ray23 Posted December 14, 2009 Share Posted December 14, 2009 We just had a rider killed in Udon this last weekend. Camera was working at the red light. The rider after stopping prceeded forward after the light turned green. A dual trailer truck hit him he missed the first trailer and was ran over by the second trailer. Why? 60 MPH = 88 fps. (fps=1.467 * MPH). If the vehicle deceleration rate is 20 fpsps (rather than the previously calculated 15 fps), then stopping time = 88/20 = 4.4 seconds. Since there is a 1 second delay (driver reaction time) in hitting your brakes (both recognition and reaction time is often 2 seconds), the total time to stop is 5.4 seconds to 6.4 seconds. To determine how far the vehicle will travel while braking, use the formula of 1/2 the initial velocity multiplied by the time required to stop. In this case, this works out to be .5 * 88 * 4.4 = 193.6 feet, plus a reaction time of either 88 feet for a second delay in reaction time, or 176 feet for two seconds reaction time. That yields 281.6 feet or 369.6 when added to the base stopping distance of 193.6 feet. If the driver is very responsive and takes only a half a second to react, the distance is reduced to 237.6 feet. Notice that the reaction time is a huge factor since it is at initial velocity. Roughly 96 Klms per hour, note 1/2 second reaction time. This is assuming a normal vehicle with good tires and brakes. On a good roiad surface, no oil or water. Rare for someone to have that kind of reaction time, one second for most of us would probably be more accurate. Now figure how much more distance for a heavy truck stop. I think it's to imagine that 6.4 seconds is far to short of a time to stop in a truck traveling 90 Klms an hour. Time the amper lights at out intersections on Ring Raod adn it;s eay to see why run light are ran even by good drivers. Good reason to check both direction even on a green light before entering a intersection. I doubt any intersection in Udon has a sufficient enough amber phase to stop safely at the speed limit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yimmy Posted December 14, 2009 Share Posted December 14, 2009 Sad. May he RIP. Always have to be extra vigilant out here, especially at traffic lights. Wonder if info will gathered about the truck - speeding, legal tyre thread etc etc. I became extra cautious about this about 2 months ago after watching the camera from a traffic light on thai TV. 3 people on a scooter just went flying through a red light, hit side on by the nose of a Hilux who was going through his green light at standard highway speed. The 3 helmetless scooter riders were flung like ragdolls, one about 5 metres into a lampost, another into the other side of the highway and one simply crushed. Sobering viewing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thaicbr Posted December 14, 2009 Share Posted December 14, 2009 Condolences to the Riders family, who ever they may be. RIP Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gotlost Posted December 14, 2009 Share Posted December 14, 2009 Average of 35 a day are killed on motorbikes in Thailand. .5, yes half a person per day dies of the H1N1 virus per day in Thailand. S€o where is the epidemic?? RIP. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ray23 Posted December 14, 2009 Author Share Posted December 14, 2009 This was posted as a gentle reminder of just how fragile things can be. It is up to us to adjust Thailand will not. The fact is we have to take care of ourselves and adjust. Many of the hazards here we can do little about but this one we can. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
basjke Posted December 14, 2009 Share Posted December 14, 2009 A few days ago there was a post about a rider which died in a similar accident in udon.Can't find the post anymore.Are we talking about the same accident or not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigBikeBKK Posted December 14, 2009 Share Posted December 14, 2009 A few days ago there was a post about a rider which died in a similar accident in udon.Can't find the post anymore.Are we talking about the same accident or not. Sounds very much like the same accident- condolences to the friends and family of the deceased. Moral of the story- NEVER assume you have the right of way when you're on a bike. Regardless of the color of the light, the consequences of failing to LOOK before you proceed through an intersection can be fatal. RIP Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ray23 Posted December 14, 2009 Author Share Posted December 14, 2009 (edited) More then likely the same been a few in the past month or so, both involving trucks one out in the sticks another in town. Edited December 14, 2009 by ray23 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zzinged Posted December 14, 2009 Share Posted December 14, 2009 Ray I don't suppose you could keep us updated? I really want to know if the truck driver gets prosecuted or not, especially since there was camera evidence as you mentioned in your opening post. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ray23 Posted December 15, 2009 Author Share Posted December 15, 2009 sure if I see the information at least he stopped. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
neverdie Posted December 15, 2009 Share Posted December 15, 2009 A few days ago there was a post about a rider which died in a similar accident in udon.Can't find the post anymore.Are we talking about the same accident or not. Sounds very much like the same accident- condolences to the friends and family of the deceased. Moral of the story- NEVER assume you have the right of way when you're on a bike. Regardless of the color of the light, the consequences of failing to LOOK before you proceed through an intersection can be fatal. RIP The other thread about this (if indeed they are the same accident) read as if the threads author witnessed the accident. I cant find it either. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Orac Posted December 15, 2009 Share Posted December 15, 2009 (edited) A few days ago there was a post about a rider which died in a similar accident in udon.Can't find the post anymore.Are we talking about the same accident or not. Sounds very much like the same accident- condolences to the friends and family of the deceased. Moral of the story- NEVER assume you have the right of way when you're on a bike. Regardless of the color of the light, the consequences of failing to LOOK before you proceed through an intersection can be fatal. RIP The other thread about this (if indeed they are the same accident) read as if the threads author witnessed the accident. I cant find it either. is this the post being refered to: http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/Beware-Ridin...amp;hl=accident Since Marshbags states that the lorry driver didn't stop it may be a different incident. Edited December 15, 2009 by Orac Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
neverdie Posted December 15, 2009 Share Posted December 15, 2009 (edited) Yeah thats the thread orac. Thanks. Edited December 15, 2009 by neverdie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ray23 Posted December 15, 2009 Author Share Posted December 15, 2009 Yep that is the same one. In the news Video they showed the truck stopped. It appeared the was on the other side of the intersection and pulled to the side. But definetly the same incident. that is why I mentioned the stopping distances ect. There is no way a heavy tuck traveling at normal traffic speeds could stop in the time allowed by the amber lights here. There has been a lot of conjecture as to what the rider had done before the accident. I will not go there. I try to learn from thse things and hopefully not make the same mistakes. This reenforced my own rule of making sure the intersection is clear ( no matter how many times the wife pokes me in the ribs ) or using a truck as a blocker. Riding defensively is extremly importatn here, that not to say I don't make mistakes. I have had two bike accidents in the past five years. Each time I have found things that I copuld have done differently and avoided a lot of pain. I still enjoy my rides here but there is definetly a learning curve. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
neverdie Posted December 15, 2009 Share Posted December 15, 2009 ^Well I can't argue with any of that Ray, you are indeed right, you need to have eyes in the back of your head plus a few other sets scanning around the place & a little bit of luck as well. RIP to your rider. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JimsKnight Posted December 15, 2009 Share Posted December 15, 2009 Yeah, there's not much you can do every time though, we all get complacent from time to time and lose focus, especially doing a routine thing we've done many times before. RIP Rider! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marshbags Posted December 15, 2009 Share Posted December 15, 2009 (edited) A split second makes all the difference re the lights at this junction and the next one going past Tesco in the opposite direction. There isn,t much / enough time between the changes and all road users have to / should make allowances for this. You also get red and green lights showing up on the same displays, allbeit filtered arrows but....TIT I,m loathe to say. The victim went off fast, thinking or whatever that the truck didn,t have a trailer in tow on the rear. Had he waited a split second later, before revving up and shooting off the second the light went red green, he,d still possibly be alive now. Several people who work around this particular junction, selling various wares, say they know of him and are not surprised as to the unfortunate accident. I am a bit taken back by the local Thai, well many of them, telling me and actually believing it, that all local farang ride and drive dangerously. ????? I always thought and believed that the opposite was true. Ray is one example of the many foreigners I personally witness, who do ride safely, from my observations, anyway. My neighbour who also witnessed the accident and stayed at the scene, actually defended me when somone remarked all riders / drivers in my case, are mad and crazy ????? I stated in the other thread, that the driver parked the truck up and then did a runner, even though he couldn,t avoid the accident. A big heavy truck pulling a trailer doesn,t have a hope in hel_l of stopping within a safe distance, based on the speed of which the light changes take place. Add to this the speed not only the trucks but lots of the other traffic approach traffic controlled junctions with... Back home you approach the lights with caution and then you also have an amber light warning you to stop when it is safe to do so. The time scale usually allows for this to happen at all relative junctions. Don,t you think that digital timers in these two particular places I refer to would benefit from a safety point of view Ray / anyone else from our local community. It has made a hel_l of a difference in the town itself, fair enough you get abuses but they are a bit less dangerous and more safety friendly. IMHO At least all road user would get a chance and an informed information display, time wise on their respective junction. IMHO again, as always. RIP whoever you are. Does anyone have any knowledge on who this guy is / was, please ? marshbags Edited December 15, 2009 by marshbags Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marshbags Posted December 15, 2009 Share Posted December 15, 2009 (edited) As an after thought, may I politely offer that the original thread on this horrific accident can be viewed on the following url that was also kindly posted by Orac. http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/Beware-Ridin...amp;hl=accident The debate is ongoing and contains additional views and thoughts in general re the road situation here. While the technical info is interesting and informative, it wasn,t the main / only cause of the accident. For more info including the day it actually happened, please have look and if possible add to it, especially if it is about safety and offers related advice. marshbags P.S. I requested that if possible, rather than move it to the Issan / Udon thread, could it be left in the general forum to serve as a warning to all our membership and provide awareness of just one of the dangers we face on a daily basis. Thanks are due to the moderators for leaving it there. Edited December 15, 2009 by marshbags Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marshbags Posted December 15, 2009 Share Posted December 15, 2009 (edited) The Ref url is not the one in the last post, it should read......................... http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/Beware-Ridin...ke-t320865.html I,d copied the one Orac posted but the end bit is missing so have posted the actual one form the original thread. marshbags Edited December 15, 2009 by marshbags Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ray23 Posted December 16, 2009 Author Share Posted December 16, 2009 No complaint from me, I only addressed one part of the issue. As it was the only one clear in my mind. By all means combine them as you wish. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marshbags Posted December 16, 2009 Share Posted December 16, 2009 No complaint from me, I only addressed one part of the issue. As it was the only one clear in my mind.By all means combine them as you wish. No probs Ray, perhaps they can be linked in some way marshbags Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soundman Posted December 16, 2009 Share Posted December 16, 2009 No complaint from me, I only addressed one part of the issue. As it was the only one clear in my mind.By all means combine them as you wish. No probs Ray, perhaps they can be linked in some way marshbags They can't be combined any more due to issues with google indexing. Only way to link is close one and leave a link to the other. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soundman Posted December 17, 2009 Share Posted December 17, 2009 I have removed the post with the link to the accident involving the rescue pick-up. It has been on Thai Visa before and is not really relevant to this thread. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ray23 Posted December 17, 2009 Author Share Posted December 17, 2009 Then I would say just let things run their course no harm in that. I really wanted to remind everyone that the red light system is a bit different here in Udon anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bard Posted December 19, 2009 Share Posted December 19, 2009 RIP Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ray23 Posted December 19, 2009 Author Share Posted December 19, 2009 Anything that would give you more warning you need to stop would be good. But from the stand point of starting out on the green, we can control that. Ring road assume the light is going to be run. The red light intersection closes to my house first one after Big C driving towards lotus. One second between amber and red. Friday afternoon 1700 hours I counted ten vehicles running the red light on Ring Road portion. At this light coming from my home ( First Homes)the green will flash for about three seconds before the amber comes on. From that approach it is sufficient. No one should be doing 90 down that road. Lots of businesses and a school. Ring Road still not enough time. There was also fresh debris from the most recent accident. Three kids were killed at that intersection within the last six months, same thing had to be first out for the green light. Yes I try to ride safely and enjoy the next day. But, I make mistakes to. usually when I have had an accident I find things that I could have done differently, One of the thin gs I have been picking up about myself on long rides when fatigue and the back pain kicks, my judgement on passing seems to fall by the way side. Time for me to allow more time for the rides. There are lots of little habits we can fall into, that we don't even notice that increase the chances for accidents. I think what makes me rethink things my wife is on that bike with me, I have to accept that responsibility. Won't just be me getting hurt. Good or bad driver/rider this is one thing we can control No matter how many times your wife pokes you in the ribs Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Powerband Posted December 20, 2009 Share Posted December 20, 2009 That intersection is notorious for accidents, traffic police should simply move the stop lights back by about 50 meters. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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