Visiting Uk With My Half Thai, Half British Daughter

[Bezza]

I'm trying to find out if I will need to get a visa for my baby if I visit the UK at Christmas with her. She will be 10 months old at the time of travel and I am British and her father is Thai. The problem I am having is that I haven't managed to get her a UK passport yet so she will be travelling on her Thai passport. I am still waiting for my UK long version birth certificate to arrive even though I applied for it over a month ago. So, I no longer have time to apply for a UK passport before travelling.

However, it also seems that I might not have time to apply for a UK visitor visa for her, if she requires one. I am really hoping that I can travel to the UK without one if I take her birth certificate and a translation to show at the border that I am her mother and British. I have emailed the UK Border Authority and the British Embassy in Thailand and am waiting to hear back from them but just wondered if anyone knows about this as I really want to book a flight soon.

Also, if I do need to get a visa for her, does anyone know how long it takes? I looked online but couldn't get a definite answer - seems to be anywhere between 2 day and 6 weeks. Can I get it in person at the British Embassy in Bangkok or does it have to be submitted by post?

Hope someone can help.

Thank you.

[7by7]

If she does not have a British passport and is traveling on a Thai passport then she will need to have the appropriate visa to enter the UK.

To apply, see Applying for a UK visa in Thailand. Note that you will need to make an appointment to submit the application.

You will need to provide evidence of your ties and reasons to return to Thailand after the visit to show that you do not intend to remain in the UK with your daughter but are just visiting.

Processing times depend upon demand. Anecdotal evidence suggests that visit visa applications are currently being processed in 5 working days or less. However, the floods may have changed this as both the UK Visa Application Centre and the British embassy are subject to closure and staff shortages due to the flooding. See Visa application centre in Bangkok closed due to floods.

You may find VAT03 - Special visitor: Child visitors helpful.

NB

British nationality law can be complex. As she was, presumably, born outside the UK then just because you are British and her mother does not automatically mean she is British; it depends on whether you are British by descent or British otherwise than by descent; which is why your long form birth certificate is needed to obtain a British passport for her. See here for more on British nationality.

Even if you cannot do so in time for this visit, you should, assuming she is eligible, obtain a British passport for her ASAP. She can then use her Thai passport to leave and enter Thailand and her British passport to leave and enter the UK, without any restrictions at either end.

Edited October 31, 2011 by 7by7
Addendum

[Bezza]

Thank you very much! It's good to finally get an answer about this as I couldn't see anything relevant on the Border Authority website other than how to apply for a visa and I didn't want to apply if I didn't need to.

Nothing is ever simple is it? Hopefully we will have a nice Christmas in England at the end of the process though!

[bobrussell]

Make sure that you make it clear in the covering letter that you have/will be applying for a British passport but are waiting for the long form birth certificate. This should help the application but as stated above you must give adequate reason to return if you have to use a Thai passport.

I would hope there would be some degree of commonsense in processing the application followed by some commonsense at the airport on arrival. None of these is guaranteed I am afraid!

Edited November 1, 2011 by bobrussell

[Bezza]

Thank you Bob. That is helpful to know. A friend just told me that her sister and her husband, who are both British and had been living in Thailand and had a baby over here, had trouble taking their baby back to the UK. Even though they had her birth certificate with them, they were suspected of trying to traffic the baby and had to show medical records as well to try to prove the baby was theirs. I'm not looking forward to going through the Thai or UK borders even with a visa and any documents I think will be useful to bring with me!! As if it's not going to be hard enough travelling on my own with a baby, I'll have the border authorities to deal with as well!

[bobrussell]

Thank you Bob. That is helpful to know. A friend just told me that her sister and her husband, who are both British and had been living in Thailand and had a baby over here, had trouble taking their baby back to the UK. Even though they had her birth certificate with them, they were suspected of trying to traffic the baby and had to show medical records as well to try to prove the baby was theirs. I'm not looking forward to going through the Thai or UK borders even with a visa and any documents I think will be useful to bring with me!! As if it's not going to be hard enough travelling on my own with a baby, I'll have the border authorities to deal with as well!

My wife and daughter had a very unpleasant run in with the UKBA at Heathrow despite valid visas based on what the immigration officer thought they might do so I have a slightly jaundiced view but the UKBA has been slammed for its treatment of some children at the border recently so should be on best behaviour!

Make sure the paperwork is correct and there is no excuse for them delaying you on entry. I would advise you take copies of the evidence showing reason to return just in case. My wife was stopped and held because she brought all her settlement paperwork with her and they assumed she was going to try to apply for settlement in the UK. I would strongly suggest you have return tickets to show when you are going to return!

I doubt you will have any problems!

[JohnAllan]

The 'birth certificate' - nationality certificate - is likely to be around 3 months, I can assure you, so you will need a visa.

[JohnAllan]

If she does not have a British passport and is traveling on a Thai passport then she will need to have the appropriate visa to enter the UK.

To apply, see Applying for a UK visa in Thailand. Note that you will need to make an appointment to submit the application.

You will need to provide evidence of your ties and reasons to return to Thailand after the visit to show that you do not intend to remain in the UK with your daughter but are just visiting.

Processing times depend upon demand. Anecdotal evidence suggests that visit visa applications are currently being processed in 5 working days or less. However, the floods may have changed this as both the UK Visa Application Centre and the British embassy are subject to closure and staff shortages due to the flooding. See Visa application centre in Bangkok closed due to floods.

You may find VAT03 - Special visitor: Child visitors helpful.

NB

British nationality law can be complex. As she was, presumably, born outside the UK then just because you are British and her mother does not automatically mean she is British; it depends on whether you are British by descent or British otherwise than by descent; which is why your long form birth certificate is needed to obtain a British passport for her. See here for more on British nationality.

Even if you cannot do so in time for this visit, you should, assuming she is eligible, obtain a British passport for her ASAP. She can then use her Thai passport to leave and enter Thailand and her British passport to leave and enter the UK, without any restrictions at either end.

Actually wrong. As the child's mother, she always has been assumed to pass on nationality. The problem was if you were a British father with a Thai partner and baby born here. But that eventually - probably because someone realised they were breaking the discrimination laws - changed.

[ludditeman]

If she does not have a British passport and is traveling on a Thai passport then she will need to have the appropriate visa to enter the UK.

To apply, see Applying for a UK visa in Thailand. Note that you will need to make an appointment to submit the application.

You will need to provide evidence of your ties and reasons to return to Thailand after the visit to show that you do not intend to remain in the UK with your daughter but are just visiting.

Processing times depend upon demand. Anecdotal evidence suggests that visit visa applications are currently being processed in 5 working days or less. However, the floods may have changed this as both the UK Visa Application Centre and the British embassy are subject to closure and staff shortages due to the flooding. See Visa application centre in Bangkok closed due to floods.

You may find VAT03 - Special visitor: Child visitors helpful.

NB

British nationality law can be complex. As she was, presumably, born outside the UK then just because you are British and her mother does not automatically mean she is British; it depends on whether you are British by descent or British otherwise than by descent; which is why your long form birth certificate is needed to obtain a British passport for her. See here for more on British nationality.

Even if you cannot do so in time for this visit, you should, assuming she is eligible, obtain a British passport for her ASAP. She can then use her Thai passport to leave and enter Thailand and her British passport to leave and enter the UK, without any restrictions at either end.

Actually wrong. As the child's mother, she always has been assumed to pass on nationality. The problem was if you were a British father with a Thai partner and baby born here. But that eventually - probably because someone realised they were breaking the discrimination laws - changed.

7By7 is correct and you are wrong John

British nationality is not assumed or assured, If the mother was "British by Descent" (born outside of the UK in a non-approved country) she does not have the automatic right to pass on her Nationality. I never understand why everyone doesn't apply for a British passport for their baby the moment it arrives. Saves lots of trouble.

Edited November 7, 2011 by ludditeman

[Bezza]

Thanks for the replies. I have submitted the visa application form and now just need to get to a flooded Bangkok to visit the application centre for the rest of the process.

Ludditeman clearly hasn't given birth and breastfed a baby all day and all night, as well as helping to run a business, keep a house clean and start a new business, oh and look after 4 dogs! Not everyone has the time to cope with everything but thank you for the other part of your reply!

[7by7]

Actually wrong. As the child's mother, she always has been assumed to pass on nationality. The problem was if you were a British father with a Thai partner and baby born here. But that eventually - probably because someone realised they were breaking the discrimination laws - changed.

7By7 is correct and you are wrong John

British nationality is not assumed or assured, If the mother was "British by Descent" (born outside of the UK in a non-approved country) she does not have the automatic right to pass on her Nationality.

Indeed, neither gender nor marital status has any effect on whether one is British by descent or British otherwise than by descent. If you are British by descent you cannot pass your British nationality onto your children born outside the UK or a qualifying territory; unless you are abroad on Crown service. See the link I provided earlier.

John, you are thinking of the old rule, changed with effect from 1st July 2006, that British fathers could not automatically pass on their nationality to their children born outside the UK or a qualifying territory unless they were married to the child's mother.