kwilco

Human error In the context of road safety and the "Safe System," human error refers to mistakes, lapses, or incorrect actions made by individuals while driving or being involved in road traffic. These errors can occur due to various factors, such as lack of attention, distraction, fatigue, impairment (e.g., due to alcohol or drugs), inadequate driving skills, misjudgement of situations, microsleeps or simply making a wrong decision. The Safe System approach recognizes that humans are fallible and prone to errors, and it aims to design and manage road transport systems in a way that considers human limitations and reduces the risk of serious injuries or fatalities resulting from those errors. The Safe System acknowledges four main components: 1. Safe Road Use: Encouraging drivers and road users to act responsibly, obey traffic rules, and avoid dangerous behaviours like distracted driving or speeding. 2. Safe Roads: Designing roads and infrastructure to minimize the risk of crashes and reduce the severity of potential injuries when crashes occur. This may include measures like installing guardrails, improving visibility, and implementing traffic calming measures. 3. Safe Vehicles: Promoting the use of vehicles equipped with advanced safety features that can mitigate the impact of collisions and protect occupants and other road users. 4. Safe Speeds: Encouraging appropriate speed limits and enforcing them to reduce the likelihood and severity of crashes. By acknowledging the inevitability of human errors and addressing the contributing factors through the Safe System approach, the goal is to create a more forgiving road transport system that minimizes the impact of those errors and ultimately reduces the number of road traffic injuries and fatalities. Human error is considered to be inevitable. Humans are fallible creatures, and despite our best efforts, we are prone to making mistakes. This is a natural aspect of being human, and it applies to various aspects of life, including driving and road safety. In the context of road safety, it is important to acknowledge that humans are not perfect drivers. We can be affected by factors such as fatigue, distraction, stress, and limitations in our attention and perception. These factors can lead to errors in judgment, lapses in concentration, or incorrect actions while driving. The Safe System approach to road safety recognizes the inevitability of human error and aims to design and manage road transport systems in a way that considers these human limitations. Instead of blaming individuals for their mistakes, the focus shifts towards creating a forgiving road environment that reduces the severity of crashes and minimizes the consequences of human errors. Often these are just minor momentary relapses or mistakes it is the CONSEQUENCES that can be mitigated. The number of actual collisions in Thailand is the same as in UK – but it is the consequences that are so different. By addressing the contributing factors and designing the road transport system to accommodate human fallibility, we can make significant progress in improving road safety and reducing the number of accidents and fatalities. This approach involves not only improving road infrastructure and vehicle safety but also promoting responsible road use and adherence to traffic rules to mitigate the impact of human errors on road safety.

I really don't thin I sould be giving your answer the time of day - it is so daft - I said its a red herring not that it din;'t happen - theree really are some dim comments on this thread

Forget the tire! It’s a red herring! Accidents will happen – they occur due to human error but most people don’t understand what human error actually is they mistakenly think it’s down to “stupidity” or “bad driving” – but theirs is the stupidity for not understanding the true nature of human error in road safety. …and that is what is happening in most of the comments on this tragedy. What the crash reports never reveal in Thailand is an accurate picture of what went wrong – they will try to naively apportion blame and sweep the matter under the carpet ASAP. The fact that it has laid bare one of the most critical issues in Thai road safety will be hurriedly ignored. Road safety is a health issue and it is the responsibility of the government (successive governments in Thailand’s case), and the authorities don’t want to face this as it impinges of businesses and their economic plans of untrammelled development. Thailand is not an oil rich country, it depends on imports for its energy – so for years it has been encouraging the use on natural gas to power vehicles. …and this comes with a range of safety responsibilities that the Thai authorities need to enforce – sadly they fall short again and again. They should have been taking precautions to help mitigate the risks associated with the high volatility of CNG, making it a safe and viable fuel alternative for buses and coaches, especially in urban settings where environmental concerns are prioritized. So how can CNG or LNG be used safely? – This is down to the government… here is an overview of the issues that need to be addressed concerning the bus (buses) involved in this incident…… First how is CNG stored on the vehicle? – In high-pressure tanks; it is stored in tanks that are built to stringent safety standards. (reinforced steel, aluminium, or composite materials) designed to withstand high pressure and external impacts…and it looks as if the tanks on the bus retained their structural integrity. Probably imported from China or maybe Europe, they should also periodically inspected and recertified to ensure long-term safety. All these systems are fitted with pressure relief devices to prevent explosions in the event of overpressure or fire, they release gas in a controlled manner when pressure or temperature exceeds safe limits. – but where did the fire start?? Where the tanks are placed is important on trucks it is usually outside behind the cab they can be mounted on the roof or under the chassis of a bus, they should be AWAY from passengers and in areas that are less likely to be affected in the event of a collision. Roof-mounting also helps in case of gas leaks, CNG is lighter than air and will rise and dissipate. All vehicles are fitted with gas leak detection systems - CNG-powered buses are/should be equipped with sensors to detect even small gas leaks. Sensors are installed in key areas such as the engine compartment, fuel storage areas, and the passenger cabin and are connected to alarm systems, which in the event of a leak, the system triggers an alarm to alert the driver AND automatically shuts off the fuel supply to prevent further gas leakage. Did this happen?? In the engine compartment design CNG-powered buses are designed with enhanced ventilation to allow any leaked gas to dissipate quickly and prevent the accumulation of gas that could lead to ignition. – did this happen?? Special care should have been taken to reduce the risk of sparks in the engine compartment. Electrical components are sealed or shielded, and potential sources of sparks are minimized to reduce the likelihood of ignition in the presence of a gas leak. Did this happen or was it some shabby, thrown together back street wiring loom? In the event of a collision or severe mechanical failure, automatic shut-off valves will stop the flow of gas from the tank to the entire vehicle - well this doesn’t seem to have happened at all!! There will also have been a manual shut-off valves that can be operated by the driver or maintenance personnel in case of emergencies, allowing the isolation of the fuel system for added safety. Obviously they were inaccessible due to the heat. What about the onboard fire suppression system? CNG-powered buses should be equipped with fire suppression systems that automatically activate if a fire is detected, particularly in the engine and passenger compartments. These systems are designed to help control or extinguish a fire before it spreads. Thermal fuses are a worry as they are designed to vent gas safely if the tank becomes exposed to high heat from an external fire, reducing the risk of tank rupture. Where they part of the problem? A universal problem in Thailand is that of driving education and training – there appears to be no comprehensive training: Drivers of CNG-powered buses should undergo specialized training to handle safety crises, such as identifying gas leaks, using emergency shut-off systems, and responding to fire alarms or other emergencies. I’d like to know if this company has a training program of any kind. Of course they cost money and you’d have to pay a “skilled” driver more money. Obviously in this appalling case, evacuation procedures failed. Was the driver trained in proper evacuation procedures? One of the 5 Es of road safety is “Engineering” – which covers both vehicles and the road themselves – under this category one had to include maintenance and service of the vehicle – without effective monitoring by the DLT this is a huge gap in Thai road safety. The system relies on the movement of brown envelopes rather than the mechanical health of vehicles. CNG buses require more frequent inspections than their diesel counterparts, especially in areas like fuel storage, fuel lines, and engine compartments. Maintenance personnel need to be trained specifically to work with high-pressure gas systems. Does this happen?? There needs to be regular gas leak testing which should be mandatory to ensure that all seals, hoses, and connections are secure and functioning properly. Tanks need to be inspected and re-certified regularly: All CNG-powered buses are equipped with easily accessible emergency shut-down switches that allow for immediate deactivation of the fuel system in case of an accident or leak. Why did this not happen?? In extreme situations, emergency venting systems can release gas safely from the tanks to prevent pressure build up and potential explosions. – did this go wrong?? Many people have pointed to the “Merc” badge on the front of this vehicle – and that’s what it is – a badge on the front of the vehicle – almost certainly this bus was coach built of a second-hand or imported chassis – even the claim that was a Merc needs to be verified There is virtually no vehicle construction and crash safety regulation enforced in Thailand. Were the fuel systems on this bus crash-tested?: The entire fuel system, including the CNG tanks, lines, and connectors, should be designed to withstand impact forces from collisions. I very much doubt they would stand up to serious scrutiny. So, what is the guarantee that they remain intact and do not rupture in accidents? Did the areas housing CNG tanks have reinforcement with extra protection to minimize damage from external impacts during crashes? We need to ask the coachbuilder!! On all buses passenger awareness is crucial – in this case the adults should be informed of what to do – there should be clear signage and instructions on emergency evacuation and safety procedures need to be posted inside the coaches so that passengers are aware of what to do in case of an emergency. – were they??? It looks as if at least of the emergency exits were unavailable due to where the bus came to rest but buses are equipped with emergency exits and easy-to-use systems for passenger evacuation, on all sides – this is critical in case of a fire or gas leak so what went wrong there? There are loads of questions as yet unanswered about this disaster but it is easy to get that sinking feeling when you realise the chances of them being comprehensively addressed and answers are incredible slim. Saving face will come first.

You clearly haven't read my post or even the OP.

I agree - it's not good - but I knew that 25 years ago.

Agreed it isn't right....but it hasn't changed for years so anyone retiring in Thailand should have been capable of taking this into account. It's not a change in the situation....it has been in force for decades.

UK pensions are frozen in Australia too

You realise there is no set aside pension fund. A UK pension is funded by CURRENT taxpayers...your NI contributions paid for pensioners when you were working. Pensioners are supported by today's taxpayers not your historic NI contributions. What you paid in wouldn't keep a mouse alive these days. How pensions are paid or frozen has been in place for decades...their is no reason to be surprised or indignant, you should have known already and taken it into account before retiring in a different country. UK has a very wisely pension system... it basically is a barbies system designed to keep pensioners from starvation. Unlike EU countries which have much higher levels and benefits to boot.

You are making some VERY stupid remarks. THis is an incident where children died and all you can do is go one about a tire - you are doing a diservice to their young lives - it's quite disgusting.

one of the factors behind Brexit was that the EU was pressuring the UK - match their pensions to the average levels in the EU - those these people voted themselves out of changing the system that has been in place for years.

This has been the case for decades - why didn't they know?

You are so naive - So what if the tire burst and so what about the Merc - do you seriously think that would cause that kind of fire if the bus was set up right? I is beyond me how unintelligent some people can be - I don't understand the first thing about what happened.

THe impact may be on the off side against the barrier and not visible in the photos.

Most of these buses are built on second-hand (imported) chassis - the bodywork was probably done in Thailand - even without the gas it's very likely the interior was not in proper fire retardant gadding - it's an automotive Grenfell.

It is very disturbing that the amateur crash reporters are so fixated upon try to find blame in the collision that may have started this tragedy. the REAL question is why, after a relatively minor collision did it escalate into a major disaster. What needs to be looked at is the whole situation with regards to coaches and safety. Collisions WILL happen it is what we do to mitigate the ramifications that is most important.

You are using this tragedy to reinforce your own "master race" sense of superiority. Like others on this thread you are looking around to blame some Thai person so you don't actually have to think about what actually happened and why. Why is it that people who cling to racist philosophies so tightly spend so much time claiming they aren't racist?

Only fool doesn't understand the limitations of anecdotal and personal observations and is unable to interpret what they see - rather than reasoned analysis, you just let your own bigotry and racism rule your brain.

Classic racist response.

It's so sad that people seem to think they are so much better by making assumptions about an incident when there is no accident report or any evidence to support that opion a..it's just an opportunity for bigotry and racism. In fact it is THEY who are so inadequate

you have no idea what went on - you are just making up stories to make yourself fell better - just hope the same never happens so you have to "prove" yourself.

Watch the series "Bangkok Breaking"

It isn't what cuased the acident that is im[ortant - it is what happened AFTER that that is so terrible.

Well it isn't - the bodies are usually coach built in Thailand - they are not properly tested (paper bag testing) - the interiors may well be specially built or modified using non fire retardant materials and of course ta gas conversion that is near a Heath Robinson affair.

Your theory being????

Yes - but the performance and safety of these vehicles including fire extinguishers are part and parcel of the design process - it looks as if highly flammable materials were used and it is unlikely they could have been extinguished anyway.