Strange Farang Phenomenon

[robblok]

Personally it depends where I am and my initial impression of the other farang (for Kilgore Trout - not meant in a racist way - sheesh!). I pretty much always acknowledge a nod or a smile from anyone - foreign or Thai (just upbringing, its automatic).

If I think they are a fellow expat, and I'm in BigC for example, I will nod as I go by. I see no problem with a pretense of comradarie - in a country where everything is stacked against us by the indiginous population and powers that be, we should all be sticking together. Perhaps the only strength we have is cumulative given our numbers.

I tourist areas, I tend not to initialte nods with obvious tourists - as I also do not with groups of suspected louts.

I think your right it depends on the impression of the guy and where you are. Like i said when fishing i usually acknowledge an other farang as we have more in common than just our skin color if we are both there. In a Big C / carefour its a bit different but i will acknowledge almost anyone. Im usually a pretty nice guy.

[Thaddeus]

When it comes to farang males, most are degenerates who you want to avoid.

Indeed, may even turn out to be ThaiVisa members, calamity.

[dansat]

I don't really care one way or the other...

It's obvious that you do care, otherwise you wouldn't even bring this up. We had a thread about this awhile back and it perplexed me a great deal. Why would a farang have an obligation to acknowledge every other farang they walk by? It's asinine to think that just because we share the same....what exactly (skin color?)....that we'd have to treat one another differently than we would any random Thai (or Japanese or Korean). Let's try this: treat everyone the same. Can you do that? And if any farang (or Thai) were to ignore your incredibly humane efforts at friendliness (or creepiness), don't get so bent-out-of-shape about it. Everyone has their own comfort zone and it doesn't mean that people are "(attempting) to lose their western identities." Where do people come up with this stuff?

What a load of rubbish you are talking about Berkshire. Why do people like you bother posting.

[mark45y]

I say hello to any Falang women I see. And if they are not wearing a bra I do a little jig.

[61guitarman61]

Would you say hello to every Farang that you saw on the street back home?

No I would not. That being said, I would also not snub a nod or smile or other friendly form of acknowledgement. As I said, i do not actively chase down every person on the street so as to say hello to each one. This refers to close proximity, like in line at the checkout, or walking through the same door at the same time, etc... I would think it creepy if a person of any ethnicity were chasing down people just to say hello. Although that is really a poor way to think as well. Perhaps this person had a really great day or just wanted to pass along some good cheer and smiles. In thinking about it, I guess I would actually prefer this over friendly person to the grinch. (But watch your back ) Lol

[61guitarman61]

I say hello to any Falang women I see. And if they are not wearing a bra I do a little jig.

I would be hoping THEY would do the little jig.

[61guitarman61]

I don't really care one way or the other...

It's obvious that you do care, otherwise you wouldn't even bring this up. We had a thread about this awhile back and it perplexed me a great deal. Why would a farang have an obligation to acknowledge every other farang they walk by? It's asinine to think that just because we share the same....what exactly (skin color?)....that we'd have to treat one another differently than we would any random Thai (or Japanese or Korean). Let's try this: treat everyone the same. Can you do that? And if any farang (or Thai) were to ignore your incredibly humane efforts at friendliness (or creepiness), don't get so bent-out-of-shape about it. Everyone has their own comfort zone and it doesn't mean that people are "(attempting) to lose their western identities." Where do people come up with this stuff?

What a load of rubbish you are talking about Berkshire. Why do people like you bother posting.

I do care, i guess, to the point that only the other westerners are the ones being anti-social horse's petoots. I give and receive dozens (sometimes hundreds) of sawasdee ka/krap greetings every day here and all with a reciprocal smile. Sure I like that. Feels great to give and receive pleasantries of this nature. (Unless you are a troll still hiding beneath your bridge.)

[61guitarman61]

My wife seems to have a similar approach to the OP on this. I regularly get dragged off to meet the farang boyfriend or husband of some friend of hers. Last week it was it was an Austrian guy who didn't speak english or thai and was 25-30 years older than me. I am sure he is a very nice guy but we did not appear to have anything at all in common or an ability to communicate effectively. Her best friend married a swiss guy last month and, when they are in Thailand, we see them regularly however my wife cannot understand why I do not talk to her friends husband more and does not grasp that I am having to use my high school french.

Point taken. I'm talking more, however, about the simple acknowledgement of existence as opposed to looking away if eye contact is accidentally made. As I said twice now, I don't really care if I meet another farang. I know hundreds and have met in passing probably tens of thousands while in the states. I just find this behavior facinating, and perhaps a little disturbing, but without any personal stake in the phenomenon at all.

The issue is that the term farang can cover a wide group of people (and even offends some for some reason who should try chilling out more!) but the only real commonality is probably skin colour. Many ppl, particularly outside the tourist areas, who have been here a while feel they have integrated to some degree with the general population around them and therefore have far more in common with locals - speak thai, understand to some degree local ways and customs - then they would with someone from a country on the other side of the world from their place of birth that shares the same skin colour.

Having said that, my wife got very frustrated when she was living in England when she saw people she thought were Thai and, after trying to talk to them, found out they were Phillipino.

Out of curiosity, what was your wife's reaction to finding out they were not Thai? I would assume that the Filipinas spoke rather proper English, and living in England, I would assume your wife would have picked up a fair amount also. They should have been able to have a conversation, correct? Last thought. Would the fact that they were Filipinas be a reason to NOT talk to them? Afterall, I am not talking about walking up to a stranger whose ethnicity I do not know, to have an in depth discussion about politics or high finance or anything of consequence for that matter. Just a nod perhaps in passing. And if this person decided to want to speak with me, and he was German or French or some other language I am unfamiliar with, I would still feign attempts at communicating. If unsuccessful, so what. New Yorker syndrome is running rampant it seems where 10M people can live in close proximity and in an apartment building with 20 apartments on your floor you do not know a single one of them. I am glad the Thais are not this way at least.

[BoonToong]

I used to say hello to other farrangs when I first came to Thailand but ended up speaking to so may weirdos and plonkers (they probably think the same of me LOL) that I have had to stop; christ, one of the reasons I left my own country was to avoid people like that..

Shame really, because I'm a friendly person and say hello to most people that I see.

Plenty wonderful local people to talk to instead.

[Orac]

Out of curiosity, what was your wife's reaction to finding out they were not Thai? I would assume that the Filipinas spoke rather proper English, and living in England, I would assume your wife would have picked up a fair amount also. They should have been able to have a conversation, correct? Last thought. Would the fact that they were Filipinas be a reason to NOT talk to them? Afterall, I am not talking about walking up to a stranger whose ethnicity I do not know, to have an in depth discussion about politics or high finance or anything of consequence for that matter. Just a nod perhaps in passing. And if this person decided to want to speak with me, and he was German or French or some other language I am unfamiliar with, I would still feign attempts at communicating. If unsuccessful, so what. New Yorker syndrome is running rampant it seems where 10M people can live in close proximity and in an apartment building with 20 apartments on your floor you do not know a single one of them. I am glad the Thais are not this way at least.

I am sure my wife could have spoken to her in english, in fact, I assume she must have to find out she was Filipina however, once she had established that she was not Thai, she did not see the need to carry on any conversation. I suppose this is the same as the situation you are refering to with farang in Thailand and, to be honest, my first reaction to my wife was that this filipina (and there are a few around where we lived as opposed to the 2 thais which I didn't know and took my wife all of 2 days to find) would be someone who my wife might like to get to know as they were of a similar age. My wifes response to this suggestion was a baffled 'but she isn't Thai".

[Moonrakers]

If I find myself out shopping, for whatever reason, I have a mission: Get in, get what I need and get the <deleted> out. Nothing else matters and and I'd even walk straight past Kylie Minogue if she was in Tesco's. If I am shopping with the wife the my mood is likely to be a foul one, you even wouldn't want to talk top me anyway in that case.

At other times such as in the street or whatever, I am headed for a destination and focused on getting there. If I am going to the pub or home, then my mind is set on pub or home. I certainly don't want to stand around in the Bangkok heat making small talk about the weather with a compete stranger. It's hot, we all know it's hot, there's no need to have a bleeding discussion about it because it won't change the fact that it is bloody hot.

I think standing about having aimless chit-chat with people you don't even know is for old people who have nothing better to do or have forgotten what they got out of bed for that day. Everybody else, believe or not, is likely to be out with a purpose.

Find me mucking about on the beach or in the pub with a beer in my hand then I'll be much more approachable. The rest of the time...... I'm busy.

[chuang]

I think when a farang meets another farang..what goes in their heads is 'a cheap charlie or a DOM '..better to avoid..

[doggie888888]

It's plain rude not to acknowledge a friendly greeting from someone else, whether from strangers or friends. Worse still are the people who just walk past without even a "thanks" when I hold the door for them. Makes me feel like just letting door go after I walk thru and watch it slam in their rude faces.

[bermondburi]

If I find myself out shopping, for whatever reason, I have a mission: Get in, get what I need and get the <deleted> out. Nothing else matters and and I'd even walk straight past Kylie Minogue if she was in Tesco's. If I am shopping with the wife the my mood is likely to be a foul one, you even wouldn't want to talk top me anyway in that case.

At other times such as in the street or whatever, I am headed for a destination and focused on getting there. If I am going to the pub or home, then my mind is set on pub or home. I certainly don't want to stand around in the Bangkok heat making small talk about the weather with a compete stranger. It's hot, we all know it's hot, there's no need to have a bleeding discussion about it because it won't change the fact that it is bloody hot.

I think standing about having aimless chit-chat with people you don't even know is for old people who have nothing better to do or have forgotten what they got out of bed for that day. Everybody else, believe or not, is likely to be out with a purpose.

Find me mucking about on the beach or in the pub with a beer in my hand then I'll be much more approachable. The rest of the time...... I'm busy.

remind me not to speak to you in Tesco !!

[jdinasia]

I always smile at farang females. When it comes to farang males, most are degenerates who you want to avoid.

You mean you do this in the UK?

[Beetlejuice]

I’ll go even further.

Not only do they give the impression that you smell bad and should be avoided, but in some instances being in the same area as another farang is like when two dogs meet for the first time and begin growling at each other.

At most times I feel hostile towards them because they seem hostile towards me.

I have no interest in going out of my way to be friendly just because it`s another white person, but I have noticed some do appear to look down through their noses at you and deliberately make body language as if to say; go on; make my day punk.

Perhaps it`s because they feel we are a threat, encroaching onto their territory and taking away the glory of them being the one and only.

[61guitarman61]

It's plain rude not to acknowledge a friendly greeting from someone else, whether from strangers or friends. Worse still are the people who just walk past without even a "thanks" when I hold the door for them. Makes me feel like just letting door go after I walk thru and watch it slam in their rude faces.

I really love the Thai politeness. Some of it is only whitewash. I understnad this. But overall we could learn alot. Westerners that is.

[bkkjames]

It's plain rude not to acknowledge a friendly greeting from someone else, whether from strangers or friends. Worse still are the people who just walk past without even a "thanks" when I hold the door for them. Makes me feel like just letting door go after I walk thru and watch it slam in their rude faces.

I really love the Thai politeness. Some of it is only whitewash. I understnad this. But overall we could learn alot. Westerners that is.

Wait till you learn the language then you can really immerse yourself in what is being said as you walk by

[61guitarman61]

I'll go even further.

Not only do they give the impression that you smell bad and should be avoided, but in some instances being in the same area as another farang is like when two dogs meet for the first time and begin growling at each other.

At most times I feel hostile towards them because they seem hostile towards me.

I have no interest in going out of my way to be friendly just because it`s another white person, but I have noticed some do appear to look down through their noses at you and deliberately make body language as if to say; go on; make my day punk.

Perhaps it`s because they feel we are a threat, encroaching onto their territory and taking away the glory of them being the one and only.

Love the pic!! I think I saw him fly past me on his wannabe Harley on Koh Samui last month when I was there. Lol

[tim armstrong]

My wife seems to have a similar approach to the OP on this. I regularly get dragged off to meet the farang boyfriend or husband of some friend of hers. Last week it was it was an Austrian guy who didn't speak english or thai and was 25-30 years older than me. I am sure he is a very nice guy but we did not appear to have anything at all in common or an ability to communicate effectively. Her best friend married a swiss guy last month and, when they are in Thailand, we see them regularly however my wife cannot understand why I do not talk to her friends husband more and does not grasp that I am having to use my high school french.

Point taken. I'm talking more, however, about the simple acknowledgement of existence as opposed to looking away if eye contact is accidentally made. As I said twice now, I don't really care if I meet another farang. I know hundreds and have met in passing probably tens of thousands while in the states. I just find this behavior facinating, and perhaps a little disturbing, but without any personal stake in the phenomenon at all.

I find it a bit curious too. I find I meet a better type of farlang at the deli counter in Big C buying ham as opposed to the Heineken bar downstairs chatting up the girls in the way too small heineken skirts. But yes walking along a street hmm! Maybe some farlang who are relatively new to Thailand are still a bit unsure about being surrounded by so many 'foreigners' ie thais, and are really tourists, rather than travellers. Travellers on the other hand blend in, speak some of the language, are open to new ideas, food etc, and do say hello to interesting looking people, farlang or otherwise. I think its a lot about confidence in oneself. Maesot is a special place. As a border town it has a lot of passing tourists doing visa runs, drug run, dodgy gem runs, and people trafficking runs, especially now in the dry season. Some will know that Irrawaddy just across the bridge is currently awash wih Karen fighters and burmese troops. It happens about the same time each year, and has to do with all the 'running'. So not surprised farlang in Maesot are a bit standoffish. There are also a lot of NGOs there doing good work in the untalked about refugee camps. Some workers unfortunately. develop a misplaced sense of their own importance, and have little time for anyone else. But like others have said, chill out and go with the flow.

[Kilgore Trout]

Would you say hello to every Farang that you saw on the street back home?

No, but I might say hi to a chink or a gook (farang is also a racist term, so think before you respond)

ACTUALLY, the term farang is not at all racist. It broadly refers to any person not from Thailand much as our term "alien" (outside of the useage with regard to beings from outer space ) refers to people not citizens of the United States. Hardly a racist term.

Actually, you are quite wrong.

If what you say is true then why is a white person with Thai citizenship still a farang? And why is a Cambodian, Laotian, Chinese, Japanese, etc. etc. etc. NOT a falang?

Please confirm the truth of what I say with any Thai person and then use logic to figure out what the actual meaning of "farang" is.

[balhamred]

Would you say hello to every Farang that you saw on the street back home?

No, but I might say hi to a chink or a gook (farang is also a racist term, so think before you respond)

ACTUALLY, the term farang is not at all racist. It broadly refers to any person not from Thailand much as our term "alien" (outside of the useage with regard to beings from outer space ) refers to people not citizens of the United States. Hardly a racist term.

Actually, you are quite wrong.

If what you say is true then why is a white person with Thai citizenship still a farang? And why is a Cambodian, Laotian, Chinese, Japanese, etc. etc. etc. NOT a falang?

Please confirm the truth of what I say with any Thai person and then use logic to figure out what the actual meaning of "farang" is.

well the meaning of 'farang' is clearly a western foreigner. at my work people will mainly call the small contingent of us that are foreign 'farang' - but that includes 2 americans who are also half asian and not white.

being called a farang by colleagues at first annoyed me and i classified it as racism to some extent, but the word is not meant as a derogatory term. sure, its use very clearly demonstrates the divide in thai peoples' minds between themselves and foreigners, but its use is not meant to harm - it is just their culture of how to describe westerners. i would not classify it as racism to be honest.

[bkkjames]

Can we save the meaning of Farang debate part 58 for another slow news day?

[jdinasia]

Would you say hello to every Farang that you saw on the street back home?

No, but I might say hi to a chink or a gook (farang is also a racist term, so think before you respond)

ACTUALLY, the term farang is not at all racist. It broadly refers to any person not from Thailand much as our term "alien" (outside of the useage with regard to beings from outer space ) refers to people not citizens of the United States. Hardly a racist term.

Actually, you are quite wrong.

If what you say is true then why is a white person with Thai citizenship still a farang? And why is a Cambodian, Laotian, Chinese, Japanese, etc. etc. etc. NOT a falang?

Please confirm the truth of what I say with any Thai person and then use logic to figure out what the actual meaning of "farang" is.

Off topic mostly -- but farang means white westerner. It isn't racist unless it is meant that way. Kaek means visitor. Asians are generally called by their nationality if known, if not by a general term. Foreigner is khon tang phrathet ... and can be used with any group that is not Thai. Some nationalities are looked up to (Japanese and Korean out of the asian nationalities, and some are looked down on like most of Thailand's neighbors. That is a nationality issue and not racial.

on topic (mostly) --- I will generally give a nod (to another farang) to someone who is on his way or we are passing each other. I will generally try and avoid social contact with other foreigners if they would have the chance to strike up a conversation. (again in passing) .... like at a store etc. I meet enough people and know enough people through work to not want to be expanding my social circles with random strangers (for the most part). Then again, it is about the same rule I use with Thais as going about my daily business.

[thaihome]

Point taken. I'm talking more, however, about the simple acknowledgement of existence as opposed to looking away if eye contact is accidentally made. As I said twice now, I don't really care if I meet another farang. I know hundreds and have met in passing probably tens of thousands while in the states. I just find this behavior facinating, and perhaps a little disturbing, but without any personal stake in the phenomenon at all.

It seems to me you are suffering from a case of Farang paranoia. This common in people that are unused or unadjusted to living in developing countries where they stand out. They also tend to think in terms of “us” and “them” and often feel the people are racist against them.

If you were an American or British person living in say Germany, how would know if another white person you saw was the same nationality as you ?

TH

[61guitarman61]

No, but I might say hi to a chink or a gook (farang is also a racist term, so think before you respond)

ACTUALLY, the term farang is not at all racist. It broadly refers to any person not from Thailand much as our term "alien" (outside of the useage with regard to beings from outer space ) refers to people not citizens of the United States. Hardly a racist term.

Actually, you are quite wrong.

If what you say is true then why is a white person with Thai citizenship still a farang? And why is a Cambodian, Laotian, Chinese, Japanese, etc. etc. etc. NOT a falang?

Please confirm the truth of what I say with any Thai person and then use logic to figure out what the actual meaning of "farang" is.

well the meaning of 'farang' is clearly a western foreigner. at my work people will mainly call the small contingent of us that are foreign 'farang' - but that includes 2 americans who are also half asian and not white.

being called a farang by colleagues at first annoyed me and i classified it as racism to some extent, but the word is not meant as a derogatory term. sure, its use very clearly demonstrates the divide in thai peoples' minds between themselves and foreigners, but its use is not meant to harm - it is just their culture of how to describe westerners. i would not classify it as racism to be honest.

I apologize. I did check for more accurate transliteration and it is used mostly to identify non-Asians. Most of the time in Thailand that would refer to the lightest color skin you see in the room - barring an over-zealous whitening cream user of Thai decent. I mispoke based on partial assumed knowledge.

[balhamred]

yeh i'm pretty antisocial when i see other farang around, even if they look reputable. thats just the way i am in england or thailand- i only like talking if its going to be an entertaining conversation and the chances of a random conversation with some random fellow white-skin while queuing at 7-11 going beyond small talk, is minimal. if im in a bar and had a few beers then i might be up for chatting who appears to be like-minded and we can hit an interesting conversation topic pretty quick without all the boring conversation intro.

[Kilgore Trout]

Agreed that it is not always used in a deragatory way, BUT....think about how the "n" word is used in rap music or in some circles of African Americans, it is not always used in a deragatory way. However, when I taught in an inner city school we taught the children that it is NOT ok to use that word at all and I very much agree with that.

I feel the same way about the word "falang," I have to accept it's use by the Thais and not be bothered too much by it as a way of life here but when I hear white westerners calling themselves "falang" it just seem ridiculous to me.

[jdinasia]

Agreed that it is not always used in a deragatory way, BUT....think about how the "n" word is used in rap music or in some circles of African Americans, it is not always used in a deragatory way. However, when I taught in an inner city school we taught the children that it is NOT ok to use that word at all and I very much agree with that.

I feel the same way about the word "falang," I have to accept it's use by the Thais and not be bothered too much by it as a way of life here but when I hear white westerners calling themselves "falang" it just seem ridiculous to me.

Frankly I don't care how you feel about people choosing to add Thai words that are quite defining into their vocabulary in Thailand. Nor do I care about what you taught children in inner city schools in the US. This isn't the US. BTW -- you can tell a lot about who a farang associates with by how he pronounces or spells the word

This is Thailand. It isn't the US. In the U.S. you wouldn't get all offended if someone adds detail to a story by saying "he's black" ... comparing the use of farang to the word nigger really is an ignorant comparison. Again, this is Thailand ... where if you are fat, people will say you are fat. If you are black they will say you are black (this goes for Thais talking about Thais --- they mostly assume black skinned foreigners are from Africa --- my black friends here use the term farang dam to quickly move the mindset of Thais away from that assumption.If you are really skinny they will say it ... why get offended about someone pointing out the truth?

I hope the day never comes where Thailand becomes so PC that it doesn't bother people like you

[61guitarman61]

Point taken. I'm talking more, however, about the simple acknowledgement of existence as opposed to looking away if eye contact is accidentally made. As I said twice now, I don't really care if I meet another farang. I know hundreds and have met in passing probably tens of thousands while in the states. I just find this behavior facinating, and perhaps a little disturbing, but without any personal stake in the phenomenon at all.

It seems to me you are suffering from a case of Farang paranoia. This common in people that are unused or unadjusted to living in developing countries where they stand out. They also tend to think in terms of "us" and "them" and often feel the people are racist against them.

If you were an American or British person living in say Germany, how would know if another white person you saw was the same nationality as you ?

TH

Lack of deodorant?

Seriously, I use the term farang alot because everyone knows and readily identifies with who I am talking about. It has ruffled a few feathers it seems so I shall cease using it in this topic. I appreciate your insight but do not accept its validity with regard to me anyway. I have gone several weeks at a time without seeing a western individual and I found myself neither wishing there were more around or put off upon seeing some stroll through. I am mostly making statements with regard to the OTHER party's response. As far as "us" and "them", there is always some of that whether here in Thailand or at home in the states and referring to lets say the Mexicans living among us. There are cultural, ethnic, religeous, culinary, physical and linguistic differences that perpetuate the "us" and "them" aspect and it is not necessarilly a bad thing. Should I lose my western identity because I am living in Thailand? Of course not. Should the Mexicans lose their ethnicity because they are living in the US? Nope. Any racist feeling is probably due to them not respecting the culture they are living in and rather than trying to fit in, being ugly tourist types.

Topic is getting broader.

Edited January 25, 2011 by 61guitarman61