jackcorbett

From what I have seen the Honda SH 150 i being introduced into the U.S. and the 125 px as well as the Honda SH 300 i are all good looking machines with good color schemes in those I've seen in pictures on the Internet and the SH 150 i I saw in Vietnam. Most Air Blades color are nice looking. And so is the Nouvo Elegance 135 c.c. in the new colors, my own favorite being red, although I bought mine in tan and black. The Elegance has a much wider and more substantial seat than a 135 c.c. Yamaha Spark for instance or a 125 c.c. Honda Wave neither of which compare for under the seat storage. I think it might initially seem tall and a bit bulky compared to such machines but is is far more comfortable. But what you get is the most versatile, and practical and comfortable machine for little money.

Got on Sukamvit Road today which is about the fourth time recently. Now....unless you need to accelerate past thick traffic to get into the far right lane to make a turn, you need to drive only 60 kilometers per hour. That doesn't seem like much but it's enough to keep up with most traffic on Sukamvit Road and that's about the fastest driving you will be doing in Pattaya. Get up to 70 kilometers per hour and except for the far right lane you will be outrunning the traffic most of the time. Today I accelerated up to close to 70 kilometers per hour on my Nouvo Elegance while I was trying to make a seat of the pants estimate of how many seconds it took to do it. I didn't time it but I'd say it took about six seconds or so to this speed. So what I'm saying is with the 135 c.c. Elegance you have the acceleration to meet all your needs in and around Pattaya.

A few days ago, my girlfriend and I went grocery shopping at Lotus. We got 8 bags of groceries. Put two bags in the under the seat storage, three bags on the hook in front of the driver (me) and my gf carried the last three bags. We had so many groceries in so many bags that it looked like we were going to load a car and the Nouvo handles that. Then just four nights ago, one of my buddies, my girlfriend and I went bar hopping together. Paul weighs about 85 kilos, I weigh 76 kilos and my gf weighs 42 kilos. We took the back streets to the main road where we hit a couple of bars or took baht taxis to other areas in Pattaya. The Nouvo Elegance handled the three of us very well. The next day I took my gf and Paul to a favorite restaurant which is a bit far to walk to from the condo...again on the back streets and no problems.

My neighbor, Gus, bought a Mio several months ago. Paul, Gus and I looked at his Mio in the parking lot, my Nouvo Elegance, a couple of Honda Clicks and a couple of Finos and we all agreed that the only bike I just mentioned that would handle this three up driving is the Nouvo Elegance. Those single shocks off to one side of the back wheel of the Finos, Mios, and Clicks simply aren't up to it. The beauty of the Elegance is it's a very practical machine for this area. It will do everything you need it to do, even things you never thought of before.

I've read it both ways--first, that the alloy wheels are not as tough and the wheel is going to break more easily with hard use, and then that they are tougher and less prone to breakage.

On the older model Nouvo Elegances you will note the huge lettering over and to the right of where Nouvo is painted just underneath the seat. For me, it's just too much. Just clutters up the look of the machine and makes it look longer and bulkier. As for the red shock absorbers with the black and silver older model 135 c.c. Elegance, in my opinion Yamaha just slapped the final finish work together, then realized when the Elegance was not selling like it should that it had screwed up. But Yamaha's not alone. When I go to the bike parking area of my condo and look at a lot of the step through bikes, the color schemes on the whole are simply god awful. In my opinion when Honda first came out with the Air Blade, the colors were not very attractive. Then it came out with that beautiful Phoenix red (is it Phoenix Red?) color scheme and several other much more attractive color schemes. From the get go Yamaha had it right with its Finos or at least some of them. The first productions models of the Click were pretty awful but in the last few months about the time Honda introduced fuel injection on the Click, Honda got the color schemes right on with the Click.

But I do think that other than the color schemes the old model 135 c.c. Yamaha Nouvo Elegance and the new one are identical. I've taken a tape out to measure the two machines. Wheel base is the same. Seat height is the same. Distance from the front of the seat to the little cowling in front of one's legs is identical. I'm not 100 percent sure about the mechanical specifics of the engine, the brakes, etc, but if I were to bet they are the same.

Well I respect your concern for the Thais getting killed on bikes every year very sad indeed.

Something have to be made/thought before the Thais will start wearing crash helmets, like teaching / picture shows in the schools and so on. I see again and again in Pattaya the local riders take off their helmets when they know they will be safe form the police. They simply don't get the point, the helmet is for your safety, not to show the police that you are a good boy.

The BMW looks very quite but at that price forget it, only a toy for the rich, dump the price to say 60K bath and then see.

Thai children in Pattaya are not even taught they should wear a helmet to protect them from getting tickets from the police. It is true that many Thais here obey the traffic laws scrupulously, perhaps even a majority. But there is a huge percentage that feel they can break every law. I've said this before-- there is a school at the beginning of my street I live on. When school lets out there is usually at least one policeman directing traffic where the kids come out on their motorbikes onto Naklua Soi 16 or Naklua Road. Most of the kids are not wearing helmets, yet out they come as the policeman waves them on. Many are riding three and four to a bike. (Well sometimes for short distances on the back streets I will drive three up as well). Later on there will be roadblocks and everyone is pulled over, Thai and Westerner alike to be fined for not wearing a helmet. So what's up with this? What message is being taught to these kids (and I have it from others that it's not this one school but in schools throughout Pattaya). Not my call but the solution is very obvious and that is to impose requirements for getting a license and changing the entire outlook of everyone concerned......driving is not a right--it's a privilege that must be earned.

Here's a picture of my Nouvo 135 c.c. Elegance. Are the alloys worth the extra 2000 baht? I got wire wheels so apparently I did not feel they were, but I can't blame you as the alloys are attractive.

If we haven't muddied things up enough already here's more to ponder. Helmet considerations

just bought another helmet, this one for my girlfriend who was using one of those cheap dealership give aways. We went to Mityon over on Third Road and Pattaya Klang here in Pattaya. Lots of helmets to choose from there. Someone here was recommending Real Helmets because they are DOT certified. There were a few there but when I asked the salesman about this he said, "Index were the best". From the thickness of the padding, heaviness of the helmet, etc I could not tell any difference so we settled on a full coverage Index helmet for around 1100 baht. That's what i use, a semi full coverage Index helmet with the Honda name on it. My girlfriend has very small feet and a small head. What fit her was an extra large which I cannot begin to get on my head.

Thai salesmen will say anything just as long as they make the most on the product. The real helmets are way up from index ones and also a bit more expensive. I have owned an index helmet and now the real stealth helmet and its a big improvement.

I would think the more expensive "Real Helmet will have a higher profit margin on it than the Index helmet I wound up purchasing. Therefore it is in the best interests of the dealership to push the Real Helmet, especially when the prospective buyer is already looking at Index Helmets, then he picks up the more expensive Real helmet and points at the DOT sticker. As I mentioned before this particular line of Index helmets were every bit as heavy, had just as much padding and seemed just as well constructed at the Real Helmets the dealership had.

Where are Index Helmets made? Did I read correctly here, Thailand? And where are the Real helmets made?

just bought another helmet, this one for my girlfriend who was using one of those cheap dealership give aways. We went to Mityon over on Third Road and Pattaya Klang here in Pattaya. Lots of helmets to choose from there. Someone here was recommending Real Helmets because they are DOT certified. There were a few there but when I asked the salesman about this he said, "Index were the best". From the thickness of the padding, heaviness of the helmet, etc I could not tell any difference so we settled on a full coverage Index helmet for around 1100 baht. That's what i use, a semi full coverage Index helmet with the Honda name on it. My girlfriend has very small feet and a small head. What fit her was an extra large which I cannot begin to get on my head.

Thanks again guys. I have no doubts the Nouvo Elegance runs well on fuel currently available but am concerned at posts I'm reading about how fast the Gasohol 95 fuel was gone, and how some posters are talking about so many changes in fuels coming up, so best to buy a fuel injection model that can cope with many. I've not been here long enough to know the first thing about the fuel situation in Thailand but surely Yamaha aren't making bikes that are going to screw up unless they're ran on a specific fuel? Is this just scaremongering by fuel injection enthusiasts or is there any basis for their argument?

And what is Yamaha's recommended fuel for the Nouvo Elegance anyway?

I've put 91 octane fuel in my Nouvo Elegance, 95 Octane fuel, aged banana syrup and even Vitalis hair oil, vintage 1959 and it's done just fine. Only thing is if I'm away for a week or longer it's a bit hard to start and I think that's because of the carburetor. But it starts. Other than this my Nouvo Elegance is smooth as silk.

Just as I'm close to buying the Nouvo Elegance, a couple pf posters on another forum have warned me off it because it's not fuel injection. One post highlighted the fact that a carburetter is tuned to one fuel, and one fuel only, and that if you fill the tank with anything else, it is likely to damage the motorcycle's engine as some fuel burn hotter then other fuels. The sensors in a fuel-injection engine apparently prevent this from happening. They also said there would be an upcoming fuel-injection version of the Elegance but I've no idea when this is likely or how costly it will be.

What's the Nouvo Elegance owners' views on the above? Are you worried?

The only thing I'm worried about is, I already paid my money and have been driving my Elegance close to one year now, and I'm afraid Yamaha will now equip new Nouvo Elegances with fuel injection and that these new models will have 11.3 horsepower instead of the paltry 11.2 horsepower mine produces. I will then cry in my beer and tell my friends, "I should have waited."

Truth is, I still haven't met a guy here who's had any significant problems (greater than a flat tire or similar) with either an Air Blade or a Yamaha Nouvo and since I live here in Pattaya year round that's a lot of guys. But I do think that if you did a search in this forum and read all the posts on the Nouvo Elegance and Nouvo MX that you will find a couple of owners who had to replace their drive belts after 175,000 miles of driving and that they are disgruntled because they had to pay 1000 baht.

Why do it yourself if Honda is going to do it for you. The newest Honda scooter the PCX is a 125cc fuel-injection scooter and it will be available around Christmas in the USA, some States it will probably be January before they have stock.

According to Honda production for this scooter is currently in full swing...

Are they producing both a 125 c.c. and a 150 c.c. Honda scooter for the U.S. market? I see a little online about a 125 c.c. model but I'm reading a lot about the 150 c.c. model I saw in Vietnam a couple of weeks ago. U.S. locations you can order the SH 150 i from And here's another article predicting the SH 150 i will be a marketing disaster in the U.S. for Honda because it will cost around $4500 and only has 150 c.c.'s. Prediction that the SH 150 I will be a U.S. marketing disaster for Honda

I will not comment on the looks of any of the scooters talked about before, the looks and designs selection I found are very personal...

First who copy who, I believe we can all agree that the current wave of retro designed scooters found the inspiration in early 70's Italian scooters. If I look back in time, I cannot find Yamaha as ever being interested in the classic Italian design. Honda has the Scoopy in several designs and versions available a few months after Vespa introduced the world's first great new "hot" scooter design.

So I not comment about design or who is first or who is second. But what I can do is compare mechanics. The Yamaha Fino is powered by a 113cc engine is using a classic carburetor, one thing Yamaha not tells when they sell a Fino (or any other scooter/motorcycle equipped with a carburetor is that they indeed can run on any fuel, but work only perfect on one fuel the carburetor is tuned to run on). A fuel-injection system like used on the Honda Scoopy i, runs on any fuel, it will adapt and it will adjust the need of fueling, it will adjust to humidity, cold, or heat, it will run as efficient the moment you start it to the moment the engine is on the perfect temperature.

A Honda Scoopy i, will start always, it is impossible to fluid the carburetor, and it always runs perfect to the best GREEN exhaust emission possible....

** Yamaha is the last scooter manufacturer who produces scooters with carburetors. As it now stands both Honda and Suzuki has stated to not produce any none-green motorcycles or scooters in 2010.

Yamaha has fuel injection in its 135 c.c. Spark models. One thing I've noticed is that when the Yamaha 135 c.c. Nouvo Elegance came out if offered for carburetion tps which stands for throttle body sensor. tps--throttle body sensor From what I have gleaned from various web sites tps gets better combustion efficiency. The 113 c.c. Nouvo MX didn't have this--the Elegance does. From a seat of the pants feel, my new Elegance gets better fuel economy than my old Nouvo MX.

Does anyone know much about this type of carburetion? How much of an improvement does it make re smoothness of the engine, fuel efficiency, etc?

One thing Yamaha did achieve with the Elegance. It held its pricing down. Three years before I bought my Elegance I paid 53000 baht for my Nouvo MX. Three years later I paid 52000 baht for the new Elegance. And the Elegance is much more bike as it's smoother, quieter, significantly more powerful and it handles noticeably better than the MX did.

Managed to test the Nouvo Elegance 135cc today and was very impressed. I thought it steered and held the road better than the smaller Click that I'm riding at the moment and I definitely felt safer. Braking was good too and it has a fair bit of poke as well.

Pretty sure I'll go for it. My quandry now is that the only place stocking them locally is a small resale garage (almost exclusively Yamaha though) as opposed to the nearest main dealer which is 30mins drive away. Assuming the local place can carry out any necessary repairs and servicing, is there any benefit to buying from a main dealer? Price is the same.

I doubt it. I have bought three Yamaha motorbikes from the same dealership on Central Pattaya Road. Good price there and excellent service but I will just as often have my Yamaha serviced at a Honda dealership within five minutes of my condo. Great service. Had a part put in to repair the rear brake for 180 baht at the Honda dealership. Seems like parts for Yamaha Nouvos are available just about everywhere and I will have to say from my experience that the service I've gotten regardless of brand is far better than I've gotten in the U.S.

Honda have announced a new 125cc fuel injected low friction water cooled engine in the PCX 125i.

Motorcycle Thailand com have some technical details and a 'review' but do not give any riding impressions. It starts off 'The Honda PCX 125i is pretty close to the best two-wheeler Honda has ever made'.

It has a catalyser fitted and an automatic stop/start system to save fuel. Both features seem a bit over the top for a run around scooter but are needed in the foreign markets that Honda intend exporting to.

The usual Honda Airblade features of combi brakes, plus an improved Fuel Injection system and larger seat and wheels are promised. Prices expected to be a little above the Airblade.

Local Honda sellers seem to have an embargo on giving out any information and say come back in November. They are not pushing for advance orders yet.

Has anyone actually seen one or come across a Road Test anywhere?

It sounds like a great new addition to the choices available.

Just do a search in this forum and for that matter the Internet in general. Example...I saw a 150 si in Vietnam and posted its picture here. That prompted my searching the web in general and I found out that Honda is currently offering this same machine in the U.S. for $4500. For some time now Honda has offered a 300 c.c. model in various locations around the planet. With a top speed of around 85 miles an hour it is reputed to stop very well, handle very well and go very well. So I doubt that a 125 c.c. Honda new model is the best machine it's introduced. It's just that Honda in both the Thai and the U.S. markets are decisively behind.

OK, I have read the ten previous posts which gave opinions in response to my OP.

Many of the opinions seem to favor the Fino for looks and because it preceded the Scoopy-i.

Are these the only reasons to base the buying decision?

My daughter has seen both and would be delighted by either model. (as far as looks.)

Price-wise the difference between these two models doesn't seem appreciable.

I have had a look at the Scoopy-i at a local shop where I am on good terms with several of the staff.

Actually, I went in to look at the Click-i, but when I mentioned it was for my daughter, the staff steered me to the Scoopy-i. They said the price was 2,000 less than the Click-i I asked about.

I talked to the head mechanic there about these two(Click-i & Scoopy-i) and he gave what seemed a reasonable answer. He said besides the exterior style of the two, the main difference was that the Click was water-cooled and the Scoopy air-cooled. If the bike was going to be driven on a 20 km. commute everyday the Click was the better choice, (but if fuel consumption is a consideration the Wave was even better.) If the bike was going to driven only to do a bit of shopping every now and then and visit relatives in our neighborhood then the air-cooled would do.

The reason I asked about the Fino is that I want a bit of info on it before I go into the Yamaha shop to look at it.

Let's see. 20 kilometers a day. If your daughter drove the Fino 1000 days EVERY DAY that's just 20,000 kilometers. I drove my air cooled Nouvo close to 14,000 kilometers and it took three years to do that. There's still nothing gone wrong with it and it's now nearly four years old. although my neighbor now owns it. I am suggesting at 20 kilometers a day without her taking a single day off your daughter will have no serious problems with a Fino for at least 3.5 years.

Let me tell you a little story. I used to farm and at first I owned Case tractors. One thing I noticed is that a lot of Case tractors would be laid up at the dealership split in half because they were having their transmissions worked on. Now this was a crackerjack dealership so they sold a lot of tractors out of that dealership. I had bought a nice tractor there and it wasn't long before I had a gear go out in the back end of the tractor. The transmission was manual by the way. So I came to the conclusion that Case tractors had weak transmissions because 1. I had trouble with mine and 2. Because I saw so many of them getting their transmissions repaired. So I switched to John Deere and the first one I got had a 15 speed transmission that required no clutching whatsoever. My neighbor said that since it was not a fully manual transmission it would be unreliable. Well......I never had any problems with that tractor and certainly not with its transmission and when I bought a 2nd John Deere I never had a problem with it either. And if I ever saw a John Deere having its transmission worked on I might have seen one...Just one in the shop having that done.

Lesson to be learned is this, "If there's no smoke, there's no fire." I love my water cooled Nouvo Elegance 135 c.c.. but not once have I ever heard of anyone having any big problems with an air cooled Nouvo or a Fino or a Mio. I therefore conclude that these air cooled bikes for the most part will not have any problems until considerable mileage is piled on them or they are abused.

From wikipedia:

The CHF50 is a scooter manufactured by Honda. It is known as the Metropolitan in the United States, the Jazz in Canada, the Scoopy in Australia and the Crea Scoopy in Japan. It can reach a maximum speed of just less than 40 mph (65 km/h) on flat ground and a maximum speed of 43 mph downhill. The Metropolitan has typical gas mileage of 80–110 mpg (US) (2.1–2.9 L/100 km). It was first offered for sale in 2002.

Just looking at the photo makes me think of a cartoon bike Just a quick note that the Yamaha Fino (as we know it in the 125cc version) was first offered for sale in 2004.

Honda really messed up by not selling the Scoopy here first before Yamaha rolled out the first Fino!

Fino is 115cc, same as Mio. same engine as Nuovo MX except for the carb with manual choke. Fino was not available in LOS 2004, Mio was. Perhaps 2006.

I think you are right. 2006. I bought my girlfriend of those days a nice bright red one and she was a real beauty. It was an utterly charming little bike and I enjoyed driving it but for some reason it did not have the power my Nouvo MX had even though both had the 113 c.c. air cooled engine. And I'm pretty such that the Fino has not upgraded to the 135 c.c. water cooled engine the Elegance has.

And as for Honda I think it's been riding on the reputation that its cars have made and bikes from years back and that it is extremely backward in certain markets...eg. the Thai market and the U.S. market. I'm suddenly finding out that in some parts of the world Honda's offering that 300 c.c. scooter and that suddenly it's waking up to the idea of sending a 150 c.c. model like the one I saw in Vietnam to the U.S. where it will be sold for around 4500 bucks. But for all these years in the U.S. you had a choice between dirt bikes. Harley look alike cruisers such as the Shadow V twin, crotch rockets, its top of the line Gold Wings or its twin cylinder 250 c.c. Rebel which produces all of 17 horsepower, which is about the same as the single cylinder 200 c.c. Phantom. Meanwhile in Japan and other countries it's offered that nice 250 c.c. bike it's apparently about to introduce in Thailand with a water cooled 29 horsepower V-twin for years. I don't like the seating positions of those cruisers. You sit there with your ass close to the ground as you are reaching up for those handle bars. And there's too much chrome to keep cleaned. So that rules out the Phantom for me here in Thailand. And at six feet and 62 years old I think I'd look a little goofy and too large on the 150 CBR. Plus I don't think its riding position would be too uncomfortable for me and its seat too small and hard. Honda obviously has the expertise, the engineering and the products (somewhere else in the world) but I do think the company deserves to get its ass kicked in Thailand whether that's by Yamaha, Kawasaki, Susuki or whomever for being so complacent and backward.

I have definitely opinions on these two. First off, the Honda offering samples I've seen in a couple of Pattaya shopping malls seem to have larger tires than any Fino or Honda Click I've seen, standard. This makes the Honda more roadworthy at higher speeds. But when I asked the Thai person in charge of one of the displays the man told me the Scoopi is air cooled and not water cooled such as the Honda Click or Air Blade. It has the Italian Vespa retro look the Fino has but my first impression is that this Honda look a like of a look a like is not nearly as beautiful as Yamaha's Fino. Yamaha got the look and the lines just right. So it looks like Honda suddenly woke up from another of its Rip Van Winkle slumbers (here in Thailand that is), realized Yamaha was kicking its butt again in one of the Thai market segments and suddenly rushed something in to compete with it. Looks like I'll soon be doing a little more online research on the Scoopi.

It seems you right, still it is very funny that Honda seems to work on two scooters for 2010 for global export. The Honda PCX is not a scooter with some other plastic body and modified engine, it is completely re-designed from zero. Only the CV-matic transmission in the PCX scooter has patented by 14 patents.

I today will try to call Honda to ask about the SH-150, should be fun.

The Honda SH 150 I will definitely up the ante for both Yamaha and Honda. First off, in the picture I took of one in Vietnam note the very large tires (for a scooter). They look to be about the same size tires the 150 CBR has. I would think this bike will have great stability on the highway at relatively high speeds. But check this scooter out Review of the Honda Sh 300 I and 2nd review of the Honda SH 300 i While I'm at it I'll even paste a picture here This scooter is now being sold in Australia. Other places as well, but so far it's not earmarked for the U.S. or Thailand. I really like the look of the new Honda 250 motorcycle that will soon be coming to Thailand. However, this 300 c.c. scooter would really be the cat's meow. If I had just bought the Honda 250 motorcycle, the Ninja 250 R, or even the Kawasaki ER6n I'd feel I bought yesterday's technology if they brought this into Thailand at a reasonable price. It's got a neat, taut look with beautiful curves, the speed and power to handle highway driving, brilliant brakes, great handling and tires large enough to soak up bumps. It is substantially much smaller than Yamaha's 400 c.c. Majesty and 500 c.c. Trimax so I would expect it to be much better in city traffic and it's much prettier. Its only weakness is it does not have much under the seat storage space.

But to those who keep questioning the reliability of the automatics, they should ponder Honda's seriousness by engineering such brilliant machines in the first place. This thing's apparently been on European highways for over a year and no doubt holding up quite well.

So fare I know, there is no 150cc Honda scooter in Vietnam, and surely not one which is going to be exported to the USA. The Thai build Honda PCX is a modern 125cc which is the new global product, this means it will be exported to the USA, Europe, Japan, and distributed around the countries in Southeast Asia.

The 125cc sounds small, but it is indeed a wonderful machine, and when it surely will push Yamaha back to the drawing board...

I beg to differ, Richard spy picture of Honda SH 150 I taken in Hanoi I took the shot in Hanoi on September 18, 2009. The bike says SH 150 I on it. Here's a few links to check out Honda SH 150 I, an American marketing disaster And here's where you can buy them in Scottsdale, AZ Just $4399 in Scottsdale And here's more specs including horsepower figure of 15.5 Bikez However, the Bikez specs claim a 4 speed gearbox. I don't get that one. It's automatic. more info Do a search under this model and you will find all kinds of info on it.

The new bigger scooter is called the Honda PCX, and it is powered by a 125cc engine...

I got the impression that he was talking of something bigger than a 125 but then again with my limited Thai, the managers limited English and the Thai 'idea' of big I may have been very much mistaken.

If all Honda's going to do is put a 125 c.c. fuel injected model in their Thailand lineup once again they are two steps behind Yamaha and playing catchup. The 110 c.c. Air Blade without fuel injection would wind up having my 113 c.c. Nouvo MX pulling away from it. Id say the 135 c.c. Elegance will do it with even more authority over a new 125 c.c. Honda automatic than the old Nouvo would overtake the Air Blade. That 150 c.c. model Honda's already got in Vietnam and is presently introducing in the U.S. has substantially larger tires than the present Air Blade or any Nouvo. It is going to take those tires and the 150 c.c. engine to put Honda on top..for awhile.

At the risk of going slightly off topic, when I was at my local dealer who knew nothing about the Honda VTR he did say that Honda will be releasing a 'big' scooter in December.

Although I have the new Yamaha Elegance I often get my bike serviced at a nearby Honda dealer, get my license sticker renewed etc. So the other day I told the place's head salesman about the 150 c.c. Honda scooter they are selling in Vietnam. He had never heard anything about it so a couple days later I brought in pictures which we put on his computer at the dealership. He said he'd call Honda about it. From what I've been reading about the Honda 150 that is now being offered in the U.S. with Italian high labor costs built in it is listed in some places with horsepower figures as high as 15.5 But I'm also reading that it seems to be governed down in some way to be able to manage no more than 65 miles an hour. But your dealership is telling you Honda will soon offer a big scoot in December. Is this the 150 model? Or the much larger and more powerful 300 model in which case we can expect much higher prices. I do love the pictures of the new Honda 250 motorcycle (new to Thailand that is). Realistically however, my girlfriend and I just went to Lotus last night to pick up groceries. You'd think one would need a car to put all those groceries in. We put two of the smaller plastic bags under the seat. I hung three bags of groceries on the hook in front of me and my girlfriend carried four bags as she rode behind me. Can't do that on a "real motorcycle". One would first have to clutter it up with a large storage tank on the rear at extra cost. Then there would be no hooks in front of the driver to hang things from. And as far as power, we had plenty to zip in front of the cars and get into the passing lane on North Pattaya Road.

I'm thinking of calling my Norwegian buddy to see if he will do a run up to Rayon (takes an hour) as he's done it a few times. He's currently renting an Air Blade and then we can compare the fuel economy of the Air Blade to my Nouvo Elegance over this stretch of highway driving. I'm also itching to rent first the Ninja 250 R just for shits and grins, then the new 650, but as long as my driving is in Pattaya and I'm picking up groceries, strapping computers on the back of my bike to take in for repair, no matter how good either one is, they aren't going to be the bike the Nouvo is or any new offering from Honda is. Unfortunately it's been raining every afternoon. Last night gave both of us such a belly laugh as we put a car's worth of groceries on my little Nouvo.

It looks to me as if Honda (and other companies) are coming full circle. That is after 35 years they are finally once again producing as good an all around bike as they used to. This is the Honda CB 350. My first bike was a CB 350 which after a couple years driving it practically everywhere I traded in for a Honda 450. The CB 350 was rated at 36 horsepower and 103 miles an hour, but I'd say that realistically it was a good 90 mile an hour bike. Now let me put this in perspective. Marlon Brando and Lee Marvin stared in the movie, "The Wild One" back in 1953. Brando's bike was a Triumph Thunderbird, which was a 2 cylinder 650 machine rated at around 33 horsepower and good for (according to my internet sources) 100 miles an hour. Back in 1950's those were the big bikes of their day along with American made Harleys and Indians. Notice the long comfortable looking seat for two the 350 CBR had and its upright riding position. When the 450 CB Honda came out, it was considered equal to in performance to the British 650's. Such bikes as the 350 Honda CB and 450 Honda CB caused a huge decline in British bike sales and the CB 750 finished the British bike industry.

Somehow Honda and the other Japanese motorcycle companies have been able to convince the average Western motorcycle buyer that what he really needed was something that was at least 1000 cc's while delivering to him either a crotch rocket or a cruiser. Personally I have no love for cruisers. The handle bars are way up in the air and the seating position is too low. And look at all the chrome one gets to spend all his time polishing. As for the crotch rockets, my last bike was a BMW 100 RS that had a sport fairing, narrow handle bars, and a crouched down riding position. That Bike was pretty comfortable so long as one was doing at least 80 miles an hour on it. The idea was that the outside air at such speeds would hit the driver at the top of his helmet at enough force to make him feel comfortable in a crouch. But it was not a good riding position for driving around in slow city traffic. The bike I had before that was the BMW R-65 650 c.c. horizontally opposed twin. I had one very minor accident while driving both bikes. That single accident was while taking a motorcycle safety course while using the BMW 100 RS. I had a bad hangover and while driving the bike REAL SLOWLY through the cones it started to go over on me and before I knew it the bike had fallen on its side.

Just take a look at what Honda's been offering to the U.S. market. It's either dirt bikes, and dual purpose bikes or it's cruisers with the high bars and low seating positions or crotch rockets. Want an all rounder that is roughly equivalent to a CB 350 or 450? There is no such animal. Closest thing is the 250 Honda Rebel with its 17 horsepower. And that bike will probably not go faster than 75 miles an hour tops. May I suggest that Honda's only been offering models that have a much higher profit margin than such all rounders to the U.S. market?

Now don't get me wrong, if Honda brought its 300 c.c. scooter I brought up in earlier posts at a decent price in Thailand I'd buy one a.s.a.p. whether I needed its power or not so Honda can be innovative when it wants to be. But when it comes to offering a broad range of products the consumer can really use, BMW beats Honda all hollow. It has fast sports tourers, it has comfortable full dress tourers, and it has single cylinder light weight 650 dual purpose machines, unfortunately at high dollar but it is offering an attractive full lineup nevertheless. When it comes to the Japanese manufacturers it's Kawasaki that's been offering the closest things to all rounders at a reasonable price.

I do like the looks of the new Honda 250 and the prospect finally of a good seating position being offered here in Thailand with a good deal less chrome to have to be slave to polishing. Thanks to Kawasaki's Ninja 250 R and recent light weight 650 twin, Honda's finally being forced to offer something that is roughly equal to what it offered 35 years ago.

How about a Suzuki Hayate, 125cc automatic, goes real real well (carries my 120kg along suk road @100km/h comfortably), gets decent fuel economy and has huge under seat storage.

Before I got my first Nouvo, my girlfriend back then and I went to Koh Samui where I rented a Mio. She hated it because of its twitchiness. We rented it for just one day. When my next girlfriend and I went to Krabi we rented first a Click, then an Air Blade. Now keep in mind that the roads are hillier and permit fast driving than traffic clogged streets here in Pattaya. I hated the Click because of its twitchiness driving two up when I'd compare it to my Nouvo Mx. Then I rented an Air Blade and I loved it. There is a huge difference down in Krabi bet ween the Click and the Air Blade as far as stability driving two up. Later on I got this girlfriend a a nice red Fino. I would have gotten her an Air Blade as I felt it was a significantly better machine. Anyway, it was a beautifully sculptured Italian replica. I could sit in a bar and just look at it parked across the street and reflect.."Yamaha's a genius for putting that design on a bike for not much more than 40000 baht. And it was a fine little machine even driving two up on the back streets around here. But for some reason it did not have the power of my Nouvo MX even though both had the same 113 c.c. air cooled engine. And at faster speeds than I'd be driving down the back streets I'd much prefer my Nouvo MX. The Nouvo Elegance is significantly more powerful than the air cooled MX and it steers quicker and more precisely.

Thanks for the replies. I plan to test drive a few this week. My rental bike is a Honda Click Forward (I don't see Click i or PGM-FI anywhere, so not sure if this is an older non-FI model?) and I have to say it's not bad but I feel slightly unsafe at higher speeds in that the steering feels a bit light and wobbly. I'm 85kg and feel that I should be imposing more of my weight forwards to compensate. This seems to be what jackcorbett posted about above. I guess the weekly shopping in the area between the seat and the steering will do just this and this aspect of the design might actually be something I need, so I'm tending to stray from bikes which don't have this space. Sounds like I should try the Yahama Nouvo Elegance and see how it feels. Anybody got a feel for the difference in gas consumption between the Click i and Nouvo Elegance?

Just do it. The Elegance is much more roadworthy at higher speeds than the Click. As for the difference in fuel economy, if there's any, you aren't going to feel one iota's difference in the pocket. If I put 120 baht of gas into my Elegance per week and even if the click gets 15 % better fuel economy than the Elegance, you will be saving 18 baht per week. That's 54 cents per week or $26.00 per year. But I rented an older model Click down in Krabi for a day and it wasn't very impressive on fuel consumption so assuming you now are driving the non fuel injected Click, you might actually be getting worse fuel economy than I'm getting with my Nouvo Elegance.

You already said you preferred automatic. I'd pick either the top Honda or the top Yamaha. This means Air Blade or the Yamaha Nouvo Elegance. The Elegance has 135 c.c.'s whereas the Air Blade has just 110. Air Blade has fuel injection and boasts 15 % better fuel economy over its older models. But......the Nouvo has a 4.8 liter fuel tank to the Honda's 4 liter which allows for 20 % greater distance between fuel stops. Power wise there's no contest. The Nouvo feels like a bigger bike so it might suit you better. I think the Mios, Clicks and Finos have tires that are just too small to give you the same safety factor as the Air Blade or Nouvo, especially if you are riding two up. And if your gf tells you she's small and can therefore handle the smaller bikes much better keep in mind you are buying, not her. And that you are probably far more logical and that the extra margin of safety (and with the Nouvo Elegance substantially greater power) and MUCH LARGER STORAGE UNDER THE SEAT) trump any possible desire of hers for a smaller machine. Keep in mind also that many Thai women learn to drive and drive well, much larger bikes such as Honda Phantoms even though they aren't that large.

Best yet. Rent an Air Blade for a few days, then rent a Nouvo Elegance for a few days, then decide yourself which one you like better.

Okies, i have a 2008 Honda Click (Fool injected model), its getting boring, whats readily available (in Pattaya) to step up its performance a bit, want to cover all bases, corner,accelerate and stop...

Any ideas.

Either get a new bike or keep what you have as it actually represents a pretty good choice for what you need in Pattaya rather than what you might want (dream about). Soon as the weather clears up a bit I'm going to rent a 250 Ninja R for one day, then a 650 Kawasaki just to do something different. But I ran into a guy getting his Kawasaki 650 topped with gas, pulled behind him on my Nouvo Elegance to wait my turn at the pump and I asked him how he liked his bike. It was a beautiful bike and when he pulled away I really liked the sound. It would be a great all rounder on U.S. highways. He said he liked his bike just fine but mine was much better for the Pattaya area. I sure wouldn't be modifying your bike in the hopes of getting marginally better performance in return for considerably less reliability.