Rob Browder

Quoting the Pattaya Mail, which he referenced. I watch several Thai related YT channels, and Mr Hart often quotes some interesting articles.

You can use income over 40K / mo from a job in Thailand with work-permit, but you will need to provide a stack of Thai company documents - basically, the same as would be needed for a Non-B Visa - a big PITA. Then, if you go for the 1-year extension - do it all over again. "Self employment" would need to be a Thai company - otherwise back to the 12-months of transfers to prove the income (edit: IF your imm-office will accept them).

For now, the ETA proposal has been delayed. It was originally proposed only for those coming in "Visa Exempt," but ... "... suspended on October 16 by the Cabinet at least until April 2025." https://www.pattayamail.com/latestnews/news/the-real-deal-about-the-end-of-one-of-thailands-unpopular-address-forms-476283 The article goes on to say, however ... At some stage in 2025 the ETA system will be extended to include all foreigners entering Thailand, including all non-immigrant visa holders such as retirees. They do not say where they obtained that information, and I hope it is unfounded, but this is the way the wind is blowing. I learned of this article here:

I file on the first day I can. Same with annual extensions. There is more time to deal with "unexpected problems," that way. One does not need to do anything wrong to have "unexpected problems" - things change / break / etc w/o warning. That said, checking in here can minimize surprises, which will usually hit someone else in the backside, first.

He thinks they will cancel it because of the Elite? I think that overpriced option's ship has sailed. If they had enough money/power to prevent the DTV, they would have. In what other way does the DTV "not make economic sense for Thailand"?? People with money / income stay and spend that money here vs spending it in other countries. That "makes economic sense" to me. After a year or so of "no problem with my DTV reports" being passed among expats - many who left, swearing never to deal with Thai immigration again, due to their past behavior - might even return and start spending their money here, again.

While still walk-up service (not eVisa), they will not take your 5K unless you qualify for the visa. I have not read a report of anyone with seasoned-funds and other known-needed documents being denied the Non-O-ME in Savannakhet.

Last report of the "all included" agent option I saw was June 2024: They used to charge him 35K Baht / year - then tried for 75K this year. I would guess they lost their contact, and were going through another agent middleman. Another agent offered the service for less, but at an "up-country" immigration-office. This fellow from January was using an "up country" agent, who also provided the funds:

I cannot answer the underlying question - but, to clarify: It is the "permitted stay" which you would be extending - the visa being expired is not an issue. But, the Elite Visa is not a "Non-Immigrant" type of visa, so you would be unlikely to be able to go directly to a 1-year extension-of-stay - though I would still ask. Would they let you apply for a 90-day Non-O Visa based on marriage, which could then be extended, from a "Privilege Visa" permitted-stay? The forms used for this are for "Tourist" and "Visa Exempt" - still worth asking at Immigration. Hopefully, someone who has done this can chime-in. Worst case, run up to Savannakhet or Vientiane and get your 90-Day Non-O Visa there.

I don't know how the agents do it, but I would guess customers provide their passport details in advance, and they book "for them" online, as slots become available. I have also seen threads reporting on-site agent-service at consulate gates on short-notice. This would not preclude having to show up at the consulate yourself for processing. Though that was not needed at some consulates in years past, it has been required everywhere for awhile, now.

I meant agent-money in an envelope for "no problem processing." I had well over a min-balance of 400K in the bank. I have read threads here of folks doing marriage-based via agent w/o funds - not cheap though. Staying here under 50, pre-DTV, was a PITA.

The primary issue is, the police cannot make laws. There is no "not a real tourist" reason in the law to deny entry, and the law instructs that immigration may ONLY deny for the specific reasons listed. The law was written in a way designed to prevent the very corruption taking place now. It was only ever "enforce-able" due to a lack of legal oversight of police-procedures. See above: As well, the terms of the Visa-Exempt entry were re-defined when it was changed to 60-days, to include other reasons for entry - making this document no-longer applicable, even if it ever had legal weight. Further, this statement begins by defining "tourism" as "not working here" - which makes sense. But then, they bring up an undefined "in/out" aka "visarun" and some vague "time" factor. How many days between leaving and returning is acceptable? Had they simply defined that one term, everyone could have complied easily. But, even if they had - how to deny-entry based on "did not stay out long enough before returning," when this was never a legal reason to deny entry? And, in the most glaring example of hypocrisy and corrupt-intent, this "problem" can be solved by paying them off through agents - including at the nation's capital-city airports - whereby "visaruns" are magically transformed into 100% acceptable "tourism."

An awesome rant making exactly this point, is here, from the Integrity Legal guy. Not allowing foreign-nationals to complete with Thais in this market-niche is good - but the rest is terrible:

I ran into this problem also - now pay at 7/11, as no bank (including the KTB branch I tried) would open an account in Thai-script for me. Some report one can get a non-Thai-script account added at the Rayong Thai-SS office, which is purportedly more friendly to farangs.

Agree - except this one - if one stayed for long periods, prior. If, for example, one was here throughout Covid on covid-extensions, they seem to really hate that. Why? There were few jobs available then - no "illegal tour guide" opportunities and such - so it's not that they think they were "working illegally." But, for a year+ the IOs had to live on their salary-income only - no doubt resulting in the loss of fancy cars, angry mia nois, etc. Hence, great resentment that those farangs "Got Away with living in Thailand ALL that time!"

I haven't seen a passport with "not entering for tourist purposes" stamped in it as the reason for denial of entry. They have also done this routine to those with Tourist-Visas. Also, "tourist" is not defined. If they set some solid criteria for "tourist," then fine - so everyone can plan accordingly - X time in Y months, or whatever. Instead, there is no consistency, which creates fear, which just "coincidentally" markets agent-services which benefit them - and they ONLY do this where the agent-services are needed to bypass it.

They don't say "not allowed" - just that they aren't condoning / guaranteeing their services. I'm sure it's a nice little earner for them.

The best reason is if you are working here (for over a year, while paying Thai-SS), and want to keep your Thai-SS health-insurance going after your job ends - saving a huge pile of money vs private-insurance. Without your Pink-ID + Yellow-Book, you will not be able to do this. Due to the sometimes-long delay-time between application to receipt, this should be done well before one's job ends. A yellow-book also precludes needing to get CORs, in many/most cases - though probably not worth it for this reason alone, unless your Amphoe isn't a PITA about it (like mine was).

Thailand's immigration law was written with this in mind - limiting IOs to very specific reasons for denial. There is no "been here too much" legal-reason for denial. But, as there is no oversight ("agent fees" pay into a pyramid-scheme, of sorts - so bought-out to the top), they just pretend you "didn't have money," and there is no one to stop them doing this.

Yes, I was responding to the oft-repeated statement that Tourist Visas were now useless due to Visa-Exempt being 60-days now.

My life has been fairly "enjoyable and stable" in Thailand, for many years - but I don't pretend to know the future. I use the same permitted-stay as you do, and I hope the rules do not change. The point is to be sure you can take "enjoyable and stable" with you, if things change unexpectedly. I would not be "gloomy" even if things were spoiled here, because I am prepared for such an occurrence - though I would be disappointed. Those unprepared could become quite "gloomy," I reckon. I have no fixed-assets in Thailand I could not afford to lose - is Rule #1. I have the wherewithal to move to another country if something goes wrong here. I keep-tabs on the immigration rules in a few other "2nd Choice" countries, just in case.

It is 100% legal to get a new passport, they can see your full immigration history to Thailand, and the only reason they would care is "Where ELSE have you been." Unless they suspect one of being a terrorist, it's irrelevant.

This is the reality of living as a foreigner in Thailand, unless one has Permanent Residence or becomes a Thai citizen. The only difference between types of entry/stay, is the "odds" of problems. I stick with my Non-O "based on retirement" extensions, because history indicates I am unlikely to have a problem in the future. That said, they have changed the rules for these before - and could again, without warning - and with or without without "grandfathering" the current qualifications.

I saw one 2nd hand report here of Russians given a hard time, but were let in after showing the receipt for payment from the Thai-Consulate at Phnom Penh and possibly other supporting paperwork.

Two public offers of airport "guaranteed entry" service: https://aseannow.com/topic/1336926-setv-metv-still-around-now-that-visa-exempts-are-now-60-days/?do=findComment&comment=19217493 www.onestopservicepattaya.com (per YT video with the agency owner)

In almost all reported cases, the person is sent to the last place they flew from. Better if you were stamped in/out there, also. Immigration can opt to send you to your passport-country, but usually an airline rep meets you in detention, and arranges a flight back where your last flight began. I had faster entry with new passports, as they seem to read every stamp on every page in a passport - presumably to see where you have been, other than Thailand. But, they can see all your Thai entries/exits on their computer.