eliotness

Second-crop farmers given govt warnings

...and no help.

Not the whole truth...

Listening to news on the way into work, heard that gov is sending out experts to test soil in many of the affected areas to test and try to help determine best alternative crops for various areas

They also plan to have these same experts Tyler to explain to farmers about which alternative crops to plant

Just hope all done in time and the farmers listen , as will turn out really bad for all (especially the farmers) if they just ignore and plant rice anyway

Alternative crops needing less water, good. Questions,

1. Is there a ready market for those alternative crops ?

2. Will the price remain stable if a large number of farmers in the region start selling at the same time ?

3. Can these alternative crops be stored for any length of time ?

4. Can these alternative crops be the staple diet for the family of a small farmer ?

5. Would not a mix of crops on a farm be better using crop rotation, so reducing rice but not eliminating it ?

6. The construction of rice paddies is such that water is retained, would any alternative crops need a different physical arrangement of the soil/banks ?

7. Will pesticides be required ?

8. Will different and potentially more expensive fertilisers and pH adjustment need to be used ?

9. Will specialised equipment need to be bought or hired to harvest these alternative crops ?

These are just a few that came to mind and no doubt posters can think of a few more.

I wouldn't like to take this off road. It appears that it is fitted with Forklift wheels and tyres. The same you see loading containers at the docks.

But perfect for crowd control !!!

It can be a good thing for the economy and for the rest of the industry/country. Look at Sweden, a country with 9 million people, has not been at war sin 1814 (yes that's right 1814!!!) unless you count UN participation and is in the top 10 of weapons exporting countries in the world!

However a substantial number of Swedes fought for the Finns against the Soviets, with even several thousand volunteering for the Wiking Division of the Waffen SS. Following the end of WW2 Sweden was on the front line of the Cold War without wishing to be subservient to the USA. Sweden has always been a leader in world science and engineering, e.g. Nobel and his explosives. To compare Thailand with Sweden is paying the greatest disrespect to Swedish science and engineering (SAAB, VOLVO BOFORS etc etc). Thailand could never in a million years achieve the Swedish level of science and engineering, however it is such a pity that great talent is spent producing weapons of war.

Ignite is a very strong word to use re. the economy. Not seen any fire in lower Isaan, rather the reverse, with agricultural prices continuing to drop, farmers going further in debt, soldiers checking on land encroachment and seizing farmland, all on top of a poor wet season

And what about the northern part of the country.

The dear leader didn't go there or even mention it. Obviously they have not been ignited yet !!!

Sorry if I missed it in the article, but where will the coal come from ?

Thailand has coal mines in the north. Thai companies also own coal mines in Indonesia and China (and possibly elsewhere).

Thanks for the info, but it seems your info is slightly dated as all the major mines have recently closed due to depletion of resources, ie the coals running out. The companies involved are, as you say involved in mines in Indonesia and China and recently Laos and Australia. So I guess they are rather more "multinationals" than Thai.

But whatever their ownership nationality it means virtually all coal will need to be imported, that's surely a double whammy in anyone's book. Not a smart move Mr PM sir.

Sorry if I missed it in the article, but where will the coal come from ?

As an experienced combat veteran who has participated in a number of battles, including the Thai-Laotian Border War, the general underlined the need for the country to have well-prepared troops. This is also to combat possible future threats like global terrorism, not to mention the possibility of having to cooperate with Asean countries in national defence technology development.

Anyone else out there find this somewhat amusing. A hardened battle veteran?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thai%E2%80%93Laotian_Border_War

So, not quite an Iraq, Afghanistan experience then general?

That goes for the vehicle too. Buyers want battle proven vehicles and weapon systems, which Thailand hasn't got. That just looks like a cardboard replica and too high a profile.

I feel with only Thais teaching English it will easier for Thais to change English so It will be closer to Thai. Americans And English teachers do not want to change it so quickly

English needs to change

I guess you're not English, otherwise you would be aware of the continuous evolution of the English language. The empire was responsible for many new words appearing in English and post war immigration has contributed many more. English, even the current version has very different roots than Thai, bit like chalk and cheese, not possible to change English to be closer to Thai, and even if you could, why would you want to when the rest of the world wants to learn real English and not Tinglish ?

Ignite is a very strong word to use re. the economy. Not seen any fire in lower Isaan, rather the reverse, with agricultural prices continuing to drop, farmers going further in debt, soldiers checking on land encroachment and seizing farmland, all on top of a poor wet season.

What's the use of alternative crops unless there is a definite market with a stable price. We planted some veg to diversify and come harvest found the wholesale price had dropped from 15 baht per kilo down to 5 baht a kilo. Not even worth growing for that price.

So they use 200 farang teachers and have achieved excellent results. Pity the latest statement from the Education Ministry seems to go against the obvious.

I wonder how it would cope with an IED ?

Yet more "big boys " Says everything that does.

Interestingly no mention of The Forest Stewardship Council (FSC). FSC certification is sought by most of the worlds timber producers as it is only given to forestry, timber and paper companies that fulfil a rigorous set of environmental and social standards (in theory anyway). This did not come about because the companies had a severe attack of wanting to do good, it was rather the enormous pressure exerted by WWF and friends and is/was a commercial decision.

Combine this with ISO 14001 for the paper mills (yes I realise there are questions about auditors and certifying agencies being open to the odd brown envelope or 2) and you go along way down the road of "real world" sustainability. Loved to have been a fly on the wall at that meeting!

Just seen it on channel 8 news. The waste being removed was so wet it was actually steaming. A close up picture showed the waste is totally mixed, so no sorting was attempted before dumping. The waste was covered with flies. Not a good situation. I hope they have a plan to make the area "clean" once the waste has been removed.

It looks like the garbage is saturated with water, so it's not going to burn very well. Furthermore how is it going to be temporally stored ? Obvious problem with flies, rats and other vermin.

Garbage for power generation needs to be sorted first for recycling, composting etc. I've never heard before of anyone digging up a dump (I would use the term "landfill" but I suspect it's no where near international standards) to use as fuel, but I will stand to be corrected if someone has knowledge of it working well. I should also imagine the exhaust gases from burning that waste will be pretty foul and will require 1st world scrubbers, not liable to happen is it ?

If you read the post they are at this time simply moving the waste from its current position to the Lom Sak facility which is about 30 clicks away,as far as I know the incinerator isn't even built yet as they state above.

I doubt it will ever get built.

I live in Lom Sak.

Then it looks like the storage will be long-term if not permanent. That raises the questions, is the "landfill" at Lom Sak lined ? What machinery do they use on site, eg compactors, dozers, front-end loaders, tipper trucks for cover material ? What is the compaction ratio achieved ? Is the landfill gas managed or just allowed to vent into the atmosphere ?

If there is no lining then there will eventually be a rather nasty effect on the groundwater. I'm guessing, but I bet they don't have leachate treatment.

Maybe time to leave Lom Sak

Time to leave Lom Sak.

I can only imagine these issues are a nationwide problem.

The site at Lom Sak is simply a concrete bund surrounding the perimeter it is very primitive,believe me they aren't capturing any gasses from this facility that much is clear.

I read a post recently on a related topic from a guy who I guess was a "environmental consultant" from Australia. He implied that he had advised the government (not sure which) and that Thailand has 1st world facilities for waste management. I know he'll probably reappear and jump down my throat quoting all sorts of data, but from the guys on the ground, like yourself, we get a very different picture.

Capturing the landfill gases tends to be governed by scale and I suspect not economical in this case, however what is important in all cases is compaction and daily cover. If compaction is not greater than 7:1 then the release of odour (Methane has no smell) will be rapid and cause nearby residences great problems. Also good compaction helps reduce leachate and reduce vermin as does daily covering (with soil or construction/demolition solids). If they do not have the right equipment then there is no chance of coping. Minimum should be a D6 bulldozer and a tipper truck (a front-end loader would be a bonus). As you live close, what do they actually have ?

I'm not just knocking Thailand as 6 years ago I opposed a landfill proposal on a factory site in the UK (where I worked) that thought they could use just a JCB. Didn't get any brownie points for that as it was a senior manager who suggested a JCB, but hey ho !!!

Collecting landfill gas is only simple if the landfill is designed with that in mind from day one. To retro-fit gas collection is not easy and can be a bit hit & miss. Landfill gas contains many toxic chemicals as well as methane and before burning it is wise to remove the condensate, which can be very foul smelling and extremely corrosive. If you attempt to burn untreated landfill gas then your burners will soon rot.

Agreed, liquified animal waste (including human) is easily stored and methane collected from anaerobic digestion, which kills most of the harmful organisms in the liquid waste. The equipment for this can literally be bought off the shelf and any scrubbing liquor can be returned to the digestion tank. This should be standard practice throughout Thailand, especially the medium and large pig farms. The digested solid/liquid is then a good fertilizer with a much reduced smell than the raw

Collecting landfill gas is only simple if the landfill is designed with that in mind from day one. To retro-fit gas collection is not easy and can be a bit hit & miss. Landfill gas contains many toxic chemicals as well as methane and before burning it is wise to remove the condensate, which can be very foul smelling and extremely corrosive. If you attempt to burn untreated landfill gas then your burners will soon rot.

Agreed, liquified animal waste (including human) is easily stored and methane collected from anaerobic digestion, which kills most of the harmful organisms in the liquid waste. The equipment for this can literally be bought off the shelf and any scrubbing liquor can be returned to the digestion tank. This should be standard practice throughout Thailand, especially the medium and large pig farms. The digested solid/liquid is then a good fertilizer with a much reduced smell than the raw pooh.

Landfill gas is a very very different matter.

It looks like the garbage is saturated with water, so it's not going to burn very well. Furthermore how is it going to be temporally stored ? Obvious problem with flies, rats and other vermin.

Garbage for power generation needs to be sorted first for recycling, composting etc. I've never heard before of anyone digging up a dump (I would use the term "landfill" but I suspect it's no where near international standards) to use as fuel, but I will stand to be corrected if someone has knowledge of it working well. I should also imagine the exhaust gases from burning that waste will be pretty foul and will require 1st world scrubbers, not liable to happen is it ?

If you read the post they are at this time simply moving the waste from its current position to the Lom Sak facility which is about 30 clicks away,as far as I know the incinerator isn't even built yet as they state above.

I doubt it will ever get built.

I live in Lom Sak.

Then it looks like the storage will be long-term if not permanent. That raises the questions, is the "landfill" at Lom Sak lined ? What machinery do they use on site, eg compactors, dozers, front-end loaders, tipper trucks for cover material ? What is the compaction ratio achieved ? Is the landfill gas managed or just allowed to vent into the atmosphere ?

If there is no lining then there will eventually be a rather nasty effect on the groundwater. I'm guessing, but I bet they don't have leachate treatment.

Maybe time to leave Lom Sak

It looks like the garbage is saturated with water, so it's not going to burn very well. Furthermore how is it going to be temporally stored ? Obvious problem with flies, rats and other vermin.

Garbage for power generation needs to be sorted first for recycling, composting etc. I've never heard before of anyone digging up a dump (I would use the term "landfill" but I suspect it's no where near international standards) to use as fuel, but I will stand to be corrected if someone has knowledge of it working well. I should also imagine the exhaust gases from burning that waste will be pretty foul and will require 1st world scrubbers, not liable to happen is it ?

I wonder why so many "crackdowns" are being mentioned. I think I've found the reason, the government has only got a pocketbook version of an English/Thai dictionary and so therefore their choice of words is very limited. They need to buy a thesaurus.

Simple solution for industries operating in a water-catchment area, no ISO 14001 certification, no licence to operate. ISO 14001 is not the be all and end all solution, but it forces industries to recognise their emissions and have steps (documented) in place to reduce that pollution. After all Thailand is a member of ISO and the Thailand Standards Institute frequently attend ISO 14000 meetings.

Back in China, all it required was a fat red envelope and a few dinners and karaoke for the inspectors while they stayed in town pretending to inspect.

Can't imagine it's much different here.

Unfortunately you are probably right and not only China and Thailand. However if the certification body is found to be taking "fat red envelopes" then they will lose their licence from ISO and be reported in the media as such. But that would require a whistleblower, a rare species with frequently a rather short life-span.

Simple solution for industries operating in a water-catchment area, no ISO 14001 certification, no licence to operate. ISO 14001 is not the be all and end all solution, but it forces industries to recognise their emissions and have steps (documented) in place to reduce that pollution. After all Thailand is a member of ISO and the Thailand Standards Institute frequently attend ISO 14000 meetings.

Simple solution for industries operating in a water-catchment area, no ISO 14001 certification, no licence to operate. ISO 14001 is not the be all and end all solution, but it forces industries to recognise their emissions and have steps (documented) in place to reduce that pollution. After all Thailand is a member of ISO and the Thailand Standards Institute frequently attend ISO 14000 meetings.

The "crackdown" on industrial plants releasing wastewater into rivers seems to be to allocate more water to the factories to ease the problem. Holy shit ! do they really mean that, surely not, must be an error in the translation. Dilute and disperse is so 19th century. The government needs to force those industrial plants to treat there effluent to an acceptable standard. It can be done, not rocket science.

"To encourage people living along various rivers not to litter" that has got to be a joke, after all littering seems to be endemic in Thailand.

Yet again fine words about saving the environment, but no substance behind the facade.