Teaching KG English to Mathayom Students

[simon43]

I'm teaching English in a typical government school to M1 - M6.

The reading and spoken English abilities of my students varies from basic to appalling

There are probably a few reasons for this that I can think of:

- The students have only learnt 'Tinglish' from their Thai teachers

- The students have been taught 'strange' English grammar from their non-NES foreign teachers. (Not a blanket accusation, but I just spent 1 hour correcting the weird English on next week's test papers that were written by a non-NES).

- The Thai educational system is somewhat fc*ked up

- Typical teenagers don't want to learn/prefer to sleep in class

- The students are stupid

As an example of their language abilities my 'What is your name' was met by blank stares for the first few days, as most of the class looked to the only student who could understand basic, spoken English. This was a class of 15 year old students

When I wrote 'What is your name' on the whiteboard, most students could not read these basic words.

As a group, they were typical teens, (half-asleep, fully asleep, not even present in the class).

I achieved some good progress by speaking and writing in Thai language during the lesson. They learnt some new words and understood how to pronounce various words after I explained this in Thai. (Please don't condemn me for using their L1 - I personally believe that using L1 at basic English level is a very useful attribute to instill confidence and understanding amongst the students).

Outside of class, I have been approached on an individual basis by many students, who tell me that they really want to learn to read and speak English, but that they have previously been thwarted by:

- The lack of approachability of the Thai teachers, the latters' lack of English skills etc

- The inability of the students to express their concerns to their foreign (NES or non-NES) teachers, because the students cannot speak English and the NES/non-NES cannot speak/read Thai.

The bottom line is that I am willing to teach these students after hours for free, to try to help them to improve their basic English. The school supports me in my efforts and I am not concerned about the money aspect.

But what is the best approach to teaching very basic reading and speaking skills to teens? Should I start with KG reading books??? Are their any ESL books for teens that use the most basic of English, but in a 'teen' environment?

Any advice and pointers to resources is appreciated.

[stubuzz]

Do not teach for free and do not tell the school you are not concerned about money. This will only help to push down the already low salaries.

[simon43]

Updated:

I have deleted my original response to your comment because your reply didn't address the questions raised in my OP.

Edited July 7, 2016 by simon43

[gandalf12]

Because thy are teens doesnt matter. Start from the most basic level you can and assume they know nothing, which from what you say is not really much of n assumption. If it means going back to learning the alphabet so be it

[LazySlipper]

Hey man,

First thing you have to do is diagnose if they can recognize question patterns. If they can't, start by teaching them the basics of formulating and answering do, have, and tag questions... If they cannot do this, this is your first step. Second step is to teach them scanning skills. They must learn scanning before they can actually start answering more complex questions in a reading comprehension text.

Moreover, you need to assess their phonic skills. We all know words by sound, but sometimes we can not recognize them in written form... and good luck with the irregular verbs... sometimes meaning is lost simply because of this.

You are embarking on a very frustrating quest... if no one has paved any of the road ahead for you...

Choke dee...

PS... I forgot!!! NOTHING FOR FREE!!!!!!!! You will just open the floodgates to abuse and the attempt by schools to squeeze more out of us...

Edited July 7, 2016 by LazySlipper

[SlyAnimal]

I would suggest that you work out for yourself what your goal is, specifically, with these students and decide what you need to do in order to get there.

e.g. How many students do you want to teach? (I'm referring to special class, not your contracted English lessons) Do you want them to learn to listen & speak? read & write? think critically? What level do you want them to be at? (basic communication? full sentences?). Or is your goal to improve the school's program for future students?

Some of these will be like bashing your head against a concrete wall, while others will be more easily achieved.

Also they will likely know a lot more than what you think they do, but students are often not confident enough to say an answer because they're not sure of themselves. As often they retain a lot more vocabulary than what even they themselves realize, they just need to unlock a decade's worth of vocabularly from their brains so that they can more readily access it and be sure of the meanings. As a result, you should find that students who you do invest time in, will often surprise you with some of the things they do know or things which you think you're teaching them for the first time but then they pick it up more easily than what you were expecting, since they already knew it, but simply had it locked away in the recesses of their mind.

Edited July 7, 2016 by SlyAnimal

[lostinisaan]

There're usually three to five students per classroom who know a little bit of English. But I really don't understand what you're trying to do?

If they're really as bad as you wrote, you'll have to start at the basics. There's no do this, do that tip to get their attention, once they hate you, you're out. And if they've started to dislike you then you'll have a huge problem.

If you want that they're able to read, you must teach them phonics. As already mentioned in my message you can have plenty of stuff, covering almost all. From easy to hardcore grammar. A phonics interactive game that's really cool, etc...

I'm sure that nobody ever heard what a vowel is, that's where you'll have to start if you want that they can read.

I've got two grade six classes and there's no way to "make them" learn. They're aware that they'll pass anyway, so please don't waste your valuable time for guys who don't deserve it.

Same same, but different? They were taught by Thai and Asian teachers before. Not even one student is able to write her/his name on a worksheet. They have to look on a notebook and copy their own names on the worksheet in every lesson?

Sorry, but the train has already left the station.......

But doing that for nothing is questionable. Think about my offer please.

You can't change the system and the system is so fragged up that nothing can surprise me anymore. .

Our Thai head teacher with a Master's in English, thesis written by a TVF member can't say one sentence without a huge mistake, or some missing words. Usually the most important ones.

There're sentences on her board like: "Where are your grade in?" "Where are your study?" and other pathetic questions.

One of our Asian colleagues asks the students: "Are you understand?"

Dude, please do me a favor and only help the ones who really want to learn and try to correct their bs English in a way that nobody's losing face.

Talk soon?

P.S. Can you use a projector??????? If yes, Power Points and a lot of educational cartoons are waiting for you.

Edited July 7, 2016 by lostinisaan

[muzmurray]

There're usually three to five students per classroom who know a little bit of English. But I really don't understand what you're trying to do?

If they're really as bad as you wrote, you'll have to start at the basics. There's no do this, do that tip to get their attention, once they hate you, you're out. And if they've started to dislike you then you'll have a huge problem.

If you want that they're able to read, you must teach them phonics. As already mentioned in my message you can have plenty of stuff, covering almost all. From easy to hardcore grammar. A phonics interactive game that's really cool, etc...

I'm sure that nobody ever heard what a vowel is, that's where you'll have to start if you want that they can read.

I've got two grade six classes and there's no way to "make them" learn. They're aware that they'll pass anyway, so please don't waste your valuable time for guys who don't deserve it.

Same same, but different? They were taught by Thai and Asian teachers before. Not even one student is able to write her/his name on a worksheet. They have to look on a notebook and copy their own names on the worksheet in every lesson?

Sorry, but the train has already left the station.......

But doing that for nothing is questionable. Think about my offer please.

You can't change the system and the system is so fragged up that nothing can surprise me anymore. .

Our Thai head teacher with a Master's in English, thesis written by a TVF member can't say one sentence without a huge mistake, or some missing words. Usually the most important ones.

There're sentences on her board like: "Where are your grade in?" "Where are your study?" and other pathetic questions.

One of our Asian colleagues asks the students: "Are you understand?"

Dude, please do me a favor and only help the ones who really want to learn and try to correct their bs English in a way that nobody's losing face.

Talk soon?

P.S. Can you use a projector??????? If yes, Power Points and a lot of educational cartoons are waiting for you.

"There're" is really only used in speech, and then only in some dialects, it should not be used in polite writing.

[muzmurray]

There're usually three to five students per classroom who know a little bit of English. But I really don't understand what you're trying to do?

If they're really as bad as you wrote, you'll have to start at the basics. There's no do this, do that tip to get their attention, once they hate you, you're out. And if they've started to dislike you then you'll have a huge problem.

If you want that they're able to read, you must teach them phonics. As already mentioned in my message you can have plenty of stuff, covering almost all. From easy to hardcore grammar. A phonics interactive game that's really cool, etc...

I'm sure that nobody ever heard what a vowel is, that's where you'll have to start if you want that they can read.

I've got two grade six classes and there's no way to "make them" learn. They're aware that they'll pass anyway, so please don't waste your valuable time for guys who don't deserve it.

Same same, but different? They were taught by Thai and Asian teachers before. Not even one student is able to write her/his name on a worksheet. They have to look on a notebook and copy their own names on the worksheet in every lesson?

Sorry, but the train has already left the station.......

But doing that for nothing is questionable. Think about my offer please.

You can't change the system and the system is so fragged up that nothing can surprise me anymore. .

Our Thai head teacher with a Master's in English, thesis written by a TVF member can't say one sentence without a huge mistake, or some missing words. Usually the most important ones.

There're sentences on her board like: "Where are your grade in?" "Where are your study?" and other pathetic questions.

One of our Asian colleagues asks the students: "Are you understand?"

Dude, please do me a favor and only help the ones who really want to learn and try to correct their bs English in a way that nobody's losing face.

Talk soon?

P.S. Can you use a projector??????? If yes, Power Points and a lot of educational cartoons are waiting for you.

Oh! The irony.

[BaldPlumber]

There're usually three to five students per classroom who know a little bit of English. But I really don't understand what you're trying to do?

If they're really as bad as you wrote, you'll have to start at the basics. There's no do this, do that tip to get their attention, once they hate you, you're out. And if they've started to dislike you then you'll have a huge problem.

If you want that they're able to read, you must teach them phonics. As already mentioned in my message you can have plenty of stuff, covering almost all. From easy to hardcore grammar. A phonics interactive game that's really cool, etc...

I'm sure that nobody ever heard what a vowel is, that's where you'll have to start if you want that they can read.

I've got two grade six classes and there's no way to "make them" learn. They're aware that they'll pass anyway, so please don't waste your valuable time for guys who don't deserve it.

Same same, but different? They were taught by Thai and Asian teachers before. Not even one student is able to write her/his name on a worksheet. They have to look on a notebook and copy their own names on the worksheet in every lesson?

Sorry, but the train has already left the station.......

But doing that for nothing is questionable. Think about my offer please.

You can't change the system and the system is so fragged up that nothing can surprise me anymore. .

Our Thai head teacher with a Master's in English, thesis written by a TVF member can't say one sentence without a huge mistake, or some missing words. Usually the most important ones.

There're sentences on her board like: "Where are your grade in?" "Where are your study?" and other pathetic questions.

One of our Asian colleagues asks the students: "Are you understand?"

Dude, please do me a favor and only help the ones who really want to learn and try to correct their bs English in a way that nobody's losing face.

Talk soon?

P.S. Can you use a projector??????? If yes, Power Points and a lot of educational cartoons are waiting for you.

Oh! The irony.

A helpful, useful and entertaining post shot down in flames by a pedant.

Oh, the pettiness.

[muzmurray]

There're usually three to five students per classroom who know a little bit of English. But I really don't understand what you're trying to do?

If they're really as bad as you wrote, you'll have to start at the basics. There's no do this, do that tip to get their attention, once they hate you, you're out. And if they've started to dislike you then you'll have a huge problem.

If you want that they're able to read, you must teach them phonics. As already mentioned in my message you can have plenty of stuff, covering almost all. From easy to hardcore grammar. A phonics interactive game that's really cool, etc...

I'm sure that nobody ever heard what a vowel is, that's where you'll have to start if you want that they can read.

I've got two grade six classes and there's no way to "make them" learn. They're aware that they'll pass anyway, so please don't waste your valuable time for guys who don't deserve it.

Same same, but different? They were taught by Thai and Asian teachers before. Not even one student is able to write her/his name on a worksheet. They have to look on a notebook and copy their own names on the worksheet in every lesson?

Sorry, but the train has already left the station.......

But doing that for nothing is questionable. Think about my offer please.

You can't change the system and the system is so fragged up that nothing can surprise me anymore. .

Our Thai head teacher with a Master's in English, thesis written by a TVF member can't say one sentence without a huge mistake, or some missing words. Usually the most important ones.

There're sentences on her board like: "Where are your grade in?" "Where are your study?" and other pathetic questions.

One of our Asian colleagues asks the students: "Are you understand?"

Dude, please do me a favor and only help the ones who really want to learn and try to correct their bs English in a way that nobody's losing face.

Talk soon?

P.S. Can you use a projector??????? If yes, Power Points and a lot of educational cartoons are waiting for you.

Oh! The irony.

A helpful, useful and entertaining post shot down in flames by a pedant.

Oh, the pettiness.

If you read Lostinisaan's posts, you would know that not only has he experienced everything in the Thai education system, but he also feels the need to explain it in poor English.

I would hazard a calculated guess that most of what he writes is pure fiction, made up by a sad man who feels the need to show how knowledgeable he thinks he is.

Apologies for being a pedant, but for someone who teaches English here, the ability to write it correctly should be important.

Bashing Thai teachers, as he often does, and then making schoolboy errors in his own posts is laughable.

Edited July 8, 2016 by muzmurray

[LazySlipper]

OP starts something but doesn't seem to follow up on his post. Did he really want some advice or did he just want to put his rating up?

Serves me right for trying to help.

[simon43]

OP starts something but doesn't seem to follow up on his post.

Did he really want some advice or did he just want to put his rating up?

My rating is fine thanks.

I posted the question yesterday. You maybe have nothing better to do that 'play' Thaivisa forum, but I'm busy teaching and have not yet had time to consider the comments and my reply to them

Edited July 8, 2016 by simon43

[Lannig]

Sorry for the naive question, I'm not a teacher so I probably don't have any input that would be considered valuable (I've tried once but was quickly dismissed), just not to die ignorant: would you please define "NES"?

[simon43]

Sorry, 'NES' means 'Native English Speaker', which perhaps suggests that this person is fluent in both spoken and written English, someone IMHO (in my humble opinion), who is able to 'switch off' any regional accent that they might have and speak English with a neutral and clear accent.

It doesn't always seem to work out like that though....

Back on-topic, thanks for the useful replies. A few of my students do have a basic ability to understand spoken and written English, but they are in the very small minority

IMHO, unless the student intends to enter university or a vocational training course (such as Hospitality), or wants to work or study overseas, I would think that improving their listening and speaking skills is more important than reading and writing skills.

[heretostay]

To answer the OP's original query,

- Sure, do anything you can to help the kids learn English (and critical thinking, creativity, and discipline)

- IMHO, you can do it for free without bringing down the average wage of other teachers; follow your heart

Keep us posted - would love to share experiences on this type of work.

[TPI]

There're usually three to five students per classroom who know a little bit of English. But I really don't understand what you're trying to do?

If they're really as bad as you wrote, you'll have to start at the basics. There's no do this, do that tip to get their attention, once they hate you, you're out. And if they've started to dislike you then you'll have a huge problem.

If you want that they're able to read, you must teach them phonics. As already mentioned in my message you can have plenty of stuff, covering almost all. From easy to hardcore grammar. A phonics interactive game that's really cool, etc...

I'm sure that nobody ever heard what a vowel is, that's where you'll have to start if you want that they can read.

I've got two grade six classes and there's no way to "make them" learn. They're aware that they'll pass anyway, so please don't waste your valuable time for guys who don't deserve it.

Same same, but different? They were taught by Thai and Asian teachers before. Not even one student is able to write her/his name on a worksheet. They have to look on a notebook and copy their own names on the worksheet in every lesson?

Sorry, but the train has already left the station.......

But doing that for nothing is questionable. Think about my offer please.

You can't change the system and the system is so fragged up that nothing can surprise me anymore. .

Our Thai head teacher with a Master's in English, thesis written by a TVF member can't say one sentence without a huge mistake, or some missing words. Usually the most important ones.

There're sentences on her board like: "Where are your grade in?" "Where are your study?" and other pathetic questions.

One of our Asian colleagues asks the students: "Are you understand?"

Dude, please do me a favor and only help the ones who really want to learn and try to correct their bs English in a way that nobody's losing face.

Talk soon?

P.S. Can you use a projector??????? If yes, Power Points and a lot of educational cartoons are waiting for you.

"There're" is really only used in speech, and then only in some dialects, it should not be used in polite writing.

Pretentious? Moi?

[thai3]

Teaching, I thought you ran a Hotel, are you qualified to teach then? Teach them Leicester speak, hey up me duck, wot you on about etc !

[casualbiker]

Simon.. I quite like the Penguin vocabulary books.. I can send you a Dropbox link if you're interested. Also occasionally use Disney English videos.. you can find them on YouTube (I use YouTube downloader)

[casualbiker]

Teaching, I thought you ran a Hotel, are you qualified to teach then? Teach them Leicester speak, hey up me duck, wot you on about etc !

Simon has many strings to his bow.. he tends to limit his whinging and whining to a minimum. Unlike you!

[simon43]

Teaching, I thought you ran a Hotel, are you qualified to teach then?

Not qualified as in having a degree in Education (or similar). I have been teaching for about 10 years, based on my Engineering MSc, ICT BSc, Thai Culture MA, TEFL certificate and a host of CPD certificates in teaching from The British Council.

I'd love to get a teaching degree, but at my advanced years, that isn't going to happen...

As far as teaching KG English is concerned, I have decided to create my own materials, at least for teaching the very basics. For example, to teach 'I play, you play' etc, I need to write this in English, then write the English pronounciation using Thai script, then write the meaning in Thai script. (I did this at school yesterday and there were big smiles all round as the students could finally read (in Thai) the English words and understand exactly how to pronounce them

[LazySlipper]

Teaching, I thought you ran a Hotel, are you qualified to teach then?

Not qualified as in having a degree in Education (or similar). I have been teaching for about 10 years, based on my Engineering MSc, ICT BSc, Thai Culture MA, TEFL certificate and a host of CPD certificates in teaching from The British Council.

I'd love to get a teaching degree, but at my advanced years, that isn't going to happen...

As far as teaching KG English is concerned, I have decided to create my own materials, at least for teaching the very basics. For example, to teach 'I play, you play' etc, I need to write this in English, then write the English pronounciation using Thai script, then write the meaning in Thai script. (I did this at school yesterday and there were big smiles all round as the students could finally read (in Thai) the English words and understand exactly how to pronounce them

Hey man, when I sorta bashed you it was cos this is what can be worked with. Your efforts and attempts at solving a problem. What you should maybe invest your time in is teaching them IPA (international phonetics). It is in most dictionaries and it would most likely save you much time in resource development. Moreover, it takes about 20 minutes to learn and lasts a lifetime.

[muzmurray]

Teaching, I thought you ran a Hotel, are you qualified to teach then?

Not qualified as in having a degree in Education (or similar). I have been teaching for about 10 years, based on my Engineering MSc, ICT BSc, Thai Culture MA, TEFL certificate and a host of CPD certificates in teaching from The British Council.

I'd love to get a teaching degree, but at my advanced years, that isn't going to happen...

As far as teaching KG English is concerned, I have decided to create my own materials, at least for teaching the very basics. For example, to teach 'I play, you play' etc, I need to write this in English, then write the English pronounciation using Thai script, then write the meaning in Thai script. (I did this at school yesterday and there were big smiles all round as the students could finally read (in Thai) the English words and understand exactly how to pronounce them

What about the sounds that they don't have, such as "th"?

[simon43]

What about the sounds that they don't have, such as "th"?

Good question. For a word such as 'they' or 'she', I cannot write this exact pronunciation using Thai letters, because this sound doesn't exist in Thai. I have to use the nearest equivalent which is 'เต' or 'ชี' (sorry Mods for the Thai..)

But then I back it up with a short video that I make where I pronounce each word slowly, such as this:

http://bbr.asia/simon/pronouns.mp4

(Yes I know the Thai font is screwed up on that video, I've changed fonts for more recent videos).

I send these videos to the students' LINE group, and they can practice listening to the correct sound in their free time.

[SlyAnimal]

Nice video, and a good idea to send it out to their line group.

Using Thai for basic vocabulary like this is probably the easiest way to effectively communicate with them when teaching some of the basics, and the video will allow them to learn/practice in their own time. I often find that the "less gifted" students respond very well to the fact that I take a special interest in them and can actually communicate with them in Thai when I try to explain to them why it's important to learn English.

Although, if they haven't learnt the basics after 6 years of English in primary school, be prepared for an uphill battle, as although it's generally a motivational problem, some of the students that have problems with English are simply not the brightest crayons in the box.

Edited July 11, 2016 by SlyAnimal

[lostinisaan]

What about the sounds that they don't have, such as "th"?

Good question. For a word such as 'they' or 'she', I cannot write this exact pronunciation using Thai letters, because this sound doesn't exist in Thai. I have to use the nearest equivalent which is 'เต' or 'ชี' (sorry Mods for the Thai..)

But then I back it up with a short video that I make where I pronounce each word slowly, such as this:

http://bbr.asia/simon/pronouns.mp4

(Yes I know the Thai font is screwed up on that video, I've changed fonts for more recent videos).

I send these videos to the students' LINE group, and they can practice listening to the correct sound in their free time.

A great post, thanks.

[Thailizardking]

Is it difficult to find a teaching job in Thailand?

I apologize, I'm Jenny and new here.

Edited July 21, 2016 by Thailizardking

[Thailizardking]

There're usually three to five students per classroom who know a little bit of English. But I really don't understand what you're trying to do?

If they're really as bad as you wrote, you'll have to start at the basics. There's no do this, do that tip to get their attention, once they hate you, you're out. And if they've started to dislike you then you'll have a huge problem.

If you want that they're able to read, you must teach them phonics. As already mentioned in my message you can have plenty of stuff, covering almost all. From easy to hardcore grammar. A phonics interactive game that's really cool, etc...

I'm sure that nobody ever heard what a vowel is, that's where you'll have to start if you want that they can read.

I've got two grade six classes and there's no way to "make them" learn. They're aware that they'll pass anyway, so please don't waste your valuable time for guys who don't deserve it.

Same same, but different? They were taught by Thai and Asian teachers before. Not even one student is able to write her/his name on a worksheet. They have to look on a notebook and copy their own names on the worksheet in every lesson?

Sorry, but the train has already left the station.......

But doing that for nothing is questionable. Think about my offer please.

You can't change the system and the system is so fragged up that nothing can surprise me anymore. .

Our Thai head teacher with a Master's in English, thesis written by a TVF member can't say one sentence without a huge mistake, or some missing words. Usually the most important ones.

There're sentences on her board like: "Where are your grade in?" "Where are your study?" and other pathetic questions.

One of our Asian colleagues asks the students: "Are you understand?"

Dude, please do me a favor and only help the ones who really want to learn and try to correct their bs English in a way that nobody's losing face.

Talk soon?

P.S. Can you use a projector??????? If yes, Power Points and a lot of educational cartoons are waiting for you.

Is it really like that?

[thai3]

Is it difficult to find a teaching job in Thailand?

I apologize, I'm Jenny and new here.

No but it seems difficult to find good teachers, even qualified ones

[Rayk]

Learning a new language takes a lot of effort, determination, hard work and a willingness to want to learn, not to mention long hours.

Teaching Thai students for roughly 4 hours per week is not going to achieve any results.

It's the same idea as a person who wants to learn to play an instrument.

Some people are naturally gifted in that area but the vast majority of people have to spend countless hours practicing,

The old saying practice makes perfect is a perfect fit when it comes to Thai students learning to speak English.

The problem is, they don't practice.

They come to school, listen to the teacher for the duration of the lesson and forget everything that he or she has taught the moment the lesson is finished.

The ones that do succeed in learning the language are the ones that put in the extra effort and work hard while at home, whether it be by watching youtube videos, reading English books, looking through dictionaries for new vocabulary and many other various educational means.

They put in the extra effort.

The majority of students couldn't care less if they can speak English.

Ask any high school student what their major is and you will only ever here either

Mathematics

science

Music

Art

Chinese

Japanese

You can't blame the children.

The only people to blame are the parents,schools and the governments who have allowed it to continue to be this way since the very beginning.

Edited July 27, 2016 by Rayk