Thailand On Edge As Court Rules On Thaksin Billions

[webfact]

Court rules Thaksin abused authority to help AIS

Addressing the adjustment of roaming charges paid by AIS to its contractor Telephone Organisation of Thailand, the high court ruled the charges were calculated to favour AIS.

The high court also ruled in a majority decision that the adjusted rules for the telecom industry were designed to favour Shin Corp.

-- The Nation

[Lancashirelad]

Abrak said:

When you have a Court case in Thailand, the first thing that happens is that they try to get both sides to mediate it. They usually have mediation rooms below the courtroom. The mediator basically says I dont care what is the wrongs or the rights in this issue I just want to find a solution that is in everybody's best interest.

What is clearly in nobody's best interest is for the divisions within this country not to be resolved. There needs to be a degree of sacrifice from both parties.

Taking away all of Thaksin's money will solve nothing as will letting him keep all his money will solve nothing. So give him half back and say the balance was a fine for abuses. If he complains that he cant live off the balance it isnt going to do him any good. If people believe taking all his money will also not lead to further destructive confrontation they are somewhat naive.

Another Abrak supporter here. I think your idea would work well.

Edited February 26, 2010 by Lancashirelad

[RegularReader]

While maybe not in the same class as Tulsie, webfact and George have been keeping up on things nicely too

Agreed.

No harm in a bit of "brown nosing", eh ??

Seriously, it's at times like these if you've got the time boards like this, tweets form guys like Tulsi and even BP with his regualar commentary update make events like this much clearer for luddite non-Thai speaker/readers like me,

Well done to all.

Even if you were near fluent this constant droning coupled with the nuance of the language used would wear you out! (I understand Thai fairly well but honestly the TV is just droning on in the background now .. nothing is sinking in for me!)

Hey come on JD.

My wife has the radio on and I can pick up bits.

But this is not Show Biz - this is a court handing down one of (if not the most) important decisions it's ever had to.

What do you want ?

The razzamataz, "never mind the rules" type of thing Thaksin was/is so famous for, or something which shows the world this is for real ?

I would have though coming from you - who appears to be as non plussed by Thaksin as I am, you would have understood that ?

[aka_jack]

Fine him half of his money and tell him the other half will be waiting for him when he collects it in person within 30 days or it is forefeited !

[jdinasia]

I really don't understand all of the detail. The question is are they going to keep his money or not. Why don't they just answer that question. All of this stuff can give weight to one side or the other but ultimately they can decide whatever they want on that issue.

Every point of law willbe fully covered before they announce how much (if any) of Thaksin's money.

[marshbags]

When you have a Court case in Thailand, the first thing that happens is that they try to get both sides to mediate it. They usually have mediation rooms below the courtroom. The mediator basically says I dont care what is the wrongs or the rights in this issue I just want to find a solution that is in everybody's best interest.

What is clearly in nobody's best interest is for the divisions within this country not to be resolved. There needs to be a degree of sacrifice from both parties.

Taking away all of Thaksin's money will solve nothing as will letting him keep all his money will solve nothing. So give him half back and say the balance was a fine for abuses. If he complains that he cant live off the balance it isnt going to do him any good. If people believe taking all his money will also not lead to further destructive confrontation they are somewhat naive.

Sorry but I have to say it re the offered solution which is meant well and definitely not a personal attack Abrak

It is not his money

It is only a drop in the ocean re his overseas / hiddden wealth.

Thaksin has salted much much more re his plundering of the kingdom and dishonest use of the institutions.

They now need to take all other assets away from him and his family also.

If confrontation is the only way to stop the destruction of Thailand ( and god forbid it takes place ) and bring stability back then so be it.

May all the innocents be put in a safe place until it ends....should it be unaviodable.

May those who stand by and let this chaos continue, come to their senses and oppose rather than support this individual.

Individual as in the many descriptions lots of poeple choose to call him but commonly know as Thaksin S.

Division is what he needs and enjoys, so he can maybe ( he thinks, ) he can walk back in and take over were he left off.

marshbags

Edited February 26, 2010 by marshbags

[jdinasia]

Hey come on JD.

My wife has the radio on and I can pick up bits.

But this is not Show Biz - this is a court handing down one of (if not the most) important decisions it's ever had to.

What do you want ?

The razzamataz, "never mind the rules" type of thing Thaksin was/is so famous for, or something which shows the world this is for real ?

I would have though coming from you - who appears to be as non plussed by Thaksin as I am, you would have understood that ?

You missed my point --- I wasn't complaining about the process --- I was stating that my brain stopped soaking it in and I was incapable of following the details (after about 10 minutes!) My co-workers and staff left at 5pm so it is me and my old weak brain all alone for awhile

[jdinasia]

I think the video of Sae Daeng that they were showing live a little while ago wandering around in full uniform and signing things for the red shirts at Sanam Luang was a bit chilling.

[RegularReader]

Fine him half of his money and tell him the other half will be waiting for him when he collects it in person within 30 days or it is forefeited !

Please understand this is not about "cutting deals".

This is about something far greater for the future of Thailand.

This day was always going to be a watershed for the country.

With the way they have presented everything so far, it would appear the courts have taken their role very seriously.

This is a chance for Thailand to grow up a bit and try to shake off the cowboy reputation (which has so often, been deserved).

Give these guys a chance.

[h90]

Hey come on JD.

My wife has the radio on and I can pick up bits.

But this is not Show Biz - this is a court handing down one of (if not the most) important decisions it's ever had to.

What do you want ?

The razzamataz, "never mind the rules" type of thing Thaksin was/is so famous for, or something which shows the world this is for real ?

I would have though coming from you - who appears to be as non plussed by Thaksin as I am, you would have understood that ?

You missed my point --- I wasn't complaining about the process --- I was stating that my brain stopped soaking it in and I was incapable of following the details (after about 10 minutes!) My co-workers and staff left at 5pm so it is me and my old weak brain all alone for awhile

You could have done it different.

Set your calender yesterday to 24th (instead of 25th) and than at the 26th they would have told you the results in the morning.

[webfact]

Thai court says Thaksin family concealed shares

by Thanaporn Promyamyai

BANGKOK: -- (AFP) - Thailand's top court said Friday that deposed premier Thaksin Shinawatra illegally hid his ownership of telecoms shares, as it delivered a ruling on whether his 2.3-billion-dollar wealth would be seized.

Thousands of troops and police were deployed across the country for what the local media have dubbed "Judgement Day", amid fears that Thaksin's supporters could react violently if the verdict does not go his way.

The Supreme Court is deciding the fate of the proceeds from the sale of the fugitive tycoon's Shin Corp telecommunications giant, which have been frozen since the 2006 coup that toppled him.

Thai authorities applied for the seizure of Thaksin's wealth on the grounds that he abused his power while at the head of government from 2001 to 2006 to become "unusually rich".

The final ruling on the confiscation was yet to come, but after five hours of reading out their findings the judges made several rulings against Thaksin, who is living in exile in Dubai to avoid a jail term for corruption.

"The court ruled consensually that Thaksin and his ex-wife Pojaman held Shin Corp shares through his two terms as prime minister," the judges said in the ruling, which was read out on national television and radio.

Thaksin had also issued a cabinet resolution in favour of his company, the judges said.

Shin Corp was sold to Singapore-based Temasek Holdings in January 2006, sparking protests. The defence had argued that the shares had been transferred to his children and his ex-wife's stepbrother.

The judges unanimously rejected arguments by Thaksin's lawyers that Thailand's attorney general was not authorised to bring charges against Thaksin and that the court was unqualified to deal with the case.

No members of his family were at court, being represented instead by defence lawyers.

Around 450 police in riot gear guarded the court but there were only around a dozen protesters from his so-called "Red Shirt" movement outside, and fewer than 100 at another protest site in the capital.

The government says up to 35,000 police and soldiers are on alert. Security was also tight around Prime Minister Abhisit Vejjajiva's office and the government said it had prepared several safe houses for him.

Thaksin, the former owner of Manchester City football club, earlier denied the accusations against him.

"I want to reaffirm that I and my family earned all of the money with our hard work, brains, and sweat. We have never been corrupt as accused," he said on Twitter early Friday.

In a video speech to hundreds of Red Shirts at the headquarters of the Puea Thai opposition party, he said: "My morale is high now."

"Today is a very significant day and a turning point, not only for my family but for Thailand's judicial and political history," he said.

Thailand's media has whipped up a frenzy ahead of the verdict, counting down to the day and reporting rumours of a possible coup against Abhisit.

The judges have various options, such as ruling that the government should confiscate all or none of Thaksin's wealth, or that it should take only part of the money, for example the portion he earned after taking power.

The case goes to the heart of the rifts that have opened up in Thai society since the coup.

The Red Shirts, largely from his stronghold in Thailand's impoverished north and northeast, loved his populist policies and accuse the current government of being an unelected elite that has hijacked their democratic rights.

The tycoon's opponents in the Bangkok-based circles around the palace, military and bureaucracy accuse Thaksin of being corrupt, dictatorial and of threatening Thailand's widely revered monarchy.

The main Red Shirt movement says it will hold off mass protests until mid-March. Red Shirt riots at an Asian summit and in Bangkok in April 2009 left two people dead and scores injured.

-- ©Copyright AFP 2010-02-26

Published with written approval from AFP.

[newsfooter][/newsfooter]

[chiang mai]

I really don't understand all of the detail. The question is are they going to keep his money or not. Why don't they just answer that question. All of this stuff can give weight to one side or the other but ultimately they can decide whatever they want on that issue.

Wow, I hope you're not suggesting that the Supreme Court should just announce the amount of the fine and then go on to explain the why's and wherefore's afterwards! I think it's really very important in a country such as this to give people an understanding of why and how the court reached their final decision, if they didn't do that then large numbers of people would react negatively and potentially violently, without really knowing why - it's also critical I believe that everyone understand that all aspects have been examined and that the court explain the details and see that due process and due diligence were followed.

[silk]

Fine him half of his money and tell him the other half will be waiting for him when he collects it in person within 30 days or it is forefeited !

Interesting to know how much fine he will have to pay in addition to "pay back" and what about interests form his multiple bank accounts?

[craigt3365]

I really don't understand all of the detail. The question is are they going to keep his money or not. Why don't they just answer that question. All of this stuff can give weight to one side or the other but ultimately they can decide whatever they want on that issue.

Wow, I hope you're not suggesting that the Supreme Court should just announce the amount of the fine and then go on to explain the why's and wherefore's afterwards! I think it's really very important in a country such as this to give people an understanding of why and how the court reached their final decision, if they didn't do that then large numbers of people would react negatively and potentially violently, without really knowing why - it's also critical I believe that everyone understand that all aspects have been examined and that the court explain the details and see that due process and due diligence were followed.

Khun mia just spoke with the family in the village...all eyes are glued to the TV...lots of red shirts there, so glad I am here!

[Squigy]

I just hope that a new begining for Thailand can take place after this case.

[h90]

I really don't understand all of the detail. The question is are they going to keep his money or not. Why don't they just answer that question. All of this stuff can give weight to one side or the other but ultimately they can decide whatever they want on that issue.

Wow, I hope you're not suggesting that the Supreme Court should just announce the amount of the fine and then go on to explain the why's and wherefore's afterwards! I think it's really very important in a country such as this to give people an understanding of why and how the court reached their final decision, if they didn't do that then large numbers of people would react negatively and potentially violently, without really knowing why - it's also critical I believe that everyone understand that all aspects have been examined and that the court explain the details and see that due process and due diligence were followed.

Khun mia just spoke with the family in the village...all eyes are glued to the TV...lots of red shirts there, so glad I am here!

And how do they swallow down all the facts?

[george]

I just hope that a new begining for Thailand can take place after this case.

Best post of the day! Bring peace for this great country!

[webfact]

Govt deliberation was allegedly cut short to allow Shin Corp to invest in IPstar instead of mandatory Thai Com 4 backup satellite.

-- The Nation

[Dap]

Update:

This seems to be gearing toward a ruling that AIS's prepaid request was not justified. The court also mentions that AIS used pre-paid scheme in an earlier promotion campaign and even extended the campaign. If prepaid scheme was costing money and being financial burden, why did AIS prolong the promotional campaign? the court says.

-- The Nation

George ... Thank you very much for your outstanding commitment to TV and its viewers.

[webfact]

This allegedly affected state interests and prevented potential competition.

-- The Nation

[webfact]

Aside from obscure process in amending satellite contract in Shin favour, Thaksin govt also allegedly gave IPstar investment privileges.

-- The Nation

[chiang mai]

I really don't understand all of the detail. The question is are they going to keep his money or not. Why don't they just answer that question. All of this stuff can give weight to one side or the other but ultimately they can decide whatever they want on that issue.

Wow, I hope you're not suggesting that the Supreme Court should just announce the amount of the fine and then go on to explain the why's and wherefore's afterwards! I think it's really very important in a country such as this to give people an understanding of why and how the court reached their final decision, if they didn't do that then large numbers of people would react negatively and potentially violently, without really knowing why - it's also critical I believe that everyone understand that all aspects have been examined and that the court explain the details and see that due process and due diligence were followed.

Khun mia just spoke with the family in the village...all eyes are glued to the TV...lots of red shirts there, so glad I am here!

And how do they swallow down all the facts?

Well for sure not everyone will understand every element of the Supreme Court findings but people are not stupid, they will understand parts of it and they will get the flavour.

[marshbags]

One thing about this judgement is the time and trouble taken to purposely explain in detail every aspect of the case.

Prosecution and defence, then outlining the why,s and why nots ect.

As of now they have been doing it for 5 and a half hours and are still patiently doing so.

It will be interesting as to the reactions of the Thaksin supporters, especially those who falsely consider themselves MP,s, Puyai and supposed carers of the country and it,s institutions, while they obviously only care about Thaksin and his backhanders / funding / bribes... or other disengenuos whatever self rewarding motivations

marshbags

[webfact]

Guilty, the court rules by majority decisions (on IP Star)

-- The Nation

[neverdie]

^Okay, good time to close the thread then, game over.

[h90]

Well for sure not everyone will understand every element of the Supreme Court findings but people are not stupid, they will understand parts of it and they will get the flavour.

One question would be: Do they watch the court on TV, or is there some red TV running which tells a complete different story?

[marshbags]

Aside from obscure process in amending satellite contract in Shin favour, Thaksin govt also allegedly gave IPstar investment privileges.

-- The Nation

There goes his honest / dishonest arrangements with Burma and the facilitating of a few baht to invest in the HIS business.

marshbags

[Old Man River]

One thing about this judgement is the time and trouble taken to purposely explain in detail every aspect of the case.

This is normal. They did the same for the dissolutions. It is amazing how they do this without bathroom breaks.

[h90]

One thing about this judgement is the time and trouble taken to purposely explain in detail every aspect of the case.

This is normal. They did the same for the dissolutions. It is amazing how they do this without bathroom breaks.

I have the felling they speak now faster than on the beginning.....

[rixalex]

Taking away all of Thaksin's money will solve nothing as will letting him keep all his money will solve nothing. So give him half back and say the balance was a fine for abuses. If he complains that he cant live off the balance it isnt going to do him any good. If people believe taking all his money will also not lead to further destructive confrontation they are somewhat naive.

Final decision should be based on following the rule of law and nothing else, certainly not placating.

The moment justice bows to public pressure is the moment it stops functioning properly.