"ISIL claims responsibility" for Orlando gay nightclub shooting that left 50 dead

[MZurf]

Too bad he had such easy access to assault weapons.

You know, they keep saying it is an assault weapon he used. But, while we have lots of data on him, his parents, his ex-wife, I have not actually seen anything about the weapon.

But my main point to you is that this guy worked his way up as a security guard. Obviously people in that sort of work, no matter how strict the gun laws, I think they will have access to high powered guns. So while you are suggesting that lax gun laws were a major contributor to this event, I don't think that is really the case here.

These people will find a way to access some weapon of mass destruction. Even if it means working for some years in a position in security, or at the nuclear plant, etc.

"You know, they keep saying it is an assault weapon he used. But, while we have lots of data on him, his parents, his ex-wife, I have not actually seen anything about the weapon."

There is no way he could have killed 50 people in a short period of time unless he was using an automatic or semi-automatic weapon. Those kind of weapons are not for hunting animals, their only function is to kill large number of people.

"But my main point to you is that this guy worked his way up as a security guard. Obviously people in that sort of work, no matter how strict the gun laws, I think they will have access to high powered guns. So while you are suggesting that lax gun laws were a major contributor to this event, I don't think that is really the case here."

I doubt if most security guards have access to automatic and semi-automatic weapons, but even if he did and used a weapon supplied by his employer doesn't mean that there shouldn't be strict gun laws. There is no logic in claiming that since there occasionally are massacres perpetrated by people who have access to assault weapons in their work then those weapons should be made available to the public.

he was using a semi-auto which is easily purchased anywhere. and yes, people do use semi -autos for hunting

"he was using a semi-auto which is easily purchased anywhere."

That's kind of my point.

"and yes, people do use semi -autos for hunting"

Semi-autos are not widely used for hunting anything other than humans. And there is no hunter that can't do without it.

[FinChin67]

I wonder if this is ever going to happen... but it would mean that the muslims need to go against quran and I do not see that happening anytime soon.

Jasser: Muslims Must Declare War on Radical Islam

http://insider.foxnews.com/2016/06/12/dr-zuhdi-jasser-orlando-nightclub-shooting-muslims-political-islam

I have been arguing that they need to do exactly this for some time now. Take to the streets, denounce them at every turn, provide no support or safe harbor, make them feel like absolute pariahs, in their own lands.

And if this does not happen, I am afraid moderate minded people around the world are going to interpret this as complicity, and support. And at a given point in time, there is a strong possibility that the entire Western world will rise up against the entire Muslim world. It would be the 4th crusade. A friend of mine argues that it already started with aftermath of 9/11. The slaughter of hundreds of thousands of women and children in Iraq, during our campaign there, for example.

It is absolutely incumbent upon every Muslim man, woman, and child to speak out against these murderous, gang raping fools. In a very loud, and a very unified manner. Same applies to the leaders in the Middle East. And the clerics. I realize some are already speaking out. And the Western media shows very little of that, as it does not fit the stereotype that is being promoted. But, if the outcry is loud enough, it is going to get attention.

Problem is that when they do this they speak against quran/muhammed/islam. The very thing they can't do safely anywhere. Women are already harassed in Europe for not wearing a veil etc. and not forgetting sharia patrols in UK & Germany. I believe the 4th crusade has started and it's going to intensify dramatically as more refugees are coming to EU and elsewhere.

[joeyg]

Sadly, the people get the government they deserve... In the future the real shortage will be body bags. This is not happening by happen stance. It is happening by design. The next attack is being planned as we type under the auspices of world leaders...

[TKDfella]

I don't want to debate the world's problems with extremist views. I just wonder what happens to a young person to make them want to kill others! I remember when I was a kid going around with a couple of cap gun's, going to the local waste ground (WWII bombsite actually) having a game with friends. But I didn't carry that fantasy over into later years, and as far as I know. neither did my friends. Is it possible that such a childhood fantasy does continue on and that's where it becomes real? No, I'm not suggesting that such a person has a 'normal' psychological 'excuse' (whatever that is). That is, some people grow up to be 'Al Capone', the Krays' and so on only today there is the 'terrorist' outlet too which allows them to prey on their own kind. Just what kind of 'enjoyment' could this shooter have had to kill 50 people. R.I.P and condolences to families.

[augustwest]

Sell guns only to atheists. The only group of people who actually think!

If atheism is the absence of belief in gods, then many Buddhists are, indeed, atheists. Buddhism is not about either believing or not believing in God or gods. Rather, the historical Buddha taught that believing in gods was not useful for those seeking to realize enlightenment.

That would include most Thai people who are Buddhist

Do you wish to think again?

Are you totally daft. Buddhism is hardly an atheist.they believe in an afterlife.

Atheists do not believe in any of that crap! Accept that when you die the show is over

[farcanell]

If true.......Payback's a bitch Obama!......But this is what you want!!.....Perpetual war serves you (the corporate schill) and your corporate buddies ....

Added bonus........you get to crack-down on the people at home ..........

All these wars in the middle east are at the heart of this hatred towards america and it's 'allies'

You memory is short...remember who started these wars.

Saddam the madman?

Or do you mean way way way back to the Westward Parthian expansion, thousands of years ago?

[F4UCorsair]

I agree Rayk, another act of stupidity by the religion of peace (if that's what it really was) has played into Trump's hands, and will make it a whole lot tougher for muslims in the US.....as it should!!

I think most Americans would believe that a Trump presidency would encourage more terror acts like this.

You "think" that "most Americans".......

On what do you base that thinking? You're politically left leaning, so think that "most Americans" are the same??

"Most Americans" are simply the majority. The majority of Americans know Trump to be incredibly divisive, pitting groups against one another. And of course, he loves guns, thinks everyone should have them. He's already out there again pushing his idea that the US should put a ban on Muslims entering America, even though this killer was born in the US. Which of course makes it much easier for groups like ISIS/ISIL to propagate their agenda that the west hates Muslims. He's a walking, talking, propaganda star for radical Muslims the world over.

I KNOW that "most Americans" implies the majority of Americans, but why do you assume that is the case?

I think Trump has the traction he has because of the silent majority agreeing with him, but because of the stupidity of political correctness, are afraid to voice their opinions. Time will tell I guess.

Muslims hate the west. Are you suggesting that the west should just blindly go along with whatever these savages hand out??

[AYJAYDEE]

"he was using a semi-auto which is easily purchased anywhere."

That's kind of my point.

"and yes, people do use semi -autos for hunting"

Semi-autos are not widely used for hunting anything other than humans. And there is no hunter that can't do without it.

they CHOOSE not to do without it. and no one is gonna be able to pas a law to change that.

http://www.outdoorlife.com/photos/gallery/guns/rifles/centerfire/2011/11/20-best-semi-automatic-rifles-big-game-hunting/?image=0

[ilostmypassword]

Republicans repeatedly opposed criminal background gun checks even for people on the terrorist watch list.

http://www.politifact.com/florida/statements/2015/dec/29/patrick-murphy/terrorist-watch-list-no-obstacle-buying-guns-rep-m/

[OMGImInPattaya]

Sums things up nicely...

[luckyman]

That is what you get if you start meddling in conflicts you know nothing about, in territory which is not yours and with a strategy nobody understands.

If Bush had'nt removed Sadam Hussein and Muammar Khadafi, IS would have been eradicated long time ago.

I am afraid that this is only the beginning.

Eitherway it might also help that idiot Trump to get elected.

Rip to the victims and speedy recovery to the injured.

Edited June 13, 2016 by luckyman

[kannot]

If true.......Payback's a bitch Obama!......But this is what you want!!.....Perpetual war serves you (the corporate schill) and your corporate buddies ....

Added bonus........you get to crack-down on the people at home ..........

All these wars in the middle east are at the heart of this hatred towards america and it's 'allies'

RUBBISH!!

RUBBISH!!............not!!.................kannot except the US and it's 'allies' want to destabilize oil rich countries and over-throw leaders to install puppet governments that adhere to

US demands while enriching themselves and leaving the populace with nothing but war and poverty!

[hawker9000]

Never hear a word from "innocent" muslims to condone this tragedy or do anything to stop the terrorism.

Apparently Iran is biggest supporter of muslim terrorists. Put a Tesla in every driveway and good riddance to Iran and rest

of Arab countries.

It is high time the west takes the gloves off and cut the snake's head off for good.

" Never hear a word from "innocent" muslims to condone this tragedy or do anything to stop the terrorism."

Why would they "condone" a tragedy?

REDMOND – CAIR, the Council on American-Islamic Relations, put out a statement today condemning the violence in Orlando and saying the shooter doesn’t represent the ideals of their faith.

http://q13fox.com/2016/06/12/local-muslims-condemn-violence-in-orlando/

The Organization Of Islamic Cooperation: The Islamic State Has “Nothing To Do With Islam,” Has Committed Crimes “That Cannot Be Tolerated.”

www.beliefnet.com/columnists/commonwordcommonlord/2014/08/think-muslims-havent-condemned-isis-think-again.html#evZdb2rFK6ypxSMU.99

Muslim advocates in Michigan and across the U.S. strongly condemned the mass shooting early this morning at a nightclub in Orlando, Florida that left 50 dead and dozens injured.

http://www.freep.com/story/news/local/michigan/2016/06/12/area-muslims-strongly-condemn-orlando-shooting/85792084/

"Nationally, several Muslim groups put out statements strongly condemning the shooting and called for Muslims to donate blood for the victims."

How touching. In London, over a thousand Muslims protested against free speech afoot FM Montgomery's statue after the Charlie Hebdo shooting. Not "public statements"; but a vocal public protest! Over a cartoon!! In Malmo, Sweden hundreds lined up to chant "slaughter the Jews". 'A pity Muslims can't seem to work up as much indignation over 50 murdered innocents in Orlando (with doctors advising the public to expect the death toll to rise...). ..."statements strongly condemning"... Pfffft

.

.

.

Hey! I know what!! Let's do what the left always does! Blame the law-abiding gun-owners for an obvious act of terror! Maybe then we can kick it up a notch & start getting these islamist nutjobs to start using bombs! Yeah, that's the ticket!!!

Edited June 13, 2016 by hawker9000

[AYJAYDEE]

Never hear a word from "innocent" muslims to condone this tragedy or do anything to stop the terrorism.

Apparently Iran is biggest supporter of muslim terrorists. Put a Tesla in every driveway and good riddance to Iran and rest

of Arab countries.

It is high time the west takes the gloves off and cut the snake's head off for good.

" Never hear a word from "innocent" muslims to condone this tragedy or do anything to stop the terrorism."

Why would they "condone" a tragedy?

REDMOND – CAIR, the Council on American-Islamic Relations, put out a statement today condemning the violence in Orlando and saying the shooter doesn’t represent the ideals of their faith.

http://q13fox.com/2016/06/12/local-muslims-condemn-violence-in-orlando/

The Organization Of Islamic Cooperation: The Islamic State Has “Nothing To Do With Islam,” Has Committed Crimes “That Cannot Be Tolerated.”

www.beliefnet.com/columnists/commonwordcommonlord/2014/08/think-muslims-havent-condemned-isis-think-again.html#evZdb2rFK6ypxSMU.99

Muslim advocates in Michigan and across the U.S. strongly condemned the mass shooting early this morning at a nightclub in Orlando, Florida that left 50 dead and dozens injured.

http://www.freep.com/story/news/local/michigan/2016/06/12/area-muslims-strongly-condemn-orlando-shooting/85792084/

"Nationally, several Muslim groups put out statements strongly condemning the shooting and called for Muslims to donate blood for the victims."

How touching. In London, over a thousand Muslims protested against free speech afoot FM Montgomery's statue after the Charlie Hebdo shooting. Not "public statements"; but a vocal public protest! Over a cartoon!! In Malmo, Sweden hundreds lined up to chant "slaughter the Jews". 'A pity Muslims can't seem to work up as much indignation over 50 murdered innocents in Orlando (with doctors advising the public to expect the death toll to rise...). ..."statements strongly condemning"... Pfffft

it was an answer to the guy who "never heard a word"

[Veeke]

If true.......Payback's a bitch Obama!......But this is what you want!!.....Perpetual war serves you (the corporate schill) and your corporate buddies ....

Added bonus........you get to crack-down on the people at home ..........

All these wars in the middle east are at the heart of this hatred towards america and it's 'allies'

You memory is short...remember who started these wars.

To rake up the memory from a few decades ago.... didn't US think that the terrorism they cultivated in Afghanisthan to lead the downfall of USSR would lead to damages across the world? However this knowledge of history won't help us to face terrorism at the moment....... the roots are deeper and inter-woven into the third world poverty

[luckyman]

It would be nice if the POTUS didn't politicize this act of Islamic terrorism and coopt it into his support for LGBT rights and anti-Second Amendment agenda. He should instead direct his rhetorical skills at calling Islam out for what it is...namely a religion of intollerance and hate and the enemy of free people the world over.

100 agreed ! Didnot understand his rethoric either as he is on his way out. And Trump will be on his way in shortly, especially if the US suffers another similar attack at random location before the elections...Obama is a pussy

[AYJAYDEE]

It would be nice if the POTUS didn't politicize this act of Islamic terrorism and coopt it into his support for LGBT rights and anti-Second Amendment agenda. He should instead direct his rhetorical skills at calling Islam out for what it is...namely a religion of intollerance and hate and the enemy of free people the world over.

100 agreed ! Didnot understand his rethoric either as he is on his way out. And Trump will be on his way in shortly, especially if the US suffers another similar attack at random location before the elections...Obama is a pussy

wanna bet?

[hawker9000]

Never hear a word from "innocent" muslims to condone this tragedy or do anything to stop the terrorism.

Apparently Iran is biggest supporter of muslim terrorists. Put a Tesla in every driveway and good riddance to Iran and rest

of Arab countries.

It is high time the west takes the gloves off and cut the snake's head off for good.

" Never hear a word from "innocent" muslims to condone this tragedy or do anything to stop the terrorism."

Why would they "condone" a tragedy?

REDMOND – CAIR, the Council on American-Islamic Relations, put out a statement today condemning the violence in Orlando and saying the shooter doesn’t represent the ideals of their faith.

http://q13fox.com/2016/06/12/local-muslims-condemn-violence-in-orlando/

The Organization Of Islamic Cooperation: The Islamic State Has “Nothing To Do With Islam,” Has Committed Crimes “That Cannot Be Tolerated.”

www.beliefnet.com/columnists/commonwordcommonlord/2014/08/think-muslims-havent-condemned-isis-think-again.html#evZdb2rFK6ypxSMU.99

Muslim advocates in Michigan and across the U.S. strongly condemned the mass shooting early this morning at a nightclub in Orlando, Florida that left 50 dead and dozens injured.

http://www.freep.com/story/news/local/michigan/2016/06/12/area-muslims-strongly-condemn-orlando-shooting/85792084/

"Nationally, several Muslim groups put out statements strongly condemning the shooting and called for Muslims to donate blood for the victims."

How touching. In London, over a thousand Muslims protested against free speech afoot FM Montgomery's statue after the Charlie Hebdo shooting. Not "public statements"; but a vocal public protest! Over a cartoon!! In Malmo, Sweden hundreds lined up to chant "slaughter the Jews". 'A pity Muslims can't seem to work up as much indignation over 50 murdered innocents in Orlando (with doctors advising the public to expect the death toll to rise...). ..."statements strongly condemning"... Pfffft

it was an answer to the guy who "never heard a word"

My comment was on the pathetic - almost contemptible - lameness of the word that was heard...

Edited June 13, 2016 by hawker9000

[augustwest]

That is what you get if you start meddling in conflicts you know nothing about, in territory which is not yours and with a strategy nobody understands.

If Bush had'nt removed Sadam Hussein and Muammar Khadafi, IS would have been eradicated long time ago.

I am afraid that this is only the beginning.

Eitherway it might also help that idiot Trump to get elected.

Rip to the victims and speedy recovery to the injured.

No need to go back that far. I do believe taking Hussein and Ghadafi out was a major blunder. But if the US had supported Assad there would be no Daesh. PC politicians will never get that.

The US should make nice with Russia and China,after all we are the 3 major players and the others don't amount to much

[halloween]

"he was using a semi-auto which is easily purchased anywhere."

That's kind of my point.

"and yes, people do use semi -autos for hunting"

Semi-autos are not widely used for hunting anything other than humans. And there is no hunter that can't do without it.

My first rifle was a bolt action. Then I spent 2 years using a semi-auto designed to kill people. After that education both my hunting rifles were semi-auto. What I can do without is unsubstantiated BS.

[halloween]

"he was using a semi-auto which is easily purchased anywhere."

That's kind of my point.

"and yes, people do use semi -autos for hunting"

Semi-autos are not widely used for hunting anything other than humans. And there is no hunter that can't do without it.

they CHOOSE not to do without it. and no one is gonna be able to pas a law to change that.

http://www.outdoorlife.com/photos/gallery/guns/rifles/centerfire/2011/11/20-best-semi-automatic-rifles-big-game-hunting/?image=0

They did in Australia.

[Scotwight]

"he was using a semi-auto which is easily purchased anywhere."

That's kind of my point.

"and yes, people do use semi -autos for hunting"

Semi-autos are not widely used for hunting anything other than humans. And there is no hunter that can't do without it.

My first rifle was a bolt action. Then I spent 2 years using a semi-auto designed to kill people. After that education both my hunting rifles were semi-auto. What I can do without is unsubstantiated BS.

Terry McVeigh Killed a couple of hundred people with fertilizer. When I was 12 years old I had a 22 automatic. At 16 a Browning automatic shotgun.

[AYJAYDEE]

"he was using a semi-auto which is easily purchased anywhere."

That's kind of my point.

"and yes, people do use semi -autos for hunting"

Semi-autos are not widely used for hunting anything other than humans. And there is no hunter that can't do without it.

they CHOOSE not to do without it. and no one is gonna be able to pas a law to change that.

http://www.outdoorlife.com/photos/gallery/guns/rifles/centerfire/2011/11/20-best-semi-automatic-rifles-big-game-hunting/?image=0

They did in Australia.

did they have to amend their constitution? big difference

[Raymonddiaz]

ISIS will claim responsibility for any attack to western countries and people, just because they want a violent response back. Violence creates more violence, and more ISIS violent followers.

To forgive and forget is the only response to stop with this madness. Leave the Islamic people and its countries alone!

That is true. Let the Arabs and Muslims in their land and never enter in their problems and you will be safe. ISIS is really extreme and they give a damn F......about death. ISIS gives a very bad name to all Muslims.

[Scotwight]

"he was using a semi-auto which is easily purchased anywhere."

That's kind of my point.

"and yes, people do use semi -autos for hunting"

Semi-autos are not widely used for hunting anything other than humans. And there is no hunter that can't do without it.

they CHOOSE not to do without it. and no one is gonna be able to pas a law to change that.

http://www.outdoorlife.com/photos/gallery/guns/rifles/centerfire/2011/11/20-best-semi-automatic-rifles-big-game-hunting/?image=0

They did in Australia.

Isn't there more people in Florida than Australia? Not comparable really.

[augustwest]

"he was using a semi-auto which is easily purchased anywhere."

That's kind of my point.

"and yes, people do use semi -autos for hunting"

Semi-autos are not widely used for hunting anything other than humans. And there is no hunter that can't do without it.

My first rifle was a bolt action. Then I spent 2 years using a semi-auto designed to kill people. After that education both my hunting rifles were semi-auto. What I can do without is unsubstantiated BS.

A real and competent hunter should carry 3 rounds. 1 for the kill shot 2nd if that goes awry and the 3rd to keep away predators on the way home!

A 30 round clip is absolutely obscene

[MZurf]

"he was using a semi-auto which is easily purchased anywhere."

That's kind of my point.

"and yes, people do use semi -autos for hunting"

Semi-autos are not widely used for hunting anything other than humans. And there is no hunter that can't do without it.

My first rifle was a bolt action. Then I spent 2 years using a semi-auto designed to kill people. After that education both my hunting rifles were semi-auto. What I can do without is unsubstantiated BS.

"What I can do without is unsubstantiated BS."

That's not apparent from your posts..

[MZurf]

"he was using a semi-auto which is easily purchased anywhere."

That's kind of my point.

"and yes, people do use semi -autos for hunting"

Semi-autos are not widely used for hunting anything other than humans. And there is no hunter that can't do without it.

My first rifle was a bolt action. Then I spent 2 years using a semi-auto designed to kill people. After that education both my hunting rifles were semi-auto. What I can do without is unsubstantiated BS.

Terry McVeigh Killed a couple of hundred people with fertilizer. When I was 12 years old I had a 22 automatic. At 16 a Browning automatic shotgun.

And the point is?

[Scotwight]

"he was using a semi-auto which is easily purchased anywhere."

That's kind of my point.

"and yes, people do use semi -autos for hunting"

Semi-autos are not widely used for hunting anything other than humans. And there is no hunter that can't do without it.

My first rifle was a bolt action. Then I spent 2 years using a semi-auto designed to kill people. After that education both my hunting rifles were semi-auto. What I can do without is unsubstantiated BS.

Terry McVeigh Killed a couple of hundred people with fertilizer. When I was 12 years old I had a 22 automatic. At 16 a Browning automatic shotgun.

And the point is?

You can kill more people quicker with fertilizer than semi automatic weapons. Automatic weapons are frequently used in hunting animals. And you don't know what you are talking about.

Edited June 13, 2016 by Scotwight

[AYJAYDEE]

And the point is?

You can kill more people quicker with fertilizer than semi automatic weapons. Automatic weapons are frequently used in hunting animals. And you don't know what you are talking about.

automatic weapons for hunting? where?