DualSportBiker

I think we need to bifurcate the user-group! 

There are plenty of generally younger lads on small and noisy bikes that are a nuisance. They ride all hours of the day, make more noise than motion, and obviously don't care about safety because they wear flip-flops and light clothing. I discount this group because I am an unashamed snob and don't consider them bikers. They are people on bikes. However, people on small bikes with the gear and the mindset are most welcome in my definition of bikers... I digress.

The rest of the 'market' is not easily lumped together, but I'll do just that... Most 'bikers', being people who actively take steps to be safe, visible, ride mainly for the fun of it, or also for the fun of it, make conscious decisions about safety. Pipe efficiency and therefore noise is one of the decisions made. However, loud pipes are also a choice of those who just want to be heard. How do you distinguish? You pretty much can't unless you talk to them... Most bikers I know do not ride at night, and do not red-line in every gear. At night I am disturbed by as many modified pipes on Honda Preludes as on Honda Waves.

What does it all mean? Who knows, but most of you complaining are doing so to the wrong people. The bikes that wake you up and make conversation impossible when they pass are not represented here and they don't care about safety. Those here with loud pipes have a valid argument that they increase driver awareness of their presence. As for horns, I've been chased by cars for using my horn 'at' them, so I don't consider that a failsafe alternative... 

Until you naysayers have ridden bikes with loud pipes and witnessed a car react, you cannot definitively state that the claim is ridiculous. This is very much a 'live and let live' scenario...

I am undecided. When in my noisy Land Rover I can still hear loud bikes behind me, so I am not convinced that they are not audible where needed. It is clear that the loudest place to be is behind them, however in narrow or crowded streets sounds reflects forward. I have certainly heard bikes behind me on many occasions here...

My pipes are stock and not terribly loud. I chose to be bright instead, and all 4000 lumens go forward at the mirrors of those holding me up...

Lisa Thomas of the Simon and Lisa Thomas 2ridetheworld team swears by loud pipes. She has ridden 600,000 km over 12 continuous years in 80 countries. As she is both sensible, and smart as well as more experienced than most, I give her opinion considerable weight.

Dualsport and adventure riders stand…


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Riding my F650 GS. Heavier but lower than your Versys. Less momentum at 20 than 100+ for sure, maybe I was riding too slowly? 

I have 8 moderately large dogs, but that does not mean taking risk on their part. Any dog in the street is a hazard until in the mirror, and owners that let them roam are criminally liable in my book... Mine are locked away on my property and unfortunately lack proper exercise because walking 8 is a logistical nightmare. Don't need to lock the house though :)

19 minutes ago, Kwasaki said:

 

Well l don't know what you were riding l was being explicit with my post l don't liked stray four legged shit machine dogs but l not want have to kill them in this way.

l was on a major road on my Versys coming out of my village and usually go faster and keep clear of car & trunks so probably 120 kph or more shut off when the dog appeared and traffic was coming from the opposite direction.

Not sure if I could have done anything about it either but l am not curious l am not gonna kill myself to save some proxy dog that an owner takes no care of and lets out on a OO licence to possibly injure or kill a road users, maybe dog lovers here agree but with some l doubt it..

 

Were you going fast when you hit the dog on your Versys? I was going 20 perhaps, the dog hit the rear half of my front wheel. Not sure if I could have done anything about it, but curious...

12 minutes ago, Kwasaki said:

I always plod slowly in soy's on my scoot or Versys because of kids and dogs darting out from places,  last year on a main road caught a dog that dashed out from the front of a parked truck with my left crash bar,  the Versys a heavy lump so didn't affect it much,  glancing in the mirror saw the dog still,  was gonna turn around but thought better of it,  forget when but some years before hit another dog in much the same way in the car and it smashed the front spoiler 2000 baht to replace. 

My soi is a cut-through between two main roads - the coffee shop is on one of them, hence a bash-hat. I'd normally wear a jacket to go further than the coffee shop, and touring boots if I go beyond that.

Many years ago I took my nephews to the ER at a local hospital here. I asked one of the Drs to explain how many accidents he thought might have been walk-aways if the rider had been wearing shoes and/or gloves and/or a helmet. He showed them a few pics of missing toes, gashed heads, skin removed from hands... Did the trick. Also worked well as a reminder for me.

Boring, perhaps, even AR, but the simple facts are most accidents are local, and the injuries can be avoided by gloves, shoes and a bash-hat. "Too hot" is not an excuse I entertain...

2 minutes ago, robblok said:

wow... your smarter then me.. i use the bike a lot instead of walking to the front of the village.. but as long as i stay in the village i dont use my helmet. You did for a 400 meter ride.. well done it must have saved you a lot of grief.

I've always thought that a loose dog or a moped leaving a market would be my downfall. Market hours up-country require extra caution... Yesterday I was proven right.

Less than 100 meters from my front gate, lazily taking the bike for coffee rather than walking 400 meters in light drizzle, I was knocked off by a dog scampering out from under a truck. Lost the front wheel while standing on the pegs, went down to the right on my hip, side and head. My helmet did its job, the rest of me was not covered. 

I have a bruise on my hip that looks like half a ripe mango was grafted onto me, my ribs are sore enough that laughing, coughing and sneezing are not a laughing matter - certainly nothing to sneeze at! Bike is pretty much fine; crash bars did their job...AGV helmet needs replacing now.

So may I take this personal reminder to remind  y'all to watch out for dogs - they can be tricky. Oh, and slow down for markets between 4 and 6ish - seems like everyone leaving a market has to turn right or is going to make a u-turn in front of you...

Safer travels chaps! Bruised, but not Beaten!

No complaints on my stock seat - like Kwasaki, I had mine raised slightly. When I ride, which is rarer and rarer these past 2 years, I do 600 k.m. a day without a problem... get a bigger bike or a smaller butt! Or custom seat of course

So you prove that DUI is dangerous... hard to be sympathetic, and easy to discount your opinion on the dangers of bikes.

I rode to Rangsit today - had the chance for a beer after a little project was successfully completed. I won't touch a drop within 4 hours of riding - not worth it. I've ridden at night twice in the last 6 years; Bkk to Nong Khai on a Friday afternoon, and Hot to Samoeng. Again, there is no point to risk it. At least you didn't do yourself serious harm like this poor chap.

8 minutes ago, evilebxxx said:

To be fair I was most intoxicated  and slippery clay roads with deep holes, rice drying spread on asphalt roads, a sudden 80 degree curve after a long straight lime without any landmark, unlit roads and so on

Really? Your crashed once every 5 trips? Makes sense that you got a car, consider a stroller... 

I have perhaps 100,000 k.m. on bikes here, half in Bkk in the 90s when I commuted, and half exclusively up-country on 1-5K trips 2 days to 2 weeks in length... The 10K k.m. I clocked up in Singapore on a Vespa were more dangerous than here.

You pays your penny and makes your choice. I'd rather be outside, immersed, excited and exposed that locked in a cage. My choice. Most bikers don't need eunuchs telling us how dangerous it is - it's dangerous because of the cars on the roads, not the other bikes... more or less...

3 hours ago, evilebxxx said:

20 years ago when I reside in Bangkok I had a motorbike, I had on average 20% chance of an accident or or a minor mishap each trip

4 hours ago, Brer Fox said:

I feel a bit sad for your sake that you are unable to understand English. I was referring to myself a one who ingests alcohol. I made no mention of it not being a drug. In fact I implied that it was a drug.

Nice try but FAIL. I am sure your attempts at insults can improve with more practice. 

 

I don't partake of ganja or any other drug (alcohol not included) so what is the point of your final unoriginal smartass comment? 

Flummoxed - how is this not stating alcohol is not a drug? You only clear statement you make is you don't do drugs and included ganja in that statement. "Alcohol not included" means either you consider alcohol excluded from your initial statement of definition, i.e., it is not a drug, or excluded from your statement of action i.e., you do consume it, or both.

2 hours ago, Brer Fox said:

I don't partake of ganja or any other drug (alcohol not included) so what is the point of your final unoriginal smartass comment? 

Keep deluding yourself that alcohol is not a drug. Are you such a slave to the definitions dictated by government? Tobacco, alcohol are defined as legal, so you don't call them 'drugs'. Nice job thinking for yourself...

2 hours ago, MJCM said:

 

What about this ? (Just guessing though)

 

They know what number the Sim Card has and who owns it. So every time the Phone connects to a Cell Phone Tower, the Computer of the provider transmits this info to whatever agency is tracking the Foreigners. However ONE major FLAW with this is that it's not very accurate.

A cell phone is typically connected to 2 or 3 towers at any time, especially in towns. Data and voice is transmitted to the tower with the strongest signal. Location accuracy based on GPRS is highly variable. Where towers are densely packed, it can be quite accurate, and has the advantage of penetrating buildings.

GPS is more accurate, but the signals from the satellites are weak, so cannot be used in a building. It is prone also to errors in heavy cloud and areas with dense buildings. The antennae on phones are small, making connection with multiple GPS satellites harder, and reducing accuracy. I've not read any technical papers on this for a while, but the ideal approach is to use both GPS and GPRS to get an accurate location when in the open. Only GPRS can give locations in a building...

One last thing. Each SIM only connects with towers from the provider the user subscribes to, i.e., True, AIS, etc. It is feasible to have a 'ping only' connection to all providers' towers. That would increase accuracy dramatically. 

High temperatures reduce efficiency in solar panels. They do work here, but not as well as on cooler climates…

There are only a couple of files you need on the SD card for this to work. Get a new card and PM me. I'll guide you through the files you need/send them to you.

is this easy to put on a 5 year old Garmin GPS for a car ?

it uses a SD card that is missing

thanks

You are clueless.

You suggest that only riders abuse the rules and are dangerous and that they endanger everyone. I suggest you revisit the video of the truck that ran through several bikers at a lights down south in late May. Some of those riders were not wearing helmets. The penalty for breaking the law is a legally provisioned sanction, not extra-judicial physical abuse or killing. It cannot be argued that a rider in a tunnel is to blame for his death by a drunk driver losing control of his vehicle. If a car were in his place with a child in the front seat - who would you blame?

The penalty for riding in a tunnel is a fine, period. His death is the result of a crime that supersedes his misdemeanour. Had the accident happened elsewhere, this would be clear to you. Despite this you lean on the riders minor infraction to impart blame for anothers abject abuse of the law. You accuse the rider of being reckless when there is no justification for it. He was not speeding, he was left in his lane (legally correctly, tactically wrong), and had a helmet on. The accident could be recreated on any two-lane road - no logical or physical differentiation with the actual accident. The only difference is the legal status of the bike.

Do you think that any of the car drivers know which tunnels bikes can use and which they cannot? Why are some free for all and some restricted? Would that change the behaviour of the car drivers? No. They would still expect bikes to be there, regardless of the law. Same for bikers not riding in the suicide lane. They know there will be a parked car around a blind corner as the driver relieves himself at the side of the road. That's why bikers don't use that lane...

The pickup driver should be charged with drink driving and manslaughter (if that charge exists in Thailand) but I hope other bikers heed this as a warning to follow road rules. Bikers flaunt almost every road rule there is. The rule against bikes going into the tunnel was probably put in place to stop exactly this kind of thing from happening. True, drink driving should be punished harshly but bikers ruin the roads with their attitudes, speed, behavior and recklessness, they just think nothing applies to them at all, From what I understand the poor biker in the video died of head injuries and although the video is sped up so it's hard to tell, there may have been a chance that with a decent helmet (instead of a decade-old 100baht Big C helmet) the biker could have survived. Only foreign bikers use proper protective gear, the Thais just ride in jeans or shorts and flip flops as if nothing will ever happen.

Your level of ignorance is astounding.

Road rules in Thailand are a joke to start off with. See my post above on the "suicide" lane. And you want bikers to follow them?

And your last sentence about foreign vs Thai bikers just shows that you have very little idea about biking in Thailand.

Its not ignorant its 100% true. The cowardly b who mowed down the bike, tried to drive off, then walked away as if he was going for a packet of fags should be banged up for manslaughter, no question (as the post states).

Thai motorcyclists are on par with a scene from Mad max, as are nearly all Thai drivers.

The line of motorcyclists in that tunnel should NOT have been there end of. They're warned of the dangers of wreckless driving yet CHOOSE to ignore it, then put everybody else at risk by doing so.

Thais are the hub" of law breaking throughout the world. Chances are he/she saw a way of saving 5 minutes and broke the law. The same applies for illegal u-turns, going the wrong way up a road, avoiding waiting at a red light.... The only reason they do it is they're lazy, selfish, inconsiderate, impatient morons who have no respect for anybody else around them.

"Bikers ruin the roads with their attitudes..." Nice one. And other drivers don't. When you state that riders should rein in their riding, you conveniently give free pass to those who break the law while blaming those who stretch it "drink driving should be punished harshly but bikers ruin the roads with their attitudes, speed, behavior and recklessness". Bad attitudes should be punished... That's a gem! If you were talking about Fortuner drivers, minivan drivers, little girls in Vios with 50 toys on the back window, I'd possibly agree...

There is a significant lack of discipline among all local drivers, regardless of what they use. I am 'abused' by car drivers when on my bike and without exception because they perceive they have priority over me due to 4 wheels and expected higher cost of their vehicle (which is typically not the case), but obviously irrelevant...

When a biker rides badly, the impact of the risk they take mainly applies at themselves. When a driver drives badly, there is a significantly higher portion of the risk that will impact other road users and those nearby. It is perfectly possible for a biker to harm a pedestrian, other rider, or even a car driver, but both less likely and with lower average harm than a car or truck.

I ride and drive here, and have done for over 25 years. From my experience I see you opinion as upside down. Bikers need no warning about the dangers of riding. They need existing legislation to be enforced. That applies to them as to all vehicles. They need legislation that protects them, not demotes their status and makes them inconsequential for cage drivers. They need higher standards of driving all around them and better policing to reduce the threats to all road users. They need consistent rules - there are bridges and tunnels we can ride, there are those we can't. There is no standard, no logic, and no consistent enforcement. There is certainly no broadcasting of why such decisions are made - no attempt to explain the purpose.

As for safety gear, you are plain wrong. Most Thai bikers wear full gear. Most scooter riders wear just a cheap helmet. You might not see a difference between a biker and a scooter rider, but that there is one of several. Since 2010 I've seen an increase in scooter riders wearing protective jackets and gloves. Helmet standards have improved. It will take another 5 to 10 years, but personal safety standards are improving for scooter riders - they are being dragged up by bikers who are highly visible in their full gear.

Driving standards on highways has improved - many more cars will drop out of the right lane when a bike approaches from behind. Now, nearly half will actually signal left before pulling in! Bikers in Thailand acknowledge those better drivers with a nod and a thumbs-up as we pass to enforce the behaviour. It is slowly having an effect - things will get better... just slowly.

The pickup driver should be charged with drink driving and manslaughter (if that charge exists in Thailand) but I hope other bikers heed this as a warning to follow road rules. Bikers flaunt almost every road rule there is. The rule against bikes going into the tunnel was probably put in place to stop exactly this kind of thing from happening. True, drink driving should be punished harshly but bikers ruin the roads with their attitudes, speed, behavior and recklessness, they just think nothing applies to them at all, From what I understand the poor biker in the video died of head injuries and although the video is sped up so it's hard to tell, there may have been a chance that with a decent helmet (instead of a decade-old 100baht Big C helmet) the biker could have survived. Only foreign bikers use proper protective gear, the Thais just ride in jeans or shorts and flip flops as if nothing will ever happen.

You must have been here a while to get it so upside down. A drunkard, driving deliveries to a school (dwell on that) loses control of his vehicle and enters the opposing lane backwards - you state bikes are dangerous... Well done. People who dance around facts are dangerous. People who break laws designed for safety are dangerous. Motorcycles are riskier - that is hard to argue against.

wow. Those cars looked like they were going pretty fast. Probably going as fast as the car in front of them with no regard to whatever the speed limit is. Empty space, speed up. But a good lesson here why riding a motorcycle is so dangerous. You are vulnerable and unprotected.

Standing up is useful on bad roads and off-road too. Helps identify surface problems early. I do it all the time when riding below 100. I've also found that if I use the rear pegs I can stand at up to 140. Applied with cation…

Dear all,

DELETED

These accurate and free maps have been updated for our riding pleasure. All those who refuse to pay ESRI for updates, or maps to run on GPS they bought outside of Thailand can get Garmin compatible maps here. The installation process is fairly simple, and the maps work with both the GPS and the route planning tools Garmin provides for Mac, Windows and Linux.

Happy Planning!

Happy to be of value:)

11. When discussing destination , lean in and discreetly take a smell of his breath , if you get a whiff of whiskey be prepared to hold on even tighter than described in # 3

That is the precise reason I started to ride here!

The smell of meths or turps at 07:30 was a subtle sign I should take my destiny in my own hands!!

OP - good list! I'd add to have a second, and close-by, back-up destination in mind if the guy turns out to be deluded about his skills!

I ride that quite often. It is highly technical and very tight. There are sections with corners every 30 yards. It gets washed out in the rainy season and has boulders on the road much of the time.

Not many alternative routes though; it's a long way around via Bo Phloi …

RIP

April 1 today - any correlation?

I ride an F650GS and dream about KTM 1290 Dukes, new Africa Twins, and grownup GSs…