TM30 experiences for condo owner-occupants???

[KhonKaenKowboy]

This seems to be the latest quagmire....don't know for sure if I need to do it..I have a yellow book, always have done my 90s, usually online.  Now, everyone needs to do a TM30.  So I mailed mine in registered mail, and kept copies.  Should I visit the office?  I'm asking specifically in the bkk forum because there are so many condo owners in BKK.  Thanks!

[jadee]

I thought the TM30 was for premises like hotels to complete if a foreigner was staying there. Do you now need to do a TM30 if you live in your own condo? I've never heard of this but perhaps others can help. 

[Peterw42]

TM30 is to be completed by the house master to report a foreigner staying at the premises. House master is Hotel, Apartment block owner, House/Condo owner or long term lease holder.  Hotels and Apartment blocks have a facility to report online, normal house and condo owners need to report manually. Move in to the Thai girlfriends house and she is supposed to put in a TM30. If you are the Condo owner (House master) you are supposed to report yourself.

Its always been the law. In the past it hasn't been enforced much, depending on which immigration office.

Lots of threads recently about a crackdown and some immigration offices are now enforcing. It appears to be mainly in Chiang Mai

[KhonKaenKowboy]

yes, I reported in CM....fined 1600 thb....even read reports of them looking for the receipt at traffic stops.

[thenewgoo]

Can anyone answer this? I rent a house in CM, TM30 done with land lord - no problem there. I will be going to my wife's family home in Lamphun (20 kms away - but different province technically). I will be staying about 1 week. Is a new TM30 required for the stay? 

[Peterw42]

9 minutes ago, thenewgoo said:

Can anyone answer this? I rent a house in CM, TM30 done with land lord - no problem there. I will be going to my wife's family home in Lamphun (20 kms away - but different province technically). I will be staying about 1 week. Is a new TM30 required for the stay? 

 

Technically yes, but unless you have some business at immigration concerning the temp address then how would they know. 

[KhonKaenKowboy]

They told me if I visited CR or BKK I wouldn't need a new one (during Monday's interrogation).  Others dispute this.  I think it is more likely one will need to be filed on you in Lamphun.

[thenewgoo]

Thanks for your replies, so technically yes, depending on who you ask, realistically no, because no one would probably care enough to enforce it - unless there is some money in it for them. 

 

Another of Thailand's 'optional'' laws perhaps. 

[Tracyb]

Hope this helps.  I am a U.S. citizen condo owner in Bangkok.  I just went in for my 2nd, one year extension of stay based on retirement, (Not Married) and re-entry permit here in BKK at Chaeng Wattana.  I've been in and out of the country several times in the past two years and have never filed a TM-30.  No one asked about it at CW.  I'll admit,  I was holding my breath in case the subject came up.  

[Deepinthailand]

When I first came to Thailand rented a condo in BKK now even then the owner knew I had to be registered at immigration but his words." Can't be bothered you do it" asked for copies house book and ID answer "no". Went to see immigration told them the story no problem you do it gave me tm 28 and tm 30 filled both in there and then copy tm 30 stapled to passport.

One a diffrent tack now went into KK immigration yesterday to ask about this buisness of if you go on holiday in Thailand or leave country to renew visa or holiday. But return to address already on file do I need to come in here every time on my return. NO only if I change permanent address. So that's what I will be doing.

[Peterw42]

16 minutes ago, Deepinthailand said:

When I first came to Thailand rented a condo in BKK now even then the owner knew I had to be registered at immigration but his words." Can't be bothered you do it" asked for copies house book and ID answer "no". Went to see immigration told them the story no problem you do it gave me tm 28 and tm 30 filled both in there and then copy tm 30 stapled to passport.

One a diffrent tack now went into KK immigration yesterday to ask about this buisness of if you go on holiday in Thailand or leave country to renew visa or holiday. But return to address already on file do I need to come in here every time on my return. NO only if I change permanent address. So that's what I will be doing.

 

That has been my experience as well. I have lived all over in different circumstances and whenever a TM30 was required (applying for res cert, extension etc) immigration has got me or GF to complete one on the spot. Crackdown in CM for whatever reason. 

Owning a condo is good, because you are not relying on someone else to put in TM30

Edited October 13, 2016 by Peterw42

[KhonKaenKowboy]

yes, but when they give you a yellow book and national ID, based on your address, and after you got a cert of residence from Imm., a rational person might think they would already no where you are, let alone umpteen 90 day reports and arrival cards with the same address.  Let's face it:  it's worse than a Mexican cantina shakedown.

[SaintLouisBlues]

Isn't the requirement for visa extension that you "may" be asked for evidence of your place of residence and that's "usually" a lease or other legal document, rather than a TM30?

[KhonKaenKowboy]

proof of address has even been asked for doing a 90 day report...can even be an ISP bill.  I did a renewal last year and wasn't asked for squat, other than bank info/letter.  However, there are signs posted at CM Immigration saying you will need proof of tm30 for visa extension.....but that is the location where it is mostly marriage extensions...we will soon see if the charade continues at the Promenada office, where retirement extensions are done.

[Deepinthailand]

3 minutes ago, SaintLouisBlues said:

Isn't the requirement for visa extension that you "may" be asked for evidence of your place of residence and that's "usually" a lease or other legal document, rather than a TM30?

Which in my case is the yellow book and ID card along with the mrs blue book and ID card. There is no lease or any other official document

 

[Peterw42]

2 minutes ago, SaintLouisBlues said:

Isn't the requirement for visa extension that you "may" be asked for evidence of your place of residence and that's "usually" a lease or other legal document, rather than a TM30?

 

That has always been the case, but some recent reports that people have had extension denied because of no TM30. 

[user82374298374]

As a condo renter, am I therefore supposed to ring up my landlord, who lives off-premise, to inform him of my comings and goings?

[SaintLouisBlues]

2 minutes ago, Peterw42 said:

That has always been the case, but some recent reports that people have had extension denied because of no TM30. 

Which appear to be limited to Chiang Mai?

[Deepinthailand]

10 minutes ago, KhonKaenKowboy said:

yes, but when they give you a yellow book and national ID, based on your address, and after you got a cert of residence from Imm., a rational person might think they would already no where you are, let alone umpteen 90 day reports and arrival cards with the same address.  Let's face it:  it's worse than a Mexican cantina shakedown.

Quite agree but not all have yellow book or Id card and some people for best reasons known only to themselfs put one address on tm6 or register at one address with immigration then live at another I personaly know two guys who do this. No won't ask them why there buisness not mine. Which is really why all these discussions started in the first place but have detoured up and down and round and round. Because someone was caught living (full time not on holiday) at an address other than the one he registered (gone full circle now).

[Peterw42]

Just now, SaintLouisBlues said:

Which appear to be limited to Chiang Mai?

 

Yes, thats right. 

[KhonKaenKowboy]

yes, that is a similar issue, with reports of people being fined in Pattaya for that....wasn't sure it it was tm6 address or tm30 address...4000 thb was quoted.

[Peterw42]

1 minute ago, Deepinthailand said:

Quite agree but not all have yellow book or Id card and some people for best reasons known only to themselfs put one address on tm6 or register at one address with immigration then live at another I personaly know two guys who do this. No won't ask them why there buisness not mine. Which is really why all these discussions started in the first place but have detoured up and down and round and round. Because someone was caught living (full time not on holiday) at an address other than the one he registered (gone full circle now).

 

Probably a visa agents address. 

 

[Deepinthailand]

Just now, Peterw42 said:

 

Probably a visa agents address. 

 

Well he must have been living with him then as thats were he was arrested

[alexlm]

My TM30 are done online in minutes.

But the website is in Thai only.

[Peterw42]

2 minutes ago, alexlm said:

My TM30 are done online in minutes.

But the website is in Thai only.

What is the address for that ? Dont you need a special login ?

[Liquorice]

It's part of Immigrations 'Good Guys In, Bad Guys Out' drive.

 

Top bosses are now instructing offices to enforce the existing requirement for TM30, without any guidance, so every office is left to it's own interpretation of just when and how the Immigration Act requires a TM30 to be filed.

Chiang Mai IMHO have gone completely overboard in this respect, probably in fear of getting their <deleted> kicked by a higher authority.

 

My own interpretation is that a TM30 only requires filing when you first take up a permanent residence, change permanent address, or leave the Country and take up residence again. That is also the stance my own Immigration office.

When touring within Thailand borders it is the responsibility of the hotel, guest house to file the TM30.

Those who have a permanent registered address, should not have to refile under these circumstances when returning to their permanent address.

 

In the absence of clear guidance from the top, I'd advise each individual to check with their own office as to their interpretation and just under what circumstances they expect a new TM30 to be filed.

 

The TM30 should be filed by the House Master. However a house master is defined under section 4 as;

“ House Master ” means any persons who is the chief possessor of a house , whether in the capacity of owner , tenant , or in any other capacity whatsoever , in accordance with the law on people act.

 

I've lived in two separately rented accommodations and in the absence of my Thai landlords (lived in different provinces), completed and signed two TM30's, as the tenant. Both accepted without question.

I believe Immigration offices are more concerned with a TM30 being filed, to cover their backsides, rather than who files it.

Edited October 13, 2016 by Faz

[Peterw42]

32 minutes ago, Deepinthailand said:

Well he must have been living with him then as thats were he was arrested

 

There have been a couple of incidents in pattaya, some indian guys, registered address was a visa agents address and they where all living elsewhere.

[Liquorice]

22 minutes ago, alexlm said:

My TM30 are done online in minutes.

But the website is in Thai only.

 

That website is for business users, such as hotels or guest houses who may have any number of foreigners passing through daily, although I have heard of the odd exception where Immigration have set up an individual to log in to do the reports.

 

Perhaps the way to go, would be to open up the online reporting to all Thai householders to log in, just as foreigners can use the 90 day online reporting system. That would allow easier reporting to comply with the law, but demise their revenue from the fines they inflict.

Money is everything here, so that idea is probably a no brainer, although it may make common sense.

[KhonKaenKowboy]

CM wasn't letting non-condo owners do their own tm30, the other day, even though they may have been chief possessors of the home.  Panic time for those unable to get extension on the last day, and wouldn't know their landlord from Adam (or Somchai).

[bark]

3 hours ago, Peterw42 said:

 

Technically yes, but unless you have some business at immigration concerning the temp address then how would they know. 

He just told 20,000 people !  If he does not deposit 693 baht into my account, by 5:34 pm today.

I am telling on him. On second thought, I just gave 20,000 people the same idea, so tell him to make it an even 10 baht .