ScouseTommy

LOL fair enough apologies accepted good sir! What you have written proves my point "...it is politicians that are dysfunctional" and politicians drive policy. That policy does not have to be in line with the original intent of a constitution as long as it does not breach that constitution. I stand by everything I said in my post. I do not claim to be an expert at all, but the things i mentioned are historical fact. They are not something pulled out of thin air! What I wrote about is based on greed you are correct. However the US constitution you obviously love was in full force whilst this went on. Doesn't that imply (even a teency weency bit...) that this isn't a 'solid' constitution? I have done my research via gun laws which are enshrined in the second amendment of the constitution (are the people amending the constitution as brilliant as your vaunted forefathers?). I am against an average citizen buying and legally owning an assault rifle, so shoot me for my personal point of view! Anyway getting back on point for this thread, the original OP ridiculed all the previous Thai constitutions because they were 'corrupt or driven by greed'. He then put up the US version as a shining example and parody of excellence! I merely pointed out this was a bit silly and not true. As you said the US Gov't breach of early agreements and everything else was about greed, under policy from the White house and when the constitution was in force!! Exactly the same thing the original OP was saying about the Thai constitution! Last point, where in the constitution does it say it is fine to data mine and spy on your own citizens private (non- threat to national security) communications? It seems to be allowed though!

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And on a side note, what the bleep is up with rewriting the constitution ?? How about

taking a tip from America, a somewhat successful country. That is where a group of

brilliant people write up a constitution that is fair to all citizens, and then you stick to

it. These Thai constitutions may as well be written on dissolving paper, as historically

each new government rewrites it in order to maximize their looting of the country.

I agree with a lot of what was said, but the above!!! You lost all credibility when you started with Team America- world police! Written by brilliant men (debatable), fair to all citizens (blatant lie). As I remember it your constitution was fully functional when you tried to ethnically cleanse the continent of indigenous peoples! It was also in place when you signed agreements giving land to said people, then ripped them up in order to 're-claim' the land because gold had been found on it. Your constitution also gives everyone the right to bear arms (written in the wild west so understandable), never amended to recognise a modern world! This has lead to incidents like Columbine etc. Sorry, but I could go on and on with this. I don't want to seem like I hate Yanks, I don't! Your post was great until you turned condescending and written a load of old codswallop at the end! alt=whistling.gif>

So now you are a expert on the yanks constitution? The US constitution is solid period! It is the politicians that are dysfunctional not the constitution. As far as the gun laws go you should do proper research before you write like you know what you are talking about. I don't want to come across like I hate the yanks across the pond. Basically none of what you wrote is based on the US constitution it was based on greed pure and simple.

Huh? Me or him? unclear

Love the smell of the Thaksin knob slobbers soiling themselves over having a decent, effective man in charge, because the contrast with their hero couldn't be more striking.

Actually the similarity is far more striking than the difference. I don't want to go into who is more "decent" because that is meaningless nonsense. It's what you do that counts, not your intentions. But if you knew anything about Thai history, you'd recognize Prayuth as one of a long line of Thai autocrats with a plain spoken populist veneer, Thaksin is just the most recent precedent.

Do you do business here? Not a bloody noodle shop or prostitute bar. I do. About 26 million baht per month.

Over the last 2 years I have been going NUTS ready to move to Cambodia or Indonesia.

Now I am staying. Since June 1, things have changed so so so much. Not attitudes alone but REAL DECISIONS.

But what would you know?

Any chance of a Job and a share in 26m THB???

Does anyone on here know any details of what the individual projects were, and what they were supposed to accomplish?

I honestly am confused by this forum. Most of TV are farang. Yet I see more agressive (close minded) vitriol spewed on these forums than I do by the people who actually have a say! Why posters on here would be red/yellow or any other shade is incomprehensible to me. It is an absolute fact Thai politics was/is and probably will be institutionally corrupt.

Suthep and the Dems were corrupt. Although I will say the level of corruption didn't bring the country to its knees.

TRT and the boss man were corrupt (proven in court)

PTP were a very popular disaster. Inherently corrupt and unable to run the country.

THEY ARE ALL BAD!!!!

I should be reading sensible people debating the shades in between black and white. Instead I read hard core red shirts - from the U.S. and hardcore Yellows/dems from the U.K. Its ridiculous.

PTP needed to go, I wish it could have been done through the constitutional court, but they needed to go; before they destroyed the economy. I agree that the best course for Thailand is to see the Shin' clan out of politics for ever.I agree with addressing corruption, vote buying and fair elections. I even to some extent agreed with the coup as greedy politicians were acting like spoiled kids. Refusing to even speak to each other, whilst making grandiose statements and threats of armed conflict, on stages.People have been murdered using 'war weapons' and nothing was being done to stop this. (PLEASE lets not mention Chalerm the great and CAPO). The army have and are stabilising things. The worrying part comes with dissolution of civil agencies, like the senate, courts etc. It becomes a bit more disturbing when the constitution is suspended indefinitely. As 'farang' in this country we should be able to see all sides and the multiple shades of grey. Side taking because your wife is from Buriram and you hang out in the village, or your business is profitable and you hang in Thong lor is stupid, close minded and juvenile.

REDS admit your team were corrupt and nearly ruined the economy

Yellows (or whatever clan it is now) admit your team were corrupt and liked to centralize the cash in BKK and did pretty much nothing for the rural poor.

Once you have admitted these failings you can look at what good both sides may have done or wanted to do. Debate and comment on the grey area's. I would have no issues with a (professional, no lackeys) PTP government free from Shin influence. Likewise with a DEM government that actually acknowledges there are Thai people outside of BKK!

Before I end my rant and go up the road for a late brekky,

"Suthep" = megalomaniac! Supported the initial protests and the reasons behind them. However this man has sounded more and more irrational and dangerous the longer they went on. Refusing to talk with even the DEMS. Demanding he be the one to name an interim PM and cabinet? Stinks of nepotism and dictatorship. A peoples cabinet stinks of communism and we all know how successful that particular system is!

Rant over and I apologise if I insulted anyone. Enjoy your Sunday!

This is but the opening gambit of the ongoing process of piecing this election together. There are still polls to be held for Bangkok constituencies that were either partially or completely closed on February 2. And then of course are the eight missing provinces in the South - totaling 28 constituencies - which didn't have any registered candidates at all. That is the area of greatest contention between the Yingluck administration and the EC. The EC maintains that a new election decree would be necessary for those constituencies. Pheu Thai disagrees, so the EC has appealed to the Constitutional Court for a ruling. Until all these polls are held, the administration does not have a whisper of a chance of securing a 95 % parliamentary quorum. When the Constitutional Court declined to nullify the election last month, it was on the basis of Article 68, as the request was filed under Article 68. Article 108, however, will be the one that will decide this. In the meantime, Article 7 takes effect in three days, effectively cancelling the administration's caretaker status in lieu of a parliamentary quorum. Whether the remaining elections are scheduled or not, Article 7 and Article 108 will unquestionably be the focus of this month.

Sorry, Its Sunday and I am to lazy to look it up, exactly what do these articles you mentioned say?

Cheers

If Yingluck, and by the looks of it when, Yingluck goes the North breaking away would pretty much be the only thing stopping Thailand from falling apart at the seams and serious blood being spilled.

This has been quoted in the context of some kind of breakaway group that only involves the people of the North, which kind misses the wider picture of the feelings of the people in the Northeast.

If the people of Bangkok want to govern themselves and are willing to come out on the streets to remove an elected government, then the people of the North have the same right.

A form of devolution doesn't just make sense, it's pretty much the only way out of this mess without serious bloodshed.

I am not red or yellow, both camps have leaders that would do the country a favour if they dropped dead tomorrow. But this is payback time for Bangkok for years of neglecting the common people, they only have them selves to blame, or to congratulate, whichever way you look at it I guess.

Sorry, I think you are completely wrong! Do you honestly think Thailand, the army, the Monarchy, for that matter a PTP government would let the north secede? If they tried it then I think we would really see serious blood being spilled. I for one have seen enough death, and have no wish to see more! You are right when you say BKK has taken too much money from the country and ignored the North and North East. That does need to be remedied, by a non corrupt gov't. Unfortunately PTP were too busy feeding at the cash trough to help the people. Also payback time??? Who pays the taxes that fund all of the hospitals and schools in the rural north? It certainly isnt the north, it is BKK. Sadly I can't see the current crisis ending well, and I have no real answers to it. However secession or devolution would not help. They would in fact (probably..) start a civil war, and if that happened there would truly be no winners.

These people have said that they just want decentralisation, not secession. And if you want to bring examples from other countries into it, look at the case of self proclaimed secessionists in Scotland, Wales, Western Australia, or multiple places in Canada. In modern times, as valid or invalid as their causes may be, I have seen no calls for them to be put in jail.

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I know what you are saying, and in a way you are right. However can you imagine the Scottish, or for that matter the French Canadians descending on the capital cities, dressed and armed like an army. Can you imagine them attacking (violently and sometimes fatally) anyone who disagrees? Thailand is very different to the places you have mentioned. When that muppet in Scotland talks about secession even the scots laugh at him. When the UDD/red hrode/loveCM lot talk then everyone has to take notice, no matter how unlikely. They have shown a willingness to use violence and a complete disregard for human life. This means the army, the government and Thai's in general need to be a little concerned. Decentralisation is not the way forward for Thailand. As for free and fair elections, seriously? PTP and the reds and quite probably the dems down south, all paid for votes. Does this meet a free and fair standard? People have been forced out of the village to vote, and told who to vote for. My Ex-GF is from Khon Kaen and has been paid to vote. Anti-democratic actions have come from both sides, you really need to remove the red tinted spectacles you are wearing. Stopping people from voting (PDRC/PCAD) was undemocratic. Burning down central world, shooting people, throwing grenades, is also undemocratic, and thats not from "...the other side..."

Wow, ten thousand.

What happen to the other 5.990,000 protesters?

Seduced by the dark side?

Yep, 10,000 peaceful protesters looking for justice to the heartless killing of innocent children, as opposed to 4,000 government supporters in Nakon Ratchasima celebrating these same killings....

10,000 wow,... they're still gonna be outnumbered by a hundred fold by the Red shirts who are NOT affiliated with the rice farmers,.... need I say more.

Are you over the age of 18? Sorry just wondered, because the my dad is bigger than your dad thing is juvenile; just like you! As other posters have said it's not about the numbers. Any chance you can get that through your thick skull? It was about a campaign for justice, over the murder of little children. Are you against that? Were you among the 4000 idiots cheering this news earlier in the week?

Any chance the MODS can start a TV - juvenile for the kids?

Grow up!

only in Thailand can people with arrest warrants out against them sit down in front of the police for a chat and go home with no worries. TIT I wonder why the red shirts get a little pissed off when justice is metered out. i don't need to here from Suthep supporters claiming how bad the YS administration is, how none of the granade incidents or nightly shootings gets investigated and why no one is arrested by the police. they cant do their job because the elites have the support of the army and the police are affraid of getting killed by them. wouldnt it be great if the Army did step in and take out the roadblock to peace (Suthep), and then stand by while a government is formed and reforms of all agencies are completed. of course these reforms might take a couple of generations and the army would be sure they were not targeted along with their eliteist friends. Really folks the only way that I see a resolution to this madness is negotiations, where when everything is said and done both sides walk away with a sense of accomplishment. no one is holding a grudge or starts the own demonstration to overthrow the next government. No standing political pary or politician can be involved in the new government under the new rules. I added this just because none of them understand how a democracy is supposed to function. a government of the people and for the people. I know the US can not do it either.

Funny... Its not only in Thailand. It is in the Ukraine (early on), and it was in Egypt as well (early on). Protesters in the UK can call for soldiers to be beheaded for 'their' war on Islam. The US, well am just not gonna go there!

You don't wanna hear about grenades??? Good for you, shall we forget the children who were murdered, shall we? Maybe we should forget today's pictures of a Father, his life completely destroyed for shopping in a Big C with his kids?

If you want to be a politician go home and try it. However a lot of your comments are number one, insensitive and number 2 stupid! Do you honestly believe that if there is an election and PTP get in, there would be peace? You are deluded. Do you think if everyone agreed and the dems or PDRC got in there would be Peace? No the UDD would bring the men in black and the fire bombs and RPG's back to BKK. There is no easy answer but what you write above is definitely NOT the answer.

Granade = grenade

Eliteist = elitist

Pary = party

Affraid = afraid

I am just a bystander...but why doesn't anybody considers some sort of autonomy for certain provinces.

north and north east and south with extensive own goverment but with vetoright from bangkok.????

But as I said...I am just a bystander and T.I.T. thus never ask why.

Worth discussing among us????

Any options are worth discussing in the current situation. I think some autonomy down south might finally provide a bridge to some sort of resolution! However I dont believe it would work or is what is needed up North?

And what if the UDD has a legal protest? What if the UDD supporters come to Bangkok to make their views known? Why would their protest be any less legal than that of the PDRC?

The groundwork was laid when the lower court said the civil disorder caused by the PDRC was acceptable. The government's hands were tied. And now you want the government which was precluded from acting against the protestors who are violent, to act against possible UDD protestors who have yet to protest. Old saying: As ye sow, so shall yee reap.

Won't it be funny if they set up stages at those intersections leading to the current protest sites? That would mean the the (current) protestors would have to go through security checkpoints manned by the reds.

Things could get very interesting.

I take it you dont live in BKK? No it wouldn't be funny it would be a blood bath. I dont find death a laughing matter but it seems many UDDers do!

I do live in Bkk. In fact, I live right on top of the Asoke protest stage.

It won't be funny at all is there is a blood bath. I was also living here during the violence in 2010 but that would be nothing compared to what can possibly happen now. That's why it's time to stop the protests as they are not serving any more purposes (like I mentioned on another thread yesterday) other than to inconvenience normal residents and local businesses.

Then why make such an inane throw away comment? I live in the area as well. If you live there and you know all this it just makes your comment even more irrelevant!

Bringing Children to "Peaceful" protests, in not an uncommon thing, anywhere in the world. Bringing children to protests, where violence is expected, is a different story. I do believe, that most of these peaceful protesters in Trat, did not expect to get attacked by grenades and drive-by shooters. The following is a response from the PDRC...

People's Democratic Reform Committee - PDRC shared Kanok Ratwongsakul Fan Page's photo.

This courageous 8 year-old girl, critically injured in last night's slaughter in Trat province, has lost her life (this is reportedly an image of her from late last night). One more adult victim also passed away this morning bringing the current Trat fatalities to five (2 children, 3 adults).

This is the second child murdered in last night's bombing. The first was a 5 year-old girl. Our thoughts and prayers are with the families of all 5 deceased and of all those injured in this horrific attack. Again, we condemn the assailants and those behind the slaughter at Trat, and fervently hope that they are swiftly brought to justice.

...The sad thing is, that people are dying, because of a few very rich and very selfish people, on both sides.

Our condolences to the victims!

One of the very few honest and sensible replies i have read today so sad

The court has ruled the protest is legal. If Reds attack protestors, the Royal Thai Police need to put a stop to it quickly. Every time they don't arrest perpetrators, they add credence to the PDRC's claim that the RTP needs to be overhauled. Even the Caretaker government is discussing things with the courts (Rule of Law).

And what if the UDD has a legal protest? What if the UDD supporters come to Bangkok to make their views known? Why would their protest be any less legal than that of the PDRC?

The groundwork was laid when the lower court said the civil disorder caused by the PDRC was acceptable. The government's hands were tied. And now you want the government which was precluded from acting against the protestors who are violent, to act against possible UDD protestors who have yet to protest. Old saying: As ye sow, so shall yee reap.

Won't it be funny if they set up stages at those intersections leading to the current protest sites? That would mean the the (current) protestors would have to go through security checkpoints manned by the reds.

Things could get very interesting.

I take it you dont live in BKK? No it wouldn't be funny it would be a blood bath. I dont find death a laughing matter but it seems many UDDers do!

Why are people taking children to these protests? I have a five year old daughter and therefore those pictures of her in the hospital hit me pretty hard. I remember in 2010, people holding screaming babies above barricades in Bangkok. Leave the kids at home!

She was eating at the noodle stall in the maRKET not protesting

And even if she was at the Protest site, She didn't deserve to be shot!

It appears she was hit by shrapnel from grenade thrown at PDRC guards eating at the noodle stall.

She was not shot.

Although I understand for those trying to spin this for their gain saying she was shot sounds more dramatic. if the headline were that she was an innocent bystander hit by shrapnel from a grenade thrown at PDRC guards eating at the stall where she was by unknown attackers - its less helpful to the PDRC cause perhaps................

Its terrible she was killed and all violence needs to be condemend.

All in my opinion of course.

I am not spinning anything. Both sides disgust me. However what disgusts me more are farang posters who try to spin EVERYTHING to suit their politics. I apologize for typing shot, however reports are conflicted. However IT DOESN'T MATTER! What matters is there is a little girl who is now DEAD!

Can we please stop posting show us your evidence? There is none due to a lack of any investigation by Police, who are led by the CMPO. Also I think red snakes posts are horrible. However lay off him at least his latest post is completely sensible and to the point regardless of politics!

Why are people taking children to these protests? I have a five year old daughter and therefore those pictures of her in the hospital hit me pretty hard. I remember in 2010, people holding screaming babies above barricades in Bangkok. Leave the kids at home!

She was eating at the noodle stall in the maRKET not protesting