jay-uk

Seems they just don't want us farangs in Thailand anymore and doing their best to shift us one way or another

How real are these two latest articles on changes in law to stop farang wives owning land. Does anyone have the latest on this yet....

http://www.nationmultimedia.com/2009/08/18...ss_30110017.php

AGRICULTURE

Foreigners 'own land through Thai nominees'

Published on August 18, 2009

The government has found that foreigners in Thailand are controlling vast areas of land - from 10 rai up to 10,000 rai - through rice-farming nominees, in breach of the Foreign Business Act (FBA).

By law, land for agriculture is restricted to Thais only.

Deputy Commerce Minister Alongkorn Ponlaboot said the Department of Special Investigation (DSI) and the Business Development Department had found foreigners owning tracts of land in the North and Central provinces.

"The government has found that some foreign companies have purchased, through brokers, vast territory for rice farming. Some small areas of land are also in foreigners' hands, mostly through marriages to Thai women," said Alongkorn.

The ministry has not named the companies or nationalities for fear of compromising the investigations.

To protect Thai rice-farming businesses and land ownership, Alongkorn said the government would continue to examine whether the Foreign Business Act had been violated.

The DSI will consider taking up the case if it finds foreign firms had intentionally violated the law, Alongkorn said.

The Business Development Department has been investigating documents and monitoring foreign companies' movements for action that might conceal their business objectives.

Alongkorn said he had also ordered related agencies to investigate land owned by Thai women, to see if they are acting as nominees for foreigners engaged in farming businesses.

There have been rumours that foreign investors, especially from Taiwan and the Middle East, have invested in rice farms in the Central and Northern provinces, raising concerns among Thai farmers and authorities.

Despite this stringent enforcement of the Foreign Business Act, Alongkorn said the Kingdom still welcomed foreign investors.

As a major world food crop producer, the Thai government has been prompt in signing trade contracts with any country wanting to ensure its food security, he said.

Ministry land bill takes aim at foreigners

Law to be first to 'fully protect' Thai farmland

-- Bangkok Post Wed 19 August 2009

The Agriculture and Cooperatives Ministry is drafting a bill to protect rice paddies from a feared massive land grab by foreigners.

The draft law will be the first to fully protect farmland, deputy permanent secretary for agriculture Thawatchai Samrongwattana said.

The bill will set out clear measures to prohibit foreigners from buying land through Thai nominees, he said yesterday.

Recently, rumours have spread that foreign businessmen have been snapping up rice-growing land, particularly in central Thailand, through proxy Thai companies to produce rice and other crops to ensure future food supplies for their own countries, or to fend off starvation at home.

Transnational business consortiums are said to be holding the land through Thai nominees, which is against the law.

Some Thai farmers are reportedly leasing land they previously owned but have since sold to the foreigners' proxy firms, observers said.

The bill will also address land ownership by foreigners who marry Thais.

Under the draft bill, each land purchase by Thais married to foreigners would be closely scrutinised by Land Department officials and a provincial farmland protection panel, Mr Thawatchai said.

He said the bill would allow the immediate revocation of the rights of plots found to be held by foreign businesses through Thai proxies. The committee would be authorised to arrange the resale of such land.

About 60 million rai of irrigation land, including areas where the Land Department will build reservoirs, and land belonging to the Agricultural Land Reform office, would be protected by the bill, he said.

The agriculture minister will table the draft bill for the cabinet's consideration next month before submitting it to parliament for approval, Mr Thawatchai said.

"The ministry intends the bill to become law within this year," he said.

The bill would allow for a fund to be set up to protect farmland. The government would be required to allocate a budget to manage the fund and buy back land from foreigners. Farmers could also take out loans from the fund to invest in developing the land for agricultural purposes, Mr Thawatchai said.

A central committee would be set up under the bill with the prime minister as chairman. It would comprise experts and representatives from the private and agricultural sectors.

The committee would regulate the use of farmland or revoke the ownership of farmland that had been purchased through nominees.

A provincial land protection committee would also be set up and chaired by a provincial governor.

Land owners could not appeal the central committee's decision, he said.

The deputy permanent secretary said the bill had been modelled on similar laws in foreign countries, such as Japan and the US, which heavily regulate land ownership.

Don, Welcome To Ubon.

I'm not a permanent fixture like some of the guys who have commented here but I have a holiday home in Tambon Kamyai and come back every 12/24 months for a break. I always miss Ubon and the people I have met are great so no doubt you and your GF will settle in well. Everything you have mentioned is accessible but you will have to do some leg work and look around to find a suitable home and shop for rent. The city is expanding fast so a little restaurant should do well if you look after your customers and maintain quality then you'll do even better. I found in the past some restauarants (thai owned) could cook you a good meal on a Monday and forget how they cooked it by Friday, so if you returned for something you liked such as a steak it was not how your taste buds remembered. However, things are picking up and more farangs are there now to make sure the quality remains good.

http://www.weloveubon.com

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ubon_Ratchathani_Province

http://guideubon.com/

http://peppersbakery.com/

http://www.wrongwayhome.com/

http://www.suanloongdaengfarmstay.com/

http://isaanstyle.blogspot.com/

http://memock.wordpress.com/

Enjoy your time up in Isaan and get reading the above sites as there is a wealth of information from people living locally.

Jay

Local builders merchants in Ubon stock them as we purchased these for our wall but as for somewhere close by Korat to buy I'm not sure, sorry.

Hi all,

I need (want?) a second hand motorbike. Just a general run of the mill bike that you see every second on the roads in Thailand. No bling bling needed, as long as it is road worthy and starts every time then I am happy. Any of you Ubon locals have one surplus to requirements or know of anyone that is looking to get rid of one? The other option of course is the repo auctions. Does anyone have any information about these places?

Cheers

MM

Hi Andrew

I did a quick search and the lists of 2nd hand motorcycles are on two of the following classified listings. Also Jason posted as on his Blog about local Ubon auctions some time back which is below. Hope this is useful:

http://classifieds.thaivisa.com/?act=advan...rd=0&sens=0

http://www.bahtsold.com/index.php?region=2...y=44&price=

http://isaanstyle.blogspot.com/2009/03/tha...epossessed.html

Regards,

Jay

Hello Memock

Can't wait to give the place a try when next over. Ubon was missing a place to eat a good western breakfast and lunch so very much looking forward to coming and saying hello. Wishing you all the best for the future with Peppers.

Jay

Hi Memock

Looks like the PM is looking to visit Ubon also but no date yet. Yellow shirts next then....:

Jay

http://enews.mcot.net/view.php?id=10910

PM Abhisit to kick off weekly provincial visits

BANGKOK, July 21 (TNA) - Prime Minister Abhisit Vejjajiva plans to visit people living upcountry on a weekly basis but, at this moment, will avoid visiting the provinces in the northeastern region, which generally still support ousted prime minister Thaksin Shinawatra, according to Minister to the Prime Minister's Office Satit Wonghnongtaey.

Mr. Satit told journalists that Mr. Abhisit is scheduled to go to the southern province of Songkla on Saturday August 1 to announce the government's community welfare scheme as a national agenda.

The week after that, Mr. Satit said, the prime minister may visit Bangkok's nearby provinces as he has engagements in the capital.

However, no northeastern province visits are currently listed in the plan, he said.

Regarding the premier's visits to Chiang Mai, Sukhothai and Ubon Ratchathani, plans have been set but the dates are not fixed, Mr. Satit said.

The visits would also depend on the policies at the destinations and the facilities to support the trips.

Meanwhile, Mr. Satit said the government is expected to deliver its six-month performance statement on Sunday and Monday August 2-3.

The official documents regarding that issue have already been prepared for members of parliament, senators, and the media, as well as the general public.

The Prime Minister's Office will also publicise the government’s performance via community radio, local cable television and advertising billboards. (TNA)

Political News : Last Update : 16:55:42 21 July 2009 (GMT+7:00)

Anybody know what they are paying around the Ubon Ratchathani area? Thanks.....

http://www.truthabouttrade.org/content/vie...368/54/lang,en/

Posted by Truth About Trade & Technology

Wednesday, 15 July 2009

BBC News

July 14, 2009 By Jonathan Head

BBC News, Bangkok

The first rains of the year have been falling for a couple of months now in Thailand’s often dry north-east, and farmers are out most days in the freshly-flooded fields, transplanting young jasmine rice seedlings.

They work quickly, bent over double, expertly spacing the seedlings in the silt.

But it is back-breaking work. And although jasmine is one of the most highly-prized rice varieties – it is grown almost exclusively in north-eastern Thailand – the farmers in this region are some of the poorest people in the country, most of them mired in debt.

Lack of investment

Their problem, says veteran rice researcher Kwanchai Gomez from Bangkok’s Kasaertsart University, is a chronic lack of investment in rice farming.

Very little of the north-east – one of Thailand’s most populous regions – is irrigated.

“Water is the most important thing that guarantees low risk," she says.

“And risk is the main problem for farmers. One year no rain, the next year floods. So you have to get a loan. Then your crop fails, and you get into debt.”

When world rice prices soared last year, everyone assumed that farmers in Thailand – for many years the world’s top rice exporter – must have done well.

Some did. But only those in the central plains region, which get irrigation from the Chaophraya River.

They grow up to three crops a year, mostly higher yield varieties than jasmine.

That is where most of Thailand’s exports come from.

The indebtedness and poverty of farmers was ignored for decades by governments in Bangkok.

Then in the 2001 election, a wealthy telecoms tycoon, Thaksin Shinawatra, drew up a platform of policies aimed directly at farmers, like debt forgiveness and a village loan fund.

It proved a stunningly successful vote-winning strategy, delivering Mr Thaksin three successive election victories, before he was ousted by a coup in September 2006.

But many of those policies have done less for farmers than Mr Thaksin claimed.

Rice mortgage

One, in particular, is proving a huge headache for the current government, led by his main rival, the Democrat Party.

It is called the rice mortgage scheme. The idea is to help farmers ride out price volatility by allowing them to sell their rice to the government at a guaranteed price.

Farmers usually have no way to store or process their rice, so they are all forced to sell at once at harvest time, allowing the millers – who do have these facilities – to bargain down the price and take most of the profit.

But the scheme has become riddled with corruption, and benefits only a minority of farmers.

“Most of them, unfortunately, are rich farmers with irrigation,” says economist Nipon Poapongsakorn from the Thailand Development Research Institute.

“Poor farmers in the north-east don’t have a surplus of rice to sell, so they don’t benefit from this policy at all. It is a pro-rich, pro-business policy”.

The scheme is also very expensive for the government, especially now, because last year – when rice prices were unusually volatile – a weak government, led by Mr Thaksin’s allies, set the guaranteed price too high.

Those with rice to sell would only sell to the government. Rice traders, like Asia Golden Rice - one of Thailand’s most successful - found it difficult to procure supplies at competitive prices for their overseas customers.

“We might even lose our number one ranking as a rice exporter to our competitors,” says Saranyu Jeamsinkul, deputy managing director for Asia Golden Rice.

“We are at least $100 a tonne higher than Vietnam - so it is rather difficult to export at the moment”.

Sorting the mess

The government has ordered Deputy Prime Minister Kobsak Sapavasu to sort out the mess.

He estimates it has already cost 11 billion baht ($325m) just to process and store crops bought under the mortgage scheme.

And because rice prices have fallen this year, when the government sells the stocks he estimates it will lose another 20 billion baht ($590m).

“The numbers are just unbelievable," says Mr Kobsak.

But his attempts to close down the mortgage scheme, and replace it with a simpler subsidy, have been blocked by his own coalition partners.

There is a strong suspicion, shared by Mr Kobsak, that a lot of politicians are making money out of the scheme – perhaps from bribes from warehouse-keepers storing it, or traders trying to buy at bargain prices.

With any hope of a new agricultural policy stalled over political bickering, one group of farmers near the north-eastern town of Ubon Ratchathani have decided to try to lift their living standards by themselves.

They have joined forces to run their own rice mill, and they are saving on escalating fertiliser costs by recycling cow dung and growing organic jasmine rice.

"I wondered why so many farmers were abandoning their farms," said Tongsuan Sodapak, the local teacher whose idea it is. "Then I realised that our problems with debt and crop prices would never be cured just by waiting for the government to help."

This group of farmers has been fortunate, because they have been able to make contact with a buyer for their organic rice in Italy. Most other farmers in the north-east have no way of marketing their jasmine rice, despite its famed fragrance and flavour.

Thailand's long preoccupation with being the number one exporter should now shift, says Nipon Poapongsakorn - to a strategy of marketing Thai rice for its quality and variety.

One retailer in Bangkok has made a start in promoting Thailand's 81 rice varieties. Gourmet Market, a luxury supermarket chain, has bins of different kinds of rice, explaining exactly which region they come from, and their characteristic. It is a bit like the terroir of wine.

"We have people coming here from places like Hong Kong," says company vice president Lakana Naviroj. "They take rice home, because they don't have the variety and quality we have here."

One supermarket alone, though, will not give Thailand's rice the impact it could have on global markets. That requires a concerted drive coordinated by different government agencies, something that seems unlikely in today's volatile political climate.

At the school where Tongsun Sodapak teaches, when he's not helping grow to rice, I asked a group of teenage girls - nearly all of them the children of farmers - how many of them would be happy to stay on the farm when they left school.

Only four, out of 34, raised their hands.

are boreholes viable and economic to use for rice farming when wanting to grow 2nd crop per year out of season. any info: would be appreciated. thanks.

This is an American TRD breeder in Chiang Mai:

www.thaidog.com

Hello UbonTaz

Fingers crossed it goes ahead. It could bring much needed business to the region and importantly Ubon city in terms of tourists. Any country on the door step of China should do well in future if they open up as a Hub to bring people in and out at speed so an improved rail system would be a step in the right direction. Even improving domestic rail services would be a postive move forward, as you mentioned. I read your blog this morning....are you sore after your work-out at Sunee Grand?

Speak to you soon.

Jay

http://www.nationmultimedia.com/2009/07/09...ss_30106928.php

High-level delegation to pursue rail talks in China

Published on July 9, 2009

A government

A government delegation led by Deputy Prime Minister Suthep Thaugsuban is scheduled to visit China this month to invite private investors to participate in high-speed train and double-track railway projects in the Kingdom, following the visit of Premier Abhisit Vejjajiva late last month.

A Transport Ministry source said the delegation would also comprise Transport Minister Sophon Saram and other high-ranking ministry officials, including representatives from the Office of Transport and Traffic Policy and Planning (OTP).

The source said the delegation would open talks with representatives of China's government and its largest state-owned railway construction enterprise, China Railway Engineering, in regard to Thailand's high-speed train and double-track railway projects, in which China had previously expressed investment interest.

The government will then use the results of the negotiations in drawing up a policy for the Kingdom's railway system, said the source.

"The move follows a conversation between Prime Minister Abhisit and the chairman of China Railway Engineering during his visit on June 24-27, in which the Chinese authorities said they would be pleased to support the government's mega-investment projects under the second stimulus measures," said the source.

The source said the Chinese side would study project details to determine whether investment was worthwhile.

The two projects were part of the country's strategic development for mass-transit and logistics systems initiated by the Samak Sundaravej government.

Under the plan, Samak agreed to develop and construct the 2,344-kilometre double-track railway project to connect with the logistics system in the region, expecting this to turn Thailand into a logistics hub for Indochina. The railway would have a standard-gauge size (1.435 metres wide).

The project would be developed under a budget of Bt367 million and consist of five routes: Chiang Khong-Den Chai for a distance of 326 kilometres; Den Chai-Ban Phachi junction (470km); Nong Khai-Nakhon Ratchasima-Kaeg Khoi junction-Ban Phachi junction-Nong Pladuk junction-Kanchanaburi (990km); Kaeng Khoi junction-Chachoengsao-Laem Chabang (247km); and Thanon Chira junction-Ubon Ratchathani (331km).

Samak also agreed to open it for private firms to participate in terms of constructing railways and operating lines by paying the State Railway of Thailand (SRT) concession fees. As a result, the investment will not be a burden on the government.

In addition, the Samak government agreed to develop a high-speed train project with speeds of more than 160kph from Bangkok to large cities that have tourist attractions.

The project would comprise four routes: Bangkok-Nakhon Sawan for a distance of 231km; Bangkok-Nakhon Ratchasima (266km); Bangkok-Hua Hin (200 km); and Bangkok-Chanthaburi (300km).

The OTP, the SRT and other agencies have been assigned to work out the construction cost.

Meanwhile, Transport Ministry deputy permanent secretary Tawalyarat Onsira, as chairman of the SRT, recently said the authority had to wait for a policy on the two projects from the government before it could take any action.

"If China is interested in the projects, it would be good for the country to link its trade and logistics between the two countries," he said.

In terms of buidling, my gf tried to go with official contractors with offices but it was way overpriced. The land was just bought informally through word of mouth. Just up from Hat Wat Tai- 500,000B for a roughly 500 square meter lot, 800,000 for a raised, post&beam house with tile roof- 3 bedrooms, 3 baths, and a 8ft high wall around the lot. The construction is just finishing. At 24 years old, I think I might me the youngest farang to ever get pulled into the isaan saga to this degree? I don't spend much time there, but jay-uk and bergen say the city is growing, I hope that means home values are going up! Can anyone confirm this?

I am not there much myself either but I do try and keep in touch with friends I've made in Ubon and family who give an insight into Ubon on a weekly basis. For us as a family with 2 kids visiting only every 2 years we get a feel for how things are expanding in the city each time we arrive. As for property value increases..... I'm honestly not sure if you can sell houses for anything more than you paid to build them. The price of new houses are on the increase but that is somewhat due to land, labour, building materials and diesel costs all going up. Houses in LOS don't seem to have the same level of appreciation unless in the cities or resorts. Ubon has seen substantial land value increases over the years but I'm not sure whether a house is going to go up in value much. Don't forget when a Thai has a million baht to build a house they will usually do the same as the farangs and build a new one. The market for second hand houses is not like ours in the west. Build quality plays a big part as perceived worth of a second hand house is much lower as they tend to deteriorate over the years. However, if your house is well located on a prime site piece of land then you will no doubt see some increase. If its out in the sticks then don't expect it to go up much. My wife's family have houses scattered around the villages and none of them have gone up much at all in the ten years I have known about them.

If you are 24yo and getting pulled into what you call a saga then my advice would be to slow things down and make any investments at your own pace. Don't get pressured into a quick house purchase without seeing for yourself the area in order to make an informed decision on who you use to build your home and whether you would be happy with what is proposed.

that's the place....

Sawang Wirawong is:

15°14'22.30"N

105° 5'27.58"E

Hello Mike

based on Google Earth you are <30 mins from Sawang Wirawong and you probably pass through there on your travels in/out of Ubon city. I'll have to come and see you next time around for that beer.

Jay

Thanks guys for letting me know how close you both are. I've checked on Google Earth and you both are 1hr+ south/south west. You are close enough for a beer when we get back for a holiday next time around. Our main home is in Kamyai close to city centre but my family have a farm in Sawang Wirawong and we wanted to know if any farangs live near by. It may be a long shot but you never know. Ubon is growing so anything is possible. When we first moved to Kamyai 10 years ago there were no foreigners now our village has 4 or 5. In time maybe sawang Wirawong will be the same. I would not be suprised if there were already farangs there.

We went to a Thai friends BBQ yesterday in our village in UK and one of the Thai ladies there with her husband has a home next to Big C and 5 mins from our home in Ubon.... the world is a smaller than we think sometimes.

Are there any TV members or expats living in or close to Sawang Wirawong. I wanted to keep in touch with anyone from that area which is only 15 mins drive from the city. If anyone who lives there could send me a PM it would be much appreciated. Thank you.

You may have more success asking the members within the Isaan forum section. They have more local experience of where to look. Are you looking to rent, sell or buy? Another good start point is the above Thaivisa classified section which lists some properties in Ubon and/or you could sell your own property on there. Bahtsold.com is another website listing in Ubon. I have seen one or two agents up/down the chayangkul road on my travels in Ubon through the city centre but word of mouth and asking around is usually best course of action. There are two expat hangouts in Ubon... N-Joy bar and WrongWay cafe they have information aswell. Darwin, who runs the following site is also very knowlegable and has lived in the area for many years:

www.weloveubon.com

Smuggling soars after excise hikes

http://www.nationmultimedia.com/2009/06/11...ss_30104856.php

on June 11, 2009

Border officials have been overwhelmed by smuggled cigarettes, diesel and liquor after the government hiked excise taxes on the items.

Contraband cigarettes have flooded the country, increasing tenfold. Oil smuggling is the second biggest problem.

The Finance Ministry will soon ask the Cabinet for a Bt900 million budget to suppress those illegal imports.

Deputy Finance Minister Pruttichai Damrongrat said yesterday that after excise duties on those three products were raised to help offset the shortfall in other tax collections, smuggling at the border including in Ubon Ratchathani, Surin and Sa Kaew had flourished.

Seized cigarettes multiplied by 10 times from the 83 cases where arrests were made last month.

Fines surged from Bt790,000 in April to almost Bt10 million last month.

Black-market diesel oil also increased with two big cases involving 17,000 litres and 16,000 litres.

Liquor was less of a problem with an average of 10-15 cases per month because the tax rate has already reached its legal ceiling.

However, border authorities need to beef up their manpower, as they only have 600 officers to curb the illicit trade, he added.

Sounds and looks great on the pictures Marco. If they get their act together as you say and start to look after the local farangs then this could be a popular hang out.

It looks great on the photos Memock. My kids would love this place....

Can they enforce really enforce this......

I think one of the most important expenses has been left off the above lists....ie..private health care/expat medical cover. Thai hospitals are not the best unless you are paying privately and we all get sick sometime.