Thais and English: Stop the rote learning, be brave to speak, get better jobs and be happy!

[Poottrong]

6 minutes ago, Kieran00001 said:

 

I can assure you that me talking about the Punjabi influence on the English language has done nothing to make your point, in fact it has rubbished it.

 

Jamaican patois does not contain the vernacular 'init', however British Jamaican youths use the term, having picked it up in the UK, where it developed originally from British Punjabi youths.  You should, unless you are a completely hopeless racist, be able to see that 'init' is no more a black thing than it is a white thing.

 

Do you think that white kids in Georgia say dawg to try to sound like black people?  How would that work considering they all say dawg, blacks and whites the same.  The pronunciation is an imitation of a southern states accent, nothing to do with black people, get over it, you were wrong about both examples you gave.

Two things:

 

1. I made it clear in my first reply that you were correct about "innit" being of Punjabi origin. Although there are Punjabi elements in youth slang the bulk of it comes from the black immigrant culture. So you can move on from the Punjabi thing now as you seem to be stuck there and ignoring the relevant point. Why it seems to be difficult for you to admit that white British kids like to talk like black kids (a fact supported by linguists) seems to be a denial of the obvious.

 

2. If you do a quick google search you will see that "dawg" in the urban dictionary  means "Slang for "my close acquaintance of an African-American ethnic background" . So yes white kids are trying to sound like black guys when they say it and not like their white grandfathers. Again, quite obvious you'd think.

 

 

[Poottrong]

10 minutes ago, Kieran00001 said:

 

 

Dawg origin

This was the 1970s, before Ted Turner was famous outside of Georgia. But the program was called "Deputy Dawg," and it was spelled this way. And this is a "suth'nism," if you catch my drift: an eye dialect on how Southerners actually pronounce words as opposed to the American English standard.

Exhibit A Dawg:

 

[Kieran00001]

8 minutes ago, Poottrong said:

Two things:

 

1. I made it clear in my first reply that you were correct about "innit" being of Punjabi origin. Although there are Punjabi elements in youth slang the bulk of it comes from the black immigrant culture. So you can move on from the Punjabi thing now as you seem to be stuck there and ignoring the relevant point. Why it seems to be difficult for you to admit that white British kids like to talk like black kids (a fact supported by linguists) seems to be a denial of the obvious.

 

2. If you do a quick google search you will see that "dawg" in the urban dictionary  means "Slang for "my close acquaintance of an African-American ethnic background" . So yes white kids are trying to sound like black guys when they say it and not like their white grandfathers. Again, quite obvious you'd think.

 

 

 

You read my post about the Punjabi origin of 'init' and claimed that I was making your point for you and started talking some nonsense about white kids copying immigrants.  They did not get init from the Punjab, they got it from third generation British Punjabi youths, there were no immigrants involved.  I have no idea what this white kids like to talk like black kids thing is supposed to mean, kids influence each other, as was just explained to you slowly three times.  Init came from Punjabi kids however you now hear black kids also saying it, so by your limited logic black kids like to talk like Indian kids.

 

 

Urban Dictionary is a parody site, conversation over.

 

 

 

[Rhys]

   MOE.. RIP..

[Kieran00001]

45 minutes ago, Poottrong said:

Two things:

 

1. I made it clear in my first reply that you were correct about "innit" being of Punjabi origin. Although there are Punjabi elements in youth slang the bulk of it comes from the black immigrant culture. So you can move on from the Punjabi thing now as you seem to be stuck there and ignoring the relevant point. Why it seems to be difficult for you to admit that white British kids like to talk like black kids (a fact supported by linguists) seems to be a denial of the obvious.

 

2. If you do a quick google search you will see that "dawg" in the urban dictionary  means "Slang for "my close acquaintance of an African-American ethnic background" . So yes white kids are trying to sound like black guys when they say it and not like their white grandfathers. Again, quite obvious you'd think.

 

 

 

I was wrong about the 3rd generation Punjabi thing and thought it best to correct myself, 'innit' was already in use in the UK in 1950's.  Here is a quote from Michael Gilbert's Blood and Judgement, which came out in 1959.

Quote

"We told the officer what we saw," said Ray, "and he told us to come straight along and tell you. That's right, innit?"

 

While I am at it, the use of dawg was in use in London in 1898, as is evidenced by J. Dodsworth Brayshaw's Slum Silhouette.

Quote

“Ev'ry markit mornin' yer ter be my dawg, ev'ry mornin' till yer like ter chuck it.”

 

 

 

[vogie]

8 minutes ago, Kieran00001 said:

 

I was wrong about the 3rd generation Punjabi thing and thought it best to correct myself, 'innit' was already in use in the UK in 1950's.  Here is a quote from Michael Gilbert's Blood and Judgement, which came out in 1959.

 

While I am at it, the use of dawg was in use in London in 1898, as is evidenced by J. Dodsworth Brayshaw's Slum Silhouette.

 

 

 

Innit is short for isn't it.

[Kieran00001]

2 hours ago, vogie said:

Innit is short for isn't it.

Yes, it is a form of 'isn't it', I think everyone knows that!  It is the way it is being used, its similarity to other tag on questions, and when and where it came into use in in the UK which are of interest.

[vogie]

4 minutes ago, Kieran00001 said:

Yes, it is a form of 'isn't it', I think everyone knows that!  It is the way it is being used, its similarity to other tag on questions, and when and where it came into use in in the UK which are of interest.

Probably just evolved.

 

[Kieran00001]

1 hour ago, vogie said:

Probably just evolved.

 

 

Well, we know one thing, it didn't appear in literature prior to 1959.

[timkeen08]

On 7/3/2018 at 10:17 PM, Kieran00001 said:

 

Well, we know one thing, it didn't appear in literature prior to 1959.

I don't remember much about literary facts and I don't know if animation is really concidered literature.  Dawg did appear in animation prior to 1959

 

I can only speak from my own perspective of the use of dawg as an American from the state of Georgia.  I cannot speak for the British, any other nationality, or any cartoon show other than Deputy Dawg.  Most Georgians do not have a deep slow southern drawl, I do not y'all.  A large majority of people living in Georgia were not born in Georgia and do not normally say dawg.  But there are certain circumstances in Georgia that do dictate when it is the right time to say dawg or dawgs.

 

The GEORGIA BULLDOGS (American Football team) was formed at the University of Georgia, USA in the late 1800's long before any of all the diffetent generations now alive were born and before the cartoon "Deputy Dawg" was created.  The Georgia Bulldogs or the word dog are normally pronounced as bulldogs or dog by most in Georgia with no slow southern drawl.  Except for that minority that still have a deep southern accent that might say those Gogia dawgs, the Gogia flag, that brown dawg, go down thar, etc...  Georgia and the deep southern states are seriously and incorrectly stereotyped. 

 

Before, during, or after a game it has been a long standing tradition to say ""how bout them dawgs" or "go dawgs" regardless of your normal pronunciation or accent.  And it is also acceptable to be used as a general greeting in jest such as when running across someone wearing a Georgia Bulldog's hat, shirt, jacket, etc...

 

Georgia is full of people from other states and other nations.  Today, most people from Georgia can and do pronounced the word dog with no slow southern accent except as dawg or dawgs when talking about American football.  People from other states also call them dawgs.

 

Deputy Dawg was an animated Terrytoons cartoon character.  A deputy sheriff located in the state of Florida.  Later the story's location was moved to the state of Mississippi and then to the state of Tennessee.   Terrytoons was sold to CBS in 1950 and they later syndicated Deputy Dawg.   There was no mention of Ted Turner in the article I read about the first company in Atlanta to be syndicated by CBS.

 

Animated cartoon shorts called "Deputy Dawg" was created and released by Terrytoons in the 1950's and 60's for American theaters and television.  American CBS began showing television weekly series in 1962.  British BBC begain showing television weekly series in1963.

 

I personally first heard the pronunciation of the term "dawg" outside of these above parameters amongst the Black and Hispanic gangs portrayed on television and movies in America along with Rap music.  Later among Hispanic and Black youths. Shortly after among youth of all races and nationalities trying to act like or to be Hispanic and Black hip wannabes.

 

 My opinion is that the common use of the word "dawg" initially started with American television (other than Deputy Dawg), movies, and musicians.  The cartoon had nothing to do with it and neither did Ted Turner.  My own sons used that word at times among their friends back in the 80's and 90's before most of the youth today were born, if you concider a youth as anyone under 30, although many over the age of 30 still say "dawg".

[Kieran00001]

2 hours ago, timkeen08 said:

I don't remember much about literary facts and I don't know if animation is really concidered literature.  Dawg did appear in animation prior to 1959

 

I can only speak from my own perspective of the use of dawg as an American from the state of Georgia.  I cannot speak for the British, any other nationality, or any cartoon show other than Deputy Dawg.  Most Georgians do not have a deep slow southern drawl, I do not y'all.  A large majority of people living in Georgia were not born in Georgia and do not normally say dawg.  But there are certain circumstances in Georgia that do dictate when it is the right time to say dawg or dawgs.

 

The GEORGIA BULLDOGS (American Football team) was formed at the University of Georgia, USA in the late 1800's long before any of all the diffetent generations now alive were born and before the cartoon "Deputy Dawg" was created.  The Georgia Bulldogs or the word dog are normally pronounced as bulldogs or dog by most in Georgia with no slow southern drawl.  Except for that minority that still have a deep southern accent that might say those Gogia dawgs, the Gogia flag, that brown dawg, go down thar, etc...  Georgia and the deep southern states are seriously and incorrectly stereotyped. 

 

Before, during, or after a game it has been a long standing tradition to say ""how bout them dawgs" or "go dawgs" regardless of your normal pronunciation or accent.  And it is also acceptable to be used as a general greeting in jest such as when running across someone wearing a Georgia Bulldog's hat, shirt, jacket, etc...

 

Georgia is full of people from other states and other nations.  Today, most people from Georgia can and do pronounced the word dog with no slow southern accent except as dawg or dawgs when talking about American football.  People from other states also call them dawgs.

 

Deputy Dawg was an animated Terrytoons cartoon character.  A deputy sheriff located in the state of Florida.  Later the story's location was moved to the state of Mississippi and then to the state of Tennessee.   Terrytoons was sold to CBS in 1950 and they later syndicated Deputy Dawg.   There was no mention of Ted Turner in the article I read about the first company in Atlanta to be syndicated by CBS.

 

Animated cartoon shorts called "Deputy Dawg" was created and released by Terrytoons in the 1950's and 60's for American theaters and television.  American CBS began showing television weekly series in 1962.  British BBC begain showing television weekly series in1963.

 

I personally first heard the pronunciation of the term "dawg" outside of these above parameters amongst the Black and Hispanic gangs portrayed on television and movies in America along with Rap music.  Later among Hispanic and Black youths. Shortly after among youth of all races and nationalities trying to act like or to be Hispanic and Black hip wannabes.

 

 My opinion is that the common use of the word "dawg" initially started with American television (other than Deputy Dawg), movies, and musicians.  The cartoon had nothing to do with it and neither did Ted Turner.  My own sons used that word at times among their friends back in the 80's and 90's before most of the youth today were born, if you concider a youth as anyone under 30, although many over the age of 30 still say "dawg".

 

Sorry, you misunderstood, it is 'innit' that didn't appear in literature prior to 1959, 'dawg' goes back to the 1800's in the UK, no idea about the US, if you check the above posts I offered a correction to my original claim that it started with Deputy Dawg, although that cartoon is credited with popularising the pronunciation in recent times it certainly goes back much further.

Quote

 “Ev'ry markit mornin' yer ter be my dawg, ev'ry mornin' till yer like ter chuck it.”

1898: J. D. Brayshaw Slum Silhouettes 

[Poottrong]

20 hours ago, timkeen08 said:

I personally first heard the pronunciation of the term "dawg" outside of these above parameters amongst the Black and Hispanic gangs portrayed on television and movies in America along with Rap music.Shortly after among youth of all races and nationalities trying to act like or to be Hispanic and Black hip wannabes.

 

Precisely. This was the gist of my original comment and subsequent follow ups. Kieran00001, however, for some reason, finds this awfully racist to point out. He also doesn't seem to think it's true which I find hard to believe.

[timkeen08]

6 hours ago, Poottrong said:

Precisely. This was the gist of my original comment and subsequent follow ups. Kieran00001, however, for some reason, finds this awfully racist to point out. He also doesn't seem to think it's true which I find hard to believe.

My sons were into Rap etc... at a young age and they said the word dawg was associated with some of their music and was used by other musicians as well.  Then later it was adopted by television and movies.

 

My sons are now in their late 30's and are caucasian Americans yet they still listened to some Rap music.  I hope that reference is not too racial for anyone.  I certainly never heard the word pronounced as dawg by youth before their time period except by maybe my dad who was a Tennessee country farm boy.  He also said things like, "put out that there far fore ya go ta bed".  Love ya dad.

 

My sons think that the idea of the word dawg coming from Deputy Dawg is a big laugh. Their quote, "Not in America, maybe in the UK?  They get everything that's cool wrong anyway?" 

 

Dawg has varied meanings other than a reference to the cartoon character but I will not go into the different examples they gave me where dawg can be used during a conversation.  Some are just not too polite or politically correct.  Some are just humorous jest among friends or a word that a particular person likes to use a lot.  Know what I mean, MAN?  I see that you do, MAN.  COOL MAN.  Same concept, MAN