Hawkman

and how are they going to separate the good teachers from the bad ones?

Just one sentence - but well to the point. I really don't know. How can you? A degree in education would be the best answer but then you will get NO teachers at language schools or Government schools and poor families will suffer. I think if the MOE, Government, country, parents and students want good teachers there needs to be some sort of proper assessment.

Any Tom, Dick and Harry could say they can teach English, but they can't. I know I keep beating the drum and I have heard some Thai school owners say the same thing, why not have the work permit and visa based on the ability to teach and teaching certificate? Everyone wins. Gets rid of the bad teachers this way and keeps the good ones.

The current system does not work in my opinion, it needs changing. In many countries you don't need a degree to teach TEFL, so why here? Many don't see TEFL as a long career move. Why can't people have more than one career as long as they do a good job at it?

I won't argue that unfortunately there are lots of rubbish teachers and wasters here, however, not all of them are teachers, I include retirees and other expats too.

"So, this is an ongoing problem that needs to be resolved, as it can lead to a shortage of English teachers and guides," he said during his weekly TV programme.

How about enforcing the schools to adhere to the law and providing work permits instead of keeping teachers semi-illegal.

Couldn't agree more, however, the problem is the current requirements prevent good teachers from being employed legally. A degree in Psychology doesn't make someone a good teacher.

Someone who is passionate about teaching, does preparation, knows how to get the best out of their students, has done a teaching course, how to correct and make their students better and knows how to teach is what makes a good teacher.

I wish for the day they scrap the degree requirement and do a teaching observation and screening instead. Then, everyone wins, bar the bad teachers.

Unfortunately, it's the MOE I believe that needs to wake up to this.

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The degree requirement is not going to change.

We all know there are good and bad teachers with and without degrees. Lets not start that debate again.

Thailand does not need more western drop outs coming here. If you are so passionate about teaching, invest in more than a 4 week cert. SIMPLE.

Agree, 4 weeks isn't enough, not in the slightest. But a 4 year degree to teach tefl for 35,000 baht a month? Tefl, celta, training, good recommendations, experience and observation. SIMPLE.

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"So, this is an ongoing problem that needs to be resolved, as it can lead to a shortage of English teachers and guides," he said during his weekly TV programme.

How about enforcing the schools to adhere to the law and providing work permits instead of keeping teachers semi-illegal.

Couldn't agree more, however, the problem is the current requirements prevent good teachers from being employed legally. A degree in Psychology doesn't make someone a good teacher.

Someone who is passionate about teaching, does preparation, knows how to get the best out of their students, has done a teaching course, how to correct and make their students better and knows how to teach is what makes a good teacher.

I wish for the day they scrap the degree requirement and do a teaching observation and screening instead. Then, everyone wins, bar the bad teachers.

Unfortunately, it's the MOE I believe that needs to wake up to this.

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I think teachers should be "qualified teachers" not a regular person who likes thailand and wants to stay here forever......and picks the easiest job in the world to cover their cost of living. Half of these supposed English Teachers and Thai Language Students from overseas have no interest at all in either teaching .......or learning.

Get a visa like all the genuine working folk, or get out and find somewhere else to hang out like sub-sahara africa......no issues with visas down there.

And that's the whole point of the discussion. Teachers who are good at what they do and are passionate and have experience should get the visas and work permits.

Get rid of the ones who aren't good whether they meet the degree requirements or not.

And no, you don't need a degree in education to teach TEFL. It helps, sure, but let's be realistic and be in the real world here.

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"So, this is an ongoing problem that needs to be resolved, as it can lead to a shortage of English teachers and guides," he said during his weekly TV programme.

How about enforcing the schools to adhere to the law and providing work permits instead of keeping teachers semi-illegal.

Couldn't agree more, however, the problem is the current requirements prevent good teachers from being employed legally. A degree in Psychology doesn't make someone a good teacher.

Someone who is passionate about teaching, does preparation, knows how to get the best out of their students, has done a teaching course, how to correct and make their students better and knows how to teach is what makes a good teacher.

I wish for the day they scrap the degree requirement and do a teaching observation and screening instead. Then, everyone wins, bar the bad teachers.

Unfortunately, it's the MOE I believe that needs to wake up to this.

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Careful you don't hex a common sense revolution. It's important for a beginner level English speaking Thai Engineer to be able to say that they've been taught English by a farang with at least a degree in Psychology, as opposed to someone who speaks and teaches Thai and can also say "I same same fluent English"?

Hence my point about have a screening and observation for a teaching requirement.

I am strongly against the idea that a white farang should just pick up a teaching job because he can speak English; not my point at all. That's the kind of person we want to rid from the tefl industry.

My point being, having a degree in something unrelated to English or education won't make you a better TEFL teacher. Being a passionate and skilled teacher, will. You don't need four years of study to become a tefl teacher in Thailand or any other country.

Would you rather someone fix your car with a degree in Cooking but no experience or someone with no degree but 10 years experience in the motor industry?

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From personal experience and others I know, applications for a work permit at a language school are rejected without a degree. You will get the 90 day non b, but not the work permit.

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Ok my report -

I got stopped last week heading along sukhumvit from Asoke towards Bang Na. It was around soi 25 at a guess, they pulled the cab over when they saw who we were.

For the record, it was very late in the night and I'm never about at that time but my friend had just flown in so was a late one catching up.

I never carry my passport, never; but on this Tuesday with the uncertainty I thought it best to.

I'm glad I did. They pulled us over and went through my passport and started grilling me about my visa being out of date. It wasn't, they were just looking at an old visa. When I approached and told them they need to turn the page they got a bit funny and telling me to stay back, ignoring what I was trying to say. I wasn't being pushy, aggressive or anything, no chance, I'm too scared to get into trouble with these guys.

They called the supervisor over and a couple of others, after a couple more times of me trying to explain to just turn to the most recent page they finally listened, nodded and closed the passport and sent me on my way.

I also saw another police stop a bit further up on Wednesday eve (coming from Thong Lor) but a lot earlier in the night; luckily, all 3 cops were questioning the others so my taxi could drift through easily, which was a relief as I didn't have my passport at the time.

So there definitely does seem a bit of stronger presence most recently.

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If a language school tries to employ a teacher without a degree, the work permit is refused, so not sure if the rules are being followed by certain agencies.

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Combination of reasons I guess and have heard.

Need more money through tax after what the last government did, foreign mafia operations, Thailand's image, too many of us here now, making the country more efficient with people respecting the system than abusing it, ASEAN etc.

Spoke to a girl that was given a really hard time at Chaengwattana for a tourist extension last week, being accused of being a teacher etc. So there is certainly a clean up. Don't know her nationality though.

And while this is ethically the right thing to do, it annoys me that they haven't targeted more serious problems here such as the farangs with the boiler rooms who basically own sukhumvit. Surely that is far more disgusting than some guy working on the wrong visa. However, in this world, money and corruption certainly gets you somewhere.




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The quality of information about ED visas on this forum deteriorates by day. I am reading it but not really participating so as not to get all the bashing form all the well wishers (haters). Walen School is taking a very good care of our students, if you are a Walen student ask directly at school. 

 

Walen School - benefit yourself. 

 

Just ignore the bitter fools on here who need to moan or criticise others or have an opinion on what others are doing here.  It's themselves who have mental and social issues.  It's just a case of some people being bitter that you have a successful business here, that's what I can only imagine.

 

To some of us, hearing information from people in the know is quite helpful.  We don't want to read pages of people complaining about other people's visas or "their" bitter opinion.  For, no-one cares about their opinions, just a faceless non important blob on the internet.

 

Knowledge, advice, or certain rumours, however, is important and so, please keep posting any information you think is helpful and let the rest of us can read that information to the benefit of all.

 

P.S. The Education visa at this very moment has little importance to myself, but I'm interested about knowing the current situation.

Exact same discussion was having with a couple of friends the other day for a mate in the position. Do you do the extension at Immigration, then get the second entry BEFORE August 12th, just to be on the safe side, even if it means you lose days from it?

He also doesn't want to book his return ticket until he knows exactly how long he has left here. I reckon just to be on the safe side, do the extension before August 12th, but that is just a suggestion, not based on any fact.

Interestingly, a Thai friend who has a relative in Immigration, said the target of this is not farang at all, just Burmese, Vietnamese and Cambodians, but hearing reports I can't believe this.

I would get the 30 day extension at immigration Thursday or Friday. That would give me till about the 24th of Aug. But I was wondering if going, lets say the 11th of Aug, would it be safer and less risky? I would be loosing 2 weeks. I also don't want to purchase my return ticket until I know the second half of my visa will be honoured.

You aren't alone in thinking that. If I were you, going before the 12th would probably be less risky as you will only kick yourself afterwards. The thing is, who's to say they don't start implementing the rules a couple of days before, or some borders take a while for it to be implemented fully.

Exact same discussion was having with a couple of friends the other day for a mate in the position. Do you do the extension at Immigration, then get the second entry BEFORE August 12th, just to be on the safe side, even if it means you lose days from it?

He also doesn't want to book his return ticket until he knows exactly how long he has left here. I reckon just to be on the safe side, do the extension before August 12th, but that is just a suggestion, not based on any fact.

Interestingly, a Thai friend who has a relative in Immigration, said the target of this is not farang at all, just Burmese, Vietnamese and Cambodians, but hearing reports I can't believe this.

I don't believe that to be true, even Thai immigration announced differently.

Nor me. Many people probably working the borders don't know exactly what's going on or will happen.

Exact same discussion was having with a couple of friends the other day for a mate in the position. Do you do the extension at Immigration, then get the second entry BEFORE August 12th, just to be on the safe side, even if it means you lose days from it?

He also doesn't want to book his return ticket until he knows exactly how long he has left here. I reckon just to be on the safe side, do the extension before August 12th, but that is just a suggestion, not based on any fact.

Interestingly, a Thai friend who has a relative in Immigration, said the target of this is not farang at all, just Burmese, Vietnamese and Cambodians, but hearing reports I can't believe this.

There's many giving advice which is fair enough and there's also people who see this has some sort of great victory dance. Many of those comments on the threads.

As said, Thailand does need to clean itself up with too many foreigners here but for many getting the right visa isn't an easy job. Can be done, yes and many are trying; not all who have been unsuccessful getting the right visa are drunk, womanising, lazy layabouts. Took me ages and wasn't easy.

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It says more about those people and what type of person they really are. Getting kicks out of others downfall is not nice. It's a bit odd. You don't see these moaners whinge or have it in for the Asian immigrants for which is the main target, it's only their fellow farang they take glee in suffering.

Don't get me wrong - would be great to see a Thailand lose many of the idiots, the wannabe playboys, the wannabe mafia, but taking pleasure that people are suffering from visa worries which will impact lives, says more about what type of a bitter person they really are. Why spend your time getting hung up about what others are doing if it ain't causing pain to others.

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The "no fail" situation here, ruins it not only for the teachers, but for the ones who try hard too.

It is quite understandable the authorities want, and maybe need, to do something about the visaruns.

What is not understandable is that authorities give visa's and the holder of those visa's cannot enter the country.

Ik would have been better for the image of Thailand and more honest for the visarunners if at arrival they were warned "no more".

I am afraid this changing of the rules while the game is running will not be beneficial for tourism.

All this gives possible tourists the idea a visa for a longer stay in Thailand is not worth.

And go somewhere else.

Also, I guess the loss of investment and jobs for Thai people will be huge.

It would have been better, for all, if the whole thing was better thought over.

Exactly. I for one, think it's a good and right thing to do something about it. But you have to give people a chance to collect bags or belongings from their condo etc. You can't have a consulate issuing visas and immigration then saying no. The logical thing would be for both parties to work together and as you say if someone already has a visa, a warning of no more is appropriate.

On the plus side - There are too many of us here now and too many taking the pi$$, those with proper visas, non proper visas or visas purchased through under the table means. Places like lower end Sukhumvit, Pattaya and so on look horrible with the amount of farang about.

On the negative side - This will impact Thailand, especially for English teaching, you will be left with a huge shortage and a lot of bad teachers who only happen to have a degree but no teaching experience or know how to teach. It will also impact some tourist spots or expat spots with many Thais losing their jobs and girls losing their boyfriends left with no money to pay the bills. I will stand by that some of the worst people I've met here were a group of 25 somethings all with degrees (not in education) living the high life here, on good teaching salary, partying each night, doing coke and didn't give a monkey's about their job; while other teachers work hard, are passionate and good at their job, but some don't have the degree requirement. Get's my goat.

They need to look at this a bit more logical and look at the future and end game and what is best for their country and their future. Otherwise, a few months down the line all these new rules will be relaxed again.

Sorry if I'm sounding a bit thick here, but does this policy include people who would pop over the border to do an in/out to get their 2nd entry on the double tourist visa or just for visa exempts?

People on a Non O visa will be able to go,enter freely without any hindrance whatsoever. Why because if you are married they cannot refuse you to visit family..... by law this is.

It's about time they are cracking down on border runners with just a single tourist visa. Who knows, maybe we will see better teachers.

Why would we see better teachers? How would that work?

Some teachers who are working illegally are no doubt bad but some have experience and are good.

All this will do is, all illegal teachers will be replaced by young backpackers with degrees in whatever (which does not make you a teacher) or fake Khao San ones, who will be out partying lots flirting with students and wouldn't know anything about tenses, how to drill, model, observe, evaluate, plan, classroom management or teaching.

Quite the opposite, this will throw teaching English into the dark ages here, full of post uni-grads milking it for a bit of fun.

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And how is that relevant?

It’s relevant to me.

The woman is bizarre, she jumped out of a limo at some Hollywood award show with her then husband and announced that they just finished having sex and then showed everyone vials of blood her and her man had hanging around their necks.

Why is it that the celebrities that are way out there sexually always drape themselves around children?

That's when she was younger; have you ever done stupid things in the past? Haven't we all been idiots at some points in our lives.

You make mistakes, you learn from them. It's life.

What has her over sexual past got to do with the good she is doing now? She wasn't harming anyone in the past, but herself. And I've never seen her sexually drape around her children, not once.

So bizarre someone dislikes her because she was a bit wild in the past.