits, but it would mean several things:

- First, I'd become a seller, and as such I'd need to spend most of my time chasing clients and networking in Europe. In fact, I think that's the kind of job that should be done from within Europe managing remotely the IT team in Thailand. The other way around is almost impossible. On the other hand I'm a IT manager, and my selling skills are low -and spent 100% of my time chasing clients and visiting stripper clubs is something I really dislike-

- Second, if the reason is to create a business, other places can offer better ROIs -like Saigon in Vietnam ( [theoretically] good universities there + lower salaries than in Bangkok)-. If you can swim across the political requirements there (you need connections and their "way" of doing business) it's a good opportunity right now to outsource IT services.

About working as a freelance. That's a field I'm exploring now. Some thoughts:

- I think there are a lot of competition in that field, and when I look at freelance websites (elance, odesk, etc) and I see the hourly wages, well, I suppose that in some place within India you can live with that money, but not even here in Bangkok.

- My experience is building big enterprise systems. That's were my skills are more valuable and where I can compete with an advantage. Most freelance works don't fall within this field. This is too 'enterprisey'

Telecommuting. I'm also exploring that possibility. Companies that allow it have clear policies like attending some meetings at the office, etc. When you want to work from home in your country that's ok. When you tell them you want to work from Thailand you usually get variations of "Sorry?". You know what I mean.

Networking in Thailand. I'm starting to do that now (and in fact I'm leaving in 30 minutes to visit my embassy near Nana Plaza). I'll work hard on this.

Visiting Thailand once or twice every month. That's an option, and in fact what my company proposed me (to give an extra month without salary to travel here every year, so that'd be two months every year). Sounds good, but really: the ten months there would be a torture. I'm doing this because I want to live here. This is the last backup plan, something to do if everything else fails.

I'm not an specialist in a highly demanded product like SAP, Meta4, etc, where there are few professionals. I built my career building big Java/J2EE enterprise projects. I'm positive that I can provide skills/results that are not usually available here (like in many places).

@loganberry

If you can send me that list, it'd really fantastic. To google looking for info about search firms, head hunters, etc, is in my todo list. Also, thanks for the complete point of view. I think that's the way I'm going to try.

About the time frame, I'm more worried about losing my contacts in my country if I stay here for long (people change roles within the companies, companies, etc) than about the economic aspect.

Once again, thanks to everyone for the replies!

Edited November 16, 2009 by juanmedin

[PattayaParent]

The term 'Western Salary' has to be qualified against what you would earn back home, tonititan is right that there are a lot of low paid jobs in UK / US and if you earn the equvalent in Thailand then you are getting a 'Western Salary'.

But tutsiwarrior is also correct that to attract their people to work here the multinational companies have to pay MORE than back home and provide housing, schools, flight etc.

There's also the balance in between. Several times I have been able to get contract work in Thailand with multinational companies on a Western Salary but with no benefits (flights, car, housing etc.) except insurance. It's cheaper for them than to mobiliose someone from back home and hard to find people to relocate for only 6~12 months

[ricwoo09]

I attach a recent survey by the American Chamber of Commerce in Thailand which shows local salaries currently paid by their members.....

File0007.PDF

[tonititan]

depends what's your job is, my salary is based in USD and is quite reasonable. let say i can earn as much as 15K baht a day, all inclusive rate but not bad for living in Thailand. OK, honestly it's very high but i deserve it because of what i do.

Can I ask what kind of work you do?

[GarryP]

Soutpeel is in Obstetrics & Gynecology. I didn't know it was open to foreigners here.

[Dakhar]

Ask yourself this: Do you have a specialized skill set in IT/Programming? How would you differentiate your skill set from a local Thai that can do the same job? What sector of IT/Programming do you work in (energy/materials/finance/etc.)

Honestly if you have the same skill set that a local can do then you will have a very tough time, especially if you can't speak fluent Thai. Even western companies are shying away from have high $$$ expats on payrolls due to severe cost-cutting measures. Your skill set will have to contribute to the companies bottom line in a drastic way otherwise you just won't stand a chance. I have only met one expat in the last few years that had a very specialized IT/Programming skill set and has several brand name companies chasing after him still. The guy literally lives wherever he pleases and gets his requested pay rate as a result.

I have to agree, you will not just be compeeting against Thais, even if you are highly specialized. As for me, I compete against Malaysians and Indians in my field. Although, no one would debate that a degree in my field from out of the US holds less worth, the employers do not care, they want "cheap" they want experience and they want people that will dedicated 24/7 to their jobs.... they don't want "American" especially when they can find what they need in cheaper from cheaper sources.

Edited November 16, 2009 by Dakhar

[ChiangMaiThai]

If you are with a western company that sends you hear then yes, but if you find something hear the salary will be low by western standards.

This is the typical party line response. I found my job over here and make more here than I would in the US and my expenses are probably half of what they would be in the US...

My experience is that either you need a very specialized skill or you need to be referred by a friend. For me, it was the latter. I'm in marketing for a resort here.

Best of luck!

[ChiangMaiThai]

depends what's your job is, my salary is based in USD and is quite reasonable. let say i can earn as much as 15K baht a day, all inclusive rate but not bad for living in Thailand. OK, honestly it's very high but i deserve it because of what i do.

15,000 Baht a day?

Care to share your secret?

[ChiangMaiThai]

I attach a recent survey by the American Chamber of Commerce in Thailand which shows local salaries currently paid by their members.....

Is that Bangkok or all of Thailand?

[Geekfreaklover]

It's not easy to find a job anywhere in the world right now. This recession is a bitch.

There are many jobs, mainly in the IT sector, but it is very difficult for someone to get a job 'off the boat,' as it were. It helps a lot to have some understanding of the country and the way it works.

As another said, it is partly about who you know and your qualifications. The restrictions on foreign workers in certain sectors is a pain. Maybe one day it will change. Thailand could be a 'hub' of industry' if she got her act together and stopped being so xenophobic she might move forward rather than backwards.

[thomasjojo]

I did the same, started on 60k in a Thai Company in Phuket once. now im off to make my own company in BKK. getting work both overseas and inland. Im a pro web manager and bulid useful sites. That works. Im aiming for 110k a month as a start. Its doable.

Do what you can best, if there is a marked for it, unless stay home and work less, go for holliday a quarter a year...

T

[ballzafire]

depends what's your job is, my salary is based in USD and is quite reasonable. let say i can earn as much as 15K baht a day, all inclusive rate but not bad for living in Thailand. OK, honestly it's very high but i deserve it because of what i do.

15,000 Baht a day? Care to share your secret?

Since LuckyFive8888 has not replied to two requests for descriptions of his work, one would have to assume he's doing something that's actually commission-based or simply blowin' smoke...

[NALAK]

if i were you i would think long and hard about what it is you like about Thailand so much. often the living here is not as good as it seems and i would not in the present climate rush into giving up a good job at home. 2 months holiday a year is good, your only ever 5 months from another month here.

[ozzieovaseas]

Dude, The hope of even finding a job here is not realistic, so the dream of getting a western salary is just that.

Unless you are an English teacher of course,for which you might get 30-50k baht per month from what i understand.

[kurnell]

I find that hard to believe...if you were sent on assignment from the western office you would get the western salary and expat package...if you approached the local office of the same organization to do the same work they would pay you a local salary; I've seen it happen here and other parts of the world...it's a trap that lures those that will do anything for local employment...don't give the bastards the satisfaction, I say...

unless, of course, one is in the oil and gas business and has 'contacts'...

I can show you my work history and bank statement. Locally hired and reckon I earn more than most. 4 different companies, started on 70k.

Curious ? 70,000 k what ? baht/pounds/ dollars x day/month

yeah...sorta wondered meself...the minimum for senior expat staff on assignment around here would be around 400k baht per month plus package to include international school fees if on family status with children...nobody that I know would mobilize for less...

Read again. I said 'started on 70k'. There are very few jobs around in the 400k bracket.

[Soutpeel]

Read again. I said 'started on 70k'. There are very few jobs around in the 400k bracket.

Assume you are talking about IT jobs ??...as the 400k bracket is about right for "starting positions" in Oil and Gas....typically 350-400/m up to and exceeding THB1 mil/m.

[KarenBravo]

I can show you my work history and bank statement. Locally hired and reckon I earn more than most. 4 different companies, started on 70k.

If the 70k is per month, I don't think that counts as a Western salary.

[KarenBravo]

Assume you are talking about IT jobs ??...as the 400k bracket is about right for "starting positions" in Oil and Gas....typically 350-400/m up to and exceeding THB1 mil/m.

Yes, I agree with that. Am also in the O&G game.

[PattayaParent]

Assume you are talking about IT jobs ??...as the 400k bracket is about right for "starting positions" in Oil and Gas....typically 350-400/m up to and exceeding THB1 mil/m.

Yes, I agree with that. Am also in the O&G game.

Ditto

[Soutpeel]

I can show you my work history and bank statement. Locally hired and reckon I earn more than most. 4 different companies, started on 70k.

If the 70k is per month, I don't think that counts as a Western salary.

....whoops and here's me thinking that was his dayrate...

US$ +/- 2000/month .........agreed thats not a "Western" Salary....would be interesting to see if he was paying tax on that as well...