New forum on postponing the election is too little, too late: Thai talk

[webfact]

THAI TALK
New forum on postponing the election is too little, too late
Suthichai Yoon
The Nation



BANGKOK: -- For some inexplicable reason, the caretaker government has been a few steps behind the fast-moving political developments, rendering every major move it has taken futile and even embarrassingly defensive.

Just as the Bangkok shutdown began with a bang on Monday, Premier Yingluck Shinawatra instructed one of her deputies, Pongthep Thepkanjana, to send invitations to 70 organisations, including 53 political parties, the supreme commander and the Constitutional Court, to attend a specially convened forum to discuss how the election was to be handled.

There were indications that the premier might be willing, after weeks of standing firm against any change in the ballot-casting date of February 2, to discuss a postponement. But a few hours later, one of her aides told the press that the hastily called meeting was not about "postponing the election". The topic was to be about the election, period.

That's another example of taking one step forward, two steps back. That has been the government's pattern all along. And it has undermined its legitimacy on many counts.

The caretaker administration's latest gesture was a curious twist that has raised questions about its working relationship with the Election Commission (EC), another independent agency that has come under attack by the government and ruling Pheu Thai Party for one simple reason: It doesn't necessarily have to toe the government's line.

The five Election Commissioners earlier this week submitted a report to Premier Yingluck detailing the problems they are facing in organising the February 2 poll that could mean we end up with a confusing state of affairs. With 28 constituencies with no candidates and 22 others with only one candidate each, the likelihood is high that the election will not deliver the required 95 per cent of MPs. Under that scenario, the new parliament could not be convened. That means a new government could not form either.

Instead of sitting down with the Election Commissioners to thrash out a solution, Premier Yingluck sent invitations to 70-odd organisations for a meeting yesterday to discuss the EC's proposal. That was nothing if not a slap in the face for the country's election agency. The EC decided not to attend the meeting, rendering it a non-starter from the outset.

The caretaker government made the same blunder a few weeks ago when it invited a panel, supposedly led by the supreme commander, to work out a plan to set up a "Reform Council" that would pre-empt the protestors' "People's Council". The scheme has so far failed to take off and it seems to have died a natural death - for the same reason that yesterday's forum was stillborn: It wasn't supposed to be a serious move in the first place.

The deadlock has deepened and there doesn't seem to be a way out - unless the premier offers an initiative that convinces the public she is ready to make a sacrifice in order to reach a compromise.

The protesters are demanding her resignation. She has said she can't step aside because the Constitution requires her to stay put. The government says the election can't be postponed either - because it claims that the Constitution says so. None of these excuses hold water. Academics and legal experts have cited clauses in the charter that could provide a way out of the current impasse.

If the government refuses to reach out for a breakthrough by holding talks with the other side, the country will be heading towards "failed state" status at a very dangerous speed indeed.


-- The Nation 2014-01-16

[Jasun]

It may have been politicking, but If there's a chance of reaching a compromise and avoiding violence, surely it's never too late.

[englishoak]

Academics and legal experts have cited clauses in the charter that could provide a way out of the current impasse.

so what are they then ? come on nation substance and proof of these clauses and names of academics please or its just another made up story

Id say the gov have been one step ahead during the whole crisis so far. proof being they are still here and holding elections.... also monday went of with a pffft not a bang

Its also never too late for talks, ask syria

Edited January 15, 2014 by englishoak

[Robby nz]

The forum was only meant to be a gathering of those who wanted an election to go ahead.

They wanted the EC to be there so they could have a good bash at it,

But the EC saw through it and wasn't playing ball.

Sure there were some who were 'invited' who were against an election on the 4th Feb but that was only for show.

Easy to see through PT, if only they would be so transparent with things like the rice scheme.

[NongKhaiKid]

I'm not sure yesterday's event is worthy of the name ' forum ' as i would suggest it was window dressing with a predetermined decision.

As par for the course YL is reported to have given two different reasons why the decision to go ahead on Feb 02, one being it was the ' decision ' of all at the meeting and later supposedly claiming there was no legal way to change the date so why then hold a forum ?

Now we are told the meeting was to discuss the actual election not when it should be held, the usual ' move the goalposts ' to suit routine.

[Siripon]

Ever since Suthep stated his campaign at Samsen railway station the government have been on the defensive.

Very confident of continued support (and hence victory in an election) from the north and north-east, Yingluck has used the only weapon she has- call an election, believing victory would give the Shinawat's legitimacy to control any proposals on reform.

But a sizeable portion of the Thai population don't accept that, and many of those are based in Bangkok, it's easy to protest at lunchtime, the evenings, the weekends,

And let us not forget many Pheua Thai MPs are sick of being under the yoke of the Shinawats, they are acutely aware the party belongs to one man only, it's humiliiating for MPs who are supposed to have dignity to serve under the slogan- Thaksin thinks, Pheua Thai does' as if they are mere employees, which is what they are.

Suthep has some powerful backers in the army - no way could he get away with his actions if he didn't.

The election will solve nothing, deadlock will remain.

I can see a closed doors meeting between Suthep and Pheua Thai ( excluding Shinawats) hosted by the army.

Finally a temporary government is announced to work out reforms with an election to be held within a year.Its members are respected technocrats, not politicians.

But the red shirts cry,' It's a coup, let's fight!'

But it's a deal reached between all parties, the stalemate post election and continuing demonstrations for the Shinawats to leave politics has left the participants with no choice if they wish to avoid a civil war.

Their party( Pheua Thai) supports the interim government, the red shirts have no stomach for a fight with their own, and anyway they fully support reform too, it's just they couldn't stomach it under the hand of Suthep.

You may say I'm a dreamer but I'm not the only one.

[poisonus]

More evidence that this government are running around like chickens with their heads cut off.

This election if it attempts to go ahead will actually just show the world that very few in Thailand actually want the election which will have the effect of screaming out that very few in Thailand want this government.... When the election crashes and burns... and I think Ying and the puppets are slowly realizing this, and deep down wish they actually had a way out of it, but now it seems that nobody is actually going to help them use a u-turn as a facade that they are 'giving quarter' to the people by postponing.

You make your bed........

[ginjag]

Academics and legal experts have cited clauses in the charter that could provide a way out of the current impasse.

so what are they then ? come on nation substance and proof of these clauses and names of academics please or its just another made up story

Id say the gov have been one step ahead during the whole crisis so far. proof being they are still here and holding elections.... also monday went of with a pffft not a bang

Its also never too late for talks, ask Syria

Hey come on, amazing to use SYRIA as a comparison. Their country is almost rubble and he wants to stay in power---because he was democratically elected ?????

[spare5]

Better late than never?

[Prbkk]

The Nation exceeds its own very high threshold for dishonesty and biased 'reporting'. the govt has tried to reach out to the opposition and discuss the postponement of the election....only to have Mr Suteph announce the details of those discussions on a rally stage. Read the Bangkok Post....it offers a relatively balanced view of events in Thailand

[englishoak]

Academics and legal experts have cited clauses in the charter that could provide a way out of the current impasse.

so what are they then ? come on nation substance and proof of these clauses and names of academics please or its just another made up story

Id say the gov have been one step ahead during the whole crisis so far. proof being they are still here and holding elections.... also monday went of with a pffft not a bang

Its also never too late for talks, ask Syria

Hey come on, amazing to use SYRIA as a comparison. Their country is almost rubble and he wants to stay in power---because he was democratically elected ?????

Just saying its never too late to talk Syria is about as close as its got recently and abated somewhat due to last and final minute talks don't tell me you think the US etc should have got involved, as it turns out talks averted an almighty poopshoot at the last moment. Thats all im saying

[ginjag]

Academics and legal experts have cited clauses in the charter that could provide a way out of the current impasse.

so what are they then ? come on nation substance and proof of these clauses and names of academics please or its just another made up story

Id say the gov have been one step ahead during the whole crisis so far. proof being they are still here and holding elections.... also monday went of with a pffft not a bang

Its also never too late for talks, ask Syria

Hey come on, amazing to use SYRIA as a comparison. Their country is almost rubble and he wants to stay in power---because he was democratically elected ?????

Just saying its never too late to talk Syria is about as close as its got recently and abated somewhat due to last and final minute talks don't tell me you think the US etc should have got involved, as it turns out talks averted an almighty poopshoot at the last moment. Thats all im saying

Had no country got involved no talks would never have taken place. For sure.

The same here had no one put up a fight against Yingluck/PTP there would have no -nothing.

[ginjag]

The Nation exceeds its own very high threshold for dishonesty and biased 'reporting'. the govt has tried to reach out to the opposition and discuss the postponement of the election....only to have Mr Suteph announce the details of those discussions on a rally stage. Read the Bangkok Post....it offers a relatively balanced view of events in Thailand

So you think the Nation is more dishonest than the said government ??? pathetic -to think on this scale. The government HAD to reach out, because it shot it'self in the foot with BEING DISHONEST

[gabruce]

isn't it impossible to have 95% of the MP's? If there are 24 missing MP's, then it's a bust. With 28 constituencies have no candidates it's finished already. With other constituencies in question (1 candidate only and that candidate has a minimum number of votes needed) it's even more not possible. What am I missing in the constitution?

[tingtongteesood]

This article takes shots at the "Govt.", whiulke suggesting the coup-mongers are on top of their game.....One must keep in mind who the PADocrats are maligning when denigrating the "Govt"......This 'Govt.' has roots and when attacking 'it', one is attacking its' entirety....Those roots are the millions who chose this 'Govt'....So when PADocrats and their coup-monger friends denigrate Ms. Y. and the Govt, they are in effect besmirching and sullying the choices made by those voters.....It is not the way to win friends and influence people come the next election....In some way that is at the heart of the problem...The coup-mongers are essentially seeking to advance their electoral prospects by changing systemics in their favor via holier-than-thou Reform pretensions, instead of adapting their policies and programs to attract a diverse electorate.

I wish people would stop going and on and on about a coup, Suteb and the demonstrators do not want one as they know this will bring the red shirts to Bangkok and probably a lot of destruction with it...Despite the red lovers continually stating 'Suteb wants violence because he wants a coup' I believe both to be completely false. They also keep saying that every bloody attack against the protestors is a fake attack orchestrated by the PDRC, bloody rubbish ! If they wanted violence and were into making false attacks, the death toll at Din Dang could have easily be made much higher, however it wasn't. Explain that one then ? Why didn't they have 50 people killed on purpose then ? Now stop spreading all this bs please, just because you repeat it a thousand times, it doesn't mean there is any truth to it whatsoever. Stick to the facts please....

[tingtongteesood]

The Nation exceeds its own very high threshold for dishonesty and biased 'reporting'. the govt has tried to reach out to the opposition and discuss the postponement of the election....only to have Mr Suteph announce the details of those discussions on a rally stage. Read the Bangkok Post....it offers a relatively balanced view of events in Thailand

I read both as well as numerous other sources and whilst I agree BP is better, Nation is not as biased as you make out. Guess the truth hurts for some people...

[kurtgruen]

Ever since Suthep stated his campaign at Samsen railway station the government have been on the defensive.

Very confident of continued support (and hence victory in an election) from the north and north-east, Yingluck has used the only weapon she has- call an election, believing victory would give the Shinawat's legitimacy to control any proposals on reform.

But a sizeable portion of the Thai population don't accept that, and many of those are based in Bangkok, it's easy to protest at lunchtime, the evenings, the weekends,

And let us not forget many Pheua Thai MPs are sick of being under the yoke of the Shinawats, they are acutely aware the party belongs to one man only, it's humiliiating for MPs who are supposed to have dignity to serve under the slogan- Thaksin thinks, Pheua Thai does' as if they are mere employees, which is what they are.

Suthep has some powerful backers in the army - no way could he get away with his actions if he didn't.

The election will solve nothing, deadlock will remain.

I can see a closed doors meeting between Suthep and Pheua Thai ( excluding Shinawats) hosted by the army.

Finally a temporary government is announced to work out reforms with an election to be held within a year.Its members are respected technocrats, not politicians.

But the red shirts cry,' It's a coup, let's fight!'

But it's a deal reached between all parties, the stalemate post election and continuing demonstrations for the Shinawats to leave politics has left the participants with no choice if they wish to avoid a civil war.

Their party( Pheua Thai) supports the interim government, the red shirts have no stomach for a fight with their own, and anyway they fully support reform too, it's just they couldn't stomach it under the hand of Suthep.

You may say I'm a dreamer but I'm not the only one.

I like it and it makes sense. Only problem is, that most Pheua Thai MP's have been in Thaksin's pocket a long time and it might be hard, to find some, who are tired of the Thaksin "Gravy Train". After all, they are all getting rich and why would they change, when the money keeps rolling in. Hopefully, you are right and some actually care about their Country, too. I wish I was an optimist, but mostly I just see "Money Number One", over here, in every area of society.

There is some hope. Out of the hundreds of Policemen, I have met, both within our family, and outside, I have met two or three honest ones, which is very refreshing and a good start. Honest politicians...hmmmm...I think, that is an oxymoron. I think, some of them, start out with good intentions, but being part of a big party, corrupts very quick. Both here and in many other Countries.

I hope your vision will come true, because I do like it and it would solve a lot of problems, in Thailand right now.

[tezzainoz]

isn't it impossible to have 95% of the MP's? If there are 24 missing MP's, then it's a bust. With 28 constituencies have no candidates it's finished already. With other constituencies in question (1 candidate only and that candidate has a minimum number of votes needed) it's even more not possible. What am I missing in the constitution?

are you stupid

They can not change the election date because the constitution will not allow them to

But when they can not get enough MP's the constitution does not really matter its what best for the country that matters

Please Thai people we need to be in power before the 180 days are up so we can give our great leader a Get Home Free Card

He has promised up great wealth when he returns a llitle for you and a lot for us

Thai people have no need but to praise us the saviours

[ginjag]

isn't it impossible to have 95% of the MP's? If there are 24 missing MP's, then it's a bust. With 28 constituencies have no candidates it's finished already. With other constituencies in question (1 candidate only and that candidate has a minimum number of votes needed) it's even more not possible. What am I missing in the constitution?

are you stupid

They can not change the election date because the constitution will not allow them to

But when they can not get enough MP's the constitution does not really matter its what best for the country that matters

Please Thai people we need to be in power before the 180 days are up so we can give our great leader a Get Home Free Card

He has promised up great wealth when he returns a llitle for you and a lot for us

Thai people have no need but to praise us the saviours

AMEN

[GeorgeO]

The Nation exceeds its own very high threshold for dishonesty and biased 'reporting'. the govt has tried to reach out to the opposition and discuss the postponement of the election....only to have Mr Suteph announce the details of those discussions on a rally stage. Read the Bangkok Post....it offers a relatively balanced view of events in Thailand

As usual, you continue to demonstrate your selective myopia ... why not try reading the whole thing? ...

"... a few hours later, one of her aides told the press that the hastily called meeting was not about "postponing the election". The topic was to be about the election, period".

The government is reaching out for nothing. They want to force this election through in their misguided belief that they can continue to rape this country.

For the umpteenth time, the election cannot go ahead until appropriate reforms are put in place, and please do not ask me to spell them out again ... I, and many others on here, have already provided appropriate lists of what is required before any election can proceed.

[Prbkk]

The Nation exceeds its own very high threshold for dishonesty and biased 'reporting'. the govt has tried to reach out to the opposition and discuss the postponement of the election....only to have Mr Suteph announce the details of those discussions on a rally stage. Read the Bangkok Post....it offers a relatively balanced view of events in Thailand

As usual, you continue to demonstrate your selective myopia ... why not try reading the whole thing? ...

"... a few hours later, one of her aides told the press that the hastily called meeting was not about "postponing the election". The topic was to be about the election, period".

The government is reaching out for nothing. They want to force this election through in their misguided belief that they can continue to rape this country.

For the umpteenth time, the election cannot go ahead until appropriate reforms are put in place, and please do not ask me to spell them out again ... I, and many others on here, have already provided appropriate lists of what is required before any election can proceed.

No George...wrong

YL sent the DPM to negotiate a May alternative with Sutph. He declined. He is playing a very silly "all or nothing" game....one he can't win ( and one the majority don't want him to play). Surely some good faith negotiating could have this sorted out...

[Prbkk]

The Nation exceeds its own very high threshold for dishonesty and biased 'reporting'. the govt has tried to reach out to the opposition and discuss the postponement of the election....only to have Mr Suteph announce the details of those discussions on a rally stage. Read the Bangkok Post....it offers a relatively balanced view of events in Thailand

I read both as well as numerous other sources and whilst I agree BP is better, Nation is not as biased as you make out. Guess the truth hurts for some people...

Some bits of The Nation are very good ( but not those claiming to be a balanced view of Thai politics).

[Baerboxer]

The Nation exceeds its own very high threshold for dishonesty and biased 'reporting'. the govt has tried to reach out to the opposition and discuss the postponement of the election....only to have Mr Suteph announce the details of those discussions on a rally stage. Read the Bangkok Post....it offers a relatively balanced view of events in Thailand

As usual, you continue to demonstrate your selective myopia ... why not try reading the whole thing? ...

"... a few hours later, one of her aides told the press that the hastily called meeting was not about "postponing the election". The topic was to be about the election, period".

The government is reaching out for nothing. They want to force this election through in their misguided belief that they can continue to rape this country.

For the umpteenth time, the election cannot go ahead until appropriate reforms are put in place, and please do not ask me to spell them out again ... I, and many others on here, have already provided appropriate lists of what is required before any election can proceed.

No George...wrong

YL sent the DPM to negotiate a May alternative with Sutph. He declined. He is playing a very silly "all or nothing" game....one he can't win ( and one the majority don't want him to play). Surely some good faith negotiating could have this sorted out...

How do you know what the majority want here? The large PTP minority may not be so large since the rice farmers seem to have woken up to the lies about late payments and false promises.

I would agree negotiation and meaningful dialogue would be fantastic - but with PTP - self admitted liars, and cheats. What chance do you think they would honor any agreements?

[bluie3]

The Nation exceeds its own very high threshold for dishonesty and biased 'reporting'. the govt has tried to reach out to the opposition and discuss the postponement of the election....only to have Mr Suteph announce the details of those discussions on a rally stage. Read the Bangkok Post....it offers a relatively balanced view of events in Thailand

I like this post. It always amazes me the way some post about Dr T being a fugative criminal - his so called crime was that he was PM when his wife bought some land - not all judges believed he was guilty of a crime.

If he did allow them to put him in a prison then all hell would have broken out with innumerable numbers of supporters tearing down the prison walls and we would have seen REAL criminals back on the streets - he has done the best thing for Thailand by remaining outside. - he was a businessman with some failures and some big wins - he didn't need to tickle the till which could be an interesting project for the corruption watchmen to look into Suthep the murderer and how he became unussually rich. He was responsible for power and water switched off so the sprinkler systems couldn't work at the time of the fires in BKK.

To go ahead with the election IF it is sure to fail is nonsense so they have done the maths and believe the parliament can be convened against the nay sayers naying.

I'm a resident since 1995 and I love this, my adopted country. Maybe now that the thought is out there about Provinces breaking away then it could grow in momentum - Isaan, North, and along the border down to Trat/Chantaburi which gives the sea-port - let the Bangkokians have their elite, their educated, their hero, Suthep, to lead them like Lennin - no elections, no freedom of speech or dissent. Tourists can pour in through the Interntional Airport in Chiangmai and still enjoy the wonders of amazing Thailand, its culture and diversity of culture.

[GeorgeO]

The Nation exceeds its own very high threshold for dishonesty and biased 'reporting'. the govt has tried to reach out to the opposition and discuss the postponement of the election....only to have Mr Suteph announce the details of those discussions on a rally stage. Read the Bangkok Post....it offers a relatively balanced view of events in Thailand

As usual, you continue to demonstrate your selective myopia ... why not try reading the whole thing? ...

"... a few hours later, one of her aides told the press that the hastily called meeting was not about "postponing the election". The topic was to be about the election, period".

The government is reaching out for nothing. They want to force this election through in their misguided belief that they can continue to rape this country.

For the umpteenth time, the election cannot go ahead until appropriate reforms are put in place, and please do not ask me to spell them out again ... I, and many others on here, have already provided appropriate lists of what is required before any election can proceed.

No George...wrong

YL sent the DPM to negotiate a May alternative with Sutph. He declined. He is playing a very silly "all or nothing" game....one he can't win ( and one the majority don't want him to play). Surely some good faith negotiating could have this sorted out...

I make a direct quote from the article and you tell me I am wrong...?! Do you ever take off your red blinkers?

[Baerboxer]

The Nation exceeds its own very high threshold for dishonesty and biased 'reporting'. the govt has tried to reach out to the opposition and discuss the postponement of the election....only to have Mr Suteph announce the details of those discussions on a rally stage. Read the Bangkok Post....it offers a relatively balanced view of events in Thailand

I like this post. It always amazes me the way some post about Dr T being a fugative criminal - his so called crime was that he was PM when his wife bought some land - not all judges believed he was guilty of a crime.

If he did allow them to put him in a prison then all hell would have broken out with innumerable numbers of supporters tearing down the prison walls and we would have seen REAL criminals back on the streets - he has done the best thing for Thailand by remaining outside. - he was a businessman with some failures and some big wins - he didn't need to tickle the till which could be an interesting project for the corruption watchmen to look into Suthep the murderer and how he became unussually rich. He was responsible for power and water switched off so the sprinkler systems couldn't work at the time of the fires in BKK.

To go ahead with the election IF it is sure to fail is nonsense so they have done the maths and believe the parliament can be convened against the nay sayers naying.

I'm a resident since 1995 and I love this, my adopted country. Maybe now that the thought is out there about Provinces breaking away then it could grow in momentum - Isaan, North, and along the border down to Trat/Chantaburi which gives the sea-port - let the Bangkokians have their elite, their educated, their hero, Suthep, to lead them like Lennin - no elections, no freedom of speech or dissent. Tourists can pour in through the Interntional Airport in Chiangmai and still enjoy the wonders of amazing Thailand, its culture and diversity of culture.

You've been a resident since 1995, but joined this site 29/11/2013. This is your 10th post. Hmmm.

Great post - Thaksin whiter than the driven snow, Paid for the IMF debt out of his own pocket. Always open and transparent on asset declarations and how he became unusually amply rich. Ok, so his government forcibly bought some land, sold it cheap to his wife, way below market value, and she sold it at a massive profit. Just coincidence, he was busy as PM at the time. All those other serious outstanding criminal cases, the potential HR violation issues and the tax evasion scam. All propaganda against the poor guy. He was amply rich so never needed his fingers in the till - hell, he's increased his fortune by some 450% since little sis became PM. Just shows what honest hard work and a nous for business can achieve. Give the guy amnesty, don't even bother trying all those other cases in court, bring him back and give him 6 months to sort the economy out and make everyone rich.