crobe

"cutting a tree without permission" ????

High crime, must be worth at least 5 years

1 minute ago, natway09 said:

Also I hope Thai leased them, not rented them

53 of the 74+ planes that they have are on lease, the others are bought

Not counting the A340s that are still lying around somewhere

2 minutes ago, worgeordie said:

Who is going to be buying ......

regards Worgeordie

Vayapuk - local Thailand pension fund

You can tell who they are, they are the ones with the CEO who has his arm twisted up his back

5 minutes ago, Fex Bluse said:

The bankruptcy court will allow authorities to seize other Thai assets. Also, they may be banned from future purchase of aircraft. They cannot hide. 

It is difficult to know exactly what will happen under the rehabilitation plan, but as far as I am aware the reason to rehabilitate under the bankruptcy court is exactly to afford them protection from creditors - i.e. creditors cannot seize their assets while the process is ongoing.

The fact that they are doing this inside Thailand rather than also filing for chapter 11 etc. leaves it open to interpretation as to whether creditors could get a local court order and seize Thai assets outside of Thailand

It would be wise not to pay for a trip from Paris to Bangkok on Thai as the plane may not take off.

In all seriousness though, one of the first settlements they will try to achieve is with the aircraft easing in order that the company can still fly once restrictions are eased and some cashflow can come in - but of course this would be a sensible thing to do.

9 minutes ago, TopDeadSenter said:

Think they lease these planes from a Guernsey reg company Amedeo Air 4+. Amedeo have been issuing RNS's as the situation unfolds with Thai airways impending bankruptcy.

They only lease 4 A350s from Amadeo

Company update from Amedeo Air Four Plus (AA4):

“Further to the announcement on 12 March 2020, the board notes the news that almost all airlines globally have been severely impacted by the reduction in passenger traffic as a result of covid-19 and understands that many Governments, banks and lessors have received approaches from these airlines to discuss how they might support the industry.  Indeed, the company has, in line with this news, received a written approach from Thai Airways, to whom the company leases four A350s, to discuss how it might support them in this period. The board, together with its asset manager and other advisors, are discussing how the company might respond, and considering the terms of any such support.  Thai have assured the company that, as the flag carrier of Thailand, it fully commits to its obligations, and they are fully up-to-date with their payments to the company.  As and when these discussions reach any conclusions the board will update shareholders accordingly.”

3 hours ago, Why Me said:

There is no Thai Chana app, at least as of now in Playstore. And you can scan the QR code with any app. It opens a link to the Thai Chana website  where you tap the green button for confirmation.

The app is called MorChana on the play store

But it is only in Thai at the moment

11 minutes ago, tropo said:

I've been here for 15 years and note that it has been improving (pre-covid, that is)

 

You're looking at Pattaya from a different perspective. As a sex tourist destination it has been getting worse for 15 years, with that I will agree... but while you'd been lamenting the decline of the sex industry, many 5 star hotels had gone up and a number of shopping malls. For non sex tourists, the place had improved by a significant degree. It might not be your thing, but for many it is.

 

Pattaya will never be the same again. This pandemic could be the catalyst to turn Pattaya into a "proper" tourist destination. If the International tourists don't come, then it will become a domestic beach resort. It will eventually find its own level after a lot of heartbreak and financial tourmoil.

You're right - things change and the perspective also changes

I lived in Amsterdam in the mid 80s and go back there now it seems a lot more touristy and less bohemian than I remember - but on the other hand people who were there in the 60s say it was so much different then

Pattaya is going through a similar transformation but is still interesting.

12 minutes ago, jimmybcool said:

I have never been to any of those (well Angeles for 3 days).  Have spent about 10 years in Pattaya.  So honest question not argument.  

 

IMO the reason Pattaya exploded wasn't just the sex trade.  Or cheap booze.  Certainly they were a MAJOR factor in it.  But the other areas were the beach (yeah Pattaya beach sucks but it's still the ocean and clean ones available locally and it is WARM year round), the fact one could party and get hookers SAFELY (no arrests or pimps banging down doors), the mixture in the local expat community and the numerous surrounding golf courses.

 

IMO the greatest killer of Pattaya is the currency issue.  If the value of foreign currency is high, and single (or not) men with money and the urge to enjoy a nightlife of debauchery and golf in the daytime Pattaya will do fine.  So is there another place that provides all of these features?  I'm open to new travels.

 

 

On Siem Reap I am especially curious.  I have friends who went to play golf.  Problem is I think there is only one course and it is pricy.  Night life?  

 

 

I am sure you are more interested in this area, and I have also spent a few trips in Angeles, but it is difficult to find the same mix of golf, beer and hookers as you have around here.

Further afield I was once sailing with friends around Spain and we put into Fuengirola, halfway between Torremolinos and Marbella, just as they were having their "beer party" weekend - ended up in a lot of drinking with a golf group from Cork, and there were girls around...

One of the best couple of days I have had

15 minutes ago, Leaver said:

I have been to Issan, many times.  Even into the small villages.  I have been the first foreigner ever seen by children, on many occasions.  I doubt your travel around Thailand, and the region, is as extensive as mine.

 

So, you have now finally said something about Pattaya, and not about me, or yourself. 

 

You say, "not as many as before."  Care to give a percentage of establishments remaining open, to those remaining closed?

 

You say western tourist numbers will be down.  Care to say what that will do to establishments catering for westerners here?

 

You say, "quite a few small restaurants, shops, bars and markets will disappear."  Once again, how many is "quite a few?" 

 

You say, "they will probably be redeveloped fairly quickly into new hotels , shops or yes, god forbid, condos."  For who?  Chinese, Indians and Russians?  More zero baht tourists. 

Getting desperate now aren't we.

You have my answer which is objective about the future of Pattaya, not tainted with bitterness like yours

2 minutes ago, BritManToo said:

Those places aren't really known for beer and hookers ................. why would anyone want to go there?

Because there is more to Thailand, and in fact Pattaya, than just beer and hookers which is the point of the OP

27 minutes ago, Leaver said:

I have also traveled, extensively, throughout the region, and particularly Thailand.   Have you even been to The Full Moon Party on Koh Phangan?  I have, despite my age.  I take it you have not seen what "change" the Chinese brought to Sihanoukville because you have never been there.  Correct? 

 

Working around the region is different to traveling around the region.  If you've worked with governments here, you haven't done a very good job, have you?  ???? 

 

I asked if you have seen the hundreds of daily renters outside The Base, and there's no response.

 

Yet, you post a photo of a new condo block being built, and then personally attack me.  Do you actually have any opinions, thoughts, predictions, hopes, concerns etc about the hospitality and / or tourism here, or all you have is personal attacks on myself? 

 

I'm thinking you have too much skin in the game. 

 

How about you play the post, not the poster. 

 

What do you think Pattaya will look like, 6 months from now? 

The few things that you have seen - Sihanoukville - are not the whole world as they seem to be to you, if you want to play the "have you ever been to" game, then have you ever been to Loei, to Trat, to Ubon or spent songkran in a small town 20 years ago where you were the only falang?

I also go to many more parts of Cambodia than just Sihanoukville that you know. 

Or have you ever been to French Guyana or Tuvalu - both places I happened to be in last year - No - I thought not - so don't try to trade experience with me as you obviously don't have any.

The fact that you only talk about WS, Soi 6 and Sihanoukville - your words not mine - shows the limited and blinkered outlook you have.

If you want to know what Pattaya will look like in 6 months time then I will tell you - much the same, there will still be bars and restaurants catering to Thais, expats and some some tourists, though maybe not as many as before.

There will be Chinese tour parties back, some more Indians and Russians, but on the whole the number of westerners will continue to fall.

And quite a few small restaurants, shops, bars and markets will disappear, but unlike in the US with the closed down malls or the UK with the boarded up high streets, they will probably be redeveloped fairly quickly into new hotels , shops or yes, god forbid, condos.

3 minutes ago, Pattaya46 said:

Aren't you confusing the App and the QR code system?

Actually no. It confused me at first.

The small restaurant in Bangkok asked first for the Thai Chana app, and if you did not have it they also had the QR code to use for signing and you can do that with Line.

39 minutes ago, Phil McCaverty said:

https://thepattayanews.com/2020/05/15/thai-culture-minister-and-former-pattaya-mayor-speaks-on-future-potential-re-opening-of-entertainment-venues-massage-shops-bars-etc/

 

 "Mr. Ittipol said that if the number of Covid-19 Coronavirus cases do not increase drastically in the country and that businesses allowed to open are seen following the safety and hygiene standards set then Phase Three would likely begin on or around June 1st.

Mr. Ittipol said Phase Three planning will be done over the next several weeks, is highly likely to include entertainment and bars"

Although at the current time I believe that bars and entertainment are listed under phase 4 - but they can change this

39 minutes ago, Bob A Kneale said:

They don't insist on that for other businesses so why do you think they'd insist on it for bars?

They started off saying it was only for shopping malls to limit the number of people inside, but government representatives have been telling more businesses that they have to use it - shops outside malls, supermarkets outside of malls and restaurants - I was in a restaurant on Monday which seats 20 people and they were saying they had been told to use it.

So if small restaurants have to do it, what is the betting they will also say it is necessary for bars - the same logic applies.

While people are allowed to sign in with D. Duck or Michel Souris then it will defy the objective and you can be sure that establishments will be threatened with closure if they do not make everyone comply (if you sign in rather than with the app you have to show ID).

Use the app or don;t go to the bar - there is the dilemma

1 hour ago, Leaver said:

I would stack up my travel around Thailand, and South East Asia, against yours, any day.  I am guessing you are one of the guys that only know Pattaya, and Isssan.  Never been anywhere else, certainly not to any of Thailand's competitors.   

 

Now, when you say maybe some of the condo's will be used as AirBnb daily rentals.  Have you seen the crowds of people, mainly Chinese, waiting to check in, at all hours of the day and night, to The  Base?  Have you seen it, with your own eyes?  Not "maybe some" but hundreds, every day.  The Base has over 800 condo's.  The photo of the building in your post will no doubt be used for daily rental also.   

 

Yes, the new building is worth more than the old buildings that were there.  What is your point?  

 

I have only been living here full time for a couple of years, but have been here many times over many years.  I am not nostalgic about Pattaya.  I see Pattaya for what it is.  

 

Talking about change, have you been to Sihanoukville in Cambodia since the Chinese took the place over?  I'm guessing you haven't.  Google it.  Do you think a similar change here would be good?

 

Yes, change happens, but changes should happen in accordance with the law, and companies should not be allowed to build large condo blocks and then have them used like a hotel, whilst law abiding small hotels and guest houses in the area go broke.

 

 

Leaver,

Don't talk about something you know nothing about

I have lived and worked in various countries in Europe, South America and Asia, and travel constantly around this region.

I have lived and worked in this area for the last 15 years, so I do know it quite well, not as well as some who have been here longer

I have welcomed visiting kings here, worked with the last 4 governments and yes, I have also visited the bars and clubs.

If all you know are the bars and soi 6, and sihanoukville as you say in your posts, then that just goes to prove what a limited outlook on life you have

1 hour ago, Moonlover said:

To which '101 people infected in quarantine' are you referring to?

In the report given today by the government spokesman

"The largest number of infected returnees in quarantine facilities was 65 from Indonesia, followed by 10 from Pakistan, five from the United Arab Emirates and three from Malaysia. There were a total 101 infected returnees in state quarantine."

I cannot include a link to the publication here

12 minutes ago, Leaver said:

As I said, you are another one playing the poster and not the post.  I have said I am not bitter.  I have nothing to be bitter about. 

 

Now, the photo of the new building you posted, if it's going to be also used for daily rental, what will that do to hotels in the area? 

You have a pretty limited view. You should get out more and see places other than bars and restaurants in a limited area.

Maybe some of the apartments in this new condo block - like those at the Base, or Centric or Posh - are used for AirBnB, and maybe some of the cheaper and older hotels may disappear but this is inevitable as evolution happens - small shops also disappeared when they built Terminal 21, but the fact is that the value of this development is many, many times what was there before, and that includes money incoming from outside.

Maybe you are bitter because Pattaya is not like it was when you arrived, many people have rose-tinted glasses in hindsight, some other think it was better when it was a fishing village - and post threads in the hope that a global collapse will return it to that state (it won't).

Change happens - but some things still remain - it is the way of all things

Something not adding up in these figures

90 people still under treatment in hospital but 101 people infected in quarantine. Are these not included in the total cases?

8 minutes ago, Leaver said:

In case you haven't noticed, they have been the hot topics for some time now, and property is always a debatable topic.  Everyone speculating what will happen, and what the future holds for Pattaya's tourism industry. 

 

I post on several topics, but have you noticed if a Thai kills his wife, it gets the usual Thai bashing for a few pages, but if a foreigner kills a bar girl, the forum lights up.   I tend not to post too much on these tragic threads, only just suggesting a possible set of circumstances or motive, but many take aim with the usual "quality tourist" comments like they forget where they are living.  The availability of drugs, sex, and alcohol, and the affordability of these, draws undesirables to Pattaya. 

 

I am the first to admit I am not living in a nice city, but it's by choice.  Pattaya is not the place to be wearing rose colored glasses. I see Pattaya for what Pattaya is, and I post according to my knowledge, experiences, observations, and opinions.

 

 

If all you can post is bitterness then probably time for a life change

Look back on your posts and take an objective view, is it just commentary or is there something underlying there that you need to fix

44 minutes ago, steelepulse said:

How do we lockdown and social distance for idiots on the road?

Autonomous vehicles - not perfect but would cut down the number of deaths by around 90%

Only way to go

On 4/22/2020 at 12:07 PM, newnative said:

     Well, if you're calling RIP for Pattaya you'll need to do the same for many other beach resorts and other tourist destinations dependent on foreign travelers.  Although many of the posters seem to think only Pattaya has been impacted by the virus, that is, of course, not the case.  The New York Times did an article pointing out the severe impact the virus has had on tourist destinations in the Caribbean and Mexico.  It's the same in other tourists spots dependent on foreign travelers with many countries shut down and air travel mostly halted.   

     Pattaya, like all these other tourist destinations, and many other towns and cities, is in for some very slow months ahead.  No doubt about it.  But, dead?  No.  When I look out my window at night I see hotels with no lights on.  However, I see lots of lights on in the condos I can see.  People are still here. This was clearly evident when the Chinese tours were halted.  The tour group Chinese were gone from the streets but there were still lots of farangs around--all the many long-term expats, the winter escape Europeans, and lots of Russian families, among others.  That's a good base to start with, along with all the local Thais and visitors from Bangkok and other parts of Thailand. 

      I have to laugh at the posters who claim Pattaya was dying even before the virus hit.  As has been said many times, Pattaya has not been dying but has been evolving into a different resort that draws far more visitors that do not hang out at the bars and go gos.  Many of these tourists spend the majority of their time in places like Wong Amat, Naklua, and North Pattaya and seldom go further south than Central Festival.  Walking Street?  What's that?  They're not on WS--they're at T21 and the entertainments in that area.  What is less important now to the health of Pattaya is the western male tourist, surpassed many times over by Chinese, Korean, Indian, Middle Eastern, Russian, and those from other Asian countries, many traveling as families. 

      Long ago and far away, when Pattaya was a much smaller city, western male tourists were the main squeeze.  Sorry, posters, that is no longer the case.  Let's have a minute of silence and then let's finally move on from the myth of the western male importance to Pattaya's well-being. 

      If you know someone who lives at Centric Sea, ask them to take you to the sky pool at Building A.  I think it's floor 45 and from there you can see forever in all four directions.  With a few exceptions here and there, just about everything you see that is 20 stories or more has been built in the last 10 to 12 years.  It's quite a lot--and it's astounding.  I remember doing just that when I lived at Centric--went to all four sides and pointed at so many highrises that weren't built when I arrived in 2010.  It really is quite amazing when you take it all in.  Just Wong Amat alone looks like a small city with all it's new towers.  None of these--and things like Terminal 21--were built for western male tourists.  Sorry, again, but that's the reality.  That's not to say that western male tourists aren't still important--they are but they are no longer the big cheese. 

      When travel opens up again, whenever that might be, Pattaya will once again attract the travelers it was getting pre-virus.  Big projects like Grand Centre Point 2, apparently still going forward, will continue the trend towards family tourists, destination weddings, and young, small group travel.  Certainly it will be a slow process to pick up--as it likely will be with many other tourist destinations--but the things that were attracting large numbers of new types of tourists to Pattaya before will still be there.  

     

Agree with all of this - it is an evolution - areas that were small bars, shops and restaurants are being redeveloped. ScubaScuba is right - there was until the end of last year a heyday for the gogo bars - more than ever before - on LK Metro there used to be one gogo and many beer bars - now almost all of the beer bars have been converted to gogogs. Whther that will remain the case will be seen.

Leaver - in his bitterness - thinks that all there is to Pattaya is 5 or 6 tourist streets where the small bars will close down - they may do - but they will be replaced with developments like the Egde across from the Hilton on 2nd road - both of which used to be small bars and restaurants.