New SETV in my second passport?

[ChomDo]

Hi,

 

I have a uncommon question concerning applying for Tourist Visas with two different passports. So I have dual nationality (passports from 2 different EU countries) and I'm going to Saigon to apply for a SETV next week. My other passport is full off different kinds of Thai visas from the past 2-3 years and my other passport is totally empty (I just got it so it's blank). This would be my second consecutive SETV so should be no problem even with the passport I'm currently using but I would like to switch to use the new one now. So my question is that would it be a problem to apply for a SETV in Saigon with a totally empty passport. I mean they would probably ask where is the stamp to enter Vietnam at least?

 

I wonder what would be the best way to handle this. Just try with the empty passport and answer the questions if they ask. Or maybe just show both passports right away and tell them that I want the visa in the empty one.

[ubonjoe]

You will need to leave Thailand on the passport your entered the country with and enter Vietnam on the other passport. Then you can use your other passport to apply for the visa.

[ChomDo]

21 minutes ago, ubonjoe said:

You will need to leave Thailand on the passport your entered the country with and enter Vietnam on the other passport. Then you can use your other passport to apply for the visa.

The problem is that if I enter Vietnam with the other passport I need a visa for Vietnam. With my other passport I can enter without a visa. This is why the new passport would then remain totally empty and I wonder what they would say about that? 

[ubonjoe]

7 minutes ago, ChomDo said:

The problem is that if I enter Vietnam with the other passport I need a visa for Vietnam. With my other passport I can enter without a visa. This is why the new passport would then remain totally empty and I wonder what they would say about that? 

You could try but normally they want to see an entry stamp in the passport you apply for the visa with.

[ChomDo]

1 minute ago, ubonjoe said:

You could try but normally they want to see an entry stamp in the passport you apply for the visa with.

Yes I would understand that alright. Maybe I would then just show both passports and ask them if they could put the SETV in my new passport. 

[ChomDo]

This is a bit off the original topic but just wanted to update that using two different passports to enter Thailand does seems to work fine. My main passport was starting to give me problems because of all the exempt and TR visa stamps so I left on a holiday and entered Don Muaeng airport with my other passport (empty one that has no record of visits to Thailand). The immigration did not ask any questions so it seemed to me that they don't connect the two passports to one person. Sounds a bit weird to me but I'm sure they would have said something or asked about my other passport that's full of thai stamps?

 

If this really works then I can get a big advantage of having two passports by switching every now and again so that I won't have too many consecutive visas or exempt stamps in one passport.  

[JackThompson]

On 2/21/2017 at 0:03 PM, ChomDo said:

The problem is that if I enter Vietnam with the other passport I need a visa for Vietnam. With my other passport I can enter without a visa. This is why the new passport would then remain totally empty and I wonder what they would say about that? 

I would go ahead and get a visa to enter Vietnam, if you want to use the new passport.   They usually need a copy of your entry-stamp as part of the application-process.  If you show them the old passport, any advantage of not showing all those old visas/entries to Thailand is lost.

 

1 hour ago, ChomDo said:

I left on a holiday and entered Don Muaeng airport with my other passport (empty one that has no record of visits to Thailand). The immigration did not ask any questions so it seemed to me that they don't connect the two passports to one person.

Switching passports "in the air" is not a problem.  They may have connected the two passports in their system - that would not have necessarily resulted in any questioning upon entry.

 

1 hour ago, ChomDo said:

If this really works then I can get a big advantage of having two passports by switching every now and again so that I won't have too many consecutive visas or exempt stamps in one passport.  

It will definitely make it easier to get new Tourist Visas from consulates which limit how many they will allow in a particular passport.  But, I would not count on an assumption that entries in different passports will not all be tied to "you" in the Thai-Immigration database. 

OTOH, what an IO sees in the passport they are examining seems to have an effect on how they view the person requesting entry - so not seeing a slew of prior Thai-visas and/or exempt-stamps could still be beneficial.

[IMA_FARANG]

Obviously you are not a U.S. citizen.

What you describe is EXACTLY why when you get a new U.S. passport the U.S. embassy here in Thailand issues you a form letter asking Thai immigration to transfer or note in  your new passport that you have a current visa in our old passport, even if your old passport is effectively canceled by the new passport.

Not all nationalities have this service, but I have changed U.S. passports several times in Thailand. and I have had my  current visa "transferred" to my new passport at Thai immigration with this form letter.

Not that this  information will help you, but just so others know the correct procedure for new  U.S. passports.

 

Edited June 10, 2017 by IMA_FARANG
added a comment

[ChomDo]

3 hours ago, JackThompson said:

I would go ahead and get a visa to enter Vietnam, if you want to use the new passport.   They usually need a copy of your entry-stamp as part of the application-process.  If you show them the old passport, any advantage of not showing all those old visas/entries to Thailand is lost.

 

Switching passports "in the air" is not a problem.  They may have connected the two passports in their system - that would not have necessarily resulted in any questioning upon entry.

 

It will definitely make it easier to get new Tourist Visas from consulates which limit how many they will allow in a particular passport.  But, I would not count on an assumption that entries in different passports will not all be tied to "you" in the Thai-Immigration database. 

OTOH, what an IO sees in the passport they are examining seems to have an effect on how they view the person requesting entry - so not seeing a slew of prior Thai-visas and/or exempt-stamps could still be beneficial.

The Vietnam trip was months ago. That time I eded up using my main passport.

 

Now that I went to Bali on holiday I came back with my other (empty) passport. I would expect them to ask some questions if they can connect my two passports because my main passport was so full of Thai stamps that it was starting to cause problems. So if they do connect the two passports at the airport immigration it means that they allow you to have a "clean start" with the other passport even though they could see that with your other passport you could have problems. This doesn't make much sense does it.  

 

Well at least like you said I should have a much easier time getting TR visas from Thai embassies (such as Saigon where they were close to not giving me one last time saying that I have too many in my passport) now that I can switch between 2 passports.

 

My passports are both EU/Shengen.

[JackThompson]

13 minutes ago, ChomDo said:

. I would expect them to ask some questions if they can connect my two passports because my main passport was so full of Thai stamps that it was starting to cause problems. So if they do connect the two passports at the airport immigration it means that they allow you to have a "clean start" with the other passport even though they could see that with your other passport you could have problems. This doesn't make much sense does it.  

As to what would "make sense" ... I could go off on a long tangent about better (IMO) procedures for both visa-application processing and screening those entering.  As-is, we know there is a warning that comes up if you have more than 6 Visa-Exempts in recent years (since they started counting).  IOs also tend to examine every page in one's passport, in my experience, so one passes through more quickly with a newer passport.

 

In your case, it is possible the passports were not linked, or even if they were, that the IO's screen does not show all your activity by-default - only if they see something that causes them to look deeper.  Whether that "over 6 exempts" warning would transfer to a linked-passport - or a linked-passport for a different country - I don't know.

Edited June 10, 2017 by JackThompson

[ChomDo]

22 minutes ago, JackThompson said:

As to what would "make sense" ... I could go off on a long tangent about better (IMO) procedures for both visa-application processing and screening those entering.  As-is, we know there is a warning that comes up if you have more than 6 Visa-Exempts in recent years (since they started counting).  IOs also tend to examine every page in one's passport, in my experience, so one passes through more quickly with a newer passport.

 

In your case, it is possible the passports were not linked, or even if they were, that the IO's screen does not show all your activity by-default - only if they see something that causes them to look deeper.  Whether that "over 6 exempts" warning would transfer to a linked-passport - or a linked-passport for a different country - I don't know.

Sure Thai immigration policies and visa options don't make much sense to me either!

 

I suppose either they didn't connect my two passports or they did but felt no need to say anything as I don't have like consecutive TR's or exempts (I've been kind of alternating between the two). For the past few years I've been doing a few TR's per year and a few trips (real holidays not visa runs) plus always a one month holiday back to my home country in the summer so I guess there's no big issue with my main passport either. It's just that last time in HCMC consulate I did have a problem and had to explain a lot. After my next exempt stamp is done I fly back to my home country for a month and will get my next TR from there into my main passport again. After that expires will go on holiday somewhere out of Thailand and return with the other passport again and so on. I guess this gives me some advantage against the system.

[JackThompson]

23 minutes ago, ChomDo said:

Sure Thai immigration policies and visa options don't make much sense to me either!

 

I suppose either they didn't connect my two passports or they did but felt no need to say anything as I don't have like consecutive TR's or exempts (I've been kind of alternating between the two). For the past few years I've been doing a few TR's per year and a few trips (real holidays not visa runs) plus always a one month holiday back to my home country in the summer so I guess there's no big issue with my main passport either. It's just that last time in HCMC consulate I did have a problem and had to explain a lot. After my next exempt stamp is done I fly back to my home country for a month and will get my next TR from there into my main passport again. After that expires will go on holiday somewhere out of Thailand and return with the other passport again and so on. I guess this gives me some advantage against the system.

Yes.  All I would add, is that if you stay here frequently, I would avoid Visa-Exempts entirely, if possible.  Entering with a Tourist Visa is much less likely to result in problems.

[ChomDo]

4 hours ago, JackThompson said:

Yes.  All I would add, is that if you stay here frequently, I would avoid Visa-Exempts entirely, if possible.  Entering with a Tourist Visa is much less likely to result in problems.

Well the exempt stamps kind of come automatically sometimes as I go on holidays. I guess they mind those less if they see that you really went for a longer holiday than just a one or two day visa run right? Of course sometimes I also have to just force a short trip after a TR visa expires. I've been trying to mix it up a bit because a few consecutive TR's can give problems too. 

[JackThompson]

42 minutes ago, ChomDo said:

Well the exempt stamps kind of come automatically sometimes as I go on holidays. I guess they mind those less if they see that you really went for a longer holiday than just a one or two day visa run right? Of course sometimes I also have to just force a short trip after a TR visa expires. I've been trying to mix it up a bit because a few consecutive TR's can give problems too. 

The time out-of-country before returning is definitely helpful - it makes it harder for them to claim you "must be working illegally."   But using an exempt is never better than using a TR Visa in terms of scrutiny upon entry.

[ChomDo]

17 hours ago, JackThompson said:

The time out-of-country before returning is definitely helpful - it makes it harder for them to claim you "must be working illegally."   But using an exempt is never better than using a TR Visa in terms of scrutiny upon entry.

They way I've been doing it for the past few years (before I used to have a long term University ED visa for some 5 years) is pretty much one month holiday in my home country in the July-August during which I get a TR visa, then after that expires I go on a holiday somewhere and come back with an exempt stamp, after that go to get an easy TR from Vientiane or HCMC and then after that expires go on holiday again and return with exempt. After that circle it's summer again and time for a one months visit back home. It's a bit of a hassle but not too bad if you want to travel to other countries sometimes. It only becomes annoying when I don't want to go anywhere and I have to leave the country.