earthing for water pump to new board

[Joinaman]

Hi there

Newbie here again

looking to connect a new 150w water pump into board, but have laid 4 mm  3 core cable so want to connect the earth into the box if possible

there are only 3 earth connections to the top part and all are full

what is the strip to the left hand side for.? 

Would have thought the board would have 2 strips, one for neutrals and one for earths

also noticed the earth for the air con unit is not connected either so would like to connect that too

I also notice that as this site says, they just seem to use whichever colour they feel like using

The switch lives on some switches are blue, some are red

The board is earthed, in a fashion, in Red, to an outside earth spike, so would prefer to use the boards earth rather than add another outside spike next to the pump

have i had the wrong board fitted too, was fitted xmas time. Cos the breakers only break when you cross the wires, not when you stick your finger on a wire

( like silly bugger here did) so no safety  

also have a spare 10 amp and spare 16 amp breaker, which is best for 150 w pump

 

Thanks to everyone on here, spend hours on the  forums reading

 

 

[RichCor]

From viewing the image, the Board is wired "Thai Style".

 

The top BUS Bar, normally used for Earth-Ground connections, here is used for the circuit Neutrals

In addition, the Neutral INCOMER goes directly to the top Bus Bar and then is linked to the Incomer Main Breaker 

 

The Red Wire may be providing Earth-Ground but is undersized, when compared to the L-N incomers.

 

What is normally is used as the Neutral BUS (to the left of the incomer breaker) is unused, and gets its power connection directly from the Main Breaker.

 

IF you want this Board to provide Earth-Ground, then you need to get a qualified electrician in to rewire it.

All the circuit Neutrals would need to be moved to the proper Neutral Bus Bar

The incomer Mains Neutral would need to be moved so it goes directly into the Mains Breaker Neutral

The top Bus Bar could then be repurposed to be the Earth-Ground Bus Bar (as originally intended)

A suitable Earth-Ground wire running from an out-door Ground Stake needs to be installed and connected to the dedicated Earth-Ground Bus Bar.

 

A Neutral-Earth LINK can then be made in the Board.

 

Potentially, you'll then need to see what existing circuits would need to have an additional green-colored third wire run to the appliance or plug points to provide ground. 

[wayned]

And!!  Before that is done you need to add an RCBO to the front end as there is not one installed, so the breaker will only open when there is a direct short and not "when you stick your finger on a wire".  When you do that with your current installation, it might open but long after you have gone up in smoke!

[Crossy]

Arggh!

 

Yes, RichCor has it, that bar at the top is ground, the one to the left of the main switch is neutral, where all your appliance neutrals should go.

 

Oddly enough, the routing of the incoming neutral via the ground bar is correct, it's the Thai implementation of MEN. Counter-intuitive as it seems it's actually no different to the routing in a UK TN-C-S (PME) installation, but the N-E link is in the service-head where you cant see it.

 

[RichCor]

12 hours ago, Crossy said:

Oddly enough, the routing of the incoming neutral via the ground bar is correct, it's the Thai implementation of MEN. Counter-intuitive as it

I always prefer to have the mains incomer isolated via Double-Pole Double-Throw.  

 

I've come across too many CUs with the Mains incomer reversed, so the always connected Neutral is actually an always connected Live. Add in poor Earth Ground implementation and you have a working CU with shockingly high power bill.

 

Not that that's happening here. Well, hopefully not.

[Crossy]

4 hours ago, RichCor said:

I always prefer to have the mains incomer isolated via Double-Pole Double-Throw.  

 

I've come across too many CUs with the Mains incomer reversed, so the always connected Neutral is actually an always connected Live. Add in poor Earth Ground implementation and you have a working CU with shockingly high power bill.

 

Not that that's happening here. Well, hopefully not.

 

I too am not a great lover of TNC-S on overheads, too much risk of an open neutral causing some, er, interesting effects, and opening the main breaker won't have any effect

 

Nothing to stop you putting a 2-pole isolator right at the front end and then doing your MEN linking, even one of the Chang knife switches will do the job. Whatever happens any N-E link must be upstream of your RCD/RCBO or you'll never get the power on.

 

Once our OP has sorted his neutral issues he ought to be able to replace his incomer with an RCBO, I think the Schneider units will fit that box.

 

 

[Joinaman]

thanks for all the advice from everyone

Have connected the earths into the existing earth bar at the top for now, at least it should be better than nothing

it seems most of the house has no earths, with most thing wired in either 1.5 or 2.5 twin, but no earth to switches or sockets

the sparks was supposed to be qualified, he was working on some large offices when he was asked to do the work so assumes he was ok

but amazed when i came to checking out the board to find out what each breaker covered

it seems hes just joined anything he fancied together

looked in the roof space and its like spaghetti junction, with loads of wires twisted with caps on and then loads of tape to stop them falling off

We stopped using them about the 60 s in the uk

Going away for a few weeks to Aussie land so will try sort it out when i get back

Thanks again to everyone

 

[Crossy]

@Joinaman whilst you're in Oz grab a few bags of Wago push connectors http://global.wago.com/uk/solutions/building-automation/building-installation/branch-boxes/push-wire-connectors-junction-boxes/index.jsp you can get them here if you know where to go but they're likely cheaper retail in Oz.

 

One of those things up there with sliced bread :)

 

 

Modern wire-nuts (plastic with a wire thread insert) are far better than the old porcelain Scruits that we used to have in the UK, I do use them but only when the Wagos are out of stock.

 

Remember these?

 

 

 

 

[Joinaman]

will look for these while i'm there, thanks, left some of these in my workshop back home

Think i will be bringing lots of things back too, 

especially one of these, hate the basic testers i have found here, find these much easier and safer to use

Yup, im old nuff to remember those, still used to find them on some of the older houses after all these years, along with the rubber sheathed cables

Even remember working on a couple of houses taking out the old gas mantles and wiring in electricity, 

Thanks again

time for barbie and watch the kangaroos  again, lol