Need To Help My Son Get A 'year In Industry'

[socrates28]

Apologise
for going off topic here - but I thought I would appeal to my Thai Visa
Family - if anyone can help or advise please let me know

My 21 year old son is about to take a year out of his degree and work in Industry for a Year

Just shows you how bad things are in UK my son cannot find any type of work

I was wondering if any of the guys on here know of any places or Companies that will take him

His skills are in Computers and Art - related to Gaming:

Working with Adobe (Photoshop, Flash, After Effects) Autodesk
(3DS Max and Mudbox), programming (HTML5, CSS3, Javascript, PHP, C and Java)

He is not looking for any Web Development or Design work

In the past I had loads of contacts with guys in Computing but over the years I moved into property and lost all my links

Its a long shot but thanks in advance....

[rwdrwdrwd]

There are loads of jobs in IT in the UK (well, in London anyway), it's very vibrant. The 'no web development' bit is likely to be a concern though, particularly given his scenario and the mention of HTML5, CSS3 JavaScript, PHP and Flash - all web technologies.

Demand for HTML5, JavaScript and CSS is extremely high, but using them is web development so...

Anyway - Gamesys, Playfish, EA, King.com all look for the skills you mention, are Gaming centric, probably also have hybrid creative openings, are always hiring and may consider someone on a year out.

[yoshiwara]

Which Uni? There are one or two things he needs to have a look at. First the CV. Lots of students produce extremely poor CVs. Has it been checked and does it have a clear statement of career objectives (checked for grammar and spelling). Second, re computing, does he have a portfolio of software created which can either be demonstrated or linked to. Thirdly, there are software gaming shows (usually in London) where the various software companies can be approached, but they will ask 'can you show us what you can do?' Another suggestion is to approach the University IT department and offer to work the summer months ie start early and forget any ideas of going on holiday.

Edited May 18, 2013 by yoshiwara

[socrates28]

Which Uni? There are one or two things he needs to have a look at. First the CV. Lots of students produce extremely poor CVs. Has it been checked and does it have a clear statement of career objectives (checked for grammar and spelling). Second, re computing, does he have a portfolio of software created which can either be demonstrated or linked to. Thirdly, there are software gaming shows (usually in London) where the various software companies can be approached, but they will ask 'can you show us what you can do?' Another suggestion is to approach the University IT department and offer to work the summer months ie start early and forget any ideas of going on holiday.

I personally went over his CV - I was in recruitment for 15 years - and yes it needed work

He has a website - linked to his CV which shows his portfolio

Yes he did try to IT Department at Uni and it was a no go

And yes he has forwarded his CV to all the companies mentioned in your other post

I will tell him about your idea regarding the Computer Shows

It is tough out there.....

Edited May 18, 2013 by socrates28

[socrates28]

There are loads of jobs in IT in the UK (well, in London anyway), it's very vibrant. The 'no web development' bit is likely to be a concern though, particularly given his scenario and the mention of HTML5, CSS3 JavaScript, PHP and Flash - all web technologies.

Demand for HTML5, JavaScript and CSS is extremely high, but using them is web development so...

Anyway - Gamesys, Playfish, EA, King.com all look for the skills you mention, are Gaming centric, probably also have hybrid creative openings, are always hiring and may consider someone on a year out.

What I meant he does not want to design websites - sorry for the way I put it

[socrates28]

There are loads of jobs in IT in the UK (well, in London anyway), it's very vibrant. The 'no web development' bit is likely to be a concern though, particularly given his scenario and the mention of HTML5, CSS3 JavaScript, PHP and Flash - all web technologies.

Demand for HTML5, JavaScript and CSS is extremely high, but using them is web development so...

Anyway - Gamesys, Playfish, EA, King.com all look for the skills you mention, are Gaming centric, probably also have hybrid creative openings, are always hiring and may consider someone on a year out.

Duplicate post

Edited May 18, 2013 by socrates28

[yoshiwara]

There may be lots of jobs in IT in London but they are for the best of the best. Universities are pushing out graduates with so-so skills and just the ability to pass modules and just do not fit industry needs and therefore find difficulty finding work. What is his average grade score to date? Over 65%? Over 70% and what is the quality of the portfolio?

[fletchsmile]

You said that in the UK, "he couldn't find any type of work", but in Thailand he is not looking for "Wed Development or Design work".

For Thailand, I think he needs to be even more flexible than the UK. From my experience even though an expert in my fields, I've sometimes had to look at variations in Thailand and be more flexible. At his age he can't really pick and choose, and in Thailand less so. So if he wants a job in a specific field the odds are better in UK. In Thailand he needs to widen his scope and be even less choosy than UK.

Perhaps a rethink as to what his priorities are: specific job or Thailand? and then realistically in the current climate and with restrictive labour practices in Thailand, any job is better than no job.

Realistically for his age, it would be personal connections and people you know in companies in Thailand. Perhaps smaller foreign-owner managed businesses.

I wish him well in his search.

Best Regards

Fletch

[socrates28]

There may be lots of jobs in IT in London but they are for the best of the best. Universities are pushing out graduates with so-so skills and just the ability to pass modules and just do not fit industry needs and therefore find difficulty finding work. What is his average grade score to date? Over 65%? Over 70% and what is the quality of the portfolio?

He is hovering between a 2.1 and 1st - he will probably end up with a 2.1

I looked at his portfolio - he made a cartoon infomercial about Malaria which could easily be shown at the beginning of a movie at the cinema anywhere in the world as it needed no translation purely visual - he even wrote the music to accompany it

He really wants to work in a Games Company - he has that mix of art and computing as well as the ability to articulate in writing - what he does lack is that 'fire in the belly' I had at his age

[rwdrwdrwd]

He really wants to work in a Games Company - he has that mix of art and computing as well as the ability to articulate in writing - what he does lack is that 'fire in the belly' I had at his age

Unfortunately above any skills, this 'fire' is probably the most important aspect - he's very unlikely to be at a senior level in any of the mentioned skills at his age so the motivation and determination is the selling point to employers. Hopefully he can find it because the blend you describe of creative and technical skills is in fact rather rare and in demand.

I didn't interpret your OP as referring to jobs in Thailand, that's very, very unlikely to happen I'm afraid to say - he's in a far stronger position in the UK for finding work experience.

How about taking the year to work on developing games (or mini applications) himself? Anyone can publish these days, games can be developed for Android and iPhone and the web with the skills he has. Perhaps this may unleash the drive and determination needed to succeed - and if he doesn't find himself running a fledgling mini games house of his own he can use the experience and portfolio items to gain work - in this industry it is all about the portfolio.

Edited May 19, 2013 by rwdrwdrwd

[fletchsmile]

Forgot to add. One option that may help is if you can find a smaller foreign owned business, maybe you could come to an arrangement where they employ him, and pay a salary, but you give them cash in hand as a thank you for doing so. The salary is a deductible expense for them. So they gain financially and your son might get his job placement

Might give more options and be of interest to small businesses here, if you can afford it, and if the key is work experience rather than earning money. Yes I know in an ideal world, earning keep, fair days wage and all that, but sometimes getting that first foot on the ladder is more important. Also some small businesses need the cash at the start and can't afford to pay. Might be a possible win-win :

Cheers

Fletch

[socrates28]

Forgot to add. One option that may help is if you can find a smaller foreign owned business, maybe you could come to an arrangement where they employ him, and pay a salary, but you give them cash in hand as a thank you for doing so. The salary is a deductible expense for them. So they gain financially and your son might get his job placement

Might give more options and be of interest to small businesses here, if you can afford it, and if the key is work experience rather than earning money. Yes I know in an ideal world, earning keep, fair days wage and all that, but sometimes getting that first foot on the ladder is more important. Also some small businesses need the cash at the start and can't afford to pay. Might be a possible win-win :

Cheers

Fletch

I am quite prepared to do this but I doubt he would get a work permit in Thailand - too much red tape (and rightly so)

[yoshiwara]

There may be lots of jobs in IT in London but they are for the best of the best. Universities are pushing out graduates with so-so skills and just the ability to pass modules and just do not fit industry needs and therefore find difficulty finding work. What is his average grade score to date? Over 65%? Over 70% and what is the quality of the portfolio?

He is hovering between a 2.1 and 1st - he will probably end up with a 2.1

I looked at his portfolio - he made a cartoon infomercial about Malaria which could easily be shown at the beginning of a movie at the cinema anywhere in the world as it needed no translation purely visual - he even wrote the music to accompany it

He really wants to work in a Games Company - he has that mix of art and computing as well as the ability to articulate in writing - what he does lack is that 'fire in the belly' I had at his age

Bottom line is that it is the fire in the belly which sells above all. Companies are buying the person at this level. Skills are raw and any company will be investing in the person with a view to future employment. Biggest criticism of students is lack of work discipline, ability to present themselves and poor maths and English skills. Fussy students expecting to be 'discovered' can be a pain.

[socrates28]

There may be lots of jobs in IT in London but they are for the best of the best. Universities are pushing out graduates with so-so skills and just the ability to pass modules and just do not fit industry needs and therefore find difficulty finding work. What is his average grade score to date? Over 65%? Over 70% and what is the quality of the portfolio?

He is hovering between a 2.1 and 1st - he will probably end up with a 2.1

I looked at his portfolio - he made a cartoon infomercial about Malaria which could easily be shown at the beginning of a movie at the cinema anywhere in the world as it needed no translation purely visual - he even wrote the music to accompany it

He really wants to work in a Games Company - he has that mix of art and computing as well as the ability to articulate in writing - what he does lack is that 'fire in the belly' I had at his age

Bottom line is that it is the fire in the belly which sells above all. Companies are buying the person at this level. Skills are raw and any company will be investing in the person with a view to future employment. Biggest criticism of students is lack of work discipline, ability to present themselves and poor maths and English skills. Fussy students expecting to be 'discovered' can be a pain.

The fire in the belly I cannot overcome - perhaps he took after his mum!

Incidentally he contacted one of the companies mentioned above and they asked to see his CV

[yoshiwara]

There may be lots of jobs in IT in London but they are for the best of the best. Universities are pushing out graduates with so-so skills and just the ability to pass modules and just do not fit industry needs and therefore find difficulty finding work. What is his average grade score to date? Over 65%? Over 70% and what is the quality of the portfolio?

He is hovering between a 2.1 and 1st - he will probably end up with a 2.1

I looked at his portfolio - he made a cartoon infomercial about Malaria which could easily be shown at the beginning of a movie at the cinema anywhere in the world as it needed no translation purely visual - he even wrote the music to accompany it

He really wants to work in a Games Company - he has that mix of art and computing as well as the ability to articulate in writing - what he does lack is that 'fire in the belly' I had at his age

Bottom line is that it is the fire in the belly which sells above all. Companies are buying the person at this level. Skills are raw and any company will be investing in the person with a view to future employment. Biggest criticism of students is lack of work discipline, ability to present themselves and poor maths and English skills. Fussy students expecting to be 'discovered' can be a pain.

The fire in the belly I cannot overcome - perhaps he took after his mum!

Incidentally he contacted one of the companies mentioned above and they asked to see his CV

Sometimes they don't want to show outward enthusiasm nowadays to protect against kickbacks but the desire may be there anyway. I assume he has internal enthusiasm as he appears to have studied hard. If a company has asked for his CV he might take a chance and follow up with a call or even visit to the HR department and ask for an interview.

[rwdrwdrwd]

yoshiwara

Sometimes they don't want to show outward enthusiasm nowadays to protect against kickbacks but the desire may be there anyway. I assume he has internal enthusiasm as he appears to have studied hard. If a company has asked for his CV he might take a chance and follow up with a call or even visit to the HR dep

artment and ask for an interview.

These companies are hassled by agents all day long every day, he's already in the door and prioritised (no agent commission on this candidate) if he has a contact to send a CV to. Calling them to ask for an interview at this stage is a bad approach - he already has a request for a CV and a contact point. Turning up unexpected on the doorstep is a total 'no-no' in my opinion, it's extremely disruptive.

I recommend he just does a strong (and very CREATIVE!) CV and submits it to them as asked. Call after 2 days (but not on a Monday) to prompt if there's no feedback.

Edited May 21, 2013 by rwdrwdrwd

[yoshiwara]

yoshiwara

Sometimes they don't want to show outward enthusiasm nowadays to protect against kickbacks but the desire may be there anyway. I assume he has internal enthusiasm as he appears to have studied hard. If a company has asked for his CV he might take a chance and follow up with a call or even visit to the HR dep

artment and ask for an interview.

These companies are hassled by agents all day long every day, he's already in the door and prioritised (no agent commission on this candidate) if he has a contact to send a CV to. Calling them to ask for an interview at this stage is a bad approach - he already has a request for a CV and a contact point. Turning up unexpected on the doorstep is a total 'no-no' in my opinion, it's extremely disruptive.

I recommend he just does a strong (and very CREATIVE!) CV and submits it to them as asked. Call after 2 days (but not on a Monday) to prompt if there's no feedback.

Fair points.

[socrates28]

Thanks for the support gentlemen

I feel so helpless - as I am a person who likes to make things happen

I guess on this one I will have to let him try his best and get there by himself

[yoshiwara]

You said: 'My 21 year old son is about to take a year out of his degree and work in Industry for a Year'

Do you mean he is intermitting a year from a 3-year degree or is he registered for a 4 year sandwich degree?

If it is the latter, and he doesn't manage to secure a 1-year placement then there should be an option to switch to a different named degree of the same type which is straight 3 year degree no sandwich element.

[socrates28]

You said: 'My 21 year old son is about to take a year out of his degree and work in Industry for a Year'

Do you mean he is intermitting a year from a 3-year degree or is he registered for a 4 year sandwich degree?

If it is the latter, and he doesn't manage to secure a 1-year placement then there should be an option to switch to a different named degree of the same type which is straight 3 year degree no sandwich element.

He is intermitting for a year

[yoshiwara]

You said: 'My 21 year old son is about to take a year out of his degree and work in Industry for a Year'

Do you mean he is intermitting a year from a 3-year degree or is he registered for a 4 year sandwich degree?

If it is the latter, and he doesn't manage to secure a 1-year placement then there should be an option to switch to a different named degree of the same type which is straight 3 year degree no sandwich element.

He is intermitting for a year

Well that is not such a good idea at all. In addition to losing one's peer group there is the loss of academic supervision and the discipline required to deliver an academic project at the end of a sandwich placement. Just intermitting is often the prelude to merely dropping out in favour of the 'real world' to forever be regretted in later life unless one hits the jackpot. Most 'new' universities offer a placement pathway. If he is at an 'old'uni not offering the placement option then he should wait until graduating and then maybe seek an employer who may support further study at masters level.

[socrates28]

You said: 'My 21 year old son is about to take a year out of his degree and work in Industry for a Year'

Do you mean he is intermitting a year from a 3-year degree or is he registered for a 4 year sandwich degree?

If it is the latter, and he doesn't manage to secure a 1-year placement then there should be an option to switch to a different named degree of the same type which is straight 3 year degree no sandwich element.

He is intermitting for a year

Well that is not such a good idea at all. In addition to losing one's peer group there is the loss of academic supervision and the discipline required to deliver an academic project at the end of a sandwich placement. Just intermitting is often the prelude to merely dropping out in favour of the 'real world' to forever be regretted in later life unless one hits the jackpot. Most 'new' universities offer a placement pathway. If he is at an 'old'uni not offering the placement option then he should wait until graduating and then maybe seek an employer who may support further study at masters level.

Its funny because I had that exact conversation with him last night

He is adamant that he is going to complete his degree and I do believe him but if he starts a placement and it turns into a job then I cannot see it happening

[yoshiwara]

You said: 'My 21 year old son is about to take a year out of his degree and work in Industry for a Year'

Do you mean he is intermitting a year from a 3-year degree or is he registered for a 4 year sandwich degree?

If it is the latter, and he doesn't manage to secure a 1-year placement then there should be an option to switch to a different named degree of the same type which is straight 3 year degree no sandwich element.

He is intermitting for a year

Well that is not such a good idea at all. In addition to losing one's peer group there is the loss of academic supervision and the discipline required to deliver an academic project at the end of a sandwich placement. Just intermitting is often the prelude to merely dropping out in favour of the 'real world' to forever be regretted in later life unless one hits the jackpot. Most 'new' universities offer a placement pathway. If he is at an 'old'uni not offering the placement option then he should wait until graduating and then maybe seek an employer who may support further study at masters level.

Its funny because I had that exact conversation with him last night

He is adamant that he is going to complete his degree and I do believe him but if he starts a placement and it turns into a job then I cannot see it happening

If what he is looking for is not a part of a degree programme then it isn't a placement. Its a temporary job and nothing more. Actually nothing to stop him transferring to another university with a placement programme even if he does line up an interview and gets an offer. Employers like Microsoft who offer placements like the idea of academic supervision and the opportunity to discuss issues with the student academic tutor. That can then be fed back to the student. Mind you he might get lucky but that luck not too apparent so far. Its a different ball game with students who have 'fire in their belly'. More worrying for students who do not and where they are driving. Edited May 22, 2013 by yoshiwara