chessman
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Posts posted by chessman
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1 hour ago, PingRoundTheWorld said:
Isn't that the whole point in the Swedish strategy? While the rest of the world will still be struggling with this for 1-2 more years, Sweden will be less affected by a second wave. This isn't a sprint - it's a marathon - all these countries that are "doing better than Sweden" didn't escape the threat - they just postponed it.
You might well be right, but nobody can be 100% sure about things. There are a lot of unknowns there, 2nd waves, levels of immunity.
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20 minutes ago, Bkk Brian said:Sars mysteriously disappeared
SARS disappearance wasn’t that mysterious. It was due to public health initiatives. As more was discovered about it, scientists learned that it only really became infectious when the symptoms became stronger. When that was known it became possible to isolate possible carriers and stop It completely.
it’s a success story for public health bodies, government cooperation and rational scientific thinking. The same things we need to be putting our faith in now.
Who knows what damage SARS could have done 100 years ago.
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12 minutes ago, Logosone said:
Stanford University professor of structural biology Michael Levitt, who specialises in mathematical models, branded lockdowns a 'huge mistake'. Professor Levitt, who won the Nobel Prize for chemistry in 2013,
I watched a long video with him, his ideas are very interesting but it must also be said, his Nobel prize and his expertise are in a completely different field.
He was also a big supporter of mask-wearing and felt that they had helped Asian countries immeasurably. How do you feel about that, Logosone?
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15 minutes ago, scubascuba3 said:
i know that killing the worlds economies was the wrong thing to do, but it will only be clear to everyone in many months time
And most governments would say that this is a public health crisis that needs to be sorted first in order to normalise the economy.
Tourism/International travel
live sporting events
Restaurants/bars
all huge sectors, employing millions, that will find it very difficult to keep their head above water, almost whatever a government decides to do.
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24 minutes ago, Logosone said:The prospect of large crowds of tourists caused one seaside town to buckle and declare that they would open public toilets to stop visitors relieving themselves in parks and beaches.
Great Yarmouth Borough Council's leader Carl Smith said yesterday: 'With the bank holiday weekend and second week of relaxed restrictions bringing the increased possibility of more tourists venturing further afield, we have decided to re-open a limited number of seafront toilets at Great Yarmouth and Gorleston from tomorrow for emergency use in the interests of public health, which remains our top priority."
Well, if they are opening up some the seafront toilets in Great Yarmouth then I admit defeat. Such action proves that people have reverted to their normal behaviour.
you got me.
I look forward to the next JP Morgan study that uses this startling and irrefutable fact to show the errors of the 100s of countries that foolishly persued NPIs.
Why bother with complex graphs showing changes in social interaction when you can just check if public toilets are open?
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2 minutes ago, lkv said:Well, that does not make her more of an expert than Tegnell now, does it?
I would never claim she was. But it seems significant that she had supported the policy but has changed her mind.
there are people posting in his forum who still seem 100% sure that what Sweden doing are correct... and at the same time someone who clearly has a very good understanding of the situation has decided that Sweden should have been tougher.
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On 5/24/2020 at 8:04 AM, Logosone said:
Just totally untrue.
Patterns have changed massively, even minor easing of the lockdown resulted in people swarming to the beaches in the UK.
Right, people going to the beach proves that interaction patterns change massively as soon as elements of lockdowns are reduced. I don’t think you believe this yourself.
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Significant that...
‘The predecessor of Sweden’s state epidemiologist has broken her silence on the country’s controversial coronavirus strategy, saying she now believes the authorities should have put in place tougher restrictions in the early stages of the pandemic to bring the virus under control.‘
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1 hour ago, Logosone said:Well of course, whether it's 0.022 or 0.039 per cent of the population, any fool can see that is a tiny number.
It’s 1000s of people, brothers, sisters, fathers and mothers. People who were loved.
And if you take the predictions by the national banks, Sweden’s GDP will fall by 0.9% less than Norways.
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1 minute ago, yuyiinthesky said:Another malicious imputation.
You write stuff like that but the next post that suggests that Bill Gates is responsible for the whole crisis you’ll be all over it.
your positions are not serious because I know exactly what side you will be on on any argument, the evidence is not important to you.
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21 minutes ago, Logosone said:You obviously don't understand the concept, if the lockdowns are suddenly lifted and lockdowns were the sole cause of reducing cases then once they are lifted case numbers would have gone up. They didn't.
Absolute nonsense.
The spread is caused by human interaction, lockdowns are a way of changing patterns of interaction. They achieved that goal. The lockdowns lift but people are still cautious and so the patterns of interaction don’t change so much.
The really interesting question is if these patterns could have been changed in other ways, without such drastic measures.
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10 minutes ago, MikeyIdea said:Just in case you didn't know, hospitals in Sweden are NOT a business, they are all government hospitals paid with tax money and the legal system doesn't support law suits for monetary gain.
It’s the same in most of Europe, if not the whole continent.
unfortunately, the people who think lockdowns should never have been introduced seem unable to argue their case solely on the merits of that position. They also want to ‘prove‘ that there is a huge conspiracy to inflate the numbers of cases and deaths, that lockdowns have actually increased the numbers of cases and deaths and many other things... It’s actually a sign of the weakness of the position, a scattershot approach that accepts any theory, no matter how ridiculous it is, if they think it undermines the arguments for lockdowns.
The truth is always a bit messier. It can be both true that strict lockdowns have been an overreaction and that we are underestimating the numbers dying due to Covid 19.
I thank you Mikeyldea for your updates about Sweden. Really interesting to have somebody there who can report what they are seeing themselves.
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2 hours ago, Peter Denis said:Also no link needed, because simply googling "BBC Hardtalk Anders Tegnell" will lead you to it.
He’s made himself available for lots of interviews so you can find many clips of him talking. Whatever you think about Sweden’s policy, he’s a sincere and serious person.
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45 minutes ago, yuyiinthesky said:
Now I understand you!
Nevertheless, your statement has absolutely nothing to do with my post. I assume you replied to someone else, and the page jumping caused by the pop up ads moved the page when you clicked.Wow, you have no idea about sarcasm at all. Are you American?
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28 minutes ago, yuyiinthesky said:Sorry, not interested. I understand that you seem to have some conspiracy theories about fake flu death numbers. I don't. Therefore I leave that exercise for you.
Still dodging the question. Not fake Flu numbers at all but worked out in a completely different way.
Amazing how you guys rely on the CDC and WHO numbers on flu but as soon as one of those organisations makes a point about how serious Covid 19 is, you talk about how corrupt they are and that they shouldn’t be trusted.
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19 minutes ago, yuyiinthesky said:You have any source for these statements? (But please not again these crazy Q anon videos!)
I’ll add an inability to detect sarcasm to your list of ‘skills’
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1 minute ago, farang51 said:
The restrictions are only for show; the governments of all countries decided to grab the chance to ruin their economies
Good point. It is a well known fact that governments always win re-election when their economy is doing badly.
I don’t know why more governments don’t do this in election years... all you have to do is sink your economy and you’d be guaranteed to win.
This proves they had the motive and we all know they had the means.or perhaps there is a flaw in my logic?
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9 minutes ago, yuyiinthesky said:
And I already answered, that the exact number does not matter.
I don't know what you impute as my position, so I try to clarify:
Why is a Covid-19 death to be avoided by all means, even disastrous lockdowns, while a Flu death seems to be no problem, and that despite the Flu death number being higher.
My position is that the humans dying from Flu (etc, also TB, cancer, Malaria) are also humans, their live should not have less value.
Nevertheless, feel free to recalculate and correct the numbers, and update the CDC stats.I’m not recalculating any numbers. I’m not saying the exact numbers matter. I’m asking a very simple question about how the numbers are calculated, a question that you are dodging.
Try and answer it, go on... let curiosity get the better of your fixed ideological position. As William Blake said ‘the road to wisdom is crooked’.
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2 minutes ago, yuyiinthesky said:
That's an unfounded imputation
It explains a lot though. ????
it’s a simple question, either you don’t know the answer or you do and you understand that answering it truthfully takes your ‘position’ down uncomfortable paths...
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1 minute ago, yuyiinthesky said:I think it has to do with this, applies it:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MathematicsAh, so you don’t understand it.
good you are honest about it
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3 minutes ago, yuyiinthesky said:
The real question is not if there are 600.000 FLU deaths per year, or 599999, or 600.001, but why there is a lockdown for X Covid-19 deaths, but there was and is not much attention for Y Flu etc death, despite Y being the higher number.
So I ask you the same question, how are those numbers calculated?
I thought it was well known, but perhaps not.
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22 minutes ago, Bender Rodriguez said:
you can look it up on cdc and other websites
I’m not disbelieving the statistics. I’m asking you if you know how they are calculated?
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26 minutes ago, Monomial said:
What is missing in the analysis is the expected additional deaths in 2020 and coming years due to the economic evisceration that governments inflicted on the population due to their lockdown restrictions.
Maybe the death rate will actually go down, as it did in the US during the Great Depression?
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1 hour ago, steelepulse said:
Nice to selectively point out the spike.
A laughable comment. You’re right though, if there was no spike then all of this would definitely be overblown!
You can’t dismiss the spike, the spike is the whole point. Governments needed to respond to that spike...
How far would you have been OK with letting that spike rise before you would have been OK with governments taking extreme action?
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Sweden - is the rest of the world dumb, blind or worse ?
in COVID-19 Coronavirus
Posted
Every antibody test that has been done recently has seemed to show a lower percentage of positives than what was expected. The recent testing of MLB employees in the US is another example, less than 1% infected in that test.
The idea that Herd immunity has managed to come to these Asian countries without anyone noticing seems almost impossible.