EU says ready for no-deal Brexit, 'British would be the biggest losers'

[Laughing Gravy]

51 minutes ago, DannyCarlton said:

There's no doubt that the subliminal messages that inundated Facebook, Twitter et. al. put out in their many millions by AIQ, Cambridge Analitica and the St. Petersberg troll farm, swang the referendum in favour of the Brexit vote. Just as the same actors did in the US election, in favour of Trump.

 

I'm not saying that you personally wouldn't have voted leave anyway but one of the phenomena of this type of "brainwashing" is that the victim is completely unaware of it. Undoubtedly had a major influence in the Brexit referendum and the US elections.

 

Interestingly, the chief achitect of this kind of vote manipulation, during the Brexit campaign, was Dominic Cummings who brought AIQ on board for the official leave campaign, was recently appointed as Boris's presonal guru.

I have to disagree totally on this. Half the people I know don't use facebook, so that theory is blown out the water.

 

How convenient that Brexit is voted, a President is voted in and its the Russians fault.

 

How about people voted leave because.,..,. have had enough of the EU, its over powering protectionist racquet, its domineering ECJ, along with its dictatorial unaccountable 5 presidents.

[Moti24]

16 hours ago, zorrow424 said:

.....why the hell did we join?

During WW2, Britain amassed a debt of billions of dollars, liberating those who now are bent on destroying a once prosperous nation.  Taking into account the rebuilding, by the mid-sixties, Britain were heading for bankruptcy.  By 1969, the only option was to join the EU, to ensure more economic stability.  And so, on the 1st of January, 1973,  Britain became part of the EU.  Since that time, the EU have been screwing Britain for every last drop of blood, for no other reason than to support the weaker countries; Britain, being one of the highest contributors, can no longer sustain a support role for those countries that seem unable to help themselves, and not before time, are calling it a day. 

 

It seems that Merkel and Macron are running the show, although how the German Chancellor and a washed-up politician who can't keep the population of his own country under control are allowed to dictate such terms, I don't know.  One thing for sure, the EU will make it as hard as possible for Britain to leave, as a warning to any other country having similar ideas.

 

Most of the EU countries appear to have short memories.  The demise of the EU will not be too far off once Britain leaves, and those countries with "similar ideas" won't be too far behind. 

Edited August 20, 2019 by Moti24

[Baerboxer]

16 hours ago, welovesundaysatspace said:

Will “become democratic again” include to give the UK’s member states a veto right (such as the EU does), letting them leave the UK when they want (such as the EU does), and maybe even having a democratically elected head of state (rather than an unelected one)?

 

Or could that mean the collapse of your little English Soviet Union? 

 

Who elected the new EU Commission Head to replace Juncker?

[Baerboxer]

3 hours ago, JonnyF said:

The EU needs to grow up and come back to the table. The surrender treaty agreed with Remainer May is completely one sided, has been rejected 3 times and is dead as a dodo.

 

So do they want a sensible deal negotiated in good faith that benefits BOTH sides are are they going to carry on with this childish, mafioso "We'll kneecap you for leaving" <deleted>? In 2016 I was a Leaver but with a somewhat heavy heart, my opinion was divided and probably 60% of me wanted to leave and 40% remain. 3 years later having studied the EU much more closely and seen the way they conduct themselves in painful detail I can't wait to leave their corrupt, protectionist racket with as hard a Brexit as possible. Their mask has really slipped, what an eye opener.

 

Even Remainers, many of whom probably like you were torn between staying and leaving, must throw their arms up in despair at the recent EU Leadership appointments and their choices.

 

It seems criminal convictions, cheating, and incompetence are ideal skills for EU leaders. Maybe those types of people do as they're told without question by those pulling the strings.

 

The referendum and Brexit has exposed a great deal wrong with the political class in the UK. It exposed just as much about the politicians and bureaucrats who run the EU and all its member states.

 

If the European people, of which I'm one, continue to accept this crock-of-<deleted> from the politicians and bureaucrats who think they know best and openly line their own pockets, they deserve all they get.

[elcaro]

3 hours ago, DoctorG said:

If the EU wasn't worried about the UK leaving they would not be making such a noise about it.

When I still read Dutch newspapers I could hardly hear anything about it. Last I read was they are fed up with uk and if they want to leave they should just get on with it.

 

Was curious how it now was and yes pretty much the same. Europe is not making noise

 

News.google.nl nothing on Brexit

News.google.be one mention of Johnson creating unrest

News.google.fr one mention of Johnson threatening to close borders

News.google.de one mention of johnson wanting to renegotiate and one article on Johnson wanting to end free movement within Europe 

 

News.google.co.uk lots and lots

 

 

 

[brewsterbudgen]

 
Who elected the new EU Commission Head to replace Juncker?

The democratically elected European parliament.

Sent from my SM-A500F using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app

[Laughing Gravy]

5 minutes ago, elcaro said:

When I still read Dutch newspapers I could hardly hear anything about it. Last I read was they are fed up with uk and if they want to leave they should just get on with it.

Well done the Dutch. Most in the UK want the same. 

I am sure the UK will sell Fish to the Dutch from UK waters at a sensible price.????

[vogie]

6 minutes ago, elcaro said:

When I still read Dutch newspapers I could hardly hear anything about it. Last I read was they are fed up with uk and if they want to leave they should just get on with it.

 

Was curious how it now was and yes pretty much the same. Europe is not making noise

 

News.google.nl nothing on Brexit

News.google.be one mention of Johnson creating unrest

News.google.fr one mention of Johnson threatening to close borders

News.google.de one mention of johnson wanting to renegotiate and one article on Johnson wanting to end free movement within Europe 

 

News.google.co.uk lots and lots

 

 

 

The EU countries don't have to do anything, how can the UK get a possibly good deal when our own remainers are doing the EUs dirty work for them.

[sirwilly]

Lets get out of the EU  as fast as possible , It was always a load of Rubbish. When we leave it will soon collapse completely I hope.

[grumpy 4680]

      Britain will be worse off, FINE, it may take a while to get back to normal, But at least we will be FREE of Juncker the JUNTER, and all the other EU cronies.

      Then we can sit back and watch the rest of rotten barrel crumble. Germany and France are welcome to it.

[DannyCarlton]

1 hour ago, Laughing Gravy said:

I have to disagree totally on this. Half the people I know don't use facebook, so that theory is blown out the water.

 

How convenient that Brexit is voted, a President is voted in and its the Russians fault.

 

How about people voted leave because.,..,. have had enough of the EU, its over powering protectionist racquet, its domineering ECJ, along with its dictatorial unaccountable 5 presidents.

OK. Let's use your figures, 50 % of Brexiteers don't use face book. 17.4m people voted leave, 16.1 m voted remain. A difference of 1.3m people. If half of that 1.3m had voted remain instead of leave, remain would have won the day. That's 650 thousand people from a total of 33.5m people who voted. If half don't use facebook, then the trolls had the opportunity of influencing half of those who eventually voted leave, 8.5m people. If they managed to swing 1 in 13 people (7.7%) in their target demographic to vote leave, they would have swung the vote the other way. 7.7% swing is very doable using targetted and personalised messages to individual, more than 60 million were sent out and I don't include the Russians in that, just AIQ, the official leave campaign and Cambridge Analitica, Farage's leave campaign.

 

I would say that your estimate of 50% of Brexiteers not using facebook is wildly optomistic, I don't know of one Brexiteer who doesn't have a facebook account, with a more realistic figure of their target audience, I would suggest it required a swing of less than 5% to swing the referendum. Cambridge Analytica claim much bigger swings than that in their targetted campaigns.

 

 

[Laughing Gravy]

17 minutes ago, DannyCarlton said:

I would say that your estimate of 50% of Brexiteers not using facebook is wildly optomistic

Is that a Freudian slip or a typical remainers way of justifying. I said half the people I know, don't use facebook.

 

I can see you are one of those that makes up things to feel better. Why don't you blame it on the Martians they influenced people to vote leave. Your post is as ridiculous as my last statement.

[DannyCarlton]

2 minutes ago, Laughing Gravy said:

Is that a Freudian slip or a typical remainers way of justifying. I said half the people I know, don't use facebook.

 

I can see you are one of those that makes up things to feel better. Why don't you blame it on the Martians they influenced people to vote leave. Your post is as ridiculous as my last statement.

Assuming that those of your friends that don't use Facebook are evenly distributed between your remainer friends and brexiteer friends my figure holds good. If they're not evenly distributed, I'd love to hear your logic as to why! 555

 

I noted that your reply in no way argued against my post, just rhetorical and personal attacks. Not unusual for Brexiteers who are unable to logically defend voting Brexit and just resort to rhetoric and insults to defend their case.

[Loiner]

 
Exactly. Which is why state organised Russian trolls targetted the Brexit referendum and why Trump has consistently insisted that UK goes down the hard Brexit route.
 
Both entities fear the EU as the most powerful

Oh my god. I did not realise that our Brexit is a fiendish plot by both USA and Russia. Have they been secret allies for very long. Come to think of it, China hasn’t condemned it much either. They must be in on it too.

[elcaro]

1 hour ago, sirwilly said:

Lets get out of the EU  as fast as possible , It was always a load of Rubbish. When we leave it will soon collapse completely I hope

Why would you hope that? What good is it to you that others fail. I wish Britain all the best when they leave and I hope they succeed.

[bristolboy]

2 hours ago, Laughing Gravy said:

I have to disagree totally on this. Half the people I know don't use facebook, so that theory is blown out the water.

 

 

Because you are the standard by which all things are measured?

[bristolboy]

7 hours ago, Somtamnication said:

Typical bully; threaten and threaten, then one stands up to them and they run with their tail between their legs. God Save The Queen!

Do you mean it's the EU that is running away? They've stood very firm from the start about what was negotiable and what wasn't? Exactly how are they running away?

[DannyCarlton]

1 minute ago, bristolboy said:

Because you are the standard by which all things are measured?

Apparently. Every brexiteer (all 17.3 million of them) share the same hopes, dreams, motives, and raison d'etre as he does. Only half of them use Facebook though. Frightening innit?

[Laughing Gravy]

49 minutes ago, DannyCarlton said:

I noted that your reply in no way argued against my post, just rhetorical and personal attacks

Your argument was built on a lie, so whats the point of arguing on something I didn't say. I didn't say 50% of Brexiteers. You did.

 

50 minutes ago, DannyCarlton said:

distributed between your remainer friends and brexiteer friends my figure holds good

I don't have any remainer friends.

 

51 minutes ago, DannyCarlton said:

I noted that your reply in no way argued against my post, just rhetorical and personal attacks. Not unusual for Brexiteers who are unable to logically defend voting Brexit and just resort to rhetoric and insults to defend their case.

Personal attacks. JHC. I said do you make things up to feel better. Don't be calling the police saying It is a hate crime. Talk about sensitive. You should join the poster ST. He gets offended when people disagree with him.

[bristolboy]

6 hours ago, DoctorG said:

If the EU wasn't worried about the UK leaving they would not be making such a noise about it.

Unlike Brexiters, the EU has never denied that the UK's departure would hurt. They just point out the arithmetically obvious case that it would hurt the UK worse.

[bristolboy]

5 hours ago, JonnyF said:

The EU needs to grow up and come back to the table. The surrender treaty agreed with Remainer May is completely one sided, has been rejected 3 times and is dead as a dodo.

 

So do they want a sensible deal negotiated in good faith that benefits BOTH sides are are they going to carry on with this childish, mafioso "We'll kneecap you for leaving" <deleted>? In 2016 I was a Leaver but with a somewhat heavy heart, my opinion was divided and probably 60% of me wanted to leave and 40% remain. 3 years later having studied the EU much more closely and seen the way they conduct themselves in painful detail I can't wait to leave their corrupt, protectionist racket with as hard a Brexit as possible. Their mask has really slipped, what an eye opener.

The evil EU? If there's no agreement it will treat the UK as it would any other country with which it has no agreements. Brutal!!!

[Bullie]

6 hours ago, DoctorG said:

If the EU wasn't worried about the UK leaving they would not be making such a noise about it.

Most of the oinking is coming from across the North-sea, as we Dutch call it. EU is keeping rather quiet about it.

[bristolboy]

2 hours ago, Laughing Gravy said:

Well done the Dutch. Most in the UK want the same. 

I am sure the UK will sell Fish to the Dutch from UK waters at a sensible price.????

And that's the only waters the UK will be allowed to fish. So as long as those migrating fish only enter the UK's waters and never leave them, the UK is sitting pretty.

Edited August 20, 2019 by bristolboy

[vogie]

3 minutes ago, Bullie said:

Most of the oinking is coming from across the North-sea, as we Dutch call it. EU is keeping rather quiet about it.

Of course the EU are being rather quiet about it, they don't have to do anything, our remainers are doing their work for them and ruining the chances of the UK getting a fair deal, they must be laughing tin hats.

[DannyCarlton]

17 minutes ago, Laughing Gravy said:

Your argument was built on a lie, so whats the point of arguing on something I didn't say. I didn't say 50% of Brexiteers. You did.

 

I don't have any remainer friends.

 

Personal attacks. JHC. I said do you make things up to feel better. Don't be calling the police saying It is a hate crime. Talk about sensitive. You should join the poster ST. He gets offended when people disagree with him.

You said 50% of your friends which, by your own admission, are all Brexiteers. So 50% of Brexiteers is a fair extrapolation going by your experience.

 

You dismissed my post on the grounds that 50% of your friends don't use Facebook so, obviously you made the same extrapolation.

 

I'm not upset by your use of personal attacks and retoric to replace reasoned logic in the discussion. You're a Brexiteer, I would expect no less of you.

 

Sad that you don't have any remainer friends, most of my friends are Brexiteers. Not a problem for me as we leave this topic at the door when we go for a few jars in Wetherspoons.

 

 

Edited August 20, 2019 by DannyCarlton

[Bullie]

3 hours ago, Moti24 said:

During WW2, Britain amassed a debt of billions of dollars, liberating those who now are bent on destroying a once prosperous nation.  Taking into account the rebuilding, by the mid-sixties, Britain were heading for bankruptcy.  By 1969, the only option was to join the EU, to ensure more economic stability.  And so, on the 1st of January, 1973,  Britain became part of the EU.  Since that time, the EU have been screwing Britain for every last drop of blood, for no other reason than to support the weaker countries; Britain, being one of the highest contributors, can no longer sustain a support role for those countries that seem unable to help themselves, and not before time, are calling it a day. 

 

It seems that Merkel and Macron are running the show, although how the German Chancellor and a washed-up politician who can't keep the population of his own country under control are allowed to dictate such terms, I don't know.  One thing for sure, the EU will make it as hard as possible for Britain to leave, as a warning to any other country having similar ideas.

 

Most of the EU countries appear to have short memories.  The demise of the EU will not be too far off once Britain leaves, and those countries with "similar ideas" won't be too far behind. 

I think it is your memory that is short, Sir. Britain amassed gigantic debts because it had to lend money from the UsA to defend itself against an powerful enemy, which certainly would have devoured it were it not for the help of the UsA and Russia. And incidentally: my country was liberated by Canadians, and most of the rest by the Americans and Russia. In spite of this debt In 1950 Britain was 30 % ahead economically over the 6 founding states of the EU. Through a lack of technological renewal Britain got behind, where others forged ahead in Europe through hard work, technical innovations (wirtschaftswunder) and perseverance. Travelling through England it often still feels like its the 1950-ties.

The Netherlands, for instance, is a greater contributor to Europe financially than the UK per capita, but you won't hear us complain: we are still the 4th wealthiest nation on earth whereas you lot come in as no. 10. We don't mind chipping in for the greater good.

You no longer rule the waves, and the EU does NOT " make it as hard as possible" for you to leave, but Ireland is no longer a British dominion, and a border is a border. You are the ones playing hardball, and will have to suffer the brunt of the consequences.

Edited August 20, 2019 by Bullie

[roobaa01]

only eu scaremongering by useless bureaucrats like alcoholic junckers or hapless uschi von der leyen. this week donald of trump and boris uk trump will announce most likely the compensating trade deal usa and uk. thereto they will kick the faces of lame duck merkel and mummy snatcher macron at the g7 summit, that will be fun.

 

wbr

roobaa01

[luckyluke]

The U.K. will soon be independent, and have its own proper idendity. 

 

Something the majority of the voters have voted for. 

 

Next step will be to have its own language. 

 

According to some sources (Wikipedia) 45% of all English words have a French origin. 

 

Certainly for the hard core of the Brexiters (and maybe many others) it is inadmissible that French ( and by extension France) will still be that important/influential in the daily life of every British. 

[Forethat]

3 minutes ago, Bullie said:

I think it is your memory that is short, Sir. Britain amassed gigantic debts because it had to lend money from the UsA to defend itself against an powerful enemy, which certainly would have devoured it were it not for the help of the UsA and Russia. And incidentally: my country was liberated by Canadians, and most of the rest by the Americans and Russia. In spite of this debt In 1950 Britain was 30 % ahead economically over the 6 founding states of the EU. Through a lack of technological renewal Britain got behind, where others forged ahead in Europe through hard work, technical innovations (wirtschaftswunder) and perseverance.

The Netherlands, for instance, is a greater contributor to Europe financially than the UK per capita, but you won't hear us complain: we are still the 4th wealthiest nation on earth whereas you lot come in as no. 10.

You no longer rule the waves, and we do NOT " make it as hard as possible" for you to leave, but Ireland is no longer a British dominion, and a border is a border. You are the ones playing hardball, and will have to suffer the brunt of the consequences.

I don't agree with your view that UK is "playing hardball". Reading such statement makes me believe you don't fully understand the proposed Brexit agreement. Quite frankly, the content is shocking. We're not the ones "playing hardball".

[Forethat]

1 minute ago, luckyluke said:

The U.K. will soon be independent, and have its own proper idendity. 

 

Something the majority of the voters have voted for. 

 

Next step will be to have its own language. 

 

According to some sources (Wikipedia) 45% of all English words have a French origin. 

 

Certainly for the hard core of the Brexiters (and maybe many others) it is inadmissible that French ( and by extension France) will still be that important/influential in the daily life of every British. 

I travel to Japan on a regular basis. The Japanese word for ice-cream is "aisu kurimu". I don't think they have any problems using that word, despite being incredibly patriotic; and we certainly haven't formed a federation with Japan. The same goes for British people, we can use the word "salad" without any issues or federation with France and the rest of EU.