Visa Crackdown Brings Expulsion Threat To Expats

[unbiasbob]

agreed that mai krap's post was a welcome one here. we need to get that perspective because people are getting smacked in the face with it although many persons here in the forum deny that this is taking place. mai krap will be referred to as a scruffy scum no doubt, who mouths off to embassy officials when he tries to get his tourist visas. the door is being slammed in the face of persons who don't fit the precise mold of each visa requirement. these requirements leave a great many in the cold who lack age, marriage or financial qualifications. and what do you know, the inablity to open a bank account on a tourist visa has reared its ugly head one more time. never fear mai krap, the experts here who opened their accounts years ago say no prob getting one open. how on earth would they know???

[possom]

q lets get some things straight ! i do not fit the precise mould of visa requirements . am well under 50 ,not married , but do have bank account ,opened last year on tourist visa . would suggest being polite as opposed to being abusive to any official in thailand ,dress smartly ask not demand and things CAN work . SO I DO KNOW . i am not trying to be an ###### ,am just saying it can be done , and attitude towards the authority in thailand is important when dealing with them . IT IS THEIR COUNTRY !!!!!!!!!!! LIKE IT OR NOT !!!!!!!!!

[pschef]

Just to put this topic to rights, yes mostly people opened bank accounts a few years ago. Now the reqiurement is a non O visa, and be registered for TAX. End of story

[unbiasbob]

thank you pschef, it's good to know the truth finally on bank accounts. i knew that the current catch 22 was a recent development like all the other visa nightmares

[dr_Pat_Pong]

man... keeping a healthy marriage is hard already, now we're talking intercultural marriage...and THIS too?!?!   No wonder Nana is such a hot spot.  

anyway, british accent is sexy, give them a little break.  ;-)

Don't tell us ... tell Dr Thaksin or the Immigration heavies in Soi Suan Phlu. They make the rules.

What isn't clear from this article is whether or not it is necessary to pony up an "additional" 400k thb whenever you renew your non immigrant visa. I would put it past them to require another each renewal.

You'll need to show the funds at each renewal. It does look as though those already on extended visa's with a wife/family will only need 200,000.

[flackjacket]

Well what a welcome back to Thailand after 8 months medical treatment in the real world. I personally feel that the Government has shaken the wrong branch of the tree, the majority of people with very limited funds are backpackers and the likes, not forgetting the drop outs. Of course Mr. T does not have to worry about social security for the abandoned wives, unlike other more advanced countries. Still never mind, as long as those in power are still getting their kickbacks then all is OK. Some foreigners have invested all their cash in building a good home for themselves and their wives to retire in. Funny the PM does not comment about all that cash that has flowed in to Thailand over the years. Well I suppose that we will just have to sit back and wait for the next extortionate bombshell.

[taxidriver]

Dr pp,You said those already on extended visas will show 200,000bt.I'll be extending my first non o in June.So 200,000 or 400'000 for me?

p.s I tried to include your text(quote) but it didn't work.Stuffed if i know what happened.

[pschef]

Dr pp,You said those already on extended visas will show 200,000bt.I'll be extending my first non o in June.So 200,000 or 400'000 for me?

p.s I tried to include your text(quote) but it didn't work.Stuffed if i know what happened.

Just click on the quote button and wait Taxidriver,

then rules are still not written in stone. Nowhere is there any mention of grandad rules, in the official paper posted on this forum. It seems the rules only state what is required now, then what will be the requirment after July. We need a clear answer from immigration about that, I guess we must wait and see. I will ask when I report at the end of this month, but I am sure it will be like pulling teeth.

[Axel]

    To make any comparison between getting a U.S. VISA and a THAI VISA is just flat stupid,,,,,,,,

q THEN CALL ME STUPID ,the comparison is that FOREIGNERS WANT THEM . what makes you think the u.s is so <deleted>***NG special ?????????????

My point is very easy. You come here on a visit and get a 30-days'-stay then a Thai should get the same in your country.

Reciprocal it is called.

[roamer]

Can we clear up the legalities of this. There is no international law that proscribes against any nation setting its own entry/residence/ requirements, in fact international law recognizes the right of any nation to set its own requirements in these fields. You can regard that as unfair, but its life.

[roamer]

Follow along those lines then recipreocity becomes expensive...remind me what do we pay for a 30 day tourist visa to Thailand ? served up at the airport. What do Thais pay for the same to the EU ? you don't need to add in the extra costs of attending the embassy from Chiang Mai say..............

[dr_Pat_Pong]

Can we clear up the legalities of this. There is no international law that proscribes against any nation setting its own entry/residence/ requirements, in fact international law recognizes the right of any nation to set its own requirements in these fields. You can regard that as unfair, but its life.

Why on earth would is be seen as unfair for a sovereign nation to make its own laws. Every nation on earth does so.

[Mai Krap]

STUPID VISA TRICKS,,,,,,,,,,,,, I will simplify this..... It is stupid to compare getting a VISA from a country where you will most likely spend and lose money to getting a VISA where you will most likely earn and gain money.....

I for one try not to break laws and Im considered honest by friends in THAILAND and abroad,,,, The point being it would be nice and dreamy to just go down and give the guy at IMMAGRATION 500 baht every month and have my VISA stamped and in the process use only one page of my visa instead of three. It would just be nice if someone would use a commen sense aproach to the VISA rules which we have to live by instead of a system where everyone feels as though they are being ABUSED and RIPPED OFF..... This current system will not get rid of the people the government wants to get rid of anyway,,,, It only discourages honest people of middle class incomes who dont wish to lie, cheat, and steal, forge documents, lease your own property back to yourself, or have your enemys whacked at a discounted rate....

[dr_Pat_Pong]

Dr pp,You said those already on extended visas will show 200,000bt.I'll be extending my first non o in June.So 200,000 or 400'000 for me?

p.s I tried to include your text(quote) but it didn't work.Stuffed if i know what happened.

It should be ok at 200,000 but as you know, Immigration officials can sometimes be a law unto themselves. Good luck.

[Richard W]

That leaves him with 7,500 Baht per month upon which to support himself and his wife. Unless Mr and Mrs Francis reside in a free hovel, live from hand to mouth, fatten up cockroaches so they can have some meat on special occasions and otherwise 'live with nature', they must be living to a standard that would cause the most unfussy of derelicts to complain before moving on.

I know of a rural Thai family consisting of husband, wife, new baby, and four teenage children from previous marriages, making 5 children in all. There is some help from an ex-spouse, so let us say 4 children for the purposes of calculation. The husband's annual income is no more than 30,000 baht - he is an orchard farmer.

What therefore must the wife's annual income be?

Or do most rural Thai homes count as hovels? In that case I can well believe that the Francis's live in a 'free hovel'; the problem is what do they do when it starts to fall down? Will they collect hand me down components from the local wat when it needs to be rebuilt?

I didn't believe the husband's income at first, but I have a Thai legal document that clearly gives it as an annual income.

P.S. I thought I'd heard some rural family's incomes cited as 5,500 baht a month.

[Richard W]

My wife has got the right, marrying me, to legally stay in my home country permanently and to get citizenship in 3 years. She hasn't had to meet ANY financial requirement to get her spouse visa (got it in 5 days) and if she weren't working (she is) she would definitely be a burden to my country (contrary to farangs in TH) since we have got a huge welfare state over here and she has all the rights to benefit from it just like any other Italian citizen.

Why is it?  Because the basic human right to have a family and to be with one's family _prevails_ (and rightly so bloody ######!).

BTW, I married her near the end of my 2.5+ years stay in LOS and I was obviously NOT working at the time. I hadn't to show I had the means to support a wife. The basic human right to live with your beloved is not a privilege of the rich where I am from.

Maybe someone could find a job for Mr Francis in Italy? If they did, he could get in under EU rules and then claim political asylum.

As things stand, I don't see Mrs Francis getting any sort of visa for the UK. The Italian immigration rules are very generous, far more so than British rules.

[BKK-Bangkapi]

...Swiss rules are generous too. Just for your curiosity, here is the process for a fiance of a Swiss citizen (male or female no difference) wanting to marry in Switzerland.

1) The Swiss fiance get a marriage form from the district and send it to the fiance in Thailand

2) The Thai fiance get a birth certificate, a single certificate, a residence certificate translated and bring them with the form to the Swiss embassy. There, sign the form. The embassy will send all the papers to Switzerland for checking. The fiance should then go to a special branch of police in Bangkok to get a police record (it takes 3 weeks to get) and send it to the fiance in Switzerland.

3) Once all papers arrived in Switzerland (1-2 weeks after), the Swiss fiance is called by the district to go there with single and residence ceritifcate and sign the marriage form there. The district will then issue a certificate to show that the Thai fiance will marry in Switzerland.

4) The swiss fiance just bring this certificate to immigration and sign that he/she will take care of his foreign fiance while in Switzerland. No financial requirements are made (I asked why and they said because it's a human right to stay with your wife or husband, no matter the finance). On the other hand, they want to get the police record of the Thai fiance as they can refuse a serious crime offender. Immigration will then instruct the Swiss embassy in Thailand to issue a marriage Visa to the Thai fiance (issued within 1 week).

5) The Thai fiance come to Switzerland and marry at the district. After this, the Thai fiance will get a RESIDENCE permit to stay in Switzerland valid for one year. This permit allows the holder to work at any place just like a Swiss citizen. No category of work are forbidden. Can change job anytime. No additional permit is required to work. Every year it needs to be renewed but it's just automatic (go to pick it up)

6) After 5 years in Switzerland, the Thai fiance can apply for Swiss citizenship. Quite automatic for someone married to a Swiss. Process taking 1-2 years. After 5 years can apply to get a permanent residence permit which allows to buy land in Switzerland. This is given automatically as well and takes about 2-3 months.

Quite different from Thailand isn't it? Maybe it's too generous....

Cheers.

[natee1]

[

We will never be able to change what the Thai government wants. What they want is far from normal considering where we are. It is unrealistic and unreasonable. If you look at the "Big Mac" index, you will see my reasoning. If you cannot see the unreasonableness of it you are clearly not well read. Just as closing the bars at midnight was, just as the Thai elite card, just as the asian crises a few years ago. All great ideas half though through.

And please for a forum that has people such as Sunbelt Asia advertising businesses, I find it unprofessional for a moderator to be so uncouth at the best of times with poster's who are angry and frustrated. Where is you diplomacy?

By the way, could someone please show me where foreigners become a burden to the Thai government.

I agree the new regulations or rather the implementation are not fair to a lot of us living here.

What is the "big mac" index?

Foreigner becoming a burden, to the gobvernment or the country and its people:

Just read some posts in this forum such as the 'shall we send the misses to work her old trade when the cash runs out' type thread....Which government would welcome people who openly discuss the advantages of being a pimp, and then complain about the strict visaregulations ?

Furthermore, as immigration states, they want to know where the money comes from, catch people who work illegally or gain profit form criminal activities.

Don't you agree people pimping their wives, running businesses without licence or selling drugs in tourist resorts are a burden to the state?

Ironically though, increasing the financial visa requirements does nothing to help catch these kind of individuals, rather makes life difficult for the majority of ordinary folks who do their best to support themselves and their Thai dependants over here.

[natee1]

WHAT A CROCK OF KRAPP,,,,,,,,After recently being told that I would no longer be able to get 60 day tourist VISAs unless I deposited 200,000 baht in a thai bank..... My reply was It is my understanding that on a tourist VISA one is not allowed to have a bank account??????? So then I asked what to do when I get married in july and I was told I would need to deposit 375,000 baht if I was married just to get a tourist VISA of 60 days..... Then was told I can get a letter from the U.S. EMBASSY that says I can support myself .....

Sounds familiar. Were you told in Vientiane by any chance? Seems to me they never read their own regulations. Donate some tissues for them to clean their glasses...

[DoubleTrouble]

I wonder if the government realizes that most of the expats that fall into the

"not enough money" category are English teachers. English teachers help Thai people learn English at a reasonable price. At the moment most teachers don't have work permits because most Schools or language centers can't/won't spend

the necessary time and money to get their teachers legitimately set up. A lot of teachers work several part time jobs at the same time, so often times schools would have a hard time giving a work permit to a teacher that only works 6 hours a week for them, but in fact the teacher is working another 34 hours a week at other places to make ends meet.

The bottom line is that the Thai who wants to learn English to get ahead is the one who will suffer. If schools are forced to give work permits to every teacher they employ, then they will pass the extra cost on to the customer, the Thais.

Sad, but true, thats what all my english teacher friends tell me.

[DoubleTrouble]

Why not just be honest and say "Hey farang, if you're not a millionaire, get outta here".

I couldn't have said it better.......seems like thats just the way it is.....

[DoubleTrouble]

6) After 5 years in Switzerland, the Thai fiance can apply for Swiss citizenship. Quite automatic for someone married to a Swiss. Process taking 1-2 years. After 5 years can apply to get a permanent residence permit which allows to buy land in Switzerland. This is given automatically as well and takes about 2-3 months.

Quite different from Thailand isn't it? Maybe it's too generous....

Cheers.

Thats complete garbage, the Swiss don't dole out citizenships like a Burger King pumps out burgers. Check again.

[BKK-Bangkapi]

Thats complete garbage, the Swiss don't dole out citizenships like a Burger King pumps out burgers. Check again.

DoubleTrouble: you are quite right in a way, it depends on the Canton and the Community where the application is made. In mine, all applicants who I know (6) were given Swiss nationality as spouse of Swiss citizen after 2 years max and none were rejected. The person is of course subject to an inquiry and needs to provide some references. If the applicant is not a trouble maker, knows one of the national language it is quite ok. But in some communities it is subject to a local poll and it's tougher, especially for middle-east and Ex-Yugoslavia peoples.

BTW I guess that calling someone's posting as "garbage" won't make you a lot of friends, think about it.

Cheers.

[unbiasbob]

...Swiss rules are generous too. Just for your curiosity, here is the process for a fiance of a Swiss citizen (male or female no difference) wanting to marry in Switzerland.

1) The Swiss fiance get a marriage form from the district and send it to the fiance in Thailand

2) The Thai fiance get a birth certificate, a single certificate, a residence certificate translated and bring them with the form to the Swiss embassy. There, sign the form. The embassy will send all the papers to Switzerland for checking. The fiance should then go to a special branch of police in Bangkok to get a police record (it takes 3 weeks to get) and send it to the fiance in Switzerland.

3) Once all papers arrived in Switzerland (1-2 weeks after), the Swiss fiance is called by the district to go there with single and residence ceritifcate and sign the marriage form there. The district will then issue a certificate to show that the Thai fiance will marry in Switzerland.

4) The swiss fiance just bring this certificate to immigration and sign that he/she will take care of his foreign fiance while in Switzerland. No financial requirements are made (I asked why and they said because it's a human right to stay with your wife or husband, no matter the finance). On the other hand, they want to get the police record of the Thai fiance as they can refuse a serious crime offender. Immigration will then instruct the Swiss embassy in Thailand to issue a marriage Visa to the Thai fiance (issued within 1 week).

5) The Thai fiance come to Switzerland and marry at the district. After this, the Thai fiance will get a RESIDENCE permit to stay in Switzerland valid for one year. This permit allows the holder to work at any place just like a Swiss citizen. No category of work are forbidden. Can change job anytime. No additional permit is required to work. Every year it needs to be renewed but it's just automatic (go to pick it up)

6) After 5 years in Switzerland, the Thai fiance can apply for Swiss citizenship. Quite automatic for someone married to a Swiss. Process taking 1-2 years. After 5 years can apply to get a permanent residence permit which allows to buy land in Switzerland. This is given automatically as well and takes about 2-3 months.

Quite different from Thailand isn't it? Maybe it's too generous....

Cheers.

Switzerland's a whacked out place dude that I would bet no one here gives a rats behind about

[FIGJAM]

As things stand, I don't see Mrs Francis getting any sort of visa for the UK.  The Italian immigration rules are very generous, far more so than British rules.

You are probably right but there is something really ######ed up in our foreign politics. Last year 35000-40000 Thais have visited UK but only 6000-8000 Italy.

Lack of applicants? Not really!

The ONLY Italian officer (+ 3 Thai secretaries) at the Visa Office of the Italian Embassy (now on a 1 month holiday!) rejects the vast majority of tourist visa requests! (to an unbelievable point, most probably crossing the letter of the law)

Here there is now a group action of citizens which is trying to bring the matter to the attention of the Italian govt (BTW any help or advice they can get here?).

Malaysians for example don't need visa and, above all, certain nationals who make a lot of trouble in Italy (like Albanians, Moroccans and Tunisians) seem to have very little problems getting here.

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Religious rants removed

/Admin

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I read an article from the Bangkok Post (16 April) talking about some boycott threats from Thai Travel Agencies to countries like mine with heavy hassles for Thais requesting tourist visa, anybody know more about this?

What I was talking about (and which made you think it's easy to get to Italy for Thais) was *spouse* visa NOT *tourist* visa.

Spouse visa are a legal right for both the Italian citizen and the foreign one (and are so granted very quickly -3/5 days- and even free of charge), tourist visa is defined by Italian (and I think EU) laws as a "legit interest of the foreign citizen usually granted to those who qualify in the name of good international relationships" (freely translated from Italian).