skatewash

I'm not sure either. I would just check that my Non-OA visa expires (the "enter before" date has passed) before I re-enter Thailand, and if it wouldn't expire I would try to get an answer from immigration before leaving Thailand. I've never had a non-OA either so not sure how it would be handled on entry if you didn't have the insurance. Hopefully, you would just get stamped in with a visa-exempt, but I wouldn't want to risk.

You also need to make sure that you won't be re-entering Thailand with a Non-OA visa that hasn't expired yet. If you enter on a non-expired Non-OA visa, you will be granted a year permission to stay but with the onerous health insurance requirements. If your Non-OA visa has expired already and you are on an extension of stay based off a non-OA visa, then yes just leave Thailand without a re-entry permit and then you can re-enter Thailand on another visa or even visa-exempt. Obtain your Non-O visa in Thailand and extend that without the health insurance requirements.

Yes, I was quite content in older days when we could draw down our lump-sums for most of the year on the retirement extension and just top it back up to 800k a few months before the application. When the year-round minimum balance requirement came in I investigated switching to the monthly-deposit method. Financially, I could have done it without concern but then I started hearing about applicants being asked about their pensions and as I won't have anything that could be considered a pension until social security kicks in I was not sure I wanted to risk having my retirement application rejected due to the money not coming from a pension. Also, the monthly-deposit method is simply more work, with you having to worry about it being made correctly each and every month. Also, as you say the lump-sum method is nearly bullet-proof. I like going to apply for my annual extension of stay knowing that I've got everything they need to see and there will be no questions. Peace of mind.

First, it is generally not a good idea to send baht to Thailand as the exchange rate obtained for baht outside of Thailand is almost universally lower than can be had within Thailand. This is true for most minor currencies, that is currencies which are not as widely traded as USD, EUR, or sterling. Bahtnet deposit automatic transfer is an indication of a domestic transfer within Thailand. For a description of what BAHTNET is: https://www.bot.or.th/English/PaymentSystems/PSServices/bahtnet/Pages/default.aspx I'm not familiar with the particular codes that Kbank uses but in general terms I think a Trade Finance deposit would be indicative of an international transfer. I'm basing this statement off of the definition of Trade Finance from here: https://www.investopedia.com/terms/t/tradefinance.asp So, I think you would have an easy time getting immigration to accept the second (Trade finance deposit) as an international transfer. I think you would have a difficult time getting immigration to accept the first (BAHTNET) but I guess with proper documentation from sending bank and the receiving bank it might be possible to convince them it was an international transfer.

There are 70 some different immigration offices in Thailand and I believe immigration officers are allowed to ask you about the source of your incoming deposits. I have heard some take the restrictive view that it must be from a pension. I don't know if they are within their rights to insist on this, but I guess it could cause problems if they did. There are certainly people who are funding their monthly deposits in other ways than just from a pension. So I guess bottom line is that's it's possible to do so but perhaps comes with some risk if you run into an immigration officer who believe it should be coming from a pension exclusively. I guess you could try to discuss this with your immigration office beforehand and see if it is acceptable to them. To be honest it's one of the reasons I'm not doing the monthly deposit method for my retirement extension because in my case it would be coming entirely from my savings with no pension component at all.

Yes, true. I knew about that exception but didn't mention it. Thanks for the correction!

I don't know what Jonathan Swift does, but one is allowed to spend any or all of the 65,000 baht deposit after it hits your bank account. The important thing is that the transfer occur every month and that each transfer be a minimum of 65,000. What happens to the money after the transfer has been made is of no interest to Immigration. This is, of course, a great advantage of the income method over the lump-sum method.

If you have a Bangkok Bank account and use Wise and choose the "long term stay in Thailand" reason for the transfer, then it will show up in your Bangkok Bank account with an FTT (Foreign Telegraphic Transfer) designation which will indicate to Immigration that your transfer was made from outside Thailand. Using another Thai bank OR not choosing "long term stay in Thailand" reason for the Wise transfer can often end up with a situation in which the transfer appears to be a domestic Thai transfer rather than an international transfer. Since monthly deposits for purpose of a retirement or marriage extension of stay need to come from outside Thailand you can needlessly complicate your task of demonstrating to immigration that your funds are being transferred from outside Thailand if you don't make the transfer as recommended in the first paragraph. There's a facebook group, TransferWISE Solutions for Thailand, that goes into greater detail about this issue.

Showing the Dr.'s appointment if you have such documentation would be useful if you get questioned at the Phuket entry checkpoint. Not anticipating any problems, but nice to have something to show if questioned.

As for why you had to wait for half an hour to get your covid extension, I suspect that had more to do with the authorized immigration officer wanting to wait until there are a certain number of covid extensions to sign off on all at once, rather than signing off on them as they become available. Just a workflow policy for the benefit of the senior officer to the detriment of the applicant. People in a bureaucracy tend to work according to what makes their lives easier not what makes your life easier. I think that's more likely than that they had to think hard about whether to grant you a covid extension.

Interesting. I still think it mostly has to do with what procedures the particular immigration office is following, rather than a reaction to anything about your particular situation. I can't explain why you were given a full extension (without being under consideration) the third time and not the first two times. Nobody believes the covid extensions are a permanent fixture for immigration and it's true that the current authorization for them expires on September 27. However, it is widely expected (not guaranteed) that an announcement will be made closer to that date that the covid extensions will be extended further. There's a theory (which may or may not be true) that covid extensions will continue to be extended until borders reopen. However, it's sort of hard to see what has gotten better enough by September 27 so that covid extensions should no longer be offered. Stay tuned for the answer sometime later this month. As for encouraging you to formalize your long stay in Thailand via a retirement extension, that does I think have to do with your situation more than some office-wide policy. I guess I would need to know more about what visa or extension of stay you were on before covid to understand why they mentioned retirement extension to you. It's not necessarily a bad idea if you are age 50 or over and come from a country that will still do embassy income letters (i.e., other than US, UK, or Australia) and you have a qualifying income. Something to consider, potentially much cheaper for you (1,900 for a year extension of stay rather than paying 1,900 for a series of 60 day extensions of stay), It seems to me they drew your attention to a potentially alternate and more stable way of staying long term in Thailand, rather than a coded warning that you will not get another covid extension. But you were there, I wasn't so maybe I missed out on any cues that may have been given.

If you are referring to the mooted RT-PCR test for domestic tourists to Phuket on day 5 after entry, that has apparently disappeared, according to the following article: https://www.thephuketnews.com/new-order-waives-pcr-testing-of-domestic-tourists-during-stay-in-phuket-81307.php

Essentially you will need to be vaccinated (as explained in the chart below) AND tested (rapid antigen is accepted as well as RT-PCR) AND you need to be in one of the allowed categories of people (live or work in Phuket, returning Sandboxer, ticket holder on day of flight out of Phuket Airport, or domestic tourist). Assuming you are a domestic tourist (don't meet any of the other exceptions) you will need to prepay for your Phuket lodging and show the confirmation from the hotel.

I believe anyone can leave Phuket without restriction, unless you are a participant in the Phuket Sandbox program and haven't yet graduated from the program which takes 14 days and passing 3 RT-PCR tests. I don't know what restrictions Hua Hin may have, but if coming from Phuket you're coming from a province with an orange covid status.

Whether you get your extension put under consideration has more to do with your immigration office than your particular case. At some offices the procedure is to put all covid extensions under consideration. At other offices people sometimes get their full extension of stay without being under consideration.

Thanks for the response. As you suggest, I'll just be moving along. Places to go, people to see.

Not sure I understand this paragraph. For instance, not sure what "pensions are blocked" means. As far as I'm aware Immigration Officers do not report retirement visas to your Home Government, IOs do not report anything to your Home Government. Not even sure how they would go about doing this if they wanted to. Not sure why they would even want to. I'm a bit mystified about what you are talking about in this paragraph.

Elements of an international transfer: 1. Fees charged by your home country bank. 2. Exchange rate used to convert from home currency to Thai baht. 3. Fees charged to do the international transfer. 4. Fees charged by your Thai bank to receive the transfer. Wise will show you the costs associated with 2 and 3. You will have to calculate 1 yourself and 4 doesn't come into play in a Wise transfer. One should consider all the costs associated with an international transfer. I often see people trying to compare one method with another and ignoring some of these elements.

Suggestions to consider: 1. Since you are Canadians and your Embassy will issue you an income verification letter (something that US, UK, and Australian citizens can no longer get) I would definitely go that route. There are basically two routes to meeting the financial requirements of a retirement extension of stay: the lump-sum method and the income method. The lump-sum method is parking 800,000 baht in a Thai bank account for a year subject to various minimum balance requirements throughout the year. The income method is where you demonstrate to your embassy's satisfaction that you have at least 65,000 baht income per month. The Canadian Embassy issues you a letter to that effect and you use that letter to satisfy the financial requirements for a retirement extension. The advantages are probably obvious, you don't have to bring the money into Thailand or keep a large sum of money in Thailand. What money you bring into Thailand and keep in Thailand is entirely up to you and not dictated by immigration requirements. No one who can easily meet the income method would want to use the lump-sum method, in my opinion. 2. I believe you do want to acquire Non-O visas for purpose of retirement in Canada because when in Thailand you would then be able to use one of you (doesn't particularly matter which one) can be the primary applicant (who needs to meet the financial requirements) and one of you can be the dependent applicant (who doesn't need to meet the financial requirements). This way you don't need two 65,000 baht/month income streams but only one. (The same argument would apply to the lump sum method.) The reason you want to do this from Canada rather than inside Thailand is that inside Thailand they won't allow one to apply for a Non-O for purpose of being a dependent upon another's Non-O visa, whilst in Canada that should be possible. 3. Were you to choose the lump sum method the money would need to be in an account in one person's name only. The reason is that immigration dislikes having more than the applicant's name on an account for the lump-sum method and even if your office would accept that they would very likely want to see twice the amount of the minimum balance, 1,600,000 baht rather than just 800,000. 4. Proceeding under the income method would mean that each year you would need to procure from the Canadian Embassy (or perhaps from the Consulate in Chiang Mai) a income verification letter proving you have 65,000 baht or more of income per month. Don't know what the Canadian Embassy charges for this letter but for comparison purposes the US Embassy charged $50 USD per letter. Remember you would only need one letter for the primary applicant. The dependent doesn't need an income letter only evidence of the relationship to the primary.

Just to add to the part about being in Thailand during your annual extension of stay application. The day you are granted your first extension of stay for purpose of retirement establishes the date that your extension of stay will expire (and start) the next year. In Chiang Mai you can actually do your application for extension of stay up to 45 days earlier than your extension of stay expiration date. Note that once established the extension of stay start/expiration date does not change. Possibly this gives you a little more flexibility (45 days) as to when you have to be in Thailand to apply for your next extension of stay. For example if your extension of stay start/expiration date is April 1, then you could do the application for your extension of stay as early as February 16, and you would receive an extension of stay until April 1 of the next year. After receiving this extension of stay you could purchase a re-entry permit (for 1,900 from immigration) and leave Thailand say in February. You could return to Thailand in say November using the re-entry permit. But you would need to be in Thailand at some point between February 16 and April 1 every year in order to apply for your next extension of stay. This is to say that you should give some thought to when you apply for your first extension of stay because you will need to apply for the same extension of stay at the same time (or up to 45 days before) every year thereafter. Pick a date that you are reasonably certain to be in Thailand each year. This will make it more convenient to maintain your annual extensions of stay year after year.

Yes, only Sandbox. There was a time when a vaccination got you a 10 day quarantine in ASQ rather than 14 days but now everyone gets 14 regardless of vaccination status.

That has caught out many people. ????

Finally some clarification on what is needed for a Phuket resident to re-enter Phuket: https://thethaiger.com/news/phuket/phuket-entry-rules-relaxed-to-allow-residents-to-exit-and-return

That's an exceptional website, but I didn't know it also covered this issue. Thanks for sharing.

Phuket also accepts up to 45 days in advance.