Pattaya Electricity Bills

[Mobi]

Thanks for all the responses , which are very interesting and have given me some food for thought.

As I said before, I have a large place, and over Christmas/New year I had a house full which meant 4 a/c's running at night. My normal bill tends to be 6,500 - 7,500 - not that much more than Rimmer's average bill, and believe it or not, lower than some bills that have been posted on other threads.

Yes, I do have 2 large fridge freezers, plus 2 more medium sized fridges.

The fact is that if you have a large residence, with all the outside lights, swimming pool pumps, illuminated water features etc. it's going to cost. As I said, I try to avoid unnecessary wastage, (all my lights have power saving bulbs, except the Halogen security lights), but I'm not scrimping on what I built to enjoy in my old age. Why should I if I can afford it?

Yes I do have my own bill from the electricity authority, with my own 3 phase power. I am sure no one is stealing my power, and as you see from my bill, I seem to be paying less per KW than many of you.

Monty's stuff about the Time of Use meter is very interesting and I will look into it. I could run my pool pump at night for a start.

I'm a bit puzzled on the posts which say you have to keep the water very hot to kill bacteria. If this is the case, Monty, would it be wise to shut it off in the day time ? And would I be safe in lowering the temperature?

Any theories anyone.?

PS I'd love to use solar energy, Raro, but its' a bit late isn't it? Once the house is built?

[Phil Conners]

No, you can retrofit a solar panel - but they're quite expensive so it might not be cost effective. Still, in this environmentally enlightened age it may be worth it to reduce your CO2 production

Edited January 28, 2007 by Phil Conners

[monty]

I looked into that hot water bacteria a bit. It was honestly the first thing I've ever heard about it, but it seems to be true.

When your water temperature in the heater comes under 60 degrees, you run the risk of getting legionella bacteria.

But, most sites having info on this particular problem advice two things, first keep the temperature higher if possible, and second, instead of drinking the hot tap water, heat cold water instead.

So to put the risk in perspective, I was wondering how many people in Thailand are using the hot tap water to make themselves a cup of coffee, or even use the hot water to rinse their mouth after cleaning teeth...

[Mobi]

I looked into that hot water bacteria a bit. It was honestly the first thing I've ever heard about it, but it seems to be true.

When your water temperature in the heater comes under 60 degrees, you run the risk of getting legionella bacteria.

But, most sites having info on this particular problem advice two things, first keep the temperature higher if possible, and second, instead of drinking the hot tap water, heat cold water instead.

So to put the risk in perspective, I was wondering how many people in Thailand are using the hot tap water to make themselves a cup of coffee, or even use the hot water to rinse their mouth after cleaning teeth...

I haven't bothered to research this, but if you're talking about Legoinaire's disease, I belivee it normally occurs in water cooled a/c sysytems which are used in large buildings such as cineams, residential care home, hospitals etc. I also understand that once the bacteria is present in the water systems, it is air born to humans, so I doubt whether not drinking the water is going to help much.

Experts out there??

[luckyluke]

My bill runs at around 3,500 - 3,800 using at least 1 aircon around the clock (but set at a very economical 26/27°C) and 2,000 with no aircon.

Does anyone know the standard rate per kWh in Pattaya?...I'm paying a marked up 6.05 baht/kWh.

I'm curious to know what my surcharge is.

Live in Banglamung,two houses for one i pay 3.1475 bath per unit, taxes included,the other one 3.2618 bth per unit ,taxes included.

[Phil Conners]

I looked into that hot water bacteria a bit. It was honestly the first thing I've ever heard about it, but it seems to be true.

When your water temperature in the heater comes under 60 degrees, you run the risk of getting legionella bacteria.

But, most sites having info on this particular problem advice two things, first keep the temperature higher if possible, and second, instead of drinking the hot tap water, heat cold water instead.

So to put the risk in perspective, I was wondering how many people in Thailand are using the hot tap water to make themselves a cup of coffee, or even use the hot water to rinse their mouth after cleaning teeth...

Apparently it's not a matter of drinking the water or brushing teeths in it:

The germ, which causes Legionnaires' disease, is a bacterium called Legionella pneumophila. People catch Legionnaires' disease by inhaling small droplets of water suspended in the air, which contain the Legionella bacterium.

Source: http://www.accepta.com/industry_water_trea...c-hot-water.asp

[bazmlb]

I have seen devices advertised that go inline with the mains power and help reduce the bill, the only thing i can think fo that would could cause this is something that does a change to cause leading or lagging power factor to confuse the meter that power isnt actually being used.

anyone seen these units around?

[midas]

could anybody comment on whether it's true that even when the electricity

bills are taken directly from meter readings they can still vary above the

standard rate of 3.89 bhat per unit ? one condominium building manager

who claims the rate is 5 baht per unit says it's because the electricity authorities

base their unit charges on how much is used ? this doesn't sound right to me and

I certainly don't think it happens in Bangkok.....................................

[elkangorito]

I looked into that hot water bacteria a bit. It was honestly the first thing I've ever heard about it, but it seems to be true.

When your water temperature in the heater comes under 60 degrees, you run the risk of getting legionella bacteria.

But, most sites having info on this particular problem advice two things, first keep the temperature higher if possible, and second, instead of drinking the hot tap water, heat cold water instead.

So to put the risk in perspective, I was wondering how many people in Thailand are using the hot tap water to make themselves a cup of coffee, or even use the hot water to rinse their mouth after cleaning teeth...

I haven't bothered to research this, but if you're talking about Legoinaire's disease, I belivee it normally occurs in water cooled a/c sysytems which are used in large buildings such as cineams, residential care home, hospitals etc. I also understand that once the bacteria is present in the water systems, it is air born to humans, so I doubt whether not drinking the water is going to help much.

Experts out there??

Legionella Pneumophila exists in almost ALL water & moist soils. It lies dormant if the environmental temperature is below about 20 degrees Celsius & is killed at about 70 degrees Celsius.

Legionella infection is acquired through breathing in aerosols (very fine droplets of water) which contain the bacteria. It is not passed from person to person nor is it acquired by drinking water contaminated with Legionella.

Since Legionella exists naturally in all water, the problem only arises when the Total Bacterial Count (TBC) is high & water aerosols are apirated (breathed in). Generally, the water needs to be between 25 & 50 degrees Celsius for the bacteria to breed quickly to high numbers.

The disease does not affect everyone who comes into contact with the bacteria. The groups most at risk are:

* People over 50 years of age (predominantly males)

* Heavy smokers

* Heavy drinkers

* Diabetics

* People with chronic lung disease

* People with impaired immune systems (ie body defence mechanisms)

There have been no reported cases of anybody in Australia contracting Legionnaires Disease from any domestic 'non aerosol' water supply. Australia is the perfect place for this disease because in Summer, when the temperatures are high, Legionella can proliferate very easily & quickly.

Cooling Towers are the main breeding grounds for this bacteria & are very dangerous because these cooling towers emit lots of water vapour (aerosol).

Therefore, there is no need to worry about this bacteria in any water storage system. Nor is there any need to heat your water storage tanks. It is advisable however, to drain & scrub the tank once per year (if this is possible. If not, forget about it).

I have seen devices advertised that go inline with the mains power and help reduce the bill, the only thing i can think fo that would could cause this is something that does a change to cause leading or lagging power factor to confuse the meter that power isnt actually being used.

anyone seen these units around?

Unfortunately, correcting the Power Factor of your electrical load will not make any difference whatsoever to your electricity bill.

Edited January 30, 2007 by elkangorito

[raro]

I have seen devices advertised that go inline with the mains power and help reduce the bill, the only thing i can think fo that would could cause this is something that does a change to cause leading or lagging power factor to confuse the meter that power isnt actually being used.

anyone seen these units around?

Unfortunately, correcting the Power Factor of your electrical load will not make any difference whatsoever to your electricity bill.

There was a device around called "Power Boss" that limits the wattage when the aircon (or any other electric device) is running idle. Can safe a great deal of energy!

Unfortunately the German guy who used to sell this in Pattaya is gone back home, no idea if this device or something similar is still available. Then again, the principal behind it is no rocket science as a rocket scientist assured me and someone with much more experience in soldering wires together than I have can manufacture this in his backyard.

[sumrit]

I looked into that hot water bacteria a bit. It was honestly the first thing I've ever heard about it, but it seems to be true.

When your water temperature in the heater comes under 60 degrees, you run the risk of getting legionella bacteria.

But, most sites having info on this particular problem advice two things, first keep the temperature higher if possible, and second, instead of drinking the hot tap water, heat cold water instead.

So to put the risk in perspective, I was wondering how many people in Thailand are using the hot tap water to make themselves a cup of coffee, or even use the hot water to rinse their mouth after cleaning teeth...

I'm no expert but I believe the hygiene regulations that restaurants etc. have to abide by in the UK include storing cooked food at either above 63C or below 5C because bacteria is only active between these temperatures. I should imagine bacteria is active within the same temperatures in water.

[sumrit]

I have seen devices advertised that go inline with the mains power and help reduce the bill, the only thing i can think fo that would could cause this is something that does a change to cause leading or lagging power factor to confuse the meter that power isnt actually being used.

anyone seen these units around?

Somebody was selling some of these units at the market in Chonburi last month. I couldn't read the explanation as it was in thai but from the daigrams on the leaflet he gave me it looked similar to something sold in the UK many years ago untill they became illegal there. If I remember correctly they work by shifting the current phase by 90 degrees with respect to the voltage so when the voltage is at maximum no virtually current is drawn and it fools the meter into not clocking up any usage. They're probably much more sophisticated now but that was the principle then.

[raro]

I have seen devices advertised that go inline with the mains power and help reduce the bill, the only thing i can think fo that would could cause this is something that does a change to cause leading or lagging power factor to confuse the meter that power isnt actually being used.

anyone seen these units around?

Somebody was selling some of these units at the market in Chonburi last month. I couldn't read the explanation as it was in thai but from the daigrams on the leaflet he gave me it looked similar to something sold in the UK many years ago untill they became illegal there. If I remember correctly they work by shifting the current phase by 90 degrees with respect to the voltage so when the voltage is at maximum no virtually current is drawn and it fools the meter into not clocking up any usage. They're probably much more sophisticated now but that was the principle then.

right...it had to do something with phase shifting. Now why did they become illegal? And why did they fool the wattmeter? According to that German guy - and he demostrated it quite well and I have a good understanding of physics - there is actually no current drawn out of the system.

[sumrit]

I have seen devices advertised that go inline with the mains power and help reduce the bill, the only thing i can think fo that would could cause this is something that does a change to cause leading or lagging power factor to confuse the meter that power isnt actually being used.

anyone seen these units around?

Somebody was selling some of these units at the market in Chonburi last month. I couldn't read the explanation as it was in thai but from the daigrams on the leaflet he gave me it looked similar to something sold in the UK many years ago untill they became illegal there. If I remember correctly they work by shifting the current phase by 90 degrees with respect to the voltage so when the voltage is at maximum no virtually current is drawn and it fools the meter into not clocking up any usage. They're probably much more sophisticated now but that was the principle then.

right...it had to do something with phase shifting. Now why did they become illegal? And why did they fool the wattmeter? According to that German guy - and he demostrated it quite well and I have a good understanding of physics - there is actually no current drawn out of the system.

They became illegal because when people used them they were stealing electricity. I think they fooled the meter because the meter needs to see both the potential and the current drawn at the same time. By phase shifting the current that the meter is looking at by 90 degrees when the potential (voltage) is there no (or very little) current is being drawn so very little is registered on the meter. Of course you don't get something for nothing and your still drawing as much power as always, its just that the meter can't see it (hence stealing the elecricity). Your German guy was wrong if he said no current was drawn from the system.

Edited February 4, 2007 by sumrit

[moo9]

Last month I paid 1,300 Baht for a 180 m2 Condo (no aircon at all since Christmas). Unit price is just below 4 Baht/unit.

[raro]

They became illegal because when people used them they were stealing electricity. I think they fooled the meter because the meter needs to see both the potential and the current drawn at the same time. By phase shifting the current that the meter is looking at by 90 degrees when the potential (voltage) is there no (or very little) current is being drawn so very little is registered on the meter. Of course you don't get something for nothing and your still drawing as much power as always, its just that the meter can't see it (hence stealing the elecricity). Your German guy was wrong if he said no current was drawn from the system.

he made a demonstration with a grinding machine. The engine was running considerably lower when running idle but picked up revs as soon as he held it onto the piece of demonstration wood.

The trick was that while the machine was running idle, less current than usual was consumed. Once it had to run on full power, the "throttle" opened and let the full current flow through.