DirtFarmer

Actually with all the translations/interpretations out there now and one of the mildest being this from one of many the other sources...

..." Suthep said the People’s Democratic Reform Committee (PDRC) was ready to step in as soon as the judicial axe falls on the current cabinet. “Once we become the sovereign, we’ll seize the assets of the of the Shinawatra family members. We won’t allow them to go abroad. They will need to report to us,” he declared. “We will appoint the prime minister of the people and submit the name to His Majesty, to be countersigned by me.”

I don't think Surapong is overstating anything...and I think it is quite clear to the world that Suthep jumped the shark long ago...

It is clear that “demagogue” is an accurate description for Suthep.

Would love to be the fly on the wall at Democrat think tank now.....

Actually, that is not a translation from a neutral source. That is a translation from Khaosod which is a copy and paste from their actual news report.

So you claim it to be a 'mild' translation do you?..... by a Thaksin funded propaganda rag?????

Please tell us why ALL the red farang have to lie to form a comment?

Are you all totally incapable of debate without resorting to lies and fact twisting?

You should be banned from the forum.

Whoopers my wife translated it as well but by all means go out and get beer and food no I did not use the Khaosod translation a thai one and the word medium was interpreted as sovereign and your claim that all I do on here is lie is in fact a lie so go get your beer you are a quart or two low... you considering yourself a debater is as far fetched as as can be you are at best an apprentice bater...... catch my drift...? all you do is slam people and rant and rave whilst licking your Suthep lollipop and drinking your Jim Jones Kool Aid...for gawd sakes man go get your beer!

Funny things fall from the sky when it rains

welcome to TVF

Point out the lies Tezz... don't just follow Whoopers down a dark alley...what lies...? We respond to articles posted by the Admin on this forum...everyone is entitled to an opinion based on whatever they can bring to the table...your opinion counts no more than mine just saying someone lies doesn't make it so... but in this case more than Khaosod covered this story and in every other version...including the Bangkok Post article as well as others all had the same or nearly the same version as I referenced above.. which came from what I was told by my wife...so the inference to deception here is specious at best and probably more of a sour grapes cuz things aren't going all too well in the PDRC camp since Saturday and I understand how their supporters may get a lil bit antsy .. tell the other press outlets and media covering this that they are lying and see what comes back at ya... there is nothing I posted or quoted that is not supported by more than at least 2 other sources... and this is not a slam dunk by the PDRC in any way shape or form so we will both have to watch things unfold at the pace they will... I stopped trying to use a crystal ball with Thai Politics many many years ago...

Actually with all the translations/interpretations out there now and one of the mildest being this from one of many the other sources...

..." Suthep said the People’s Democratic Reform Committee (PDRC) was ready to step in as soon as the judicial axe falls on the current cabinet. “Once we become the sovereign, we’ll seize the assets of the of the Shinawatra family members. We won’t allow them to go abroad. They will need to report to us,” he declared. “We will appoint the prime minister of the people and submit the name to His Majesty, to be countersigned by me.”

I don't think Surapong is overstating anything...and I think it is quite clear to the world that Suthep jumped the shark long ago...

It is clear that “demagogue” is an accurate description for Suthep.

Would love to be the fly on the wall at Democrat think tank now.....

Actually, that is not a translation from a neutral source. That is a translation from Khaosod which is a copy and paste from their actual news report.

So you claim it to be a 'mild' translation do you?..... by a Thaksin funded propaganda rag?????

Please tell us why ALL the red farang have to lie to form a comment?

Are you all totally incapable of debate without resorting to lies and fact twisting?

You should be banned from the forum.

Whoopers my wife translated it as well but by all means go out and get beer and food no I did not use the Khaosod translation a thai one and the word medium was interpreted as sovereign and your claim that all I do on here is lie is in fact a lie so go get your beer you are a quart or two low... you considering yourself a debater is as far fetched as as can be you are at best an apprentice bater...... catch my drift...? all you do is slam people and rant and rave whilst licking your Suthep lollipop and drinking your Jim Jones Kool Aid...for gawd sakes man go get your beer!

I am sure they already know about that... but then Surapong is not a democrat or PDRC...why on earth would he advocate for them...?

Of course anyone can color anything according to their bias but I think outside neutral parties,,,not caught up in the drama... can measure what was said against what constitutes treason or any other untoward act by holding up the benchmark Law/ or whatever form be it Constitutional or other... and seeing if it actually does constitute a criminal or untoward act... and make an independent decision themselves... It is not uncommon in any adversarial system that one party argues 180 degrees in opposition of the other party..in fact that is usually the case.. then of course the arbiter must weigh the preponderance of the presented facts/opinions and make a decision accordingly...

but my guess is even the most die-hard supporters of Suthep are cringing a lil bit and are having a hard time with the fact that he might have said exactly what he is attributed to have said and more... IMO ...he should have quit after the amnesty bill... claimed the victory there and gone back to rebuilding with Abhisit and the Dems a decent and progressive manifesto for change and reform .. presented that to constituents and done political and grass roots outreach in order to grow their support base...and maybe in taking the higher road at that time might afford them an electoral victory down the road but...that day is long gone and in it's wake we have this division and growing unrest...and as this "faux pas" gathers steam he will continue to lose it....

Actually with all the translations/interpretations out there now and one of the mildest being this from one of many the other sources...

..." Suthep said the People’s Democratic Reform Committee (PDRC) was ready to step in as soon as the judicial axe falls on the current cabinet. “Once we become the sovereign, we’ll seize the assets of the of the Shinawatra family members. We won’t allow them to go abroad. They will need to report to us,” he declared. “We will appoint the prime minister of the people and submit the name to His Majesty, to be countersigned by me.”

I don't think Surapong is overstating anything...and I think it is quite clear to the world that Suthep jumped the shark long ago...

It is clear that “demagogue” is an accurate description for Suthep.

Would love to be the fly on the wall at Democrat think tank now.....

As we all wake up this morning to realize that Khaosod's lead story yesterday was actually mostly fiction and an elementary schoolboy's attempt to embroider a Thaksin fantasy that portraits Suthep as something of a cross between the Marquis de Sade and Count Dracula - we find that Suthep never at any point suggested that he wanted to be prime minister. Ever. Nor had Suthep at any point characterized himself as the leader of a coup. Ever. What Suthep did suggest is that a prime minister could be nominated by the people, pending royal approval.

Having said that, it will never happen, and not only that, should not happen. Suthep is bending the constitution here. The constitution allows for the nomination of an interim prime minister in the event of a parliamentary vacuum through articles 172 and 173. But that is for the Constitutional Court to decide. Not Suthep. And Suthep ought to know that this narrative too easily plays into Thaksin and Pheu Thai's hands. Suthep's skills for inspiring support and public enthusiasm are undeniable, and he has also without question been key in bringing about a real climate and thirst for reform. The Yingluck administration would not be in the tenuous position it's in without the mobilization efforts of Suthep since November to build populous support. The rallies and walks are a symbol of peaceful expression, and they are an ebullient and positive image to maintain. But at this point Suthep really should just shut up. It's time for him to take a back seat. Let the judicial process do what it's supposed to do - and that is to constitutionally uphold the law. This process should at all times be a constitutional process. There are two key verdicts coming up - the NACC and the Constitutional Court. Concerning the later, if they find Yingluck guilty of abuse of power, they will doubtless base their entire ruling on the precepts of the constitution. As long as the courts' rulings are heard and respected, this crisis will be resolved constitutionally, as it should.

Abhisit presents the correct formula here : respect for the rule of law, negotiations, and reform. He's right. Democracy cannot survive without respect for the rule of law. If this current situation teaches us anything, it is that. Even here, though, in an article from The Nation - we have problems with catchy headlines. At no part in this article does Abhisit or any other Democrat characterize their party as a " saviour ". But what Abhisit does do here is to reiterate that the respect for the process of law is the foundation stone of democracy.

For Abhisit to be credited by you for the "correct formula" is an absurd notion.. considering his checkered past track record..it is all well and good to take the ideals I believe we all agree would be the framework for a higher moral ground moving forward....ie: respect for the rule of law, negotiations, and reform. but it lacks sincerity coming from Abhisits mouth considering he does not practice what he preaches...

To all the posters pouring scorn on the only politician speaking sense, show me an alternative from the current administration. They have all abandoned their stations.

Some more questions for the same group who will surely decline to answer because they lack the ken.

What should happen to a candidate when votes are paid for?

What should happen when the opposition is physically abused when canvassing?

When MPs cheat in house voting, what should their party do?

If their party fails to discipline them, do they have the moral ground to complain when they are charged?

Should the offending party criticise the courts and legal bodies?

In cases such as the amnesty bill, would you expect you MP to vote for what is right or vote with the party in a censure debate?

If you can't answer these questions then you should not be posting your twisted distorted nonsense in response to someone who can.

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What should happen to a candidate when votes are paid for...

Ask Korn he admitted the Dems outspent others in the last election...and it didn't work

What should happen when the opposition is physically abused when canvassing...

Ask Suthep he is the master at preventing people from exercising their electoral rights...

When MPs cheat in house voting, what should their party do?

They should throw out the vote and make it mandatory that reps attend voting sessions ...

If their party fails to discipline them, do they have the moral ground to complain when they are charged?

They have the right to complain and oppose a "charge" a charge is not the same as a finding or conviction..

Everyone has the right to charge and defend against charges...

Should the offending party criticise the courts and legal bodies?

Unless there is a complete gag order and in most free countries...yes it is fair to criticize courts and legal bodies... It is called the adversarial system... and given the context here... hardly impartial bodies,,,,

In cases such as the amnesty bill, would you expect you MP to vote for what is right or vote with the party in a censure debate?

I believe the Mp should represent his/her constituency and find the definition of "what is right" measured by the highest moral or ehtical personal integrity.....but we are talking about politicians here... so that may entirely be moot...

You prove my case

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? Huh...? what case...? read my original post... i stated known facts out there in the real world... not scorn as you imply and I answered your questions.... but this thread isn't about you or me ..it is about the claim the Nation made by inferring Abhisit as the Messiah...which is about as ridiculous as nipples on a turtle... the piece reads like a PR brochure for the Democratic Party ...

To all the posters pouring scorn on the only politician speaking sense, show me an alternative from the current administration. They have all abandoned their stations.

Some more questions for the same group who will surely decline to answer because they lack the ken.

What should happen to a candidate when votes are paid for?

What should happen when the opposition is physically abused when canvassing?

When MPs cheat in house voting, what should their party do?

If their party fails to discipline them, do they have the moral ground to complain when they are charged?

Should the offending party criticise the courts and legal bodies?

In cases such as the amnesty bill, would you expect you MP to vote for what is right or vote with the party in a censure debate?

If you can't answer these questions then you should not be posting your twisted distorted nonsense in response to someone who can.

Sent from my Nexus 7 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

What should happen to a candidate when votes are paid for...

Ask Korn he admitted the Dems outspent others in the last election...and it didn't work

What should happen when the opposition is physically abused when canvassing...

Ask Suthep he is the master at preventing people from exercising their electoral rights...

When MPs cheat in house voting, what should their party do?

They should throw out the vote and make it mandatory that reps attend voting sessions ...

If their party fails to discipline them, do they have the moral ground to complain when they are charged?

They have the right to complain and oppose a "charge" a charge is not the same as a finding or conviction..

Everyone has the right to charge and defend against charges...

Should the offending party criticise the courts and legal bodies?

Unless there is a complete gag order and in most free countries...yes it is fair to criticize courts and legal bodies... It is called the adversarial system... and given the context here... hardly impartial bodies,,,,

In cases such as the amnesty bill, would you expect you MP to vote for what is right or vote with the party in a censure debate?

I believe the Mp should represent his/her constituency and find the definition of "what is right" measured by the highest moral or ehtical personal integrity.....but we are talking about politicians here... so that may entirely be moot...

................This is part two of the Suthep Abhisit Leekpai plan... but both Leekpai and Abhiset have their own ghosts to contend with... Leekpai's government was brought down by the corruption of none other than Suthep...it is all public record...Abhisit has several cases pending which have been unattended lo these many years by the "independent agencies" and was also tainted by the corruption/back room deals/shenanigans of yep ...Suthep...and several will expire in the next twelve to 15 months... probably because it is not in the interest of this group of cowboys...to expedite or bring them to a close ....all public record...so...I'm not tossing my hat in this ring..and I hardly think the general consensus now keeps Abhisit's choir boy image any longer...

The Abhisit government was charged in several cases of corruption, particularly related to spending under the Thai Khem Khaeng economic stimulus program. After much public pressure, Abhisit appointed Banlu Siripanich head of an investigative committee to investigate allegations within the Ministry of Public Health. Banlu's committee's findings included: bribery by a supplier of ambulances; irregularities in the purchase of UV fans; overspending on construction of building; inflated prices for machines and equipment.

Abhisit's Social Development and Human Security Minister also resigned due to a corruption scandal. In addition, Apirak Kosayodhin, the Democrat Party Governor of Bangkok, were indicted by the National Counter Corruption Commission on 11 November 2008 for corruption in the purchase of 6.6 billion baht in fire-fighting equipment. Apirak resigned from his office on 13 November.

Democrat MPs saw their personal net worth increase by 4.3 billion baht while Abhisit was Prime Minister. Democrat financier Kalaya Sophonphanit's personal wealth increased by 422 million baht, while the wealth of MPs Wilat Chanpitak and Chalermlak Kebsap increased by 303 and 302 million baht respectively. 10 out of 10 MPs whose wealth increased the most during Abhisit's premiership were all Democrat MPs.[210]

TPI illegal donation scandal

In early 2009, the Democrat Party was accused by the Opposition of receiving 258 million baht in illegal donations from businessman-turned-politician Prachai Leophairatana. Prachai was the founder of failed petrochemical firm TPI Polene (which was under rehabilitation under the Financial Institutions Development Fund) as well as advertising shell companies Messiah Business and Creation. In the lead-up to the 2005 general election, while Abhisit was Deputy Party Leader, TPI Polene allegedly transferred the funds to Messiah Business and Creation, which then transferred the funds to senior Democrat Party leaders and their relatives in batches of less than 2 million baht each to over 70 separate bank accounts (2 million baht is the maximum that banks can transfer without reporting to the Anti-Money Laundering Office).[211] The opposition claimed that the Democrats never reported the donation, which was far in excess to legal limits, to the Election Commission.[212] Abhisit denied the allegations, claiming that his party's accounts had been checked by auditors. Other Democrat Party leaders claimed that "the alleged donation never took place" and that the "party never obtained it."[213] Receiving and using an unlawful donation could result in the dissolution of the Democrat Party and the banning of its executives from political office for violating the Political Party Act.

The Opposition raised the issue in a debate of no-confidence, and accused Abhisit of approving false account reports for 2004 and 2005 to the EC and filing false information.[214] The government won the vote, despite the Bangkok Post calling the evidence against the Democrats "overwhelming" and even the pro-Democrat Nation called the Opposition's presentation "clear-cut."[215][216] However, the scandal was subsequently investigated by the Department of Special Investigation. The DSI prepared a 7,000 page report which it submitted to the Election Commission in early 2010.

The EC claimed that the DSI report contained many holes.

Yes... the very same EC that was appointed by coup leaders...so that is not unexpected...

Now I am sure that there will be posters who will attempt to disavow these facts and are free to do so...but the fact remains Abhisit remains the front for a far more sinister group that only use the banner of Democracy as it's hue and cry... many things of which we cannot speak here...and it really is a shame we can't because it is indeed an inherent factor and one that should not be taken lightly...and will soon all be played out in the open.... and the eventualities I am sure will catch many off guard..

I wish Abhisit was his own man..I really do.. I like him... he is fairly adept at handling tough questions...and for that I give him credit...but unfortunately he too is too engrained in the patronage-client system of politic which has little or nothing to do with Democracy ...sin nam jai.. (Gifts of Good WIll) the giving of monetary perks when bidding on contracts...etc ... during his time in office it has been reported that the "good will" perks went from 20-30% to 30-40%...

The World Justice Report says, that Thailand’s civil justice system, is under political influence.

But enough on Abhisit... there is plenty of stuff out there on him if you bother to check...

Nobody currently in the thrust of Politics is clean.... I daresay politics does not lend itself to be a pristine process of Democracy...but I truly do believe that now fronting Abhisit would be a major stumble on the Dems part.. He is too polarized already and the majority of voters see him as the enemy... course' nobody is asking me what I think so I am just spouting off here just like all the rest...

but...I think a better play for the Dems is to front somebody that hasn't been targeted by as much vehemence by the opposition as Abhisit has.. he surely cannot win a legitimate election.

Does anybody know a more moderate Dem or is there a list somewhere to look at of people they can offer as a potential candidate that doesn't come with as much baggage...? I just don't see him as being able to move country forward given the stands he has taken...

Khaosod have such a purely dreadful history given almost all the reporting they have done, to such a degree that they are often completely isolated regarding the stories that they cover and their own inimitable way of reporting them, that it would be prudent to wait until this is covered by other news agencies.

Good grief, it has been covered in other media, both Thai and non-Thai. Those of you who supported this monster uncritically over the past six or more months should be a little ashamed of yourselves. That said, this is nothing that wasn't glaringly obvious to those who bothered to look at what he was saying rather than just cheering him along. You forget the threats to kill Yingluck, the list of 3000 to be eradicated after he wins, and much more of the same.

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yeah I posted a translation from Thai of this in another thread yesterday and it was much closer to this Khaosod version than the one in the other paper...but either way...those who think this guy will honor anything he has promised in the past ( final pushes...going home to Samui ...my job will be done... etc etc... retire...bla bla perhaps are in for a rude awakening...as I said before...he is addicted now...he can't stop... if he goes home to Samui who will he rant to...? the cat...?

It seems to me that all. Thai in the PTP care about us an electorate vote from the majority. Even in the US they haveu many presidents who have been sscked from moral and legal issues. Watergate scandal, nixon, clinton to couple. They were elected by the majority yet their wrongdoings got them canned and all it took was one person showing how they did wrong and some investigation to prove it. The same ia happening here yet the people in the north either dont care, have red blinders or are paid to ignore the bad things about their leaders actions. .An elected Gov is a good thing and id part of democracy. But the elected Govs main concrern should be for their peoples benefit. Thinking they can do what they want to benefit family, friends, and peopke in their party is wrong. All the REDS want to claim bias from the army, courts, and rulings against them mosty because the one who learned all the bad things the PTP and YL were doing came from the DEM party. But it doesnt matter who blew the whistle on their wrongdoings. What matter is now their dirty secrets are coming out and being addressed. If they are not guilty i am sure they will able to prove it. If not then they need to go without a fight. I am also sure that the PTP uses prejudism and bias to get their supporters. If it had been a different party what would the PTP do? Who could they blame for leaking the dirty secrets? The facts would be the same incriminating them.

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I for one do not oppose transparency in any administration..and if politicians chose to die on their own swords,,, because of bad choices failed policy, corruption... or worse...so be it... but for me the underlying issue which is so painfully obvious is that there is no equity in the application of the law... and the "tools" of enforcing the law are all bought and paid for by people who do not think the same as me...people who do not want to use a Democratic structure..yet herald that as their beacon... SO much duplicity...and every day more brazenly one sided...as you said it matters not the color of the culprits what matters is they don't get away with it..but I beseech you do some more research on the corruption of the Dems government...which certainly was not for the benefit of "the people" which is why I maintain that what we see here is a quick fix,,,perhaps...maybe not maybe the door for transparency will be shut further...that remains to be seen...but what is abundantly clear,,, this is a power grab,,,no more no less...and the eradication of all these ills will take generations and will stem from a new born form of integrity permeating from parents to children from age one.. and through a complete restructuring of education going forward to give the tools to the future generation to be able to make a choice and not be swallowed up by the deceptions, and easy acquisition of wealth afforded by the mythology of expertise,,. from the back room dealers who defy the rule of law and appoint those who allow the same and by doing so are complicit in the acts themselves .... I certainly hope as the future of my son here is my foremost concern..that we are on the upward swing of the pendulum but by the markers thrown down in the last 5 months or so I fear the opposite..