candide

1 hour ago, Crazy Alex said:

Doesn't matter. Government targeting a specific religion for any reason is unconstitutional. There are still plenty of religions, other than Christian, who attend services.

 

Plus, as you know, if any American police agency said they were going to get tough on Muslims going to their mosques, there would be screeching from the leftist media at the highest possible volume. Think 12 on a Marshall amp.

Is it unconstitutional to target specific events?

1 hour ago, Jingthing said:

Yes but the truth of what 45 did and didn't do is available to all that care to learn.

 

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/04/11/us/politics/coronavirus-trump-response.html?utm_source=digg

 

 

 

And what he said!

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/timeline-president-donald-trump-changing-statements-on-coronavirus/

4 minutes ago, rabas said:

I'll try to get a graph. Death rate can differer for many reasons, including virus subtype if they have different presentation. New York area was hit from Europe while Washington state and California were mostly seeded from East Asian counties like Japan and Korea.  But we will need to wait for some time before any of that is proven.

Ok, it makes sense. 

3 minutes ago, Crazy Alex said:

So what?

The motivation to attend religious ceremonies is higher when there are major events. I guess that if instead of Easter, it would be Aid el Fikr, there would be warnings for Muslims.

In addition, not all areas have a significant numbers of Muslim inhabitants, while there are plenty of Christians e everywhere in the US.

2 minutes ago, rabas said:

Cases yes, deaths no. On a normal timeline (non shifted) the EU6 group cases have equal slope and a 6 day offset. The deaths are quite different. I think one reason for the death rate differential is that different regions were hit with different subtypes, most notably subtype-S and subtype-L. Of course, there are other factors.

 

 

Are you sure? Death follows infection for a certain percentage of infected people after a certain time, so both numbers are completely correlated.

17 minutes ago, rabas said:

Anything in China is suspect for all the usual reasons.  For a valid comparison, use six core European countries with an equivalent population to the US that have varying case and death rates like the US. These are  Germany, UK, France, Spain, Italy, and Switzerland.

 

USA   cases  534,494  deaths 20,637

EU6   cases  684,157  deaths  64,930

 

What do you see that's different?

What's different is that the outburst in the US happened about 2 weeks later than in Europe, so it is not at the same stage of diffusion . It is (unfortunately) likely that numbers in the US in two weeks will be similar to the current numbers in the EU.

And the US has a very knowledgeable leader...the moron doesn't even know the difference between a bacteria and a virus. ????

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/us-politics/trump-antibiotics-coronavirus-white-house-briefing-brilliant-enemy-genius-idiot-a9460636.html

6 hours ago, frantick said:

My problem with all of this is that they should always use the word 'reported' when they don't. If anyone believes the China numbers, given the lack of info we can get out of them, they're delusional. 

 

All the MSM has to do to redeem themselves is get a few reporters into China and report some facts. Alas that would be real journalism and not what we get today.

 

We constantly see all the warts and all from open societies, and we bicker back and forth while the truth in closed societies is probably much worse, and if reported accurately could possibly pull us closer during this mess.

And of course, we must believe you when you claim MSM don't use the world 'reported' and don't have any critical attitude when information comes from China.

As for your suggestion, the problem is simply that they are not allowed by the Chinese government to investigate.

18 minutes ago, nauseus said:

Any evidence is still emerging and certainly incomplete. That's part of the reason many governments erred at the start of this. The South Koreans and Taiwanese tackled it best and fastest - probably because they had better intelligence and assumed that the Chinese had a much earlier and bigger problem than was declared. As the global guiders, WHO dithered about and refused to use the pandemic classification for far too long. Now look at it - useless! 

February 11

GENEVA (Reuters) - The World Health Organization asked countries to be “as aggressive as possible” in fighting the newly named COVID-19 coronavirus on Tuesday.

“If the world doesn’t want to wake up and consider the virus as public enemy number one, I don’t think we will learn from our lessons,” WHO chief Tedros Adhanom Ghebreyesus said in Geneva.

“...We are still in containment strategy and should not allow the virus to have a space to have local transmission.”

https://fr.reuters.com/article/topNews/idUKKBN205218

5 hours ago, faraday said:

Less deaths per population though.

 

 

It doesn't make sense to compare countries which are at different stages on the diffusion curve. When one looks at the slope of the curve, the US don't look particularly good.

BTW, the graph is from an excellent updated article. Free access.

https://www.ft.com/coronavirus-latest

1 hour ago, riclag said:

 Nonsense,

"If you listened to the World Health Organization director general’s January 30 speech on why his agency was declaring the outbreak a public health emergency, you would not have had a clue about the concerns over China’s lack of transparency and early response. That’s disease diplomacy in action".

"The WHO’s head, Dr. Tedros Adhanom Ghebreyesus, praised China, and has repeatedly done so on Twitter and in public statements since".

https://www.vox.com/2020/2/10/21124881/coronavirus-outbreak-china-li-wenliang-world-health-organization

 

 

The whole world watched these two perpetrators co mingle  through diplomacy during this  viral atrocity ,as a result many countries were being reassured to continue, while they at the same time lacked transparency. .    He's responsible to the billions of people that have suffered pain ,loss of life and monetary hardship,present and future generations! imop.

In conclusion, the world leaders must come together, like all crimes against the world and determine whether  he is a accomplish or a accessory to this and deal with him accordingly. 

I'm done with you!

As very well explained in the article you link, there may have been good reasons for being diplomatic. Bashing China would not have improved anything.

He's not responsible of billions of people...blah blah. That's pure propaganda B.S. As explained to you by other posters, it's governments who make policy decision, not the WHO.

The main difference between countries which were able to fight the virus (China, SK) and others, is that they quickly implemented a policy of extensive testing, tracking and isolating. This has been advised by the WHO from the beginning. They were not late and proposed a protocol as early as January 17. Most countries failed to do that, including countries which have experienced an outburst later than SK and had more time available to implement it. The so-called world leaders have only to blame themselves, starting with Trump.

7 hours ago, Crazy Alex said:

I see. So WHO will just regurgitate whatever is in front of them if it's all the info they've received? If that's all they're going to do, and did, what good are they? We can just go straight to the Chinese Communist Party in the future and save ourselves tens of millions of dollars wasted on the cretins at WHO.

That's how it is defined. It collects and diffuses information given by member states, you know, like 'Botswana declared it's first patient today', etc... It's not a watchdog like the IAEA, it has no investigative power and member states have not signed a treaty allowing WHO to send inspectors to check facts.

For a new virus with no prior experience, there was no way WHO could 'imagine' alternative scientific information.

12 minutes ago, ChouDoufu said:

and for every drug they develop that gets approvel and makes billions, there are dozens of others they spent millions on researching and testing only to fail.

 

we consumers tend to notice only the lottery winners.

Schumpeter.

10 minutes ago, Crazy Alex said:

Same as yours, though probably better. I doubt he or she is heavily invested in the therapy in question not working. Selection bias can be a major problem.

Don't put words in my mouth, please. I am not invested in it not working. My position is that it is not yet scientifically established that it works or not. The FDA doesn't know (it is allowed only for trials), health authorities in Europe don't know and are currently conducting a large scale trial. 

Only your side, following Trump as usual, is on propaganda mode about it.

The other facet of my position, as you know, is that Trump should shut up about it.

12 minutes ago, Mama Noodle said:

what? 

Show the quotes from MSM accusing Trump of racism and mentioning the CHINA travel ban (not another travel ban decided for another reason than the covid, I.e. Nigeria). There isn't any such accusion campaign by MSM.

32 minutes ago, Chiphigh said:

You have got to be kidding. They have peddled first the travel ban is racist then jumped to the trump administration didn't react fast enough. 

 

What planet are you living on? 

Which travel ban are you talking about? The China travel ban? If yes, it's a lie.

51 minutes ago, Crazy Alex said:

Yes, because that is a new concept WHO just came up with because they are so brilliant and useful. LOL

Thank you for stressing that Trump is an idiot who was not even able to push policies that rely on such evident common sense. Instead of downplaying risk and talking B.S. for weeks on TV.

41 minutes ago, Crazy Alex said:

So they were only able to repeat what they're told and not find a coherent message. Wow, it's even worse than I thought. Thanks for pointing this out.

So which other scientific evidence was available? That's one of it's mission, communicate the information provided by its members.

1 hour ago, riclag said:

 He  told every country  there is no need(not recommend ) for  restriction for travel and trade January 30th. He needs to be held accountable !

https://www.who.int/news-room/detail/30-01-2020-statement-on-the-second-meeting-of-the-international-health-regulations-(2005)-emergency-committee-regarding-the-outbreak-of-novel-coronavirus-(2019-ncov)

 

He may have been wrong. However, most of them did not follow his advice, so he cannot be accountable for what happened in countries who decided to implement travel  restrictions, I.e Italy, US, France, Australia, Afghanistan, Costa rica etc....

On the other hand he recommended early and extensive testing... WHO applied it apart from SO and China?