Business Owners In Pattaya-Staff Problems

[phl]

Really was hoping to hear from business owners in Pattaya ONLY.

I have been running a few businesses here in Pattaya, including a hotel.

I find it very difficult to find staff and to keep them.

I usually advertise on pattaya job center as all other places seem to be useless.

I offer above minimum wage, plus the food, tips, bonuses, overtime, and social security, so everything is by law plus more.

Always have dozens calling for the reception, but 99% of them do not show up for interview

Many of those who show up, have work experience of 2-3 months in each work place( not a good indicator)

Some can not string 3 words in English and yet coming to apply for reception job(advert clearly states must speak English)

Too often, after offering them a job, they do not show up to work

Some work for 2-3 days and disappear

A VERY major trouble i always have is no one and i mean no one in the past 2 years worked for over 4 months, usually 2-3 months and gone without so much

as a phone call

Many who come to work or interview as i have learned have bf a foreigner who supports them, so they only look for job because

1. boring to stay home

2.bf wants them too

Those do not usually last more than 1 week.

Have tried to pay more money, but did not seem to matter. With some, after giving them a pay rise and a bonus, they also disappear.

So my question to fellow Pattaya business owners is, do you experience same trouble finding staff and keeping staff? Those who manage to keep staff for long time, how do you keep them?

Those in sex industry business, please do not comment, as in this town there is no problem to find staff for that, i am more interested to hear from people in similar business as myself .

Your house maids or gardeners also do not really qualify as i have no problem with my home staff( may maid has been with me for 5 years and never missed a day of work)

[chuckd]

Sent you a message.

[Spalpeen]

It's not just Pattaya or Thailand. This is a problem the world over. There's a whole generation with no work ethic, no skills to offer and a huge sense of entitlement. My wife, Thai herself and a hard worker, despairs when employees show no interest in working and just disappear after a few days or weeks.

[toenail]

Even the major car manufacturers in Thailand (which offer good wages and benefits compared to other places) are having challenges finding enough workers. Many employees do not last a year which is an investment problem since these companies have to take time to train the worker for their job. Then there is a limit number of Thais that have special degrees for the corporate world (electrician, chemical engineering,draftsman...) so these few can pick and choose their jobs. With the young adult Thais that are into the service industry (hotel and tourism) it seems they quit their jobs before finding another - no worry. My view on this employment shortage is because many Thais that have lived on farms are use to being their own "boss" and the structured 8 hour job and being away from family is not appealing even if the money is better

[phl]

Even the major car manufacturers in Thailand (which offer good wages and benefits compared to other places) are having challenges finding enough workers. Many employees do not last a year which is an investment problem since these companies have to take time to train the worker for their job. Then there is a limit number of Thais that have special degrees for the corporate world (electrician, chemical engineering,draftsman...) so these few can pick and choose their jobs. With the young adult Thais that are into the service industry (hotel and tourism) it seems they quit their jobs before finding another - no worry. My view on this employment shortage is because many Thais that have lived on farms are use to being their own "boss" and the structured 8 hour job and being away from family is not appealing even if the money is better

absolutely agree.

before i could not understand why so many shops have 10 times needed staff, but i think it is clear now, because 1 day they have 10 times, but the next not enough.

1 thing which really puzzles me is they(staff) always cry about not having the money, minimum wage not being enough etc etc etc, yet they do not want to work or stay employed.

whats the difference is minimum wage is 1000 baht per day if they do not work for more than few months.

also at the same time,while inexperienced, naturally start on low wage, but after working for at least a year, they always get a good payrise and more so with every year, yet they do not do that.

I have to ask though, how do Thai owners and business operate? To me and i could be wrong, but it seems every place where i shop or eat they seem to have same staff, same faces. Watching managers/owners speak with staff- it does look like they do not ask them to do things, but tell them and wages paid are really minimum.

One place i eat, they pay their cook 6500 per month for first year and if cook stays longer its up to 9000 per month. In the mean time, i can not get a cook for under 12 000 to start

[Darrel]

It's not just Pattaya or Thailand. This is a problem the world over. There's a whole generation with no work ethic, no skills to offer and a huge sense of entitlement.

Very true. I'm delighted that I got through my entire working life without ever needing an employee. I just did everything myself (with great success) and when things started getting a bit too busy I just stopped taking on new customers.

Cant think of anything worse than having to employ staff in a restaurant environment, no matter what nationality they might be.

[marinediscoking]

I experience the same problems as you, but for the last couple of years I have found stability by hiring ladies who are 40ish. As long as you treat them fairly they seem to stick around and are more professional. In general they are slower to learn while training but their loyalty makes up for this in the long run. Most help wanted sighs that I see specify "must be under 30" and are missing out, unless they don't mind turnover.

[somtampet]

good day to you.

My partner will be looking for work in the next few weeks.We are in the uk on holiday at the moment,and will return on the 15th of May.She has been working for a cheese company for two years,speaks,reads good english and has worked in quite a few industries over the years.Have u got a number she could contact you on for a chat as to what jobs may be available,and she will get back to you when we are back in Pattaya.

john

[marstons]

good day to you.

My partner will be looking for work in the next few weeks.We are in the uk on holiday at the moment,and will return on the 15th of May.She has been working for a cheese company for two years,speaks,reads good english and has worked in quite a few industries over the years.Have u got a number she could contact you on for a chat as to what jobs may be available,and she will get back to you when we are back in Pattaya.

john

has Farang boyfriend and worked in quite a few industries seem to indicate what OP has problems with. Worked in quite a few industries, think you might have shot your self in the foot on that one.

[jaapfries]

Please PM me, cheers.

[pauljones]

They flee when they discover you are expecting them to actually do work?

I've seen staff quit a good paying job to take a position that pays less but not much performance is expected.

You know, arrive late, take a nap, play facebook, eat, pretend to work a bit then go home early....

[LennyW]

We went through about a dozen maids for our house before we found one that stuck it out, the one that stayed was deaf so she did not hear my wife yakking all the time - result!!

Very difficult to get staff for our noodle shop too, plenty girls appear looking for a job but they all think they are cooks!! after a couple of days when they realise their job is to serve, prepare veggies, take orders and CLEAN UP...they disappear, the ones that seem most reliable are the 40 + women with young kids, provided you can accommodate their school pick up / drop off needs they seem to have a better work ethic, but still difficult!!

[phl]

Funny a few guys mention older people.

I have also tried that, even went as far as 60

They did not disappear, they were stealing (thinking i would not notice) and did hardly anything, ie just sit there and watch others work.

One of the funniest things once, was my maid who was in late 30's advised reception, guy was mid 50's that the lights blown in one room.

His response was "go get a ladder and change it" mind you reception was dead ie no customers, plus there were 2 people on the shift in reception and myself.

The very same man also ALWAYS washed his hands with drinking water from the machine,

[phl]

good day to you.

My partner will be looking for work in the next few weeks.We are in the uk on holiday at the moment,and will return on the 15th of May.She has been working for a cheese company for two years,speaks,reads good english and has worked in quite a few industries over the years.Have u got a number she could contact you on for a chat as to what jobs may be available,and she will get back to you when we are back in Pattaya.

john

has Farang boyfriend and worked in quite a few industries seem to indicate what OP has problems with. Worked in quite a few industries, think you might have shot your self in the foot on that one.

Having farang boyfriend or having worked in a few industries is not really a problem

Experience from the past with every single one with similar history is

1. Farang boyfriend starts to pick and choose what hours she will work and what days he will have off

2. Farang boyfriend will spend half a day sitting in reception "watching"

3. She decides she does want or need to work, because he is giving enough money

4. Worked in many industries for 2 months if that, ie waste of my time for training

and one of the best with experience in many industries (yet none relevant) is the salary they ask. Just few example of the latest few

Came for a job of maid, advertised salary 8000 baht for maid with experience.

She worked in pizza shop 5 years ago for 2 months, she worked in factory for 6 weeks. she is 34 years old and this is all her experience, none of it as a maid.

She was asking for 9000 baht.

Could not help myself but to question her and salary.

"You have no experience as a maid, you are in your 30's and only worked for less than 3 months, it is advertised 8000 but here you are asking for 9000" i asked

Her response was(in a very very bad english)" yes before i clean house for farang and he give me 9000 baht and only boom boom me sometime"

[LennyW]

Very difficult for Thai workers to take orders from other Thais, and vice versa..Thai bosses don,t like to give orders to their fellow countrymen.

You look at any sweet running building site operation here in Pattaya you will find most of the labour is Burmese/Cambodian with Thai bosses, they have no problem giving orders to them workers!!

[phl]

Very difficult for Thai workers to take orders from other Thais, and vice versa..Thai bosses don,t like to give orders to their fellow countrymen.

You look at any sweet running building site operation here in Pattaya you will find most of the labour is Burmese/Cambodian with Thai bosses, they have no problem giving orders to them workers!!

Lenny, i do not think we need to discuss how well locals take orders or how managers like to manage.

I only say that because country somehow is operating and has one of the strongest economy's in the world(according to baht strength)

The regular place where i eat, i see manager speak with staff on the same level as they speak with dogs if not worse, HOWEVER, STAFF (a large number of them) are still working there and their salary is no more than 6500 if that.

I like to be believe that the problem is somewhat limited to Pattaya due to the caliber of people who come to work here.

Had a few maids who turn bar girls, ie work maid for 2 months, go MIA and then show up few months later offering their "service" and working bar.

I have had maids "service" guests, reception "doing" customers and the list goes on.

Though to be honest, it would make me feel better if people in other city's like BKK etc had the same problems( i know its sad for me to think this way, but i am honestly running out of idea's and energy)

Lately i been doing 18 hours every day myself, because new staff do not show up, or old staff do not show up and notice is sms(if lucky) 30 mins after they suppose to be at work.

Do note, i do have contracts and penalties, so they loose their salary's and deposits and yet even that does not stop them.

Have also employed Burmese at one stage and while they were more reliable, they also did not break a sweat. One maid use to take the whole day to clean 1 room, yes really 1 day for 1 room.

I have changed my management style so many times now that i do not think i have a style anymore.

I did try tough, nice, friendly, respectfull, strict, not strict at all, rewarding, but it all failed, nothing seems to work.

A few of my friends also seem to have the same problems, but all of them are married so their wives always find someone to replace, not necessary the right person but A person to work for time being.

One of my friends the other week said the funniest thing i heard in a long time as we were talking about staff, his exact words were

"At this point, i will employ anyone, even if its just a monkey with mouth, 2 hands and a pair of legs"

[petercool]

After working in Thailand for many, many years in the service industry, I really do feel that there is a cross-cultural issue with farang bosses and Thai staff. Experience proved - for me at least - that a good Thai deputy was required who did the hiring and firing and instructing of staff and the farang boss dealt with him or her rather than anyone else. It may not suit your situation but it's my 2 cents worth.

[marstons]

Very difficult for Thai workers to take orders from other Thais, and vice versa..Thai bosses don,t like to give orders to their fellow countrymen.

You look at any sweet running building site operation here in Pattaya you will find most of the labour is Burmese/Cambodian with Thai bosses, they have no problem giving orders to them workers!!

Lenny, i do not think we need to discuss how well locals take orders or how managers like to manage.

I only say that because country somehow is operating and has one of the strongest economy's in the world(according to baht strength)

The regular place where i eat, i see manager speak with staff on the same level as they speak with dogs if not worse, HOWEVER, STAFF (a large number of them) are still working there and their salary is no more than 6500 if that.

I like to be believe that the problem is somewhat limited to Pattaya due to the caliber of people who come to work here.

Had a few maids who turn bar girls, ie work maid for 2 months, go MIA and then show up few months later offering their "service" and working bar.

I have had maids "service" guests, reception "doing" customers and the list goes on.

Though to be honest, it would make me feel better if people in other city's like BKK etc had the same problems( i know its sad for me to think this way, but i am honestly running out of idea's and energy)

Lately i been doing 18 hours every day myself, because new staff do not show up, or old staff do not show up and notice is sms(if lucky) 30 mins after they suppose to be at work.

Do note, i do have contracts and penalties, so they loose their salary's and deposits and yet even that does not stop them.

Have also employed Burmese at one stage and while they were more reliable, they also did not break a sweat. One maid use to take the whole day to clean 1 room, yes really 1 day for 1 room.

I have changed my management style so many times now that i do not think i have a style anymore.

I did try tough, nice, friendly, respectfull, strict, not strict at all, rewarding, but it all failed, nothing seems to work.

A few of my friends also seem to have the same problems, but all of them are married so their wives always find someone to replace, not necessary the right person but A person to work for time being.

One of my friends the other week said the funniest thing i heard in a long time as we were talking about staff, his exact words were

"At this point, i will employ anyone, even if its just a monkey with mouth, 2 hands and a pair of legs"

There was a thread last month on the Samui forum with the exact same problem, as an employer on Samui i had exact same problem, beleive it it or not business in the sex industry have the exact same problem, as the staff all run off with farangs. Used to do my head on pay day as you would know as soon as they had the money in there hands it was thanks boss today my last day. think they are just plain lazy, i see thai goverment has just agreed to let in 200,000 workers from Myramar as the facotries cant find Thai workers.

[phl]

After working in Thailand for many, many years in the service industry, I really do feel that there is a cross-cultural issue with farang bosses and Thai staff. Experience proved - for me at least - that a good Thai deputy was required who did the hiring and firing and instructing of staff and the farang boss dealt with him or her rather than anyone else. It may not suit your situation but it's my 2 cents worth.

yes i am also aware of that, and did try having a manager. the result was also rather disappointing,

With 1 manager, they all did nothing if i was not there, and when i say nothing, i mean nothing, they all sat around lobby like a group of monkey's and ate all day long(was watching them from across the road.

The next manager, was little better, but kept asking for instructions every 5 mins, so was kind of useless to have him

The last one was great in terms of doing his job and training new staff, HOWEVER all went tits up when he hit the bottle and cards.

Also another problem with having a manager and allowing him to run the business is should he leave or be found doing something dodgy, the moment he quits or gets fired the entire staff also run away

I realize i come across being very negative, but am not at all, just speaking from experience of what has happened to me.

On a positive note, a number of my ex employees returned asking for their job back after a few months. I would strongly advise NOT to take them back, as i have discovered recently, they do the same thing they did last time-ie run away without a notice

[phl]

Very difficult for Thai workers to take orders from other Thais, and vice versa..Thai bosses don,t like to give orders to their fellow countrymen.

You look at any sweet running building site operation here in Pattaya you will find most of the labour is Burmese/Cambodian with Thai bosses, they have no problem giving orders to them workers!!

Lenny, i do not think we need to discuss how well locals take orders or how managers like to manage.

I only say that because country somehow is operating and has one of the strongest economy's in the world(according to baht strength)

The regular place where i eat, i see manager speak with staff on the same level as they speak with dogs if not worse, HOWEVER, STAFF (a large number of them) are still working there and their salary is no more than 6500 if that.

I like to be believe that the problem is somewhat limited to Pattaya due to the caliber of people who come to work here.

Had a few maids who turn bar girls, ie work maid for 2 months, go MIA and then show up few months later offering their "service" and working bar.

I have had maids "service" guests, reception "doing" customers and the list goes on.

Though to be honest, it would make me feel better if people in other city's like BKK etc had the same problems( i know its sad for me to think this way, but i am honestly running out of idea's and energy)

Lately i been doing 18 hours every day myself, because new staff do not show up, or old staff do not show up and notice is sms(if lucky) 30 mins after they suppose to be at work.

Do note, i do have contracts and penalties, so they loose their salary's and deposits and yet even that does not stop them.

Have also employed Burmese at one stage and while they were more reliable, they also did not break a sweat. One maid use to take the whole day to clean 1 room, yes really 1 day for 1 room.

I have changed my management style so many times now that i do not think i have a style anymore.

I did try tough, nice, friendly, respectfull, strict, not strict at all, rewarding, but it all failed, nothing seems to work.

A few of my friends also seem to have the same problems, but all of them are married so their wives always find someone to replace, not necessary the right person but A person to work for time being.

One of my friends the other week said the funniest thing i heard in a long time as we were talking about staff, his exact words were

"At this point, i will employ anyone, even if its just a monkey with mouth, 2 hands and a pair of legs"

There was a thread last month on the Samui forum with the exact same problem, as an employer on Samui i had exact same problem, beleive it it or not business in the sex industry have the exact same problem, as the staff all run off with farangs. Used to do my head on pay day as you would know as soon as they had the money in there hands it was thanks boss today my last day. think they are just plain lazy, i see thai goverment has just agreed to let in 200,000 workers from Myramar as the facotries cant find Thai workers.

LOL, as sad as it sounds, but i am sort of glad, i am not the only one in that boat.

Is it the same across the entire country? do thai business have the same problem?

Understand factory's may have hard time, but in my opinion, working in an air con hotel, with tv, chairs and hardly straining yourself does sound like a good job

[phl]

here is a good one for you guys.

i been advertising for a cook helper position offering 8500 baht per month, do not NOT a chief but a cook helper.

anyhow today had one come for an interview, gave him an application form to fill out.

application form has the usual questions plus things like past work experience and expected salary.

get ready for it, he hands back the form, which has no work experience at all and expected salary of 15 000 baht per month.

NOTE: Job advertised at 8500 per month.

i did ask him where he saw the advertising for the job and he confirmed the location, i did ask him what salary was advertised and again he confirmed the

8500, and yet he STILL puts down 15 000

[pipo1000]

here is a good one for you guys.

i been advertising for a cook helper position offering 8500 baht per month, do not NOT a chief but a cook helper.

anyhow today had one come for an interview, gave him an application form to fill out.

application form has the usual questions plus things like past work experience and expected salary.

get ready for it, he hands back the form, which has no work experience at all and expected salary of 15 000 baht per month.

NOTE: Job advertised at 8500 per month.

i did ask him where he saw the advertising for the job and he confirmed the location, i did ask him what salary was advertised and again he confirmed the

8500, and yet he STILL puts down 15 000

Well you could hardly expect he gonna write down 7500 do you.If you advertise the salary then why you ask the question anyway.

The problem with Thais is that they work untill they have enough money for living one month without working.This normally takes 3 months because they are already 2 months salary in debt before they take on a job.

So after the 3 months they stop working and live 1 month from the salary they saved and another 2 months from money they will borrow from friends and relatives.

[phl]

here is a good one for you guys.

i been advertising for a cook helper position offering 8500 baht per month, do not NOT a chief but a cook helper.

anyhow today had one come for an interview, gave him an application form to fill out.

application form has the usual questions plus things like past work experience and expected salary.

get ready for it, he hands back the form, which has no work experience at all and expected salary of 15 000 baht per month.

NOTE: Job advertised at 8500 per month.

i did ask him where he saw the advertising for the job and he confirmed the location, i did ask him what salary was advertised and again he confirmed the

8500, and yet he STILL puts down 15 000

Well you could hardly expect he gonna write down 7500 do you.If you advertise the salary then why you ask the question anyway.

The problem with Thais is that they work untill they have enough money for living one month without working.This normally takes 3 months because they are already 2 months salary in debt before they take on a job.

So after the 3 months they stop working and live 1 month from the salary they saved and another 2 months from money they will borrow from friends and relatives.

i would expect for him to write anything but 15000 ie double the advertised amount.

do keep in mind that 8500 is for an experienced cook helper, NOT just someone who likes to cut veggies

So i would also expect for someone who decides to put down double the offered salary to have enough brain cells to invent some work history rather than just hand over a form with nothing in it.

The question is there, because i advertise in a number of places and not all state the salary. i also advertise at a local supermarket, as well as on the actual hotel.

the 3 months "rule" you mention is true, HOWEVER, from what i have seen so far, their salary lasts less than 2 weeks, sometimes even less.

Not because its low, but because they constantly change jobs, borrow money so they always owe money to someone or for something.

hard drinking after work, does not help the savings plan either:)

Edited May 15, 2012 by phl

[thaidiver]

Some great posts, funny but true. Not to mention any business names, but the large hardware store's employees next to Big C are amazing to behold. Last week there must have been 200 employees lazing, standing around chatting, oblivious to customers and superiors. Seems to be the same shtick every time I'm there. How do places like this make any money? I haven't a clue.

When I was a teenager I used to love to actually work at my drugstore or hardware store job, made the time go by faster.

[Asiantravel]

Some great posts, funny but true. Not to mention any business names, but the large hardware store's employees next to Big C are amazing to behold. Last week there must have been 200 employees lazing, standing around chatting, oblivious to customers and superiors. Seems to be the same shtick every time I'm there. How do places like this make any money? I haven't a clue.

When I was a teenager I used to love to actually work at my drugstore or hardware store job, made the time go by faster.

there is no need for me to mention any names either because you have already done so for me

in your post above ( clue-third letter of the alphabet )but I have to say the shop assistants in this establishment

are some of the rudest and most apathetic people I have ever come across in a retail environment

Edited May 15, 2012 by Asiantravel

[pipo1000]

Some great posts, funny but true. Not to mention any business names, but the large hardware store's employees next to Big C are amazing to behold. Last week there must have been 200 employees lazing, standing around chatting, oblivious to customers and superiors. Seems to be the same shtick every time I'm there. How do places like this make any money? I haven't a clue.

When I was a teenager I used to love to actually work at my drugstore or hardware store job, made the time go by faster.

there is no need for me to mention any names either because you have already done so for me

in your post above ( clue-third letter of the alphabet )but I have to say the shop assistants in this establishment

are some of the rudest and most apathetic people I have ever come across in a retail environment

I had the same problem at the same hardware store previously.But not anymore since I have spoken to the manager,during my conversation with him customers at the other side of the store must have thought that the roof came down.

[joepattaya1961]

It's not just Pattaya or Thailand. This is a problem the world over. There's a whole generation with no work ethic, no skills to offer and a huge sense of entitlement. My wife, Thai herself and a hard worker, despairs when employees show no interest in working and just disappear after a few days or weeks.

You're right, it's a mentality/attitude/loyalty thing.

Has nothing to do with background, study-level or intelligence, you will find it everywhere. Even signing labor-contracts, asking for 'warranty-money' or delaying payments of bonuses/commissions......it doesn't matter.

[vediovis]

It's not just Pattaya or Thailand. This is a problem the world over. There's a whole generation with no work ethic, no skills to offer and a huge sense of entitlement.

Very true. I'm delighted that I got through my entire working life without ever needing an employee. I just did everything myself (with great success) and when things started getting a bit too busy I just stopped taking on new customers.

Cant think of anything worse than having to employ staff in a restaurant environment, no matter what nationality they might be.

Darrel, I totally understand what you're saying. Believe me, I really do.

But, unfortunately, we are going to be old one day, and the world shows bad perspectives.

To have Staff and set up a team can be a way to protect against the future. It's hard to do it alone, especially when you have to start from scratch, but it's the only solution I can see to buy house and to try to secure children's future education.

Edited June 13, 2012 by vediovis

[PoodMaiDai]

While the larger problem is with the youth of today in general, you are in the wrong country for responsible employment. Thailand is slacker central. Best you can do is try to make it "sanook" for them, hire a bunch of other dummies to sit around and do nothing with them, and replace them when needed or after they move on.

I hate to say it, but the world will always need low skilled factory workers, low paid laborers, farmers, and prostitutes. Thailand has those markets on lock down.

Edited June 13, 2012 by PoodMaiDai

[toenail]

I disagree with the above post. Good customer service is possible in Thailand as long as TRAINING and SUPERVISION is implemented. Places such as Hard Rock Cafe, Starbucks, (most) of your 5 star hotels, and some salesclerks in certain department stores (BKK) have acceptable customer service but this is due to good training (and most likely) better pay to keep a better staff.. Pattaya is most likely the worse place for customer service since the Thais that work here are so transient -come and go; plus their attitude seems to be a bit lethargic towards tourists who most likely have left a negative impression on them due to a few rude or demanding customers. With all the locally runned restaurants and bars, it is interesting to see the ones that are packed with customers everynight. It will be the ones that are well runned with a good, trained staff (and most likely the owner is persent helping).