Jerusalem holy site closure 'declaration of war' - Abbas

[webfact]

Jerusalem holy site closure 'declaration of war' - Abbas

(BBC) A spokesman for Palestinian leader Mahmoud Abbas has described the closure of a disputed Jerusalem holy site as a "declaration of war".

The move came amid tension and violence after the shooting of a Jewish activist. Israel's PM urged calm, saying Mr Abbas was stoking unrest.

The holy site will reopen on Friday, Israel's economy minister says.

Yehuda Glick, a campaigner for greater Jewish prayer rights at the Temple Mount/al-Haram al-Sharif, was wounded.

Israeli police later killed a Palestinian suspected of shooting him. Moataz Hejazi, 32, was shot after reportedly opening fire when police surrounded his home.

Rabbi Glick is a well-known US-born campaigner for the right of Jews to pray at the site, which is currently prohibited.

The compound - known to Jews as the Temple Mount and to Muslims as Haram al-Sharif - is the holiest site in Judaism, and contains the al-Aqsa Mosque - the third holiest site in Islam.

Full story: http://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-29828547


-- BBC 2014-10-31

[Somtamnication]

Religion and war...friends forever.

[Lissos]

I 'get' what Moshe Dayan was hoping to achieve by backing off the mount in 67, but arguably what he hoped to avoid by allowing the Waqf to resume control, could be described as ending up manifesting anyway, being dragged out over decades instead as the mount is utilised by opponents of Israel as a highly symbolic focal point, a bastion, a state within a state almost, and arguably one remaining square of the 19 year Jordanian occupation of East Jerusalem.

Edited October 31, 2014 by Lissos

[Steely Dan]

Abbas has no doubt been looking for a pretext to start intifada 3. If so I think Israel should take full control of the Temple Mount area once and for all and build the third temple there.

Edited October 31, 2014 by Steely Dan

[coma]

Religion. The common denominator in the majority of world conflicts.

[ezzra]

Abbas should is lame duck president with the Hamas not on his side, he hope to provoke response

and action by coming out with such unhelpful proclamation, the is an entity that are still holding the

status of 'Refugees" after 70 years, just so they can suck a bit longer on the worlds tits for sympathy

and money.. yes, Israel is not perfect, but Abbas is not a partner for peace, not now anyway...

[RustBucket]

Abbas has no doubt been looking for a pretext to start intifada 3. If so I think Israel should take full control of the Temple Mount area once and for all and build the third temple there.

Not that easy.

That could start a very large war and if I know Israel the way I do, it could end up in nuclear exchange if all their Muslim neighbours attacked them simultaneously.

[kamahele]

The Jews and Muslims and nuts. This site needs to be destroyed except then both groups would fight over who got to worship the rubble. Just nuts.

[Ulysses G.]

Abbas has no doubt been looking for a pretext to start intifada 3. If so I think Israel should take full control of the Temple Mount area once and for all and build the third temple there.

Not that easy.

That could start a very large war and if I know Israel the way I do, it could end up in nuclear exchange if all their Muslim neighbors attacked them simultaneously.

Their Muslim neighbors have attacked them simultaneously a number of times and got their butts kicked without any need for nukes. That is why their Muslim neighbors don't try it again.

[rickirs]

Considering their treatment of holy Islamic sites, Israel might give ISIL and the Taliban an open invitation to vist Jerusalem. A 30-day visa would be sufficient for them to conduct their "visits."

[RustBucket]

Abbas has no doubt been looking for a pretext to start intifada 3. If so I think Israel should take full control of the Temple Mount area once and for all and build the third temple there.

Not that easy.

That could start a very large war and if I know Israel the way I do, it could end up in nuclear exchange if all their Muslim neighbors attacked them simultaneously.

Their Muslim neighbors have attacked them simultaneously a number of times and got their butts kicked without any need for nukes. That is why their Muslim neighbors don't try it again.

You need to read this http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_wars_involving_Israel All of these 'skirmishes' were territory based.

If they were to claim that holy shrine, they would be sparking a holy war. It's a bit different.

I once had a convo with a Pakistani guy I used to work with about Pakistan's newly acquired nukes and asked him if they would ever use them in a war with India. He disagreed, but made a point of telling me that the only nation likely to get nuked by Pakistan would be Israel if they ever dared attempt to claim Haram al-Sharif.

He said the entire Muslim world would rise up together (including Pakistan, Iraq, Iran etc....) and obliterate them. I believe him. That is why Israel have promised it will reopen today.... You don't normally get to see the Israelis rattled. But they know how sensitive that place is.

They would get flattened.

[Seastallion]

".. Israel's PM urged calm, saying Mr Abbas was stoking unrest."

Typical. Do something very provocative, then call the reaction "stoking unrest".

[RustBucket]

".. Israel's PM urged calm, saying Mr Abbas was stoking unrest."

Typical. Do something very provocative, then call the reaction "stoking unrest".

He knows that Abbas will try to start a holy war, and that is the last thing he wants.

Abbas on the other hand knows that place is the only card up his sleeve to get an entire Islamic coalition on their side and take back their country.

[Seastallion]

".. Israel's PM urged calm, saying Mr Abbas was stoking unrest."

Typical. Do something very provocative, then call the reaction "stoking unrest".

He knows that Abbas will try to start a holy war, and that is the last thing he wants.

Abbas on the other hand knows that place is the only card up his sleeve to get an entire Islamic coalition on their side and take back their country.

Abbas doesn't want war. He wants a treaty which includes '67 boundaries. He isn't even trying for '48 borders.

[Ulysses G.]

Abbas has no doubt been looking for a pretext to start intifada 3. If so I think Israel should take full control of the Temple Mount area once and for all and build the third temple there.

Not that easy.

That could start a very large war and if I know Israel the way I do, it could end up in nuclear exchange if all their Muslim neighbors attacked them simultaneously.

Their Muslim neighbors have attacked them simultaneously a number of times and got their butts kicked without any need for nukes. That is why their Muslim neighbors don't try it again.

All of these 'skirmishes' were territory based.

Your source calls them WARS, which is exactly what they were and The Jews were attacked in the first place because they were not Muslims. The other Arabs could care less about the Palestinian Arabs. It is foolish to pretend that the wars that all these Muslim countries lost repeatedly were not about religion.

Edited October 31, 2014 by Ulysses G.

[orosee]

I wish newspapers would adopt a policy of writing "holy" (in inverted commas) just to emphasize that this is a completely virtual concept and not a real thing people are fighting about. It would highlight the nonsensical aspect of killing one another: a "holy" war, a "holy" site, a "holy" man. Lift that bronze age rubbish out of our day to day language and life.

Similarly all other fictional characters and devices:

"Harry Potter"

"witches"

"warp drive"

"god"

Wasn't so long ago that journalists could properly use quotation marks to highlight debatable aspects of their reports.

[vogie]

The Jews and Muslims and nuts. This site needs to be destroyed except then both groups would fight over who got to worship the rubble. Just nuts.

Jeremy Bowen, News at Ten.

[Lissos]

I once had a convo with a Pakistani guy I used to work with about Pakistan's newly acquired nukes and asked him if they would ever use them in a war with India. He disagreed, but made a point of telling me that the only nation likely to get nuked by Pakistan would be Israel if they ever dared attempt to claim Haram al-Sharif. He said the entire Muslim world would rise up together (including Pakistan, Iraq, Iran etc....) and obliterate them. I believe him. That is why Israel have promised it will reopen today.... You don't normally get to see the Israelis rattled. But they know how sensitive that place is. They would get flattened.

Which in itself is an example of how the wider Ummah is not in the slightest bit interested in Palestinian Nationalism. It never was, and went out of its way to scupper its attempts on many occasions. It is interested in opposition to the Jewish State above all else, and the temple mount is merely used as a powerfull symbolic bastion. If your co worker believes the entire Ummah would unite (can they ever unite on anything? Even in previous wars against Israel, each state is on memoir record, competing with each other to grab territory for their own states in the event of a victory) and nuke Israel, then they'd end up murdering countless Arabs (Muslim and Christian) along with everyone else. In turn, those nations would probably be utterly decimated by Israel and Western nations in response. I believe your co worker's mouth was writing cheques that his nations couldn't cash, but who knows.

[Bwanatickey]

Abbas has no doubt been looking for a pretext to start intifada 3. If so I think Israel should take full control of the Temple Mount area once and for all and build the third temple there.

Not that easy.

That could start a very large war and if I know Israel the way I do, it could end up in nuclear exchange if all their Muslim neighbours attacked them simultaneously.

That Rocks, rock on with that idea, towards the final solution that Fundamentalist Christians all over the world believe in " Armageddon "

Where God will only save Christians from the aftermath.

The Holy Rock of insanity.

[Lissos]

The Holy Rock of insanity.

[japsportscarmad]

Abbas has no doubt been looking for a pretext to start intifada 3. If so I think Israel should take full control of the Temple Mount area once and for all and build the third temple there.

Not that easy.

That could start a very large war and if I know Israel the way I do, it could end up in nuclear exchange if all their Muslim neighbours attacked them simultaneously.

Abass can't start a war he can't even control Gazza in fact it's only recently he's even been allowed to visit by Hamas. And a few Chinese made AKs and Kyber Pass copies ain't going to cut the mustard against a modernised army such as Israel's at least not in a proper war. The problem at the moment for Israel is America at least until Obamas gone. The U.S. do not want to upset the Gulf states and Saudi as relying on them to fight IS which is ironic as they funded the bastards in the first place of course before America armed them by leaving lots of high quality weaponry with the Iraqi army who we know have no history off giving up and surrendering and his republican guard who did fight and were well trained are most likely now embedded in IS (Think Gulf wars 1,and 2 and how fast we got in).

No that nuclear option if available won't happen as a nuclear exchange has to have two parties with nukes. In any case if Israel really has nukes that is that aren't controlled by the U.S. Which we really don't know. But what your suggesting is that Israel's nuclear capability if any (after all their claimed Iron domes appears made out of plasticine if 1100 rockets a month are fired in), then they should if they have any have their nukes taken off them or face sanctions like Iran but more serious ones as they "allegedly" have a nuclear capability. Of course if or when Iran builds a viable weapon then all bets are off.

I would doubt if the butchers of IS and their other similarly barbaric fundamentalist cohorts would really care about starting a nuclear attack (it can't be an exchange as discussed) as we all know "Allah" will protect them and take "them off to paradise" no doubt with a horde of virgins or BMWs, Donkeys, goats or something else desired by the flesh. Additionally, depending on the type of nukes they do or do not have let's assume they have (But Sadam had no major chemical weapons and at least Tony Blair and good old George W claimed he had) they would in most cases destroy themselves as well, and probably trigger a NATO nuclear strike back as the fall out or nukes themselves would affect NATO members, and any strike against a NATO member is a strike against all, and several NATO members do have the capability to land a very big nuclear strike.

Israel I don't think will do much with the Temple Mount or the shit politically will really hit the fan both domestically and world wide and would lead to sanctions or other measures especially from the EU, however Israel due to its weapons technology could fight back with sanctions of their own which would hit the UK in particular. Furthermore, from what I see of the Temple Mount Israel spends a fortune on keeping it as it is and as open as possible. I'm not saying their ideal but to be fair on this issue they do deserve at least some credit (In my opinion).

Edited November 3, 2014 by japsportscarmad