Mumbo Jumbo Posted August 22, 2006 Share Posted August 22, 2006 I would like to backup my Computer ( Windows XP ) using an External HDD, to keep an image of the system, as a friend lost every thing when his HDD packed up , So heres my question... my computer has both USB and FireWire Connections, which connection would be best to use on an External HDD..? If I use an External HDD to back up my computer would I need any extra software to allow me to transfer info from my computer to the new external HDD..? I also being a newbie to computers don't really know what make and size of HDD to buy, my computer has a HDD of 250 GB , can any one please offer advice on this backup subject ... Thanks ............ Mumbo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GoodHeart Posted August 22, 2006 Share Posted August 22, 2006 I'll point you in the right direction by giving you some ideas about certain questions you need to ask. First off, in order to decide whether to go with a USB or a Firewire HDD check to see which speed yours' are. Once you know whether yours are USB 1.0 or 2.0 versus Firewire 400 versus 800. You'll have that issue sussed. Next-up the backup itself. You could just transfer files on your own to the new HDD. But it's also highly likely that several of the HDD's you consider will come with a seperate bit of software to automate the task of backing up. So, with that in mind here's two links that go into greater detail on that. Browse Backup Utilites and Backup Software to compare Good luck! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billzant Posted August 22, 2006 Share Posted August 22, 2006 Dear Forum, I saw this post on backup so I thought I would put a related question. I use a USB external hard drive 40GB. This is more than enough. I backup My Documents - and to find the size I right click and go to properties. To make the backup quicker I have split My Documents into perm and temp so that I only have to backup the temp - drag and drop onto the drive. Every so often I then amend the perm and copy that back into My Documents. messy but I haven't lost anything. I don't really know what the backup utilities do so I have avoided them. I believe they check the dates of the existing files to see if any changes have been made and then copy but I am not sure. At the samee time I have avoided buying software so have never investigated those. Any comments or recommendations? Hope you are keeping well, All the Best Bill Z Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lopburi3 Posted August 22, 2006 Share Posted August 22, 2006 There is one more very important question to ask yourself - do you want to recover with an operational system or not? Backups will not do that. You have to use one of the software disc clone type programs. With these if your main drive fails you can use your backup to recreate the entire disc and all programs should work as before. So you may end up wanting to do both. For my 20GB of main hard drive files it takes about 30 minutes for a weekly disc copy (I keep photos/music things on backup and CD's). If you just use backup be sure all your software programs are on it in the install versions so that you can use them to propagate a new drive. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silvero Posted August 22, 2006 Share Posted August 22, 2006 I use a system partition image - I use a BartPE boot CD with the DriveImageXML plugin to back it up. It's reliable, easy to use, and free too. Works great with USB, but I've not tried firewire so can't comment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billzant Posted August 22, 2006 Share Posted August 22, 2006 Dear Forum, Your suggestions are interesting. Silvero - You creata a data partition, and then use BartPE boot CD with the DriveImageXML plugin . Is this free software that backs up the whole of the partition? What did you use to create the partition? At one stage I used partition magic but I can remember having a few scares and gave up. Lopburi3 - I have looked a little into drive image software but got worried and gave up. If you don't know whether it works it is rather frightening to risk all your data (15-20years of personal stuff) on unknown software. If I have formatted C the computer can be up-and-running in a couple of hours and then another two or three weeks while I personalise. A long time, you might say, but I am sure it will give me what I want in the end. Further comments? Hope you are keeping well, All the Best Bill Z Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silvero Posted August 22, 2006 Share Posted August 22, 2006 Yes the software is free and it can backup and restore an entire partition. Re the partition, you already have a partition. Simply put, a partition is just a section of a hard drive that Windows will display as a drive letter, like C:. For example, if you have a 40Gb hard drive, and Windows tells you that the drive is about 40Gb in total size, then you have one 40Gb partition. I have a 120Gb hard drive with a 40Gb partition and an 80Gb partition - Windows reports this as a C: drive with 40Gb and E: with 80Gb. The software just takes everything on the partition, which for many people is the whole drive, and copies an image of it onto another drive. It is not a bootable image, but you can browse the files from the image, extract individual files from it, restore the whole image to a drive. All wizard/gui driven. A raw image and compression is also supported. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charma Posted August 22, 2006 Share Posted August 22, 2006 There are degrees of safety in this situation. The problem with backing up to a partition is that if there is a major physical failure of the drive, you could lose the lot. Next level would be say manually backing up important documents to either a separate drive or DVD/CD's. This is more labour intensive and would not restore system data. It also relies on you remembering which docs you have created/amended. After that you can use various back-up utilities to save documents only or entire system data. This can be done to an external HD or DVD/CD (using multiple discs). Next level is using the utility to back-up to a RAID hard drive. This can be various formats, the safest being a mirrored drive. This means that your data will be saved in two indentical drives (mirror) and if one fails, the alternative will be utilised giving the best possible protection. I use an external buffalo networked drive which comes with it's own backup software. One click of a button saves my entire system on to two mirrored drives. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silvero Posted August 22, 2006 Share Posted August 22, 2006 Quite right, that's why I backup to an external USB HDD. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
britmaveric Posted August 22, 2006 Share Posted August 22, 2006 Also if you are going to image - suggest you create a base image with OS and the software after a reformat, so you have a completely clean system. Then add all of your necessary files back and create another image. Make sure you test if the image actually works. Worst thing would be to restore and realize it wasn't any good. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Reimar Posted August 22, 2006 Share Posted August 22, 2006 There is a german website: http://www.miray.de/home/index.html where you can find HDClone. This software let you also clone a HDD via USB pp. Check it out. I personally use this software and other from ACRONIS at: http://www.zcronis.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
svenivan Posted August 22, 2006 Share Posted August 22, 2006 Hi guys, I used an extra HDD connected to USB for a year and backed up my photos (3 years of them), my music (more than 12000 songs) and a software system I have written. 4 weeks ago this extra HDD did not work, ('the device could not be recognized etc'). I tried it on two other computers with same result. A week later I went on holiday for 11 days, I unplugged my computer from everything. Came back, pluged it in and it did not start. Took it to the shop and they said my harddrive had krasched. When they wanted to send it to BKK to get a new harddrive I told them that I wanted the old disk back too. I had to pay for it but mai pen rai. Now my question: Where can I find someone that can retrieve my data from my now two corrupted harddrives? Someone got an idea? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Reimar Posted August 22, 2006 Share Posted August 22, 2006 Hi guys, I used an extra HDD connected to USB for a year and backed up my photos (3 years of them), my music (more than 12000 songs) and a software system I have written. 4 weeks ago this extra HDD did not work, ('the device could not be recognized etc'). I tried it on two other computers with same result. A week later I went on holiday for 11 days, I unplugged my computer from everything. Came back, pluged it in and it did not start. Took it to the shop and they said my harddrive had krasched. When they wanted to send it to BKK to get a new harddrive I told them that I wanted the old disk back too. I had to pay for it but mai pen rai. Now my question: Where can I find someone that can retrieve my data from my now two corrupted harddrives? Someone got an idea? Send me a PM or e-mail Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZZZ Posted August 22, 2006 Share Posted August 22, 2006 If you only want to backup one directory, say My Documents: Create a new Briefcase on the desktop, drag or copy the MY Documents directory to the Briefcase, copy the Briefcase to the external USB drive. Any time you would like to do a backup just select update All in the briefcase menu on the external drive. All files that have been changed since last update will be updated and all new files will be copied, it may not be able to handle some files like database files but it will tell you whats been done and not done. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mumbo Jumbo Posted August 22, 2006 Author Share Posted August 22, 2006 Just wondering has any one tried this ...... Karen's Replicator Automatically backup files, directories, even entire drives! Karen's Replicator copies selected files from one drive/folder to another. Source and Destination folders can reside anywhere on your network. Options include repeated copies at intervals as short as a few minutes, or as long as several months, copy only files that have changed, and the replication of file deletions. New features allow you to specify which files should not be copied, and also which days a file should be skipped! can be found at .....http://www.karenware.com/powertools/ptreplicator.asp Thanks ..........mumbo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silvero Posted August 22, 2006 Share Posted August 22, 2006 Svenivan, if an external USB HDD is 'not recognized' it could be the HDD itself or the USB case that is faulty, you say the shop told you the HDD crashed, but have you checked yourself? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
svenivan Posted August 22, 2006 Share Posted August 22, 2006 Svenivan, if an external USB HDD is 'not recognized' it could be the HDD itself or the USB case that is faulty, you say the shop told you the HDD crashed, but have you checked yourself? They checked in my shop and put the HDD in a another case but with the same result. So I assume it is the HDD that is the problem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
z21rhd Posted August 23, 2006 Share Posted August 23, 2006 I would like to backup my Computer ( Windows XP ) using an External HDD, to keep an image of the system, as a friend lost every thing when his HDD packed up , So heres my question... my computer has both USB and FireWire Connections, which connection would be best to use on an External HDD..? If I use an External HDD to back up my computer would I need any extra software to allow me to transfer info from my computer to the new external HDD..? I also being a newbie to computers don't really know what make and size of HDD to buy, my computer has a HDD of 250 GB , can any one please offer advice on this backup subject ... Thanks ............ Mumbo Hello M, As you have a 2 part question, one dealing with hardware and the other dealing with software :- Lets look at Hardware being the most important : External HDD - first establish what you have in your existing hardware i.e. Do you have 2.0 USB capability (this is important for the transfer speed to the external HDD. To find out go to Start>>Settings>>Control Panel>>System>>Hardware>>Device Manager>>USB Controllers>> look for "USB 2.0 Enhanced Host Controller") ans = HAVE . Do you have UPS power supply, ans = HAVE. Next If you have both of these, then next you need to select the best Enclosure for the HDD. The type you should look for is one that has its own independent power supply (the power supplied by an USB port is NOT adequate to drive an external HDD) The independent power supply that comes with the HDD enclosure is a small transformer/converter - it steps down 220V AC to 12V DC and 5 V DC @ 2A. The Enclosure + its PS retails in Thailand for around 1,200 Baht. Next You say that your computer has a 250 GB HDD. Is this a single drive ? or the GB sum of more than 1 drive? Is your PC a desktop or a laptop ? IF it is a desktop or a laptop with only drive of 250Gb installed. then you definately need a secure place to store your collected data and images. Lets have a look at what the average person uses his computer for :- e.g. Email , Internet, Spreadsheets, Documents, Pictures, Music and Video. It is because of the last 3 that one needs 250GB, exclude those then 250GB is too big ! Nowadays , Hardware Gurus are recommending a Desktop setup along the following lines :- Single HDD on the IDE cable to the MB - this containing the Operating System Program and all other software programs (If this crashes permanently you will have lost very little in the way of data - maybe stuff that was still in the My Documents folder) 80 GB will probably suffice. In external enclosures you would have one or more 80GB HDD (as many as 128 HDD's) One of which could be a clone of the internal drive, any or all the others would contain the data etc in partitioned or none partitioned drives. Next Installing/Connecting the type of Enclosed HDD and its PS to the Destop :- After inserting the HDD into the enclosure - connect its power supply to the UPS (not to the Thai wall socket - obviating power surges etc) then connect the 12V lead from the power supply to the HDD Enclosure. Connect the Enclosure's USB cable to the Desktop's USP socket. Switch on Desktop - Switch on Enclosure = Bingo ( if you have Win XP then plug and play will find the new drive and recognise it) Next To Clone your 250GB drive, you really need another 250GB drive. However, if you want to store your data etc in external drives - this is easy - get a program like Novatix's ExplorerPlus (Nothing to do with Microsoft's Win EX) this will allow you to seamlessly transfer/copy move data etc from one drive to another. Caveat Storing your data on HDD's wherever they are, has the same intrinsic risk - they fail, they crash, Back up your data onto CDs, DVDs etc - keep them in a dark, dry, clean place and you should still have them in 10+ years. Therefore to answer you question/s accurately - need to know exactly what hardware you and what you do with it . regards Suandaao Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
z21rhd Posted August 23, 2006 Share Posted August 23, 2006 Svenivan, if an external USB HDD is 'not recognized' it could be the HDD itself or the USB case that is faulty, you say the shop told you the HDD crashed, but have you checked yourself? They checked in my shop and put the HDD in a another case but with the same result. So I assume it is the HDD that is the problem. Nothing Wrong with the drive - the External drive has to be initiated Go to you Windows help, check out initiating HDDs - if you need more help come back to me Suandaao Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silvero Posted August 23, 2006 Share Posted August 23, 2006 svenivan, I would remove the HDD from the case and install it in your PC, the first question is whether it is recognised by the BIOS. If it is recognised, and spins up then you can use software to try to get whatever data is there off the drive and attempt recovery. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mumbo Jumbo Posted August 23, 2006 Author Share Posted August 23, 2006 HI Suandaao , Thanks for your reply..... great Info First....yes I do have USB -2 connections on my computer Do you have UPS power supply ..... Yes You say that your computer has a 250 GB HDD. Is this a single drive ? or the GB sum of more than 1 drive..... No I have only one HDD on my computer Is your PC a desktop or a laptop ....... Its a PC Mainly used for emails , web surfing & photo storage Just a few questions ( from a computer newbie ) ... I was under the impression that if you buy an external HDD it comes complete with an Enclosure and power supply ..? , is it possible to buy an External HDD unit ready to go...? or is the buying of a seperate Enclosure plus a HDD the best way to go ..? Can you recommend a make of HDD...? and any idea please about Price..? I live out in the sticks so it will mean a long trip to go and buy the things I need, in your Caveat you say .....Storing your data on HDD's wherever they are, has the same intrinsic risk - they fail, they crash, Back up your data onto CDs, DVDs etc - keep them in a dark, dry, clean place and you should still have them in 10+ years. again being a newbie can you please advise me on an easy to do the Backup onto CD', DVD ...? ( I am Running Windows XP Media Edition ) Thanks ............. Mumbo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
calibanjr. Posted August 23, 2006 Share Posted August 23, 2006 I use Norton Ghost, does a complete mirror and incremental backups with compression, never had any problems. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gary A Posted August 24, 2006 Share Posted August 24, 2006 Sometime back I was touting the built in backup program in Windows XP Pro. I was using it regularly and recently had occasion to test it. I was stunned that it would NOT boot up from the floppy. The last part of the process requires you to insert a floppy disk to boot from if you have a problem. Fortunately I was able to repair my hard drive and lost nothing BUT it is obvious that I will indeed be looking for another way to back up my hard drive. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ken Posted August 24, 2006 Share Posted August 24, 2006 ......Can you recommend a make of HDD...? and any idea please about Price..? I live out in the sticks so it will mean a long trip to go and buy the things I need, in your Caveat you say .....Storing your data on HDD's wherever they are, has the same intrinsic risk - they fail, they crash, Back up your data onto CDs, DVDs etc - keep them in a dark, dry, clean place and you should still have them in 10+ years. again being a newbie can you please advise me on an easy to do the Backup onto CD', DVD ...? ( I am Running Windows XP Media Edition ) Thanks ............. Mumbo Mumbo: If you are "shopping" in Korat.....I bought 160GB Maxtor Hard Drive for 3,400 Baht at IT Plaza. Also bought a USB enclosure with powersupply, etc for 1,100 Baht. The shop installed the Hard Drive in the enclosure for me. I use "True Image" software to backup and make a complete image of my PC computers. It works well and because I sometimes like to "play", on occasion I've have had to use my backup to restore my systems. True Image has never failed me. You can also use True Image to back up on CD's DVD if you are so inclined. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mumbo Jumbo Posted August 24, 2006 Author Share Posted August 24, 2006 Thanks ..... Ken, I am going over to Korat next week and will have a look around the IT Plaza , I am also going to look for genuine ..True Image & NOD 32 , at the same time . Thanks ............. Mumbo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
astral Posted August 24, 2006 Share Posted August 24, 2006 I have my hard disk partitioned so it is quite easy to just copy files from each partition to folders names D, E etc on the backup disk. Subsequently I use Filesync to copy the files that have been charged or added. I have not experimented with an Image of the C partition, but I have friends who have done so successfully, using TrueImage. I use 300GB Seagate disk. It is a real usable 300Gb, not a short measure. I would never use a Western Digital disk after having two crash in succession. Yes they were replaced under guarantee, first one then the second............ but I would not trust any data to the WD disk again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mumbo Jumbo Posted August 24, 2006 Author Share Posted August 24, 2006 Thanks ...astral Your comment ......I have my hard disk partitioned so it is quite easy to just copy files from each partition to folders names D, E etc on the backup disk can you just outline for this newbie how to do this..? also your comment .......... use 300GB Seagate disk. It is a real usable 300Gb, not a short measure What do you mean by short measure ....? Thanks ........... Mumbo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mumbo Jumbo Posted August 24, 2006 Author Share Posted August 24, 2006 MAXTOR Harddisk 250GB 7200/SATA150/16Mb Buffer SKU: SKU16406 Harddisk Maxtor 250GB 7200 รอบ ระบบ SerialATA 150Mhz หน่วยความจำ Buffer 16 Mb ..........Our price: 3,591 Bath MAXTOR Harddisk 250GB 7200/SATA2/16Mb Buffer SKU: SKU7005 Harddisk Maxtor 250GB 7200 รอบ ระบบ SerialATA 2 หน่วยความจำ Buffer 16 Mb ...................Our price: 3,493 Bath Maxtor Harddisk 250GB 7200/133/8Mb Buffer SKU: SKU8969 Harddisk Maxtor 250GB 7200รอบ ระบบ UltraATA 133Mhz หน่วยความจำ Buffer 8Mb ................ Our price: 3,394 Bath Can some please explain the differences in the above HDD's ...EG SATA150 SATA2 Ultra ATA 16Mb Buffer 8Mb Buffer Thanks ................ Mumbo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tywais Posted August 24, 2006 Share Posted August 24, 2006 (edited) Can some please explain the differences in the above HDD's ...EG SATA150 SATA2 Ultra ATA 16Mb Buffer 8Mb Buffer Thanks ................ Mumbo SATA150 is Serial ATA 150MB/Sec transfer rate SATA2 = SATA300 or 300MB/Sec transfer rate Ultra ATA = Parallel ATA 16MB/8MB buffer is the output prefetch cache to speed up the transfer from the platter rotation (slow) to the computer buss (fast). Most external USB enclosures support only PATA (parallel ATA) and not SATA (serial ATA) so be careful to choose a drive and enclosure that are compatible. So the Ultra ATA drive with a USB enclosure (parallel ATA bus inside) will do the job fine. PS. Better to choose a USB or USB + firewire enclosure then a firewire only. Allows you the ability to move the drive to nearly any computer since USB is predominant. Edited August 24, 2006 by tywais Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
z21rhd Posted August 24, 2006 Share Posted August 24, 2006 MAXTOR Harddisk 250GB 7200/SATA150/16Mb Buffer SKU: SKU16406 Harddisk Maxtor 250GB 7200 รอบ ระบบ SerialATA 150Mhz หน่วยความจำ Buffer 16 Mb ..........Our price: 3,591 Bath MAXTOR Harddisk 250GB 7200/SATA2/16Mb Buffer SKU: SKU7005 Harddisk Maxtor 250GB 7200 รอบ ระบบ SerialATA 2 หน่วยความจำ Buffer 16 Mb ...................Our price: 3,493 Bath Maxtor Harddisk 250GB 7200/133/8Mb Buffer SKU: SKU8969 Harddisk Maxtor 250GB 7200รอบ ระบบ UltraATA 133Mhz หน่วยความจำ Buffer 8Mb ................ Our price: 3,394 Bath Can some please explain the differences in the above HDD's ...EG SATA150 SATA2 Ultra ATA 16Mb Buffer 8Mb Buffer Thanks ................ Mumbo HI MJ, As you tell me that you use you PC for surfing the web - check out this URL for the Guru's answers to your questions :- http://www.pcstats.com/glossary.cfm What ever type you buy make sure that it is compatable with your existing hardware - don' t leave the shop until everything works hunkydory. (As an aside - I would buy 2 enclosures with their own power supplies and 2 new hard drives each no more than around 120GB, These I would have the technician initialise and partition each with 3 equal partitions - this way you are not keeping all your eggs in one basket - each partition is used for different categories of data - etcc....) Suandaau Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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