Muirton

If you could supply me one instance of a government so corrupt that they had a bill unanimously rejected by the senate, other than Yingluk's........

And whats your point? It was rejected. The system worked.

How do you think the Senate will consider the newly muted amnesty?

Please stop with your distorted view of history. The government resigned because the opposition did, leaving them without a quorum, not because of unanimous senate rejection, and not because of public protest. In 6 months they could have passed their corrupt amnesty bill without senate approval, preventing prosecution of the crimes they were currently committing and thousands of ongoing cases.

If you think that is the system working, you are deluded.

Stop attempting to change the subject, I am NOT interested.

And who, pray tell, is interested that you are not?

I love the way that the junta lovers cry that "they were not in power, as they dissolved parliament" which ironically was what many were calling for, including all those on here who continue to say that they were not kicked out of power because they had already dissolved parliament as they were demanded to!!!

I am sure someone with more energy than me, could go back on people like Bill767 etc and find many a post calling for them to dissolve parliament!

If you are going to talk about me please get my name right.

It is billd766 and not bill767.

It shows, at least to me, that you cannot read and comprehend even something as simple as my screen name.

"It shows, at least to me, that you cannot read and comprehend even something as simple as my screen name." Pray elucidate for us the connection between your plaint and the OP?

Moreover, if Yingluck is to punished for alleged corruption, it should be through a criminal prosecution, and depending on the verdict a punishment imposed by the court, not by administrative orders enforced by civil court action.

I am not sure where you come from but the previous PTP government was NOT forced from office at all. The PM, Yingluck Shinawatra actually dissolved parliament on 9th December 2013 and became the caretaker PM with limited powers and none at all to take out loans that the incoming government would have to repay.

No matter what spin you attempt to put on it, you are wrong.

They called an election, which was prevented from happening by a mob run by a leading opposition politician, and whose activities were, shall we be generous, regarded benignly by the judiciary and the military, (some might say they colluded). The military then used the resulting stalemate to justify a coup, and installed a junta government which for 18 months has persistently strengthened it's grip on power.

If that is not being forced from power - then how would you describe defeat of Germany in 1945 - a minor setback for National Socialism?

In claiming that the Yingluck Government was not forced from power you are simply denying an evident ( if inconvenient for your narrative) truth.

..........................Moreover, if Yingluck is to punished for alleged corruption...........................

I thought she was being charged with negligence, not corruption.

http://www.businessinsider.com/r-former-thai-pm-in-court-on-negligence-charges-2015-5?IR=T

If it were possible to charge Thai politicians with corruption the courts would be tied up for years. And I think the main reason she was even charged with negligence was because of the amount of money involved (and of course because she is a Shinawatra and everyone has it in for that family)

............................"which was prevented from happening by a mob run by a leading opposition politician".............................

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-25116427

"Suthep Thaugsuban, a former Thai deputy prime minister, resigned from the opposition Democrat Party to lead protests aimed at dislodging Thailand's government."

......................."and whose activities were, shall we be generous, regarded benignly by the judiciary and the military, (some might say they colluded).".....................

Not going near that one, waste of time even discussing that subject.

It seems to me the main arguing point the majority of the Junta-bashing posters use is how "crooked bent and dirty" the current regime is.

Most of the Shin-bashing posters like myself don't deny that, so you really are arguing with yourself. We don't defend the actions of the Junta, although some posters have this crazy idea in their heads that we do.

Personally I would love to see free and fair elections (wow ! never had them before) held tomorrow, just as long as the Military, the Shins and their terrorist wing, and the Democrats had no part in those elections whatsoever.

I think it is comical to read some of the attacks on the current regime, when the previous governments were just as guilty.

The previous governments were elected. And, please, no more "Taksin bought elections".

Thaksin did buy elections and it should be brought up, since there are those that will try to push the inconvenient fact away.

Example: And, please, no more "Taksin bought elections".

"Thaksin did buy elections ..." Poodle in the microwave.

The September 19 issue off The Economist [which I acquired in Rangoon] — says of the head of the current administration that he “sometimes resembles a ham actor ad-libbing his way through an audition for a rôle a an unhinged dictator.” 'Nuff said.

I love the way that the junta lovers cry that "they were not in power, as they dissolved parliament" which ironically was what many were calling for, including all those on here who continue to say that they were not kicked out of power because they had already dissolved parliament as they were demanded to!!!

I am sure someone with more energy than me, could go back on people like Bill767 etc and find many a post calling for them to dissolve parliament!

In most western democracies, a government that passed a bill so blatantly self-serving and corrupt that it was rejected unanimously by the Senate and caused huge public protest, would have resigned out of shame. Yingluk and company dont understand the concept.

"In most western democracies, a government that passed a bill so blatantly self-serving and corrupt that it was rejected unanimously by the Senate and caused huge public protest, would have resigned out of shame." Since you know this, please supply TV with the instances that you know of. Otherwise, what to think, what to think of your opinions.?

Good man. The Thaksins need to be kept out of politics.

You didn't finish the sentence. If you did, you're boring us to death with you banalité.

Moreover, if Yingluck is to punished for alleged corruption, it should be through a criminal prosecution, and depending on the verdict a punishment imposed by the court, not by administrative orders enforced by civil court action.

I am not sure where you come from but the previous PTP government was NOT forced from office at all. The PM, Yingluck Shinawatra actually dissolved parliament on 9th December 2013 and became the caretaker PM with limited powers and none at all to take out loans that the incoming government would have to repay.

No matter what spin you attempt to put on it, you are wrong.

They called an election, which was prevented from happening by a mob run by a leading opposition politician, and whose activities were, shall we be generous, regarded benignly by the judiciary and the military, (some might say they colluded). The military then used the resulting stalemate to justify a coup, and installed a junta government which for 18 months has persistently strengthened it's grip on power.

If that is not being forced from power - then how would you describe defeat of Germany in 1945 - a minor setback for National Socialism?

In claiming that the Yingluck Government was not forced from power you are simply denying an evident ( if inconvenient for your narrative) truth.

..........................Moreover, if Yingluck is to punished for alleged corruption...........................

I thought she was being charged with negligence, not corruption.

http://www.businessinsider.com/r-former-thai-pm-in-court-on-negligence-charges-2015-5?IR=T

If it were possible to charge Thai politicians with corruption the courts would be tied up for years. And I think the main reason she was even charged with negligence was because of the amount of money involved (and of course because she is a Shinawatra and everyone has it in for that family)

............................"which was prevented from happening by a mob run by a leading opposition politician".............................

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-25116427

"Suthep Thaugsuban, a former Thai deputy prime minister, resigned from the opposition Democrat Party to lead protests aimed at dislodging Thailand's government."

......................."and whose activities were, shall we be generous, regarded benignly by the judiciary and the military, (some might say they colluded).".....................

Not going near that one, waste of time even discussing that subject.

It seems to me the main arguing point the majority of the Junta-bashing posters use is how "crooked bent and dirty" the current regime is.

Most of the Shin-bashing posters like myself don't deny that, so you really are arguing with yourself. We don't defend the actions of the Junta, although some posters have this crazy idea in their heads that we do.

Personally I would love to see free and fair elections (wow ! never had them before) held tomorrow, just as long as the Military, the Shins and their terrorist wing, and the Democrats had no part in those elections whatsoever.

I think it is comical to read some of the attacks on the current regime, when the previous governments were just as guilty.

The previous governments were elected. And, please, no more "Taksin bought elections".

I love the way that the junta lovers cry that "they were not in power, as they dissolved parliament" which ironically was what many were calling for, including all those on here who continue to say that they were not kicked out of power because they had already dissolved parliament as they were demanded to!!!

I am sure someone with more energy than me, could go back on people like Bill767 etc and find many a post calling for them to dissolve parliament!

In most western democracies, a government that passed a bill so blatantly self-serving and corrupt that it was rejected unanimously by the Senate and caused huge public protest, would have resigned out of shame. Yingluk and company dont understand the concept.

It was rejected by the Senate, as per how the system works. And they dissolved parliament as you mention.

Should the junta stand down for lying about the single gateway?

Oh deary me! Parliament was dissolved almost a month later. Remind me, was that because of PTP's shame over corruption, the mass public protests, or because the opposition resigned, in the red shirt version of history?

Stick to the topic.

The topic is freedom for Thais. Let's stick to it. You tell the head of the current administration. I ain't gonna walk into days of attitude adjustment by informing him. Be TV's guest on this.

Lol he's not leaving in 2017. The master of incompetence won't leave until there's a recession so deep the elites pry him out. Thailand will never get a trade agreement with a western country with der fuhrer at the head. Manufacturing will move to Vietnam most likely after TPP and Thailand will only have the Chinese teet to suckle. Oh the humanity. Hopefully this period is studied by future children as a reason not to have a military strong enough to hold its own country hostage.

OMG another near unknown with OTT remarks not even wanting to also recognise the good being done. It is there if you want to see.

Pray list, in under 5 words or less, three "goods" and remove our blindness.

It's only illegal in your mind.

and in the minds of many others.

Look, this "government" has control of the country.

But that doesn't make this "government" legitimate.

I'm sure they will struggle on without your stamp of approval.

Struggle on they will, every day a fiasco larger than the day before. It's time for three high-speed submarines from China to Bangkok.

The head of the current administration is doing his utmost to keep us all up to date. The problem is the date is July 13, 1789.

I like this statement he made

The prime minister said Tuesday that his government would duty-bound to seek compensation for the loss and it was necessary to use the administrative order because the civil case will expire in two years.

How can an illegal government be duty bound?

I suggest that you petition the Privy Council and the highest person in the land who actually have made this government legal.

If you cannot accept that fact then the problem is yours.

Neither you nor I nor perhaps 99% of TVF posters can affect the reality that this government is legal and in charge of running the country.

It is NOT an illegal government and nothing you can say or do will affect that no matter what spin you try to put on it.

If this "government" is not "illegal", what does it take for a government on this planet to be illegal?

Whether members like it or not, PM Prayut is applying the law & there was an enquiry that found fmr PM Yingluck guilty of negligence & malfeasance in control of the Rice Pledging Scheme, now she's being brought to justice. All you naysayers, would you be happy if she simply walks free, does a runner, same as Bro & leaves all the poor rice farmers down the drain further?

Similar to telling the farmers they can plant only one crop this year?

What's wrong with advising greedy farmers that there is not enough water to go round this year.

What is your basis for calling Thailand's farmers "greedy"? Please supply specific cites and sites -- if, that is, you're not in great ignorance insulting Thailand's farmers. If you can't supply the facts you must have in order to be able to state the farmers are "greedy", what conclusion can the readers of this thread come to regarding you?

Her family name is Shinawatra. What more justification is needed?

Evidence would be lovely.

I like this statement he made

The prime minister said Tuesday that his government would duty-bound to seek compensation for the loss and it was necessary to use the administrative order because the civil case will expire in two years.

How can an illegal government be duty bound?

It's only illegal in your mind.

How about "illegal" in the minds of 69.5 million Thais and falang interested in democracy?

I like this statement he made

The prime minister said Tuesday that his government would duty-bound to seek compensation for the loss and it was necessary to use the administrative order because the civil case will expire in two years.

How can an illegal government be duty bound?

This "government" has a duty to comfort the comfortable and afflict the afflicted. History gives it high marks for fulfilling this duty.

The United nations. What a joke. Only a handful of the hundreds of countries represented there have democracy. Laced with dictators and corrupt politicians. I would rather live here than in many of the poverty stricken rat holes the U N represents. Just look at what happens to citizens of many of these counties from amputations, stonings, beatings and outright murder. The U N has a real gall complaining about Thailand.

As for the E U? Another joke . Not elected by the people of the E U countries yet able to dictate the fate of nations. Another bunch of power seaking polies no better than the mob running the U N.

Say goodnight to the folks Gracie.

Good night, Gracie.

seems that the biggest right that has been suspended by the junta is the rights of the Reds to blow up children with RPG's. Other than that I don't see any real suppression of peoples rights here in Thailand.

Taksin and Yingluck governments both suppressed the press just as much if not more than the junta has done, doesn't anybody remember that?

Thailand is safer and more stable than it has been for a very long time.

Police states are always "safer and more stable". What a banal statement.

what is all the fuss about ? Giving Thais true democracy would be like giving a condom to a eunuch, they wouldn't know what to do with it.

That is an incredibly patronising post from someone who probably reaped the benefits of democracy all his life.

Democracy, however, didn't teach him civility or manners.

lets all not forget that this so called government is ILLEGAL

The head of the current administration said astonishingly in this past Friday's "Restoring Happiness" spiel that he was well received at the UN "even though I wasn't elected".

The United nations. What a joke. Only a handful of the hundreds of countries represented there have democracy. Laced with dictators and corrupt politicians. I would rather live here than in many of the poverty stricken rat holes the U N represents. Just look at what happens to citizens of many of these counties from amputations, stonings, beatings and outright murder. The U N has a real gall complaining about Thailand.

"I would rather live here ..."

Allow me to ask a hypothetical question.

What if "here" some day in the distant future was to be "laced with dictators and corrupt politicians". Would you then leave the LOS?

I mentioned on another thread how everything is going wrong for the head of the current administration and that that can be measured by how long is Friday yaks are. There is a better measure which is: How many ThaiVisa trolls defend him? Fewer by the day -- and they change their identity once they are laughed off the field.

There never was a lot of posters defending him. They were all in your mind, you created them to justify your many posts attacking the Junta, which is actually against forum rules. But you were not the only one who imagined all these so-called "junta lovers".

"How many ThaiVisa trolls defend him?"................you better be careful labeling anyone you disagree with a "troll".

And as far as posters changing their identities goes, you are right, there is a lot of that going on. But they are mostly red/Shin supporters who changed identities because they were banned, not because they were laughed off the field.

Please let the PM know how you measure how "everything is going wrong for the head of the current administration" as I am sure he will be interested in that !

Words fail.

anyone notice the chinese have gone? the normally extreamly busy chinese hotel at the end of my street and other chinese businesses around pattaya are empty. it is supposed to be some chinese holiday as well golden week or something. hope it is not from the bombing.

Please keep your ignorance to yourself. It adds zilch to the OP.

ignorance of what champ? you lost me on this response.

ignorance of what exactly? everyone knows where the chinese have gone except me?

this discussion was about the govt expanding the economy. tourism is perhaps the most important part of the economy in my area, a fair part of which is chinese based. govt said this week there were large numbers of chinese tourists in thailand now due to some chinese holiday. my comment was about the tourist industry not doing so well due to seeing a lack of chinese tourists. hope this helps you understand my post, i thought it was fairly relavent to the topic.

not entirely sure what your reply was about. maybe you can help me out on an explanation.

i sense alot of pent up anger and frustration in this chat forum and i wonder if it a fair representation of westerners in thailand or just of people using this forum.

"everyone knows where the chinese have gone except me?" Yes.

anyone notice the chinese have gone? the normally extreamly busy chinese hotel at the end of my street and other chinese businesses around pattaya are empty. it is supposed to be some chinese holiday as well golden week or something. hope it is not from the bombing.

Please keep your ignorance to yourself. It adds zilch to the OP.

I mentioned on another thread how everything is going wrong for the head of the current administration and that that can be measured by how long is Friday yaks are. There is a better measure which is: How many ThaiVisa trolls defend him? Fewer by the day -- and they change their identity once they are laughed off the field.