American Husband Died In Florida, Thai Wife Is In Thailand. How To Finalise Things?

[jpinx]

The lady flew to Florida and they had the funeral, etc. but the situation was too fraught for her to do anything much more than appoint the attorney who had acted for her and her late husband previously. She had to come back to Thailand for her family, but things were not finalised and now the in-laws are asking for some things which don't quite add up - such as wanting all the mail for the deceased husband to be forwarded to them and not to the widow.

Does anyone know the "common law" situation in Florida for a foreign lady who holds a green card and loses her husband? Apart from the specifics of what the will says - does she have full authority over her late husbands estate? I am not from USA and am unfamiliar with USA / Florida law so any comments, highlights, pointers, etc would be much appreciated.

[NeverSure]

Have her pose the questions and complaints to the US attorney. He can get an emergency hearing in court the same or next day and completely shut out anyone who isn't in the will. And no, she doesn't have to be there. He is her attorney and an officer of the court. "Her attorney" as in power of attorney. He can act alone in her behalf.

[jpinx]

ok - thanks for that. We can explore that with the attorney by phone. I am being very careful because inlaws are also the childs grandparents and the lady does not want to upset anyone. I'll post more details here when I see the correspondence in full. At the moment I am only getting snippets, but she is worried enough to ask me to go and stay with the family in Thailand to help sort it out. I'm on the way now.....

[sirineou]

even though the husband has passed away, she is still the wife and retains all her marital rights,

She should not have her husbands mail forwarded to his family as such mail could be pertinent to her and contain information required by her , such as social security survivors benefits that she might be entitled to, life insurance and retirement funds .jointly owned property.etc.

[jpinx]

Thanks - you confirm my own thoughts. I have advised her strongly to get the attorney to forward all mail to her in Thailand. There will be more questions as it comes in.

[rookball]

its not strange at all to forward the deceased letters to his parents locally instead of his spouse who is staying in overseas. its her mother/father in law . . speak to them, they just lost a son . is there a bad relationship between them or something?

[jpinx]

The conversations are on-going, and as I said above, there is no desire to upset anyone. The reason for my involvement is to explain the documents written in English and get some advice from sources like you guys. The reason for the widows concern is that she is not at all confident that she is doing the right thing and she does not like some things that are happening, like the inlaws giving the attorney instructions contrary to her own.

[manly100]

Determine who the executor of the Will is. Validate the Will with probate. To ensure the widow does all she can to enhance her prospects of achieving the greatest financial benefit to the effect the late husband’s Will permits she would need to exclude any person not mentioned in the Will from any information of any kind. Her attorney needs to be instructed the same. The only information passed should be that which is required in the Will. Extended family relationship can be damaged then and widow will need to accept that. Few Will executions result in happy outcomes. Her real efforts should be focused on discovering all assets, death benefits, insurance benefits, future benefits, and most importantly preventing any person holding power of attorney for the late husband executing it without her knowledge, like selling assets unknown to the widow using power of attorney appointed by the late husband prior to his death. The longer the widow takes for discovery the more chance of assets disappearing. She would need to have her attorney act on discovery. If other family members not mentioned in the Will start making demands, treat it as an attempt to obtain financial gain. If they request mail to be diverted this would indicate an attempt to prevent her lawful notification of activities such as confirmation of sale of property etc, etc.

[NeverSure]

A power of attorney expires upon the death of the grantor. The attorney-in-fact can't act in the place of someone who died, any more than the deceased can act.

Unless these family members who are interfering are heirs in the will, they should be shut out of communication about it and certainly denied mail.

Let the attorney sort it out and get an emergency hearing. Get a cease and desist order, and an order to turn over all mail received so far. It might be best if the mail went to the attorney for a while in the interest of time (speed.) It would be best if the mail was delivered from relatives to the attorney in case their are legal or other important documents.

Edit. For the sake of any harmony, blame everything on the attorney. He won't mind. "My attorney said 'this,' and my attorney is handling it."

Edited December 1, 2012 by NeverSure

[manly100]

A power of attorney expires upon the death of the grantor. The attorney-in-fact can't act in the place of someone who died, any more than the deceased can act.

Unless these family members who are interfering are heirs in the will, they should be shut out of communication about it and certainly denied mail.

Let the attorney sort it out and get an emergency hearing. Get a cease and desist order, and an order to turn over all mail received so far. It might be best if the mail went to the attorney for a while in the interest of time (speed.) It would be best if the mail was delivered from relatives to the attorney in case their are legal or other important documents.

Edit. For the sake of any harmony, blame everything on the attorney. He won't mind. "My attorney said 'this,' and my attorney is handling it."

While a POA expires upon the death of the grantor that does not prevent the power still being used illegally or legally with power of attorney with durable provisions, in any case it remains a trip point to identify.

[farang000999]

Why don't you ask her for the lawyers phone number?

[NeverSure]

A lawyer won't speak details with anyone who isn't his client. This is also where I'm confused as to how the relatives are giving conflicting instructions to the attorney.

The wife needs her own attorney, period.

[NeverSure]

A durable power of attorney is for when the grantor is incapacitated. It may or may not be limited to certain actions. It still expires upon death.

If there is a will, the will takes over.

This woman needs to retain her own attorney who won't talk to relatives. She also needs to find out if she's the only heir, and to what.

[NeverSure]

Dang, why don't people make trusts? Deed everything to the trust, put all money in the name of the trust, etc. etc. Then the trust says who the successor trustee is, and who the heir(s) are, and to what.

When the grantor (trustor) dies, the trust doesn't die and it owns the assets. Think of it like a corporation where the president dies but the corporation plods on.

Now the successor trustee simply takes over and disperses the assets of the trust according to the wishes of the grantor. No probate is required. Ideally the 1st successor trustee is the heir, or one of the heirs. Namely, it should be the closest or primary heir such as the wife.

Everything I own is in the name of my trust. My house, vehicles, household furnishing, collector items, bank accounts... Even my checks say on them "The xxxxx revocable trust, xxxxxx, trustee." Printed right on them where there's just usually a name. At the bank there is a copy of the notarized trust showing me as authorized to act including writing checks.

It's just too simple.

[Hawaiian]

Listen to Never Sure. He certainly has correct information and good advice. Thankfully, my mother named me as successor trustee. Because of my experience in real estate and securities I have avoided a lot of unnecessary cost in liquidating her assets for distribution. I have also fended off challenges from my siblings who hired expensive attorneys by consulting with my lawyer and following his advice. Yes, a trust is the way to go.

[craigt3365]

You've got some great comments here. Number one is to have the attorney sort this out. That's what you're paying them for!

Best of luck. Let's try this topic over in the Marriage and Divorce forum. Topic Moved.

[jpinx]

She called her nearest Veterans of Foreign Wars office but got a very cool reception and just told to send them an email. Anyone got experience of this organisation?

[jpinx]

There is more... I am now told there will is unsigned. With the death being in Florida... what's the situation?

[Hawaiian]

Inheritance laws vary from state to state. If it is determined by the court that the will is invalid, then the distribution of assets usually follows a set formula on who gets what. Where I live, the first $200,000 goes to the deceased's spouse.

A friend's (she is Thai) husband died intestate (no will). She gets her husbands federal retirement, but has been advised not apply for it until she receives her U.S. citizenship. The income tax rate is substantially higher for those without U.S. citizenship. It appears like the lawyer has gotten the in-laws to relinquish any claims they might have. Another reason to have a good attorney.

[Hawaiian]

jpnix, try this: www.floridaprobatetrustlaw.com/2009/12/articles/probate/florida-inheritance-laws-no-will/

Edited December 3, 2012 by Hawaiian

[jpinx]

jpnix, try this: www.floridaprobatetrustlaw.com/2009/12/articles/probate/florida-inheritance-laws-no-will/

Thanks for that - interesting reading...

I hear of widows who have managed to get the various issues resolved, but this widow in not a strong characte and is still in deep shock and barely capable of getting through a day. Her own family have stopped her driving and have even considered the "crazy hospital". Given that my Thai is virtually on-existent and the only English speaker in the family is the widow, I am struggling to make any meaningful progress for her. The USA attorney has told the widow it will take up to a year before things are settled, which I find preposterous, but the widow is now so thoroughly brow-beaten that I fear she will not do anything and meantime the funds are being syphoned to cover costs of this, that and the next thing.

I confess to a feeling of helplessness in the face of human greed.......

[craigt3365]

She's doing the right thing. Let the lawyer handle it. Only way to go. Too bad there was no will. Makes a huge difference depending on the state. And yes, legal fees will eat into the funds very quickly. But no other way to go without a will and surviving children.

If her English is not good, I'd get a local translator to help. Maybe a friend or family member who can help? If not, I'd try to find somebody locally who can help????

[jpinx]

There is a 7 year old daughter.

Where she lives is very rural Thailand and no-one speaks English.

She has no will to fight for her rights and she is being steamrollered.

Edited December 4, 2012 by jpinx

[Hawaiian]

One year is not an unreasonable time frame, especially if there are challenges from other possilbe heirs. Legal notices have to be published and waiting periods met. This all takes time. Explain this to her.

Edited December 4, 2012 by Hawaiian

[jpinx]

Many thanks for all comments. The attorney in USA is doing his job and hopefully the estate will be settled according to Florida state law. I appreciate all the input very much, this has been a saddening and salutory experience. I hope no-one has to go through anything similar. Personally - I am now looking at trusts and howthey work in the legal systems worldwide. One can not decide where one will die......

[craigt3365]

Many thanks for all comments. The attorney in USA is doing his job and hopefully the estate will be settled according to Florida state law. I appreciate all the input very much, this has been a saddening and salutory experience. I hope no-one has to go through anything similar. Personally - I am now looking at trusts and howthey work in the legal systems worldwide. One can not decide where one will die......

A trust isn't necessarily required. If I am not mistaken, the biggest problem here was lack of a valid will?? Trusts are great if you have a lot of assets, need protection from lawsuits (etc), are dealing with an aging parent, etc.

I just setup one for my mother as she is unable to sign anything any more. Otherwise, a will would have worked just fine. When my father died, his will was all that was needed.

I'm no expert! But don't spend money unless you have to. I'd do some research before setting one up. IMHO.