Schooner

The price of oil is high because of speculation and whoever said that the Enron traders have found a new place to dwell are not far from the truth. Enron wrote the book on driving up energy prices and this pattern is the same as that. There were no shortages then and there are no shortages now.

The fact is the worldwide demand is actually less than it was two years ago. I agree that it is projected to increase but it is not what is driving these prices. Oil is sold the same as most comodities. The only difference is that you don't actually have to take posession of it and you don't even have to use any of your own money.

What is incredibly interesting is how everyone here is speculating what the cause is depending on their particular political view and that my friends IS the problem. WE DON'T KNOW for sure because Bush gutted the SEC years ago and there is no one left who could tell us what the hel_l is going on.

Also there is a trading organization CIS that congress allowed (when no one was paying attention) that is outside the US regulatory authority and no one really knows what the hel_l their doing. I've seen numbers between 15% and 49% of the futures are being bought buy this group. Huge institutions are buying futures on margin as a hedge against the declining dollar and their are no margin limits. So the speculates are speculating what the other speculator will do with a rumor or a bit of bad news and there is no oversight

This administration wants this to happen because it creates a buzz of fear that we won't be able to drive to work and we won't be able to afford food and it is in that time of fear that there will be an election and guess what?

But the real reason for the price is BECAUSE THEY CAN it is as simple as that. Americans (I'm an American) have become sheep. They are so fat and lazy that they can't get off the couch to protest. The government can tell them anything (through the existing media) and they will believe it and even after they learn that they have been lied to they will do nothing.

We just did it in April and it was about 5 weeks before we got the interview date. There is no packet 4. You can go to the embassy website and watch for the interview date to show up but they will notify you also by mail.

Pattaya is a cool city like no other in the world where two worlds coexist side by side. It has great hotels, resturants, nightlife, and attractions. I did the nightlife for awhile but got bored with it and fortunatly there was more to it than just the sex tourest stuff.

Why should I be embarrassed. Why would I care what people thought

People will not seek help until they reach some sort of a bottom. Where that bottom is can be different for each individual and unfortunately some don't make it. For those that do decide to get help, the help is always there if they are sincere. Your daughter sounds like she is not ready yet and no amount of intervention on your part will change that. You cannot restrain someone if they want to do drugs and she will be out of there the first time she craves her drug.

I have known several people who have gone to extremes to "save" there child and the success rate is about the same as leaving them to screw up there life to the point where they are sick enough to change. My opinion is to let them live there life and sort it out for themselves.

I know this sounds pretty hard, but when you learn more about the poor success rates for all of the above suggested approaches you might just agree with me. Personally I believe in helping, but they have to want to help themself otherwise your wasting your time. More importantly you have to let them make the first move. Drug addicts are extremely smart people and they are very good at telling people who love them what they want to hear to get what they want.

I would suggest you learn more about addiction through alonon or other programs and learn how to deal with the situation without becomming part of the problem. It seems to me that the most important part of her recovery is for you to deal with whatever feelings of guilt that you may have over her addiction

there are some interesting designs being made from steel containers. Add some insulation, windows, ac and it's ready. Some of the designs being built in the US are hard to tell from conventional.

They just don't see it as inconsiderate because they all do it. I think that they do practice "the golden rule" but most of this stuff dosen't bother them and they can't understand why it bothers us.

Well, with the exception of the guy who shot 7 because of it. It is one of the things that I can't stand about Thailand.

We were up in the village a month or so ago and the noise there was driving me crazy. Two times during one night the dogs went off then it started at 4:30 with chickens and geko's and dogs, and then grandma talking to a neighbor three houses down, and then the temple drum, and the anouncements that went on for 2 hours. I am usually pretty tolerant but it was making me crazy. I bailed and went back to Pattaya where I could find some quiet.

My other pet peve is people pushing in front of me in line at 7-11. I don't tolerate it anymore and if I stayed in Thailand it would likely get me killed. That's one of the reasons that I cannot live there.

It's good to hear from people who have given this more thought than I have. For the moment I'm staying put with the nominee company. What's that expression about the devil that you know vs. the devil that you don't know. I have zero confidence with anyone in Thailand that would have to help me do something different.

If this all blows up, and I seriously doubt that it will than it will be all over TV and then the thousands of home owners in my situation can get togather and take some sort of action.

On the bright side, my house is rented out for healthy return and it has appreciated 20% (mostly due to the dollar) it is for sale but I am not really that anxious for it to sell because the rent is a great return on my investment and I don't know where I would put the proceeds.

IMO the government comes out with one of these things to scare us and slow growth. It worked. Pattaya property appreciation dropped from the teens to about 6% overnight. Now it is started back up again.

Amazing thing, history and to hear it from the mouths of the participants always causes me to pause and appreciate the experences of others.

From a anthropological standpoint life for humans was pretty rough up until 100 years ago or so. Many of the classical periods that some of us talk of as being so civilized were only civilized for the rich. For a few million years humans have been clasing it out. I suppose that from that perspective it is getting better. It's hard to tell sometimes.

I used to think I had a difficult childhood...

thanks for sharing those stories.

Thank you for the complement Canuck. I am in fact a class act who has figured out what gives me pleasure and struck a balance between giving and taking. Apparently we are in agreement regarding healthy give and take relationships based apon mutual support and respect and NOT on what we pay or don't pay. Sorry you missed that point in my description of my relationship. I mentioned that a few of my friends brag about not paying because they do. Their GF's are not women that I would choose to be with and in fact would run from. Since you missed it the first time: "the security of a relationship cannot be determined by what you pay or don't pay".

The OP's question was aimed at determining what a "responsable" manner of payment is. I pay 3,000 per month because it replaces the 3,000 that my wife was paying before she met me and we negotiated that before we married. The other amounts I paid were to satisfy what I consider to be "responsable contributions and opportunities to do something nice. Frankly I think the OP is paying too much too soon and I would not agree to it. I would not even consider 2mm baht and would probably have asked her to leave if she thought that crying would get her anything. It is up to him if he feels he's getting his moneys worth. I have a friend who pays more to a BG. We have all agreed that for the pleasure he getting were staying out of it.

I wouldn't know about trouble hooking up with a 20 yo in the west because I haven't tried. Perhaps you could enlighten me.

I did not set out to hook up with a 20 something in Thailand either (except on a short term basis). What happen is I met a women who I enjoyed being with and now two years later I still enjoy being with. The fact that she is 23 is icing on the cake. Apparently your experences are different from mine.

I believe she gets into bed with me because she loves me as a wife loves her husband. She does not have a cultural objection that prevents her from being with an older man. She shares her life with me because I am a intelligent, funny, successful and happy guy who also happens to be a good mentor. She is intelligent enough to realize that her relationship with me provides her with opportunities that she would otherwise not have. She still has to do the work. She dosn'r want a free ride and wouldn't get it from me. So you see if I am the best she could do, she has in fact hit the motherload and what it says about her is that she was smart enough to wait for the big fish and not go home with the first farang that tried to talk her panties off. It says that from an early age she knew what she wanted and she focused her considerable efforts on obtaining it. I've met more than a few folks in my lifetime who could learn a thing or two from this simple 23 year old farm girl.

What is "normal" for you is not necessarily normal for me or anyone else. The whole point is creating a life that is interesting and fulfilling. Every relationship demands compromises if they are balanced. The amount that I contribute is small for me and generates huge good will for her. However you look at it, it is the right thing to do.

We met through her mother who cooked at a restaurant that I frequented. She was working in an electronics factory 12 hours a day 60 hours a week and living in a one room "apartment" with one of her girlfriends. She had been working for two years and been given increasing responsibility but was still only making 10,000 per month even with the overtime. From that she was supporting her grandparents. It would have been rediculess for me to not replace that support if I was asking her to come live with me.

Most people who are not married to a 23 year old think that the reason anyone would be with someone that young is for the sex but it is not the main reason for me (although it is quite nice) What attracted me to her was her sense of humor, her intelligence and the confidence she exudes. She is a huge tease and is constantly turning things upside down to create these ironic looks at things we see everyday and applying her dry wit to them. I guess it's no surprise that her favorite American sit com is Seinfeld. She has all the DVDs' and it is how she has learned to speak English so well. It is a constant challenge to keep up with her mind. It is also incredibly satisfying to turn her on to new activities and adventures and to see her grow and learn and apply her values to ideas. She is a great cook and is constantly adapting Thai recipes to other ingredients to create great tasting interesting food. She loves to grow things and pretty soon we will disappear in a thicket of herbs and flowers. Everyone who meets her loves her and respects her for the same reasons I do. There is a reason why we respect some people immediately when we meet them and it has nothing to do with age. My 87 year old mother adores her and it is truly a beautiful thing to see them working in the garden togather.

Overall I am happier being with her. It is strictly a cultural view that only people of the same age should marry and we all know what the underpinnings of that view is. If it goes against the grain of what is culturally acceptable than that is good enough reason for me to do it. Anyone that we would meet who would express an objection would identify themselves as someone we would not want to know.

We don't drink or smoke. We spend our time enjoying and sharing the benefits and beauty of life. Will it last forever? Who knows. One thing that I am certain of is that I am happier doing this than many of my ex-pat friends who seem to have found their happiness at the end of a bar stool while they espouse upon the behavior of others.

After 11 pages of this it's obvious that this topic brings out peoples passions. Love it or hate it Thailand brings out peoples passions and isn't that really what this is all about?

The OP's question was what is a reasonable amount to pay and frankly it was a question that I struggled with in the early stage of my relationship. In my case my future wife was a virgin and and so I thought it particularly important to get as many issues resolved as possible before moving "forward".

My wife was raised to be a honest, responsible, hardworking young woman by her grandparents who are rice farmers but who instilled in her a set of values that will hold up anywhere in the world. I support her grandparents with 3000 baht per month. Instead of Sin Sot I built a new house with the help of her family for about 300,000. Her aunts live all around her in the same block so they all help out. In the two years we've been together we have paid out another 5,000 or so for medical stuff and farming expenses.

My wife is 23 and I am 55. She was #3 in her high school graduating class, Number 2 in her University class and in every instance shown a willingness to work hard and contribute. She is now attending a community college in Florida. She show's enough promise that I think she should go for it and yes I am paying for it. To be fair it is a hel_l of a lot less than I paid for my own two children to attend college and flunk out. The reason that I am happy doing this is I too come from a poor background and some folks helped me along the way and so this is just pay back. I wouldn't do it if she did not show such promise. The day after she received her green card she went to work as a housekeeper in a hotel. Within a month they wanted to make her manager.

The OP has acknowledged that he would do things differently if he was starting over which brings me to my point.

Living with MY Thai wife is a constant negotiation. That is no surprise to me because I believe that LIFE is a constant negotiation. I am happy that this is so because frankly if it were not life would be too predictable and boring.

When I think of all the things that I have spent big money on in my life to get some excitement or pleasure this has to be the best bang for the buck. If it turns out that a hardworking and fun young woman gets off to a better start so much the better. The joy that she has brought to me and the pleasure of knowing her everyday is worth it all.

I want to say something about the age difference. Study ofter study has shown that women are most attracted to strength of character and humor. My wife constantly reminds me that she is happy with the trade off between my old reliability and her friend's young handsome cheating boyfriends and husbands. True, my odds are not good for the long term, but given my record she has more to worry about than me.

To answer the question of money to the rest of the family here is how I handle it. My wife's mom had a gambling debt of 50,000. My wife was helping her pay the interest from her pay at an electronics factory. If I wanted my wife to quit working I had to take over that payment. What I choose to do was pay it off and make it a loan. I told her mom that her line of credit was 50,000 and when she paid that back interest free than it would always be there. Needless to say she will never pay it off. Same for the rest of the relatives. I loaned 1000 baht to her brother, when he pays that back I might consider loaning him some more.

Finally I want to say something to all you guys out there that brag about not paying anything. I think you have some self image issues if you believe that the value or the security of a relationship can be measured by what you pay or don't pay. I know a couple of your types and judging from the looks, waistlines and attitudes of their wives I'm not surprised that you don't want to pay. If you can afford it than why not pay a reasonable amount to help.

What is interesting here is the range of opinions regarding what one should pay and why. What I don't get though is why do some of you care so much about what the OP does.

When one of you figure out a way to guarantee a particular outcome from any human relationship let me know

My wife's friend has been married to a German guy and living in Germany for about 5 years. Apparently they came back to Thailand several months ago to open a jewelry shop. She (the abandoned wife) suspects that her husband ran off with one of the young employees. He left her a note saying he was leaving her and took everything with him and left her holding the rented house, rented shop and a car bought on payments in her name. He also took the bank book and her Thai passport.

Now there's probably more to this story than I'm getting but it does seem rather rotten to just dump her like that if that's whats happened. I'm assuming that she has some legal rights since she is still married to him under German law.

My guess is that he does have some legal responsability here and if he were to be reminded of them he may decide to do the right thing. My question is how she can go about getting what she deserves. Should she be contacting a lawyer in Germany to remind him? What do you think?

Hi

Quick question, I want to send a laptop to my girlfriend next week. What would be the quickest way to do this? Would it be best to just take It to the Post Office?

Will there be any extra charge when it gets into Thailand?

Bad idea. the duty on electronics to Thailand is over 100% Another thing to think about is that if it dosn't have a Thai keyboard than it will be of limited use to her. better to hand carry it next trip.

Having said all that there is a very small chance that it will get discovered in the mail (EMS) if it does she will have to pay.

I feel a lot safer with the company arrangement than I would with the 30 year lease. There is currently some debate if even that is legal and as I understand it, it is not renewable which I think would make it harder to sell and then there is the whole inheritance issue.

A company can be transfered in 5 mins by changing the director. I imagine that there are thousands of nominee companies out there and I have no doubt that if anyone of them were being "looked at" we would all know.

Let's say that they did come after us. The remidy would be to make it legal in a reasonable time frame when we would all just change to whatever the latest money making Thai scheme would be.

TIT is Thailand and we have to live with a certain amount of uncertainty.

I own a house through a nominee (technically illegal) company. It was set up by a Thai lawyer and then "gone over" by my lawyer and no red flags. Then a few months later the government anounces that this process was out of control and had to stop. Needless to say I was worried.

Since then (March 2006) nothing more has happened and I understand that the land office is again processing nominee companies. There was never any discussion of what would happen to those who already had nominee companies and as I understand it the government wouldn't have the resources to tackle it even if they wanted. So, the short of it is that for the thousands like me who already have a company ownership nothing will happen. When I sell my villa all I have to do is sell the company and the land office never sees it. I looked at lease options but I think for people who already have a company it is a safer option.

Like many things in Thailand there are laws and then there is selective enforcement of those laws.

I am 100% sure that this is a shakedown. Issan parents want to see there daughters married because there is still shame in traditional families when their daughters sleep with men outside of marrage. If this was ligit they would be talking about sin sot and marrage not building a house. The daughter would not be staying with you in your hotel either.

If you stall about paying any money than you are only opening yourself up to plan B to extract money from you. You have already established that this women is after money now you have to decide if you want to hitch yourself to what will no doubt be a lifetime of money demands. She and her family have already figured out that your enough of a sucker to still stick around after the 1mm baht pitch so they will just work on closing you on a lesser amount.

I would move on now before she figures out what your soft spot is.

I believe that I read somewhere that the majority of visa applications are turned down for inadequate paperwork. I also read that the console's have about 10 mins to review and decide each persons application and that the decision is made before the interview. the interview is only a formality in 99% of cases because the decision was already made during the review. I also read that they could care less about the way you are dressed or age differences.

There are ample warnings about the need to supply the required information and there even are instructions on how to orgainize and present it. I had to read over and over the instructions and check and recheck the paperwork for the two visas that I got approved. In one case I happen to catch a change in a form the day before I mailed it. It is not that difficult but you have to be careful. All total I maybe had 15 - 20 hours tied up in the process. It took about 7 months start to finish and after we were married we had to go through the whole process again for the green card. That process takes about the same length of time and she cannot work, drive or go to school during that time. We both now have to report any address changes within 10 days...forever

I know people who are not detail orentiated and would have a struggle with the paper work. There are no second chances you have to get it right the first time and they do not have time to help or coach people. Sad as that is I guess I can understand it.

Having said all that there are veterans orgainizations that will go the extra mile to help vets with stuff like this.

I also submitted a couple of questions to the staff (after recieving the standard reply) and they were answered politly and in a friendly manner.

From the news I read that the National Visa Center (which does the name checks and the preliminary stuff before sending it on to the BKK Embassy) they were looking to hire 1500 people because of the huge influx (3 million) of applications for citizenship last year due to the consideration of changing immigration laws.

I can relate to this story. I went through the process a little over a year ago and all went well for my wife and I but it is a complecated process that requires attention to detail. But if you think that getting them to the US is complecated wait until the green card application. It is worse.

As I understand it the people at the embassy only care about the ligitimacy of the relationship and the sponsers ability to support the benifactor. When we went for the interview they were very nice and even personable, joking with my wife in Thai.

I am currently assisting a friend to get his girlfriend over and she has an interview on June 6 I understand that the system is completly overwhelmed because of the extreme number of applications that were submitted last year.

Personally, I think it sucks that there are 12 million illegal mexicans in the US and we have to go through all this to bring a few thai girls over. And another thing I think if your a vet it should be an automatic approval. All this crap about fighting for freedom...freedom for what?

I'm glad I stumbled on this thread. A few weeks ago a friend of mine told me that he was geting an increase in libedo from Sustanon and I decided to try it after checking it out on the web. (there is tons of information out there) it appeared to me that it was worth a try. I was able to buy it at a pharmicy on second road near the white house. It appears that the price ranges between 150 and 250 per box of three vials. The injection was 50 baht and the clinic where I went for the injection had it also for 150 baht per injection. I've had a couple of injections and haven't noticed any change in energy or libedo.

I'm taking advantage of the special medical check promotion at Bangkok-Pattaya and will ask for the testostorone level test. I did read about the side effects mentioned here in this thread and I agree with the importance of checking natural levels and taking the minimilist approach.

I too would be interested to know if anyone believes that it is effective at increasing libedo or energy. Otherwise what's the point.

Am I correct in assuming that I can get my 1 entry tourest visa (from the US) stamped in Vientiane for another 30 days stay in Thailand. I'm going back to the US April 30. My current one entry 60 day indicates I have to go out by the 12th. I thinking I can just cross the border and maybe spend a few days exploring Laos before returning to Thailand.

Any one see a problem with this thinking? thanks.

Same old story from the same old posters who probably couldn't afford to buy anyway. It's all speculation being offered. Here is the reality. There are thousands of houses out there that are currently owned by nominee companies (mine being one of them) when the goverenment first anounced the enforcment of the non foregner ownership and put a stop to the creation of nominee companies (many are still being created) we all freaked out a bit, but the reality is that nothing has happened. No one has lost there property due to having a nominee company ownership and In my opinion if you already have one it is a safer bet than a 30 year lease.

When I sell my house I will actually sell the company and the papers will not even see the land office. The government has stated several times that they have no intention of pursueing companies like mine. The reality is that they do not have the resources to do it if they wanted to.

Here's another fact I bought my house because I wanted a comfortable place to live in and it made my time here so much more pleasent. For the last year I have been back in the states and the place has been rented to a very nice couple who being afraid to buy, are paying me rent of 32,000/month. I have about 4.5 million tied up in the house and lived there for two years. If I don't sell it than I can live with the current return which given the current uncertainty of the markets is a healthy return that is relitvely safe. If I sold it tomorrow I will have made almost 20% just on the dollar exchange.

When I talk to others who actually own property that is desireable. (A condo is a huge concrete echo chamber where if someone farts 30 floors below you hear it and every one is mismanaged to rob the farang IMO) They are in similar situations.

Again, look at the billions that are being invested in Thailand by huge develpers with huge staff's to analyze all the growth data. Apparently they are stupid and the handfull of posters here are the smart ones.

I think that the topic was is the Thailand Housing market a bubble. Here's what I think: The US housing bubble was driven by low interest rates and a lack of morgage oversight. It was out of control for 10 years but is just now collapsing because every warm body who could possibly get a loan to buy a house has bought one and there are no more suckers, er, I mean qualified buyers to buy in to keep the bubble afloat. It's been kind of like musical chairs, "don't be left standing when the music stops"

Several of my friends who made millions on the US bubble started working there way out last year and only got stuck with a few properties unsold which they can easily handle.

Thailand is not a bubble in the same sense as the US was because it is not being driven by cheap, out of control lending. It is being driven by demand from developed countries that have become over valued. The big corperate developers know this and have plans for thousands of new units because there is demand for them. Where are all the baby boomers going to find there piece of paridise at an affordable price?

I agree that lot's of bad things could happen but you have to be a poker player to invest in anything and for my money Thailand housing has been safer and a more consistant a return for the past 3 years that I have had a small piece of it. I bought in with the idea of flipping but now rent for a very nice 9.5% return and that's not counting the currency exchange profit if I sold now (18%)

Now I've had offers to sell but I don't know where I would put the money and get the same return with the same security. I know Thailand is not perfect, but look at the alternitives. I occasionally read the negative crap that gets posted here by the disgruntaled few but my investment just continues to appreciate.

My experence is that people are buying and renting. The growth rate is probably around 4-6 percent for properties in the 4-8 million baht range. Higher priced property is selling better.

I have a house rented and I thing if you buy a quality place in a desirible location you won't have any trouble renting or selling. My average return on investment is about 8% without considering what I could make on the exchange rate if I sold it today (30%)

IMO the market was too hot a couple of years ago and it really needed to slow down, but make no mistake it will continue to run along at 4-6% which is desirable in any economy. Let's not forget what the huge developers know and that is that there are millions of baby boomers retiring soon and they want to live in warm temps.

I lived in Thailand for a couple of years on a retirement visa than came back to the states last December (2006) and let my retirement visa lapse.

My Thai wife and I are going back for a couple of months in Feb (Feb 12 - Mar 30) I'm planning on applying fr a 60 day tourist visa and then an extention once there. It looks like we will be leaving Thailand at least once since we plan to do some travel outside Thailand as well.

Is this the best option for me? 60 tourist with one extension or is there something I'm missing?

thanks in advance for the advice.

My wife (thai) and I are planning a return to Thailand in Feb 08 for about 3 months of traveling and sight seeing and we want to rent a late model pickup with the large cab and prefer automatic.

I own a home in Pattaya (rented) and have lived in Thailand for a couple of years and have a Thai drivers license so I am experenced with driving in Thailand.

We would prefer to pick up the vehicle at the airport when we arrive as we will be going upcountry to visit the family first.