Paagai

Hi everybody...sorry that I did not get to view all the posts earlier as reply and as I was busy with a couple of my own company's projects.

I wish to thank everybody for their comments and just to make something clear.....everyone has the right to start their own groups according to their own requirements and needs. I am sorry if my intentions harmed anybody as I had no ill intents at all. Please if you are not within the prerequisites that I had indicated, do not take it in the wrong way and please instead start your own groups!

Pertaining to some posters comments here...I do not need business referals as please do check my background as I am also a sponsor onTV under the PR Express Banners, the Pastry Club Banners and also I had taken the main mast place once for the Flower Show at The Nai Lert. Also about wanting to find sex......I am very happily in a monogamous relationship for the last seven years and we are not into groupies or switching partners or whatever else.The whole objective was to have an alternative to the commercial scenes in Bangkok or even from the Soi Two,Soi Four or Chatuchak or Langsuan Crowds or even the sathorn Soi One scene.

We already have informally get togethers once a month at the moment at either the Dream Hotel, The Syn Bar, The Grand Hyatt or at The Met and we are now looking to extend it to once a fortnightly. For those of you who have send me their PMs, one of my staff will be getting in touch with you soon.

Till Then, thanks once again to everyone for their comments and also sorry for any misunderstandings.

Whilst I might fit the social demographic you are looking for, I'd rather slit my wrists than attend this kind of function. Reminds me of those invitations I get from time to time for a free wekend in a five star resort - just spend 30 minutes at a seminar whilst we sell you timeshare, or, whatever. In this case a PR companies services......

Remember to hire a very big room at your chosen five star hotel, you'll need it just to fit your ego in.

I'm thinking he must be cute, and you're having trouble taking your eyes off him.

Indeed, its a good job we have no klongs with boys around here as the neighbours would all be out with their fishing rods

When I first read this thread I thought PB must have been drinking (or worse) but he's posted it at 09:49 so assume he's serious. But this is Thailand, nothing should be too suprising.

I'll also add that the visa process is very long and unnecessarily complicated.

That's nothing, wait 'til you try the country itself

For example, on a recent trip through an Indian airport I counted NINE rubber stamps on various documents (Passport, boarding pass etc) between airport entrance and boarding the plane

Apparently last night was the closing night at the Peak - third hand information not yet confirmed first hand. They will start clearing the site Wednesday.

Maybe a good thing in the longer term. The Chiang Mai scene is very stale these days, maybe this represents an opportunity for some newer venues that will re-juvenate it?

For the benefit of those contemplating a visit to Chiang Mai and to paraphrase Mark Twain - the report(s) of The Peak's demise are greatly exaggerated. I have just returned from an evening there and the whole place is running at full throttle - allowing that it's rainy i.e. low season. As I learned tonight (first not third hand) from the owner of Friendship Bar (widely regarded as the the flagship and certainly most popular bar in the complex) - yes, notices were issued....... again. Yes, these were disputed and are potentially the subject of court cases to come........ again. There is also talk that the site owner (as in Central department stores, previously mentioned) has its own money issues and is not ready to clear/re-develop the site any time soon. Meanwhile, they're happy to go on collecting the 7,000-ish baht per month per bar rent. TIT - this story looks like it has a while to run yet. As of now, the site is not being cleared and The Peak as a whole is "business as usual" - including the katoey show paid for by The Peak's mangement. Enjoy .

This is true (I've been meaning to post an update...): some of the bars have defied the instruction and stayed open. But Cupid Bar and Chez Nous have closed as of the 12th (and my information came indirectly from A at Cupid bar). The description "running at full throttle" is also greatly exaggerated given two of the five gay bars have shut - that only leaves MTVee and Friendship as genuinely gay owned bars, whilst Paradise seems to have a 50/50 crowd these days. When I was there a couple of nights ago both were deserted, this has often been the case over the last few months (though I did ride past last night and Friendship looked unusually busy).

The story Steve2UK got from Nui (Friendship bar) is much more upbeat than he'd told me. Nui's prophecy a few days ago was they had days or weeks left rather than months (though he was still smiling). Also, Central don't get the bar rent, the Peak management does, who - in turn are meant to pay Central - herein apparently lies the root cause of the problem! I'd also heard Central wants to sell the site quickly whilst it can still get a good price, rather than develop it.

Apparently last night was the closing night at the Peak - third hand information not yet confirmed first hand. They will start clearing the site Wednesday.

Maybe a good thing in the longer term. The Chiang Mai scene is very stale these days, maybe this represents an opportunity for some newer venues that will re-juvenate it?

Seems the rumours have some basis in fact. Apparently the Thai businessman who runs the place was in breach of his lease with the big Thai owners, they've reacted accordingly, but now there's been a small outcry and the whole thing is on hold until the end of September (Don't know which year though ). No doubt more will emerge ove rthe coming weeks, but I suspect the final demise is not far off.....

Apparently a new central department store and mall is a more appealing business model than some down market tourist bars (Boy and girl in fact).

I noticed the same phenomenem on a trip to UK a few months back. Only older guys in the bars - the one's with an ingrained closet/Gay village mentality.

It seems the newly liberated younger generation no longer feel the need to restrict themselves to gay bars. These days they're more likely to be found in some straight disco bar with their fag hag friends arguing over who is the cutest straight, (or maybe?) guy there. And its a vicious circle: young western guys aren't going to go to a gay bar packed with older guys leering at them (unless they are Rommanians looking for tricks ).

So the purpose of the gay bar has changed - you don't need them to find sex anymore if you have an internet connection!

2 nights ago there were letters being given out to the bars in the area of the peak , I cannot read Thai but from the reaction of the bois I can only assume they were notices of eviction or non renewal of leases, does anyone know any more about this?

My understanding, based on good authority (though no guarantees it's fact ) is the Peak, along with a lot of the rest of the night bazzar, is owned by the Chang Beer company (Can't recall the company name but its one of the biggest in Thailand). They've been talking about redeveloping the area for several years and the story has been "everything will close next year" for several years now. So this should be no suprise (if indeed its what actually happened - the OPs post is not definitive - it could just have been the BIB giving notice of closure for yet another holiday, and collecting their Tea money ). The Peak, (Climbing wall and all the bars) was leased and constructed by the Thai business man who ran the climbing wall he also has a couple of guest houses and other business interests in Chiang Mai. Its he who sublets the bars.

With the opening of the new "Phrom Paradise" high end condo and boutique hotel complex right opposite I think the demise of the Peak is inevitable. No one would want those kind of entertainment venues right across the street [incidently, one of the bar owners was rumoured to have done very nicely out of a land deal related to that complex ]. In any case the Peak has been in terminal decline for several years, and with expected imminent closure no one was likely to invest; the bar owners have just been extracting the last drops of milk from the cash cow before she dies. The faces turning tricks down there haven't changed for years either, and in a business where looks and good health is everything, several of them look like they may soon follow the cash cow .

When the Peak does eventually close, it will only leave the real sleaze bars behind the D2 hotel, but I suspect they won't survive long in that location either. The city is rumoured to have a plan to banish all of Chiang Mai's seedier entertainment establishments (including the girlie bars on Loy Kroah) to Chiang Mai land: out of sight of the "quality tourists" they are expecting to arrive in vast numbers

Was this an area where gatoeys were very aggressive towards tourists? If so, perhaps that could have something to do with it. I'm not gay, but I have absolutely nothing against those who are. I see the problem as not being one of sexual preference, but more of the aggressive gatoeys hassling/stealing from tourists. Shutting the whole scene down is an easier way to deal with it than proper patrolling and going after the few bay guys (or 1/2 guy 1/2 gals )

Sorry, this theory is way off the mark.

No-one was "behind the wall burning down". The fire was caused by a stray flame-powered paper balloon coming to rest on the top of climbing wall and setting it alight. Apparently, this was around 4.00am and the area was practically deserted. I assume one of the local hotel security guards spotted the blaze, but the wall was gutted in a couple of hours.

People were still drinking in Paradise bar - it was New Years day so the bars could stay open. Apparently the fire caught hold very quickly and there was much running around rescuing furniture etc, by the time the fire trucks arrived the structure was already gutted.

Just in case anyone has any doubt about these new super-tight regulations, I saw people being sent away because they didn't have the red-sealed hotel letter a couple weeks ago, and spoke with a number of Thais who had been there three or four times and were *still* getting the run around.

Best bet is wait till after the olympics

The latest tightening reg says that faxed hotel reservations are no longer acceptable. You need an original, mailed copy, with ink seal at the bottom. This means you need at least a couple of weeks lead time in most cases.

I posted earlier in this thread - I work with a multinational with an office in Beijing. Things have got a lot worse since my last post. We've been told no more multi entry visas now until October! Also, we're basically winding down the office until after the olympics because many of the staff are having problems with accomodation (Basically their land lords are throwing them out - or demanding extortionate rents for two motnhs trying to cash in on the shortage of rooms in July and August).

I can also confirm, any documentation, invitation letters, hotel confirmations etc, MUST have the original chinese rubber stamp!

Not to go into detail, but a friend reported having a bizarre encounter earlier this year, pure sex between consenting adults, in a men's toilet or changing room, with a 30-something father of two children who stayed outside. It really does happen.

I can believe bizarre! Was drinking with a pal at some well know out door bars in CM, this Thai guy, 30 ish, follows us to each bar and sits a few tables away and keeps staring. So, I go to the hong naam, and whilst I'm taking a leak he blatantly walks up and puts the goods on display which earned him a smile and a "mai ao kap"....... ten minutes later, he repeats the show for my pal which gave us a great laugh comparing notes . This guy sure was desparate, and not bad looking, if he'd only sat next to us and just said hello he just might have got what he wanted

I know an even more bizarre happening involving a monk but will spare the details for etiquette . Another "only in Thailand" story!

There is a Thai ladyboy cabaret show in Soho. Don't recall the venue.

Currently touring the UK is:

The Lady Boys of Bangkok – 'Devils and Angels' – The 10th Anniversary Tour

Its a big Thai ladyboy show at various UK venues up until December.

check out: ladyboysofbangkok dot co dot uk

Saw it a few years back (after running into some of the cast in a bar like you do - genuine whako Thai Katoey too). Not bad show, something along the lines of a cut down version of Simon Cabaret.

I would say that Walai House is a little too far away from the action. It's in the Santitham area of town which is, in my opinion, a little rough.

By "a little rough" I assume you mean its real Thailand (or was that Myanmar ?) rather than the farang infested fantasy ghetto around Thapae/night bazzar area. And trust me, there is plenty of "action" to be found in Santiham - and much more fun than the tourist trap whore bars on Loi Kroh.

Sending a tourist to a famous Red Light district for Thais might not be doing them a big favor unless they speak Thai very well and don't mind having sex with women who are pretty much slaves.

Uh, judging from Paagai's avatar, we might be comparing apples to oranges.

Oh yes, and living in a veritable garden of Eden with fruits of all varieties just waiting to be picked off the trees

I know Santitham's notoriety as UG has pointed out, but it also has a large student population, many of whom are just looking for a good time. Though this is Thailand, so no such thing as a free lunch! Speaking some Thai is also essential if you want to enjoy!

I would say that Walai House is a little too far away from the action. It's in the Santitham area of town which is, in my opinion, a little rough.

By "a little rough" I assume you mean its real Thailand (or was that Myanmar ?) rather than the farang infested fantasy ghetto around Thapae/night bazzar area. And trust me, there is plenty of "action" to be found in Santiham - and much more fun than the tourist trap whore bars on Loi Kroh.

I've never seen the rooms in Walai, but the lobby is nice and the staff friendly (go there for coffee sometimes). There's an awsome noodle shop just up the soi too which is a regular party hang out and the Santitham area has many small local bars restaurants and street food. Not so many tuk- tuks around there, but its only a short walk to Huai Kaew road and the Kad Suan Kaew shoppiong centre and other amenities. Santitham Plaza is a couple of blocks away and has several ammenities including a swimming pool, fitness centre etc.

Is your non-B visa, which I presume is valid for multiple entries, on page 17 of your passport?

--

Maestro

Well spotted , page 17 is exactly where the visa is! And yes, its multiple entry.

Flying Blue (KLM / Air France) but as Colino says there is nothing stopping you from accumulating as many cards as you want.

The card does not make me loyal to the airline - I always shop around for the best deal and flight times.

Flying Blue is a great program - I have lifetime Platinum status (Thats A LOT of flights.....) they treat me like royalty, can thoroughly recommend. Tends to keep me loyal to them too, even though I don't need to make the annual renewal points anymore.

They're flying termites, very common this time of year. The Thais call them maeng mao/แมงเม่า and yes they eat them.

When dining outdoors near bright lights, you may end up eating a few too, as they have a nasty habit of getting stuck into food on one's plate.

They tend to swarm around 7:30pm on warm evenings. and are gone within a half-hour or so. They swarm toward lights, so leave as many lights off as you can to reduce the nightly invasion.

Useful information . I had hundreds of these things errupting out of the ground in the garden a couple of weeks back. Nice to actually know what they were.

Arrived at Suvarnabhumi few days ago with Non-B Valid until 18 May, stamped for 90 days no problem.

However, when I left Thailand 10 days before immigration at CNX asked if I had a non-b then wrote under the current entry stamp "visa xxx 17" - the "xxx" being undecipherable. This seemed a little strange as I was leaving, though reading the above I guess its a reminder that the visa is valid only until May 17 (as per other posts in this thread).

I'm in and out of Thailand every 2-3 weeks so have a passport full of Non-B stamps - They never seem to do more than a quick flip though to find a blank page, so I can't see what purpose the annotation would serve?

Chiang Rai is a fantastic place for a debaucherous night out every once in a while.

Maybe not what the OP is looking for but I could tell some stories of nights spent bar hopping between Lobos and Regency . Both these bars are typically dead, but we usually turn up with an entourage and - in Chiang Rai it seems pretty much anything goes......... I'd love to share the details but I fear they'd have PB racing for the delete key Lets just say that when there are no other customers around all the staff can concentrate on the job in hand, so to speak

Almost got ripped off in Lobos once; one of the Thais in our gang (a retired soi Twighlight veteran ) spotted the trick and gave the captain some of his razor sharp tounge resulting in a free bottle of whisky by way of apology .

CR night bazzar is a great place to eat and drink in the evenings with plenty of eye candy, CR also has several discos. One, (the name escapes me- its a couple of blocks west of the clock tower) has quite a strong gay contingent on a Saturday night. Two more are south of the town center, one is the imaginatively named "Sperm club" which I've heard good reports of . I can't remember the name of the other, but its a big Thai place along the lines of Hollywood.

Incidentally, one of the best (and certainly the biggest) reasons for visiting Lobos can now be found in CM at New My Way

I was refused today again. The consulate said the emailed confirmation of hotel reservation that I'd brought was not sufficient. It had to be a 'hotel reservation form'. Am still trying. As far as I could tell, not a single tourist visa was issued during the hour I was there. Lots of refusals though.

Wow thats bloody ridiculous ... this is certainly causing me to re-evalute my travel plans. You'd think they would be streamlining tourist

visa processing with the olympics looming ...

I wonder if the consulate in Vientiane is enforcing these "new rules".

Was talking to a colleague in Beijing yesterday, it seems to be a worldwide thing as we're having a hard time getting visas from any countries now. Apparently multiple entires are almost impossible now. And finding a hotel in Beijing anytime around the olympics equally impossible.

Anytime I've been to Dj recently (which is rare), I regret it immediately I walk in the door!

If I go anywhere in BKK it would be Sakae (Near democracy monument). No farangs and no attitude, just a fun place with people enjoying themselves.

I am looking for real Burmese food, not Burmese influenced dishes. I mean things like the dried tea salad and a sour vegetable dish I can't really pronounce, that sort of thing. Is there such a place in Chiang Mai? I miss this food from when I lived in San Francisco. I also don't understand why there aren't Burmese and Malaysian restaurants all over Thailand; its like there is no interest in neighboring cuisines. Cambodian food we can do without ...

Some Shan friends have cooked "real" Shan dishes occasionally at my house (whatever "real" means). The term gourmet didn't apply! nothing I'd go out of my way to look for again But as the same people, would eat ANYTHING, I shouldn't be suprised (note they are lovely people, just different tastes, not to mention table manners)

I'd think there are many places that sell this food in the Chiang Pheuk/Chottana area (e.g. as mentioned by a previous poster). But, I guess they don't advertise much as the BIB might take an interest.

Anyone been to the Chinese consulate in Chiang mai to get a Chinese visa? Like to know how long it normally takes to process a tourist visa application. Hope you all had a safe festival....

Got both a tourist and business visa on separate occasions last year. Very efficient in Chiang Mai, just need a a passport, plus photo and fill in their form. IIRC how long it takes is proportional to how much you pay... fastest service you make the application one day and pick up your passport the next (there were time constraints, e.g. had to apply by, maybe 1.00 p.m. and pick up passport before noon next day - something like that but don't recall exactly).

Things may be different at the moment, I'd heard there's a visa clampdown becuase of the olympics (we have a large office in China and business Visas have become an issue, even thoiugh its a thoroughly legitamate operation).

The first part of your post was a fair comparison that was on topic, was not offensive, and didn't violate forum rules. The rest was you wanting to spread your own political beliefs about the Middle East which don't belong here and which I feel are silly.

Re-reading what I wrote, I agree with you hence the deletion. Of course, I don't believe my views are silly and every one is entitled to an opinion, but they were off topic, phrased offensively and detracted from my real point. i.e. Shan people get a rough deal in Thailand, and an even rougher deal in Burma, that is a topic I do have passionate views about.

The reason that I am "touchy" about the subject of Israel is that I believe that being anti-Israeli is mostly just another way to justify hating Jews - no matter how it is spun - and it has become quite fashionable once again. It is not a big leap from hating Israelis to hating all Jews.

In my opinion, they have been hated and suffered for long enough.

I travel extensively, have lived in several countries and have friends of many nationalities, colours and creeds; I sincerely hope no one would think me to be a racist. Given that my father was in the miltary in Palestine at the time, I do have a jaundiced view about the formation of the state of Israel. I suspect given where the world is sixty years on, and with the benefit of hindsight, some might now consider it could have been done better. Anyway, back on topic, sixty years on we can say the same about Buma too.........

You are just looking for any excuse to spread your silly political beliefs on a forum where they are not wanted and they don't belong.

As far as "made up" borders and countries go, just look around Asia if you want something to whinge about. At least that is a topic that belongs here and is permitted by forum rules.

UG you seem to be very touchy whenever the subject of Israel or Israelies is brought up in this forum It wan't me who made the comparison, but apologies if my observations about it offend you, I could probably have phrased them more diplomatically! I don't have any issue whatsoever with people from Israel.

Apart from that, the topic was the treatment of Burmese people by Thais in Chiang Mai, I'm not clear what your problem is with that? I was merely making observations about the way things are in Thailand and the Thai mindset, I don't understand why you think these are "silly political beliefs".

It amazes me how racist Thai's can become when talking about Burmese people, especially when some of these Thai's are still in the feudal paddy fields themselves! Its an argument I've had several times with Thai friends, old prejuidces die hard I guess

If you grew up here you might understand. Surrounded by 'enemies' all your life. Similar to what Israelis go through, I suspect. And the govenment and parents and teachers all express these feelings...

I agree the xenophobic indoctrination that persissts in Thai schools is unbelievable. The Thai education system seems hel_l bent on teaching people what to think, rather than how to think objectively. Along with many things in this dysfunctional country, it suits the ruling classes for it to remain like that, which means it will! If you have the money or connections to make problems go away, this is a country where there are no laws and you can do exactly whatever you like.

Just watch the joggers in Lumphini park freeze like stone statues at 6 p.m. Where else in the world does that still happen?

Of course, one big difference with Thailand is that, unlike the surrounding "enemies", Thailand never had the shit kicked out of it by an occupying colonial power! I think that has a lot to do with the Thai psyche; particularly the arrogance!