MaxLee Posted December 31, 2012 Share Posted December 31, 2012 21 million tourists and STILL zero investment in infrastructure, safety measures, crackdowns on tourism mafias in Phuket, Krabi, Koh Samui etc.,… only on the surface flood mega projects with zero real information, more under the table money, and foremost, rice scam and first car scam Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chiangmaikelly Posted December 31, 2012 Share Posted December 31, 2012 21 million tourists and STILL zero investment in infrastructure, safety measures, crackdowns on tourism mafias in Phuket, Krabi, Koh Samui etc.,… only on the surface flood mega projects with zero real information, more under the table money, and foremost, rice scam and first car scam What do you call the billions of baht spent in new malls by the Central group and hotels by all other investors? Not to mention a new airport and plans for a high speed rail system. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nisa Posted December 31, 2012 Share Posted December 31, 2012 A few of the restrurant owners I know wonder were these people are, they say not as good as last year. I think too many non spending chinese. ------------------- The "tourists" arriving annually figures are a bit of a joke. To TAT anyone arriving at an airport in Thailand who is not Thai is a "tourist" and "new to Thailand" even if theyactually live long term in Thailand. For that reason, the annual "Tourist" figures are just a meaningless jpke .... sim[ly designed to impress those who belirvr in figures. For example, if some lives here for a year on 90 day stay visas, he or she will exit and re-enter 4 times in one year. The official "tourist" figures from TAT will show those entrys as 4 "new" tourists to Thailand. First of all the folks you describe make up a very small percentage of foreign visitors. Second of all they are still tourist or foreigners visiting the country. Thirdly I am not aware of many countries who let tourists stay indefinitely or who don't count a a person visiting simply because they have visited the country before. Numbers are available showing the breakdown of visitors and from which country they are from and from what country their trip originated. So, you can look up how many people crossed the Cambodia land border to enter Thailand who were not from Cambodia. These types of numbers have been posted here previously and .they simply don't account for as many folks as you may believe. Bottom line is there are foreigners visiting the country and those that are permanent residence, have become citizens, have work permits or are retired are not leaving and entering the country on these types of trips. One thing that can be a legit arguments (but kind of missing the point) is that the numbers really are about foreign visitors and not tourists but this is splitting hairs because they are foreigners spending money in Thailand.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nisa Posted December 31, 2012 Share Posted December 31, 2012 21 million tourists and STILL zero investment in infrastructure, safety measures, crackdowns on tourism mafias in Phuket, Krabi, Koh Samui etc.,… only on the surface flood mega projects with zero real information, more under the table money, and foremost, rice scam and first car scam What do you call the billions of baht spent in new malls by the Central group and hotels by all other investors? Not to mention a new airport and plans for a high speed rail system. Somebody has to be completely blind not to see the HUGE investments in Infrastructure by both the government and private investors over the years. Even if you have not been hear the last decade(s) these types of things are easily spotted. Just looking at Bangkok without doing any research you see a new airport, the re-opening of then old one, a subway system, a sky train system, numerous new hotels, new and huge malls, new and upgraded roads, water management, increased requirements for becoming a cop, cheap wide spread internet coverage as well as cell phone ... One could go on and on and point out the HUGE leaps and bounds not just Bangkok but all of Thailand has made over the last decade without doing any research except opening one eyes and considering what Thailand was like not long ago. But sadly most of the folks unable to do this are the ones who don't accept that tourism is on a good upward trend and only can complain about what Thailand is not more like back home and then only to complain about how Thailand has changed and used to be less restrictive and more free to worry about oneself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nisa Posted December 31, 2012 Share Posted December 31, 2012 (edited) I stopped believing this nonsense back in 2010 when the entire country was empty for 3 months during the political unrest yet the government was announcing record numbers of arrivals. It's just like anything else in Thailand; to be taken with a large pinch of salt. Sent from my GT-I9100T using Thaivisa Connect App Well that's cool. So what do you think an accurate number is? http://www.thaiwebsites.com/tourism.asp Not to mention political unrest is not that uncommon in Thailand and the unrest of 2010 didn't start in 2010 and the major incident happened in a small area of Bangkok (easily avoided) over a fairly short period outside of the high season. Edited December 31, 2012 by Nisa Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kilgore Trout Posted December 31, 2012 Share Posted December 31, 2012 A few of the restrurant owners I know wonder were these people are, they say not as good as last year. I think too many non spending chinese. Your restaurant owners will increasingly grow their worries...guaranteed! The Asian tourist is a totally different tourist rather than the western farang, the restaurants were used to see. Asian tourists travel in groups and you are mistaken by the non-spending Chinese; they spend more than their western counterpart! Asian tourists have a day-to-day program, fully booked in booked hotels, buses, restaurants and sightseeings. They are not the typically beach tourists! Asians do NOT like to stay on the beach during daytime; they dont like to get brown/burned like the western tourist. And, what's more important: they are here to stay and will be a MAJOR group of inbound tourism, whether one likes it or not. After all, it's THEIR hemisphere..is it not? So the west is MY hemisphere then and i have more right to Jamaica than the chinese? What a stupid, stupid argument: Sent from my GT-S5660 using Thaivisa Connect App Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MaxLee Posted December 31, 2012 Share Posted December 31, 2012 21 million tourists and STILL zero investment in infrastructure, safety measures, crackdowns on tourism mafias in Phuket, Krabi, Koh Samui etc.,… only on the surface flood mega projects with zero real information, more under the table money, and foremost, rice scam and first car scam What do you call the billions of baht spent in new malls by the Central group and hotels by all other investors? Not to mention a new airport and plans for a high speed rail system. The point is INFRASTRUCTURE, do you think you can acquire high tech on low infrastructure? What will happen if you put 10 elephants on a wooden amazon bridge?.… get the idea??? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Naam Posted December 31, 2012 Share Posted December 31, 2012 21 million tourists and STILL zero investment in infrastructure, safety measures, crackdowns on tourism mafias in Phuket, Krabi, Koh Samui etc.,… only on the surface flood mega projects with zero real information, more under the table money, and foremost, rice scam and first car scam What do you call the billions of baht spent in new malls by the Central group and hotels by all other investors? Not to mention a new airport and plans for a high speed rail system. don't waste your time CK. the anti-Thai brigade does not listen to logic. they find a flaw in each and everything Thai. makes one wonder why the EFF they are living in this country Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chiangmaikelly Posted December 31, 2012 Share Posted December 31, 2012 21 million tourists and STILL zero investment in infrastructure, safety measures, crackdowns on tourism mafias in Phuket, Krabi, Koh Samui etc.,… only on the surface flood mega projects with zero real information, more under the table money, and foremost, rice scam and first car scam What do you call the billions of baht spent in new malls by the Central group and hotels by all other investors? Not to mention a new airport and plans for a high speed rail system. The point is INFRASTRUCTURE, do you think you can acquire high tech on low infrastructure? What will happen if you put 10 elephants on a wooden amazon bridge?.… get the idea??? New airport, new subway, new sky train. Get the idea?? Try visiting Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BookMan Posted December 31, 2012 Share Posted December 31, 2012 I stopped believing this nonsense back in 2010 when the entire country was empty for 3 months during the political unrest yet the government was announcing record numbers of arrivals. It's just like anything else in Thailand; to be taken with a large pinch of salt. Sent from my GT-I9100T using Thaivisa Connect App Well that's cool. So what do you think an accurate number is? http://www.thaiwebsi...com/tourism.asp Not to mention political unrest is not that uncommon in Thailand and the unrest of 2010 didn't start in 2010 and the major incident happened in a small area of Bangkok (easily avoided) over a fairly short period outside of the high season. One of the better and easy to read graphics that has been posted on rising tourist numbers to Thailand Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bangon04 Posted December 31, 2012 Share Posted December 31, 2012 (edited) Somewhere in Thailand there is a warehouse stacked to the roof with 21 million paper arrival cards..... just for this year. In my daydream I could not see the 21 million paper departure cards... so they were probably in another large warehouse. But are the paper arrival cards and the paper departure cards that Thailand makes its own citizens fill out every time they travel abroad held in the same warehouse and counted by the same army of arrival card and departure card counting staff??? or are they held in a separate Thai only warehouse? How many staff does it take to count 21 million arrival cards? c0s they don't seem to have a functioning computer system to do the job..... I entered Thailand 10 times and departed 9 times during 2012.... will I cause a recount?? Edited December 31, 2012 by bangon04 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nisa Posted December 31, 2012 Share Posted December 31, 2012 One thing I do believe Thailand has seen less of the last few years (during the global economic crisis) is number of long term western residents. I think you will find most of the folks who business' have been slow relied on these tourists. As well I believe the quality of the tourist has improved in terms of their being more folks looking for actual vacationing and exploring as opposed to those looking for cheap sex and partying. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nisa Posted December 31, 2012 Share Posted December 31, 2012 (edited) I entered Thailand 10 times and departed 9 times during 2012.... will I cause a recount?? Only if they counted your arrivals as being more than 10. If they counted you (your seperare arrival card) ten times then the figures would be 100% accurate and not the least bit misleading. In addition they have also counted your departures and were able to calculate your average stay and then combine that with everyone else to come up with the average stay of foreign visitors. They also recorded your point of entry as well as your nationality and the country which you entered from and added this to the totals too... they make all this information available to the public if you are interested. So, if you wanted for example to see how many people from England (or any country or total of non-Cambodians) entered Thailand by land through Cambodia it is all available to the public. I am not sure why anyone might think that the numbers represent a unique visitor who has never been to Thailand before especially when TAT is also keen to make public the number of repeat visitors. Edited December 31, 2012 by Nisa Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Markaew Posted December 31, 2012 Share Posted December 31, 2012 I did my 90 day report yesterday. Normally I just go in and straight up to the window. This year there has been a wait every time. Yesterday I was #40 and #23 was being served when I got there. Airplane arrivals are up from last year. The GDP is up, the Stock Exchange of Thailand is up 36%. Central mall in Pattaya is packed every day I go. The big Japanese restaurant in Rayong has a waiting list every time I go. All the economists are reporting positive about Thailand. The only place one reads anything negative about Thailand is on Thai Visa. Why do you always bring up Thai economy into tourism numbers??? Do you not understand it is not related ??? What does 90 days reporting have to do with tourism? And finally , are you not aware that 1 year has 12 months and while right now we are at the peak of high season, the other 11 months of the year,the place was almost empty compared to previous years Tourism is one of the driving forces of the Thai economy. If tourism is up the economy will be up. Tourist dollars have a multiplier effect on the economy. Tourism is very related to the Thai ecomomy. Many Farang tourists stay more than 90 days. How many single men stay at hotels and eat at restaurants 6 months a year and then go back to Canada and the USA? A lot. And they spend a lot. I mention the economy because the numbers from international sources can be trusted more than anecdotal evidence from some old whiners writing from cold water flats in the West because they are jealous of people who live in Thailand. Any responsible person with knowledge of the tourism business in Thailand will attest that this year season or no, is better than last season. Word to the wise. No one likes to dine at a restaurant with no customers. Not according to Thai Tourism. They claim that the Thai economy iis large enough that tourism is merely a small segment of the economy, which is fortunate because tourism is shrinking. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Markaew Posted December 31, 2012 Share Posted December 31, 2012 I did my 90 day report yesterday. Normally I just go in and straight up to the window. This year there has been a wait every time. Yesterday I was #40 and #23 was being served when I got there. Airplane arrivals are up from last year. The GDP is up, the Stock Exchange of Thailand is up 36%. Central mall in Pattaya is packed every day I go. The big Japanese restaurant in Rayong has a waiting list every time I go. All the economists are reporting positive about Thailand. The only place one reads anything negative about Thailand is on Thai Visa. Why do you always bring up Thai economy into tourism numbers??? Do you not understand it is not related ??? What does 90 days reporting have to do with tourism? And finally , are you not aware that 1 year has 12 months and while right now we are at the peak of high season, the other 11 months of the year,the place was almost empty compared to previous years Tourism is one of the driving forces of the Thai economy. If tourism is up the economy will be up. Tourist dollars have a multiplier effect on the economy. Tourism is very related to the Thai economy. Many Farang tourists stay more than 90 days. How many single men stay at hotels and eat at restaurants 6 months a year and then go back to Canada and the USA? A lot. And they spend a lot. I mention the economy because the numbers from international sources can be trusted more than anecdotal evidence from some old whiners writing from cold water flats in the West because they are jealous of people who live in Thailand. Any responsible person with knowledge of the tourism business in Thailand will attest that this year season or no, is better than last season. Word to the wise. No one likes to dine at a restaurant with no customers. Very true. When I sit down at an empty restaurant they always seat me by the window. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chiangmaikelly Posted December 31, 2012 Share Posted December 31, 2012 I did my 90 day report yesterday. Normally I just go in and straight up to the window. This year there has been a wait every time. Yesterday I was #40 and #23 was being served when I got there. Airplane arrivals are up from last year. The GDP is up, the Stock Exchange of Thailand is up 36%. Central mall in Pattaya is packed every day I go. The big Japanese restaurant in Rayong has a waiting list every time I go. All the economists are reporting positive about Thailand. The only place one reads anything negative about Thailand is on Thai Visa. Why do you always bring up Thai economy into tourism numbers??? Do you not understand it is not related ??? What does 90 days reporting have to do with tourism? And finally , are you not aware that 1 year has 12 months and while right now we are at the peak of high season, the other 11 months of the year,the place was almost empty compared to previous years Tourism is one of the driving forces of the Thai economy. If tourism is up the economy will be up. Tourist dollars have a multiplier effect on the economy. Tourism is very related to the Thai ecomomy. Many Farang tourists stay more than 90 days. How many single men stay at hotels and eat at restaurants 6 months a year and then go back to Canada and the USA? A lot. And they spend a lot. I mention the economy because the numbers from international sources can be trusted more than anecdotal evidence from some old whiners writing from cold water flats in the West because they are jealous of people who live in Thailand. Any responsible person with knowledge of the tourism business in Thailand will attest that this year season or no, is better than last season. Word to the wise. No one likes to dine at a restaurant with no customers. Not according to Thai Tourism. They claim that the Thai economy iis large enough that tourism is merely a small segment of the economy, which is fortunate because tourism is shrinking. I said a number of things what is, "not according to Thai Tourism?" And two, from what reputable source do you pull the information that Thai tourism is shrinking? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lemoncake Posted January 1, 2013 Share Posted January 1, 2013 (edited) "BANGKOK, Dec 24 – Inbound tourists to Thailand reached 21.8 million persons this year, representing a 14 per cent increase from last year " "BANGKOK, Dec 28 – Inbound tourists to Thailand hit a historic record of almost 22 million persons this year" "THAILAND (eTN) -- Thailand's tourism industry is likely to grow by more than 10% next year and about 23 million foreigners are expected to visit the country in 2013," You are the one trying to misslead as you can see by the leads that you provided! The millionth person traveled on flight TG 551, The total international visiters officially were 21.8 million which is the same as an estimated 22 million and the expectation is to grow by 10% about 23 million next year 2013. At least I and others have given facts on what we have said yet you still have not given any for the statements you have made about the decline of the numbers of tourists to Thailand 3rd time, since you seem to have a problem with responding to a simple question Please underline for me where "some " posters were discussing INCOME decline. I can see the discussion about decline in tourist numbers but failing to find the discussion of income Man you really have some problem! Lack of tourists equates to lack of income! As you have stated that you own a hotel yourself and that your hotel is empty that equates to a loss of income that you normally would of had! Maybe you should look at your business and see if you could change things to get these tourists in ? It's better than being blind to the fact that tourism is up and those that addapt to changing times benifit Soooo 1. You make a silly statement and rather than being man enough to admit it, you just snake your way around not to face it 2. Let me give quick education in economics so you do not embarrass yourself in the future when speaking with grown ups. Now, for the sake of a lesson, will be using hypothetical people and numbers, I have a hotel with 100 rooms. 50 rooms sell for 1000 baht and 50 rooms sell for 2000 baht. Last year i sold 50 rooms for 10 days, bringing total income of 500000 baht This year same time i sold same amount of rooms, 50 but the 2000 baht rooms bringing my total income for the same period and same number of rooms to 1000 000 baht. Question. Did i have double the amount of people stay in the hotel? because income is double from last year. Answer. No, i did not, i had the same amount of people who paid more for the rooms making my income double. Another lesson Last year i sold 50 rooms for 10 days, bringing total income of 500000 baht This year, i sold 25 expansive rooms making my total income 500000 baht. Question. Did i have same number of people stay in the hotel as last year? Answer. No, i did not, i had half the amount of people, but they paid for expansive rooms Final Lesson Last year i sold 50 rooms for 10 days, bringing total income of 500000 baht They also ate in my restaurant and spent 500000 baht This year due to wage increase i increased my prices by 10% on all rooms and food So this year i had the same amount of people staying in the same rooms but paying extra 10% They ate the same food but also paid extra 10%, now bringing my total for the year to 1100000 baht Question. Did i have more customers? Answer. No, i did not, i had the same amount of customers, but they paid extra 10% increasing my income by 10% End of Lessons. An increase of income from Tourism does not represent increasing number of tourists it does represent the increasing amount of money they spent,. Rising prices overall is a huge factor on yearly income received and is no indicator that there are more tourists coming into country. Hotels occupancy rates are the first indicator of tourist numbers because tourists can skip many restaurants and bars, but they all need to sleep somewhere. Pattaya, Phuket hotels were empty for most part of the year, sorry can not comment for Chiangmai or Isaan towns. Edited January 1, 2013 by lemoncake Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nisa Posted January 1, 2013 Share Posted January 1, 2013 "BANGKOK, Dec 24 – Inbound tourists to Thailand reached 21.8 million persons this year, representing a 14 per cent increase from last year " "BANGKOK, Dec 28 – Inbound tourists to Thailand hit a historic record of almost 22 million persons this year" "THAILAND (eTN) -- Thailand's tourism industry is likely to grow by more than 10% next year and about 23 million foreigners are expected to visit the country in 2013," You are the one trying to misslead as you can see by the leads that you provided! The millionth person traveled on flight TG 551, The total international visiters officially were 21.8 million which is the same as an estimated 22 million and the expectation is to grow by 10% about 23 million next year 2013. At least I and others have given facts on what we have said yet you still have not given any for the statements you have made about the decline of the numbers of tourists to Thailand 3rd time, since you seem to have a problem with responding to a simple question Please underline for me where "some " posters were discussing INCOME decline. I can see the discussion about decline in tourist numbers but failing to find the discussion of income Man you really have some problem! Lack of tourists equates to lack of income! As you have stated that you own a hotel yourself and that your hotel is empty that equates to a loss of income that you normally would of had! Maybe you should look at your business and see if you could change things to get these tourists in ? It's better than being blind to the fact that tourism is up and those that addapt to changing times benifit Soooo 1. You make a silly statement and rather than being man enough to admit it, you just snake your way around not to face it 2. Let me give quick education in economics so you do not embarrass yourself in the future when speaking with grown ups. Now, for the sake of a lesson, will be using hypothetical people and numbers, I have a hotel with 100 rooms. 50 rooms sell for 1000 baht and 50 rooms sell for 2000 baht. Last year i sold 50 rooms for 10 days, bringing total income of 500000 baht This year same time i sold same amount of rooms, 50 but the 2000 baht rooms bringing my total income for the same period and same number of rooms to 1000 000 baht. Question. Did i have double the amount of people stay in the hotel? because income is double from last year. Answer. No, i did not, i had the same amount of people who paid more for the rooms making my income double. Another lesson Last year i sold 50 rooms for 10 days, bringing total income of 500000 baht This year, i sold 25 expansive rooms making my total income 500000 baht. Question. Did i have same number of people stay in the hotel as last year? Answer. No, i did not, i had half the amount of people, but they paid for expansive rooms Final Lesson Last year i sold 50 rooms for 10 days, bringing total income of 500000 baht They also ate in my restaurant and spent 500000 baht This year due to wage increase i increased my prices by 10% on all rooms and food So this year i had the same amount of people staying in the same rooms but paying extra 10% They ate the same food but also paid extra 10%, now bringing my total for the year to 1100000 baht Question. Did i have more customers? Answer. No, i did not, i had the same amount of customers, but they paid extra 10% increasing my income by 10% End of Lessons. An increase of income from Tourism does not represent increasing number of tourists it does represent the increasing amount of money they spent,. Rising prices overall is a huge factor on yearly income received and is no indicator that there are more tourists coming into country. Hotels occupancy rates are the first indicator of tourist numbers because tourists can skip many restaurants and bars, but they all need to sleep somewhere. Pattaya, Phuket hotels were empty for most part of the year, sorry can not comment for Chiangmai or Isaan towns. Why not focus on your problems at your hotel as opposed to obsessing over your false belief that tourism numbers are down and why your business is hurting? I just can't see how looking for other business' hurting is going to help you. Why not look at what the ones who are doing well are doing and how they are taking advantage of the booming tourism industry in Thailand. Tourism is changing, people coming are different and the income they bring is growing ... focus on how to capture some of that money or simply get out of a business that relies on tourism since you don't seem to get it. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chiangmaikelly Posted January 1, 2013 Share Posted January 1, 2013 (edited) "BANGKOK, Dec 24 – Inbound tourists to Thailand reached 21.8 million persons this year, representing a 14 per cent increase from last year " "BANGKOK, Dec 28 – Inbound tourists to Thailand hit a historic record of almost 22 million persons this year" "THAILAND (eTN) -- Thailand's tourism industry is likely to grow by more than 10% next year and about 23 million foreigners are expected to visit the country in 2013," You are the one trying to misslead as you can see by the leads that you provided! The millionth person traveled on flight TG 551, The total international visiters officially were 21.8 million which is the same as an estimated 22 million and the expectation is to grow by 10% about 23 million next year 2013. At least I and others have given facts on what we have said yet you still have not given any for the statements you have made about the decline of the numbers of tourists to Thailand 3rd time, since you seem to have a problem with responding to a simple question Please underline for me where "some " posters were discussing INCOME decline. I can see the discussion about decline in tourist numbers but failing to find the discussion of income Man you really have some problem! Lack of tourists equates to lack of income! As you have stated that you own a hotel yourself and that your hotel is empty that equates to a loss of income that you normally would of had! Maybe you should look at your business and see if you could change things to get these tourists in ? It's better than being blind to the fact that tourism is up and those that addapt to changing times benifit Soooo 1. You make a silly statement and rather than being man enough to admit it, you just snake your way around not to face it 2. Let me give quick education in economics so you do not embarrass yourself in the future when speaking with grown ups. Now, for the sake of a lesson, will be using hypothetical people and numbers, I have a hotel with 100 rooms. 50 rooms sell for 1000 baht and 50 rooms sell for 2000 baht. Last year i sold 50 rooms for 10 days, bringing total income of 500000 baht This year same time i sold same amount of rooms, 50 but the 2000 baht rooms bringing my total income for the same period and same number of rooms to 1000 000 baht. Question. Did i have double the amount of people stay in the hotel? because income is double from last year. Answer. No, i did not, i had the same amount of people who paid more for the rooms making my income double. Another lesson Last year i sold 50 rooms for 10 days, bringing total income of 500000 baht This year, i sold 25 expansive rooms making my total income 500000 baht. Question. Did i have same number of people stay in the hotel as last year? Answer. No, i did not, i had half the amount of people, but they paid for expansive rooms Final Lesson Last year i sold 50 rooms for 10 days, bringing total income of 500000 baht They also ate in my restaurant and spent 500000 baht This year due to wage increase i increased my prices by 10% on all rooms and food So this year i had the same amount of people staying in the same rooms but paying extra 10% They ate the same food but also paid extra 10%, now bringing my total for the year to 1100000 baht Question. Did i have more customers? Answer. No, i did not, i had the same amount of customers, but they paid extra 10% increasing my income by 10% End of Lessons. An increase of income from Tourism does not represent increasing number of tourists it does represent the increasing amount of money they spent,. Rising prices overall is a huge factor on yearly income received and is no indicator that there are more tourists coming into country. Hotels occupancy rates are the first indicator of tourist numbers because tourists can skip many restaurants and bars, but they all need to sleep somewhere. Pattaya, Phuket hotels were empty for most part of the year, sorry can not comment for Chiangmai or Isaan towns. Just a flat out untruth. Pattaya had about 7 million hotel guests in 2011 with an occupancy rate of 66%. Registered accommodation establishments in Pattaya as of December 2010 were 49,348 rooms. This was an increase of 28% over 2009. When the figures come in Pattaya will have about 8 million hotel guests in 2012. 8 million guests is not empty. www.c9hotelworks.com/.../pattaya-2011-hotel-market-update-2012-... Or google Pattaya on course to set record numbers. Edited January 1, 2013 by chiangmaikelly 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ozziebloke Posted January 1, 2013 Share Posted January 1, 2013 "BANGKOK, Dec 24 – Inbound tourists to Thailand reached 21.8 million persons this year, representing a 14 per cent increase from last year " "BANGKOK, Dec 28 – Inbound tourists to Thailand hit a historic record of almost 22 million persons this year" "THAILAND (eTN) -- Thailand's tourism industry is likely to grow by more than 10% next year and about 23 million foreigners are expected to visit the country in 2013," You are the one trying to misslead as you can see by the leads that you provided! The millionth person traveled on flight TG 551, The total international visiters officially were 21.8 million which is the same as an estimated 22 million and the expectation is to grow by 10% about 23 million next year 2013. At least I and others have given facts on what we have said yet you still have not given any for the statements you have made about the decline of the numbers of tourists to Thailand 3rd time, since you seem to have a problem with responding to a simple question Please underline for me where "some " posters were discussing INCOME decline. I can see the discussion about decline in tourist numbers but failing to find the discussion of income Man you really have some problem! Lack of tourists equates to lack of income! As you have stated that you own a hotel yourself and that your hotel is empty that equates to a loss of income that you normally would of had! Maybe you should look at your business and see if you could change things to get these tourists in ? It's better than being blind to the fact that tourism is up and those that addapt to changing times benifit Soooo 1. You make a silly statement and rather than being man enough to admit it, you just snake your way around not to face it 2. Let me give quick education in economics so you do not embarrass yourself in the future when speaking with grown ups. Now, for the sake of a lesson, will be using hypothetical people and numbers, I have a hotel with 100 rooms. 50 rooms sell for 1000 baht and 50 rooms sell for 2000 baht. Last year i sold 50 rooms for 10 days, bringing total income of 500000 baht This year same time i sold same amount of rooms, 50 but the 2000 baht rooms bringing my total income for the same period and same number of rooms to 1000 000 baht. Question. Did i have double the amount of people stay in the hotel? because income is double from last year. Answer. No, i did not, i had the same amount of people who paid more for the rooms making my income double. Another lesson Last year i sold 50 rooms for 10 days, bringing total income of 500000 baht This year, i sold 25 expansive rooms making my total income 500000 baht. Question. Did i have same number of people stay in the hotel as last year? Answer. No, i did not, i had half the amount of people, but they paid for expansive rooms Final Lesson Last year i sold 50 rooms for 10 days, bringing total income of 500000 baht They also ate in my restaurant and spent 500000 baht This year due to wage increase i increased my prices by 10% on all rooms and food So this year i had the same amount of people staying in the same rooms but paying extra 10% They ate the same food but also paid extra 10%, now bringing my total for the year to 1100000 baht Question. Did i have more customers? Answer. No, i did not, i had the same amount of customers, but they paid extra 10% increasing my income by 10% End of Lessons. An increase of income from Tourism does not represent increasing number of tourists it does represent the increasing amount of money they spent,. Rising prices overall is a huge factor on yearly income received and is no indicator that there are more tourists coming into country. Hotels occupancy rates are the first indicator of tourist numbers because tourists can skip many restaurants and bars, but they all need to sleep somewhere. Pattaya, Phuket hotels were empty for most part of the year, sorry can not comment for Chiangmai or Isaan towns. There is something really wrong with you! If someone dissagrees with you? You accuse them of trolling. You consistantly make non commen sense statments and fudge figures to back those riddiculous statements. everyone has replied to you with figures of fact at each time you have questioned! Yet still you have not given any fact or proof of what you have stated. You are just getting boring now and you are the one that is looking like fool now! A ridiculous conversation with you Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lemoncake Posted January 1, 2013 Share Posted January 1, 2013 Soooo 1. You make a silly statement and rather than being man enough to admit it, you just snake your way around not to face it 2. Let me give quick education in economics so you do not embarrass yourself in the future when speaking with grown ups. Now, for the sake of a lesson, will be using hypothetical people and numbers, I have a hotel with 100 rooms. 50 rooms sell for 1000 baht and 50 rooms sell for 2000 baht. Last year i sold 50 rooms for 10 days, bringing total income of 500000 baht This year same time i sold same amount of rooms, 50 but the 2000 baht rooms bringing my total income for the same period and same number of rooms to 1000 000 baht. Question. Did i have double the amount of people stay in the hotel? because income is double from last year. Answer. No, i did not, i had the same amount of people who paid more for the rooms making my income double. Another lesson Last year i sold 50 rooms for 10 days, bringing total income of 500000 baht This year, i sold 25 expansive rooms making my total income 500000 baht. Question. Did i have same number of people stay in the hotel as last year? Answer. No, i did not, i had half the amount of people, but they paid for expansive rooms Final Lesson Last year i sold 50 rooms for 10 days, bringing total income of 500000 baht They also ate in my restaurant and spent 500000 baht This year due to wage increase i increased my prices by 10% on all rooms and food So this year i had the same amount of people staying in the same rooms but paying extra 10% They ate the same food but also paid extra 10%, now bringing my total for the year to 1100000 baht Question. Did i have more customers? Answer. No, i did not, i had the same amount of customers, but they paid extra 10% increasing my income by 10% End of Lessons. An increase of income from Tourism does not represent increasing number of tourists it does represent the increasing amount of money they spent,. Rising prices overall is a huge factor on yearly income received and is no indicator that there are more tourists coming into country. Hotels occupancy rates are the first indicator of tourist numbers because tourists can skip many restaurants and bars, but they all need to sleep somewhere. Pattaya, Phuket hotels were empty for most part of the year, sorry can not comment for Chiangmai or Isaan towns. There is something really wrong with you! If someone dissagrees with you? You accuse them of trolling. You consistantly make non commen sense statments and fudge figures to back those riddiculous statements. everyone has replied to you with figures of fact at each time you have questioned! Yet still you have not given any fact or proof of what you have stated. You are just getting boring now and you are the one that is looking like fool now! A ridiculous conversation with you Sorry what proof do you need? did you not understand something from the lessons above? Everyone has replied with what sorry? facts based on what sorry? oh thats right government released figures which no doubt are 100% correct, or did you mean facts that auto sales are up? and that somehow becomes evidence that tourist arrivals are up Or is it perhaps the irrelevant drivel about domestic tourism that somehow turned into fact that tourist arrivals are up? So please do enlighten me what facts have "everyone" provided that year 2012 had more tourists or had the amount they released. I do not expect a coherent response or even something related, but just for the sake of it, lets see what you can come up with Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ozziebloke Posted January 1, 2013 Share Posted January 1, 2013 Soooo 1. You make a silly statement and rather than being man enough to admit it, you just snake your way around not to face it 2. Let me give quick education in economics so you do not embarrass yourself in the future when speaking with grown ups. Now, for the sake of a lesson, will be using hypothetical people and numbers, I have a hotel with 100 rooms. 50 rooms sell for 1000 baht and 50 rooms sell for 2000 baht. Last year i sold 50 rooms for 10 days, bringing total income of 500000 baht This year same time i sold same amount of rooms, 50 but the 2000 baht rooms bringing my total income for the same period and same number of rooms to 1000 000 baht. Question. Did i have double the amount of people stay in the hotel? because income is double from last year. Answer. No, i did not, i had the same amount of people who paid more for the rooms making my income double. Another lesson Last year i sold 50 rooms for 10 days, bringing total income of 500000 baht This year, i sold 25 expansive rooms making my total income 500000 baht. Question. Did i have same number of people stay in the hotel as last year? Answer. No, i did not, i had half the amount of people, but they paid for expansive rooms Final Lesson Last year i sold 50 rooms for 10 days, bringing total income of 500000 baht They also ate in my restaurant and spent 500000 baht This year due to wage increase i increased my prices by 10% on all rooms and food So this year i had the same amount of people staying in the same rooms but paying extra 10% They ate the same food but also paid extra 10%, now bringing my total for the year to 1100000 baht Question. Did i have more customers? Answer. No, i did not, i had the same amount of customers, but they paid extra 10% increasing my income by 10% End of Lessons. An increase of income from Tourism does not represent increasing number of tourists it does represent the increasing amount of money they spent,. Rising prices overall is a huge factor on yearly income received and is no indicator that there are more tourists coming into country. Hotels occupancy rates are the first indicator of tourist numbers because tourists can skip many restaurants and bars, but they all need to sleep somewhere. Pattaya, Phuket hotels were empty for most part of the year, sorry can not comment for Chiangmai or Isaan towns. There is something really wrong with you! If someone dissagrees with you? You accuse them of trolling. You consistantly make non commen sense statments and fudge figures to back those riddiculous statements. everyone has replied to you with figures of fact at each time you have questioned! Yet still you have not given any fact or proof of what you have stated. You are just getting boring now and you are the one that is looking like fool now! A ridiculous conversation with you Sorry what proof do you need? did you not understand something from the lessons above? Everyone has replied with what sorry? facts based on what sorry? oh thats right government released figures which no doubt are 100% correct, or did you mean facts that auto sales are up? and that somehow becomes evidence that tourist arrivals are up Or is it perhaps the irrelevant drivel about domestic tourism that somehow turned into fact that tourist arrivals are up? So please do enlighten me what facts have "everyone" provided that year 2012 had more tourists or had the amount they released. I do not expect a coherent response or even something related, but just for the sake of it, lets see what you can come up with Your more than ignorant about any inteligent conversation! your the one trolling mate and getting boring more and more by every post you make! It's like trying to have a conversation with a 5 year old ! have a happy new year it's up to you Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lemoncake Posted January 1, 2013 Share Posted January 1, 2013 Soooo 1. You make a silly statement and rather than being man enough to admit it, you just snake your way around not to face it 2. Let me give quick education in economics so you do not embarrass yourself in the future when speaking with grown ups. Now, for the sake of a lesson, will be using hypothetical people and numbers, I have a hotel with 100 rooms. 50 rooms sell for 1000 baht and 50 rooms sell for 2000 baht. Last year i sold 50 rooms for 10 days, bringing total income of 500000 baht This year same time i sold same amount of rooms, 50 but the 2000 baht rooms bringing my total income for the same period and same number of rooms to 1000 000 baht. Question. Did i have double the amount of people stay in the hotel? because income is double from last year. Answer. No, i did not, i had the same amount of people who paid more for the rooms making my income double. Another lesson Last year i sold 50 rooms for 10 days, bringing total income of 500000 baht This year, i sold 25 expansive rooms making my total income 500000 baht. Question. Did i have same number of people stay in the hotel as last year? Answer. No, i did not, i had half the amount of people, but they paid for expansive rooms Final Lesson Last year i sold 50 rooms for 10 days, bringing total income of 500000 baht They also ate in my restaurant and spent 500000 baht This year due to wage increase i increased my prices by 10% on all rooms and food So this year i had the same amount of people staying in the same rooms but paying extra 10% They ate the same food but also paid extra 10%, now bringing my total for the year to 1100000 baht Question. Did i have more customers? Answer. No, i did not, i had the same amount of customers, but they paid extra 10% increasing my income by 10% End of Lessons. An increase of income from Tourism does not represent increasing number of tourists it does represent the increasing amount of money they spent,. Rising prices overall is a huge factor on yearly income received and is no indicator that there are more tourists coming into country. Hotels occupancy rates are the first indicator of tourist numbers because tourists can skip many restaurants and bars, but they all need to sleep somewhere. Pattaya, Phuket hotels were empty for most part of the year, sorry can not comment for Chiangmai or Isaan towns. There is something really wrong with you! If someone dissagrees with you? You accuse them of trolling. You consistantly make non commen sense statments and fudge figures to back those riddiculous statements. everyone has replied to you with figures of fact at each time you have questioned! Yet still you have not given any fact or proof of what you have stated. You are just getting boring now and you are the one that is looking like fool now! A ridiculous conversation with you Sorry what proof do you need? did you not understand something from the lessons above? Everyone has replied with what sorry? facts based on what sorry? oh thats right government released figures which no doubt are 100% correct, or did you mean facts that auto sales are up? and that somehow becomes evidence that tourist arrivals are up Or is it perhaps the irrelevant drivel about domestic tourism that somehow turned into fact that tourist arrivals are up? So please do enlighten me what facts have "everyone" provided that year 2012 had more tourists or had the amount they released. I do not expect a coherent response or even something related, but just for the sake of it, lets see what you can come up with Your more than ignorant about any inteligent conversation! your the one trolling mate and getting boring more and more by every post you make! It's like trying to have a conversation with a 5 year old ! have a happy new year it's up to you funny enough, i was expecting nothing other than something like this, just in line with the rest of your posts Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chiangmaikelly Posted January 1, 2013 Share Posted January 1, 2013 (edited) PATTAYA, 14 June 2012: Pattaya is enjoying a double digit growth in hotel occupancy,while another 1,000 rooms will open by 2016, C9 Hotelworks says its is latest market update on Tuesday. Top suppliers to Pattaya remain unchanged since 2008. Due to the proximity to Bangkok, the domestic market still ranks number one, responsible for 25% of all arrivals, followed by Russia (23%), China (11%), Germany (6%) and Taiwan (4%). http://www.ttrweekly...pattaya-hotels/ Mövenpick Hotels & Resorts,Established in 1973, is a 5-star hotel management company with 12,000 employees, and is represented through over 100 hotels in 26 countries, with a concentration in its core markets of Europe, Africa,the Middle East and Asia. The international hotel group,with roots in Switzerland, is expanding its hotel portfolio in Asian cities and has opened in Singapore,Philippines, India,Vietnam and Thailand. Movenpick doesn't make mistakes. Pattaya is a good place to be for the savvy hotel owner. Did I mention Movenpick is opening a new hotel in Pattaya this year? Edited January 1, 2013 by chiangmaikelly Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
philw Posted January 1, 2013 Share Posted January 1, 2013 "BANGKOK, Dec 24 – Inbound tourists to Thailand reached 21.8 million persons this year, representing a 14 per cent increase from last year " "BANGKOK, Dec 28 – Inbound tourists to Thailand hit a historic record of almost 22 million persons this year" "THAILAND (eTN) -- Thailand's tourism industry is likely to grow by more than 10% next year and about 23 million foreigners are expected to visit the country in 2013," You are the one trying to misslead as you can see by the leads that you provided! The millionth person traveled on flight TG 551, The total international visiters officially were 21.8 million which is the same as an estimated 22 million and the expectation is to grow by 10% about 23 million next year 2013. At least I and others have given facts on what we have said yet you still have not given any for the statements you have made about the decline of the numbers of tourists to Thailand 3rd time, since you seem to have a problem with responding to a simple question Please underline for me where "some " posters were discussing INCOME decline. I can see the discussion about decline in tourist numbers but failing to find the discussion of income Man you really have some problem! Lack of tourists equates to lack of income! As you have stated that you own a hotel yourself and that your hotel is empty that equates to a loss of income that you normally would of had! Maybe you should look at your business and see if you could change things to get these tourists in ? It's better than being blind to the fact that tourism is up and those that addapt to changing times benifit Soooo 1. You make a silly statement and rather than being man enough to admit it, you just snake your way around not to face it 2. Let me give quick education in economics so you do not embarrass yourself in the future when speaking with grown ups. Now, for the sake of a lesson, will be using hypothetical people and numbers, I have a hotel with 100 rooms. 50 rooms sell for 1000 baht and 50 rooms sell for 2000 baht. Last year i sold 50 rooms for 10 days, bringing total income of 500000 baht This year same time i sold same amount of rooms, 50 but the 2000 baht rooms bringing my total income for the same period and same number of rooms to 1000 000 baht. Question. Did i have double the amount of people stay in the hotel? because income is double from last year. Answer. No, i did not, i had the same amount of people who paid more for the rooms making my income double. Another lesson Last year i sold 50 rooms for 10 days, bringing total income of 500000 baht This year, i sold 25 expansive rooms making my total income 500000 baht. Question. Did i have same number of people stay in the hotel as last year? Answer. No, i did not, i had half the amount of people, but they paid for expansive rooms Final Lesson Last year i sold 50 rooms for 10 days, bringing total income of 500000 baht They also ate in my restaurant and spent 500000 baht This year due to wage increase i increased my prices by 10% on all rooms and food So this year i had the same amount of people staying in the same rooms but paying extra 10% They ate the same food but also paid extra 10%, now bringing my total for the year to 1100000 baht Question. Did i have more customers? Answer. No, i did not, i had the same amount of customers, but they paid extra 10% increasing my income by 10% End of Lessons. An increase of income from Tourism does not represent increasing number of tourists it does represent the increasing amount of money they spent,. Rising prices overall is a huge factor on yearly income received and is no indicator that there are more tourists coming into country. Hotels occupancy rates are the first indicator of tourist numbers because tourists can skip many restaurants and bars, but they all need to sleep somewhere. Pattaya, Phuket hotels were empty for most part of the year, sorry can not comment for Chiangmai or Isaan towns. Please inform the name of the hotel so that I can make sure I never stay in it....... 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rubl Posted January 1, 2013 Share Posted January 1, 2013 Man you really have some problem! Lack of tourists equates to lack of income! As you have stated that you own a hotel yourself and that your hotel is empty that equates to a loss of income that you normally would of had! Maybe you should look at your business and see if you could change things to get these tourists in ? It's better than being blind to the fact that tourism is up and those that addapt to changing times benifit Soooo 1. You make a silly statement and rather than being man enough to admit it, you just snake your way around not to face it 2. Let me give quick education in economics so you do not embarrass yourself in the future when speaking with grown ups. Now, for the sake of a lesson, will be using hypothetical people and numbers, I have a hotel with 100 rooms. 50 rooms sell for 1000 baht and 50 rooms sell for 2000 baht. Last year i sold 50 rooms for 10 days, bringing total income of 500000 baht This year same time i sold same amount of rooms, 50 but the 2000 baht rooms bringing my total income for the same period and same number of rooms to 1000 000 baht. Question. Did i have double the amount of people stay in the hotel? because income is double from last year. Answer. No, i did not, i had the same amount of people who paid more for the rooms making my income double. Another lesson Last year i sold 50 rooms for 10 days, bringing total income of 500000 baht This year, i sold 25 expansive rooms making my total income 500000 baht. Question. Did i have same number of people stay in the hotel as last year? Answer. No, i did not, i had half the amount of people, but they paid for expansive rooms Final Lesson Last year i sold 50 rooms for 10 days, bringing total income of 500000 baht They also ate in my restaurant and spent 500000 baht This year due to wage increase i increased my prices by 10% on all rooms and food So this year i had the same amount of people staying in the same rooms but paying extra 10% They ate the same food but also paid extra 10%, now bringing my total for the year to 1100000 baht Question. Did i have more customers? Answer. No, i did not, i had the same amount of customers, but they paid extra 10% increasing my income by 10% End of Lessons. An increase of income from Tourism does not represent increasing number of tourists it does represent the increasing amount of money they spent,. Rising prices overall is a huge factor on yearly income received and is no indicator that there are more tourists coming into country. Hotels occupancy rates are the first indicator of tourist numbers because tourists can skip many restaurants and bars, but they all need to sleep somewhere. Pattaya, Phuket hotels were empty for most part of the year, sorry can not comment for Chiangmai or Isaan towns. Please inform the name of the hotel so that I can make sure I never stay in it....... Terribly sorry, but I think promoting one's own hotel by posting name and other details is against forum rules. Asking for such details might even be seen as baiting, or trolling. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
philw Posted January 1, 2013 Share Posted January 1, 2013 Oh Dear.................... Perhaps our Dutch Uncle does not understand preventative need. I don't want to promote the place, I want to know how to avoid it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DocN Posted January 2, 2013 Share Posted January 2, 2013 They believe in Thai- government numbers! OFFICIAL numbers! 'nuff said! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chiangmaikelly Posted January 2, 2013 Share Posted January 2, 2013 They believe in Thai- government numbers! OFFICIAL numbers! 'nuff said! Nuff said? You Trink now? Of course it is not enough said. Look at the reputable hotel chains and businesses like the Central group and Movenpick that are investing heavily in Pattaya. They employ economists and MBA's from all over the world to advise them and the word is Pattaya is the place to put your money in spite of a couple of spoil sports on Thai Visa who have no idea what is going on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lemoncake Posted January 2, 2013 Share Posted January 2, 2013 Terribly sorry, but I think promoting one's own hotel by posting name and other details is against forum rules. Asking for such details might even be seen as baiting, or trolling. Phil has troubles keeping up with reality and fantasy, as at times he owns big factories and then few months later does 15 day border runs, not to mention 1000 baht might be 3 times more than he can afford But thats irrelevant, what is relevant was the following sentence which i had no doubt a troll would miss Now, for the sake of a lesson, will be using hypothetical people and numbers, 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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