How To Set Up An Ebay Business In Thailand

[jon128]

Greetings,

I am a Canadian who wants to relocate to Thailand. During my last trip, I saw some goods that I think would sell well on Ebay.

Anybody have experience selling on Ebay while living in Thailand? Please include your successes and failures.

What kind of visa would I be able to get?

Is it even legal for me to generate income selling on Ebay from Thailand?

Will the Thai immigration come after me for making a living while in country?

If my selling becomes a success, I will need to make a lot of deliveries at the local post office. Do they get suspicious or tip off immigration? Any ways around this?

At the post office, my sales will be to individual customers in North America and Europe. Do I label the packages as gifts? What sort of mail system is best?

What are the legalities to live in Thailand and sell goods on Ebay?

Do I register a business in Thailand? Please outline the steps needed.

I was planning to get a 60 day tourist visa and start selling on Ebay while I am there just to gauge the demand. If there is demand for my goods, then I was considering doing a visa run to extend my visa. But I don't want the hassle of visa runs and being worried about immigration. What ways around this for my peace of mind?

I plan to open a Paypal acct back here in Canada and then withdraw money from my ATM out in Thailand. I've heard that Paypal bans isps from Thailand so I'll have my brother in Canada email me with account updates.

Any other ways around Paypal?

Any other good ways to accept credit card payments while out in Thailand? (I've heard of CCNow. Anybody use them?)

How long could I stay out in Thailand for?

Plus, how do I keep track of taxes. Do I pay taxes to Canada or Thailand? Any way to save on taxes?

If there are any Canadians/Americans who have an ebay business and living in Thailand, could you guys please list the steps you took to open the business?

Regards,

Jon

[Bob Chittie]

I think many, many people have thought about ebay from Thailand. Shipping has always been the thing that has prvented me from getting involved, but I never considered using the post office. I suppose that most packages do get through.

As far as doing ebay from Thailand, technically its not proper, but I think you can get away with it no problem. I've never heard of post office people tipping off immigration. If you're concerned, just rotate post office branches. I've sent a few things by the post office and I don't recall filling out a form declaring what I was sending. Can anyone else comment on this?

I use PayPal (US account) from a Thai ISP no problem. And I have a PayPal ATM to withdraw cash directly or I can have it sent to my US Bank account and withdraw from there. PayPal does ask you very frequently if the recent log ins from these ISP's were you. But it works no problem.

You can get a non-im o visa at the right consulate. Or if you have the money, you can start a company here and do everything by the books.

At the end of the day though, if you find something that sells well for you, even on tourist visas, my personal opinion is that you've got nothing to worry about. You're spending time in Thailand doing product research for your company back home, while you're on extended vacation. Come on over.

[BKKdreaming]

couple of things.....

If I was sending in the post I would make sure there is some kind of tracking number ,

its seems that tracking numbers keep Postal workers (any country) more honest.

Getting paid is probably your biggest problem, are you going to put Thailand on your ebay auction location ?

not sure if that will be picked up by Paypal when it gets paid.

Would love to hear how it works out......

[Bob Chittie]

couple of things.....

If I was sending in the post I would make sure there is some kind of tracking number ,

its seems that tracking numbers keep Postal workers (any country) more honest.

Getting paid is probably your biggest problem, are you going to put Thailand on your ebay auction location ?

not sure if that will be picked up by Paypal when it gets paid.

Would love to hear how it works out......

Not sure why everyone thinks you can't use your US PayPal account from Thailand. I believe they asked me to fax some documentation and that was that. Quite frequently, it shows me the Thai IP address that has been logging in and asks if that was me. And there's no problems whatsoever.

My concern is that people might not bid if they see that it must be shipped from Thailand. Maybe they don't trust international shippers or maybe they think its a scam or maybe they don't want to wait for the Thai post office to deliver.

[PvtDick]

Another piece of advice: make sure that whatever you are selling is legal. Don't even THINK of trying to sell pirated software, movies, music, clothing, watches, etc., etc...they WILL track you down and you WILL be arrested.

[Bob Chittie]

Another piece of advice: make sure that whatever you are selling is legal. Don't even THINK of trying to sell pirated software, movies, music, clothing, watches, etc., etc...they WILL track you down and you WILL be arrested.

Does anyone know of this actually happening? As has been pointed out, if you go to ebay now, you will see pirated software. Are ebay sellers constantly being arrested?

[PvtDick]

Yes, they are. It's not worth the risk, trust me.

[Thaiboxer1]

Yes, they are. I have personally been involved in half a dozen cases in the last month. It's not worth the risk, trust me.

How are these Ebay sellers being tracked down? And who is tracking them down? What are the punishments for being caught selling these bootleg items?

[PvtDick]

They rights owners employ lawyers and private detectives, such as myself, to track them down and coordinate arrests. We use a number of methods to identify and locate the perpetrators, which I am not at liberty to detail further. Let's just say that it is impossible to set up an eBay account, accept payments, and conduct email correspondence in a way that is completely confidential.

The criminal penalties are up to 800,000 baht fines and 8 years in prison. Foreigners can additionally be subject to deportation and blacklisting for life.

[Bob Chittie]

They rights owners employ lawyers and private detectives, such as myself, to track them down and coordinate arrests. We use a number of methods to identify and locate the perpetrators, which I am not at liberty to detail further. Let's just say that it is impossible to set up an eBay account, accept payments, and conduct email correspondence in a way that is completely confidential.

The criminal penalties are up to 800,000 baht fines and 8 years in prison. Foreigners can additionally be subject to deportation and blacklisting for life.

One eBay vendor -- in this case a Thai -- happens to be in line to have their home raided by the police tomorrow. Again, trust me -- some of these rights owners are very serious.

Wow, thanks for the information. I guess ebay keeps all this kind of quiet, but I would have guessed that the media would have picked up on it. I have to confess, I have considered putting up a copy of Photoshop for auction from time to time for a little extra beer money, but I never got up the courage. I think I'll avoid considering it from now on. You'd think ebay would have stronger warnings on their site, not just 'multiple infractions may result in suspension'.

You could incorporate offshore with an offshore bank account in some countries that can't be touched... woops, I'm thinking about it again. Ok, I'll stick to the legal products.

[Bob Chittie]

They rights owners employ lawyers and private detectives, such as myself, to track them down and coordinate arrests. We use a number of methods to identify and locate the perpetrators, which I am not at liberty to detail further. Let's just say that it is impossible to set up an eBay account, accept payments, and conduct email correspondence in a way that is completely confidential.

The criminal penalties are up to 800,000 baht fines and 8 years in prison. Foreigners can additionally be subject to deportation and blacklisting for life.

One eBay vendor -- in this case a Thai -- happens to be in line to have their home raided by the police tomorrow. Again, trust me -- some of these rights owners are very serious.

I don't mean to be rude, but do you sometimes feel a little silly tracking down these people when millions of copies of bootleg software are available in shops all over Thailand and the same police who are going to raid this poor guy's house don't do a thing, but collect tea money? Or do you feel differently about these cases since the software is going international?

[medicinebox]

There are thousands of copies and contraband on Ebay. You can list what you like, but eventually Ebay will catch up with you and start ending your auctions. If you persist you will be suspended from Ebay for 60 days. Post office should'nt be a problem, but the country you are sending to may open the box and sieze the goods. Then you will have a disgruntled buyer to deal with.

IMHO, it is not solid enough to leave home for. You get suspended then what do you do for income. I would look for another way to make a living, and only dabble on Ebay for beer money.

Expect lower bids if shipping from Thailand, as it puts many buyers off.

[PvtDick]

I don't feel silly when I get paid by the rights owners. It's just a job; I don't look at it that philosophically.

The rights owners know that their options for dealing with local sales in countries like Thailand are limited. It is very hard or impossible to control. But when someone someone starts exporting this contraband to other, cleaner markets -- like the US or Western Europe -- that really pisses them off.

Please note that it is not eBay taking the action, but the rights owners. eBay will end auctions and suspends accounts, which is all they can do. The rights owners, though, will track you down and have you arrested -- if you do enough to piss them off, that is. They don't have the resources to go after everyone who puts one copy up for sale.

[bartender100]

Thailand has done a fairly good job of getting rid of copyright goods,I think its impossible now to buy copy PC games in Pattaya,the shops that I used that were doing it have either been closed or running down there stock(no new ones)

Last time I was in Bangkok I tried to buy those Lacost socks 5 for B100,but could not find any were,and on sukhumvit,if you look carefully not much copy stuff around now.

[Darknight]

Thailand has done a fairly good job of getting rid of copyright goods,I think its impossible now to buy copy PC games in Pattaya,the shops that I used that were doing it have either been closed or running down there stock(no new ones)

so go 20 km down the road to sriracha. The computer mall is full of them. I even was there when they made a raid on couterfit stuff which meant that the owners who DIDN't pay tea money were raided while the shop next door kept on selling even when police were standing outside.

Besides all programs can be found on the right places on the net. It just cost you download cost then, not even a copy can compete with that....

[appleman_thai]

I posted some stuff to IReland for my Brother..... just some silk scarves and a few sets of cutlery - not very much at all. I also put some Pantip COmputer CD's in the parcel and 1 week later there was a customs letter threatening legal action on my brothers doorstep! -

They eventually gave the cutlery and scarves after a few weeks wrangling and grovelling but the CD's were gone........ (burnt for themselves or just burnt dead is a good question.

So be careful.......

[maerim]

If you can't buy pirated stuff here in Thailand may I suggest a trip to any carboot sale on a Sunday in the U.K.?

Or the delights of the grotty markets in the less desirable parts of Manchester,if not perhaps a computer fair then?

You can buy whatever you want D.V.D.s computer software ,games.C.D.s you name it you can buy it.

They will even change it if it don't work, of course me being an upstanding citizen I would not dream of getting involved with nefarious activities such as these and I don't want P.C Dick turning up on my doorstep tooled up.

[MadFrankie]

aye.. Probably not such a good idea, 6 people got arrested and deported in pattaya a few weeks ago for it, u should be able to find this in the news secition if ya have look.

[PvtDick]

I even was there when they made a raid on couterfit stuff which meant that the owners who DIDN't pay tea money were raided while the shop next door kept on selling even when police were standing outside.

You are seriously misinformed here. The police do not decide who gets raided and who doesn't. The rights holders' representatives do. I perform this function quite often, and nothing stops me from nailing the shops I want to nail. The cops know if they tried any silly business, their names would be on the PM's desk first thing the next morning.

It may appear to an outsider that some shops are being targeted while others are spared, and that outsider might assume that the reason is tea money being paid to the cops. The fact is, when we stage a raid, we often cannot put together the manpower to take down every vendor in a certain shopping mall, or in a certain shopping area. We have to choose the largest, or the most notorious recidivists, or the ones that are otherwise giving us the most trouble. Also, we are often going out for a sole rights holder, whose product may be in one or two shops, while next door they may be selling 1,000 fake items of something we're not interested in.

I just love these farangs who think they know it all about everything.

[medicinebox]

I perform this function quite often, and nothing stops me from nailing the shops I want to nail.

So nothing stops you from nailing the shops you want to nail?

The fact is, when we stage a raid, we often cannot put together the manpower to take down every vendor in a certain shopping mall, or in a certain shopping area.

[Darknight]

I even was there when they made a raid on couterfit stuff which meant that the owners who DIDN't pay tea money were raided while the shop next door kept on selling even when police were standing outside.

You are seriously misinformed here. The police do not decide who gets raided and who doesn't. The rights holders' representatives do. I perform this function quite often, and nothing stops me from nailing the shops I want to nail. The cops know if they tried any silly business, their names would be on the PM's desk first thing the next morning.

It may appear to an outsider that some shops are being targeted while others are spared, and that outsider might assume that the reason is tea money being paid to the cops. The fact is, when we stage a raid, we often cannot put together the manpower to take down every vendor in a certain shopping mall, or in a certain shopping area. We have to choose the largest, or the most notorious recidivists, or the ones that are otherwise giving us the most trouble. Also, we are often going out for a sole rights holder, whose product may be in one or two shops, while next door they may be selling 1,000 fake items of something we're not interested in.

I just love these farangs who think they know it all about everything.

if you raid a complete shopping mall and you have shop 1, 2, 3, 4 in a row selling the same stuff , you have to explain to me why you don't go in shop NR 3 then ???

I just love these farangs who think they know it all about everything.

UHU , i agree ???? probably proud of your job are you , ratting on others and getting paid for it???

[PvtDick]

It's called protecting individuals' and companies' legal right to product they have created. In a civilized society, that's a good thing. Maybe it's just that you've never created anything (or, at least nothing worth protecting).

Anyway, if I've only got three guys, shops 1, 2, and 4 may get raided if shop 3 has less product. If I'm working for AutoCad, for example, and shop 3 has no AutoCad product (something that may not be obvious to a moron standing by gawking with his jaw down at his navel), shop 3 will not get busted even though it may be bursting at the seams with other pirated software.

To an outsider who doesn't know sh##t from shinola, it may look like there is funny business going on. There isn't.

[Darknight]

It's called protecting individuals' and companies' legal right to product they have created. In a civilized society, that's a good thing. Maybe it's just that you've never created anything (or, at least nothing worth protecting).

Authoring rights are history , on music and on software.... you can try all you want . It's always crackable and the incentives will always be there since the company's charge ridiculous amounts for their software. Or you think Autocad with a price over the 100.000 bath is normal???

Anyway, if I've only got three guys, shops 1, 2, and 4 may get raided if shop 3 has less product. If I'm working for AutoCad, for example, and shop 3 has no AutoCad product (something that may not be obvious to a moron standing by gawking with his jaw down at his navel), shop 3 will not get busted even though it may be bursting at the seams with other pirated software.

To an outsider who doesn't know sh##t from shinola, it may look like there is funny business going on. There isn't.

I'm in the It biz longer then you are probably a Dick. Besides these shop owners laugh in your face , when you confiscate everything , they just fill there shop again the next day .

Sure you are doing society a very important service ???

--snip--

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Edited May 12, 2004 by george

[Topprofile]

Thailand has done a fairly good job of getting rid of copyright goods,I think its impossible now to buy copy PC games in Pattaya,the shops that I used that were doing it have either been closed or running down there stock(no new ones)

Last time I was in Bangkok I tried to buy those Lacost socks 5 for B100,but could not find any were,and on sukhumvit,if you look carefully not much copy stuff around now.

I think there are still lots of copys lying around in the shops on Sukhumvit...?

Polo, Lacoste, Diesel, Nike, DVDs, watches... Anything you want.. Passing it everyday...

Go to Panthip in BKK and check your PC games...

[PvtDick]

As I said, I do not look on it philosophically. I personally don't care if the actions of the rights owners have any long-term effect, and I don't care if Autocad charges over 100,000 baht for a legit copy. If you want to justify stealing other people's property because you consider the price they set too high, you have my blessing. I'm doing a job I've been hired to do, and there is nothing dishonorable about it. If the shop owners just laugh, then no one is getting hurt.

[maerim]

I just love these farangs who think they know it all about everything.

So you are in love with yourself then.

Don't you think you have been watching too many D.V.D.s of course not the pirated type of American cops,you take down,sh##t from shinola and so on.

Surprised you have not"wasted" anyone yet.

[PvtDick]

I never claimed to know everything, but I do know my business. And it does not include "wasting" people. Perhaps you've been watching too many old Starsky & Hutch episodes.

[Topprofile]

I never claimed to know everything, but I do know my business. And it does not include "wasting" people. Perhaps you've been watching too many old Starsky & Hutch episodes.

Good you know what you are doing, otherwise one might be worried for you... They might just lock you up otherwise

The things that you know I can forget without noticing...

[Richard Hall]

From a commercial point of view oversees e-baying or better say retail business in general can be barely profitable mainly because of high handling (including overseas payment transfer) and transportation cost usually eating the entire margin up and/or eventually resulting in incompetitive pricing. Also clients tend to be hesitant to shop in foreign countries because if there is a legale dispute across borders it is very difficult to get a poosible claim pushed through and receive compensation. All is basically a matter of trust and how can one have faith is an individual (may it be in the role of the seller or the buyer) never met personally and being located thousands of miles away.

Under these circumstances, if at all, only light and kind of valuable merchandise (e.g. collectors items such as coins, stamps etc.) seems to be suitable to allow a decent margin but on the other hand customers (particularly those that shop on e-bay) are surely very reluctant when it comes to relatively high spendings. Engaging into selling counterfeit products should not even be taken into consideration for obvious reasons.

Last but not least the sole way appears to be concentrating with your (virtual) retail business on the home (national) market only, the place where you (or a business partner) are physically present. The goods to be retailed are acquired in bulk (to keep the own cost down) and tried to be retailed piece by piece in your national market by using auction systems such as e-bay. This seems to be the method those all those e-bay sellers seem to employ when it comes to foreign merchandise. On the occasion of visiting a country they buy a lot of goods at places such as Chatuchak and take them back with them in their suitcase or have them shipped to their home address.

Nevertheless, there is no way to make business without risk (although crooks and scammers always claim the opposite) and the seller might end up with dead unsellable stock because the most unpredictable species on earth (besides human females in general) is a customer. One may think to have discovered the ideal product because all aspects appear to be right (good quality, fancy, good price etc.) and possibly even get big attention from a large consumer crowd. People praise the product , the idea, the concept to be absolutely innovative and outstanding but eventually they do not actually buy. The rather turn to well-known overpriced, branded material they have a relation to because it is heavily advertised with a big budget. If David Beckham or Britney Spears uses something it just gotta be good! (No further comments on this subject but brainwash works with all(!) people even if they deny otherwise the biggies in the games wouldn't spend millions of bucks).

Don't expect to win the game because of a better product, a better price or better service. Once a brand is well established principally the label can be attached to dog excrement (politly said) and it sells well.

Summary: E-bay/retail business targetting at overseas customers will not work in most cases because the buyers always browse the internet for bargains and well bargain calculation just does not work if your customers live on the other side of the moon. If by any chance your name is David Beckham of course you surely find a buyer on Mars willing to pay a handful of nuggets for your used smeared underwear which leaves us with the conclusion to focus on becoming a celebrity first before opening your virtual retail store.

[BKKdreaming]

Great points Richard ....

as far as Ebay , pick a section , look at completed auctions and see how many items got NO bids.

this still costs the seller something to list it.

Also if you looked at many of the items with some bids,

they did not meet reserve, again costing the seller listing fee money with no income !

Ebay always wins and gets paid , sometimes you win !

I sell stuff on Ebay , a very large percent does not get bids,

so I have cut back my listings and only put high profit items that I have boxes of in the garage.

Your items have to sell for $20-$30 each minimum to even make it worthwile.

The best thing to sell on ebay is junk you got free or were going to throw away !

start it at 1 cent and see where it goes,

BUT then its only "mad" money and not an income....

hope that helps,,,,,