Financial requirements for UK settlment visa

[Batty]

After 17 years full time in Thailand, I have completley had enough and miss the UK, the wife and I want to move back there (as per another post I made recently) but after reading the 79 page financial requirement document I think my chances might be slim at best.  I was hoping some of you might be able to confirm my gut feeling for me.

 

The problem is last years earnings.  I actually had a good year and easily made more than the reuired amount but the issue, as is more common than you might think in this day and age, is proving it.  I guess you could say I am in digital nomad no-mans land, remotley managing a self employed style online business (which has no relation to either the UK or Thailand) with no official company registered and little in the way of a paper trail.  I can prove regular monthly funding transfers to my bank (a bank outside of both Thailand and the UK) and regular payments to my supplier in Germany, with the difference being my profit - but thats all I can prove.  Payments in from the same source, payments out to the same supplier, with, as I said, the difference being profit.  I can provide invoicing to my customers and from my supplier, and thats all.  

 

My savings are not enough - only around 25K GBP tucked away, although 6 months ago that was only around 18K.  I could sell my car (planned to anyway if moving back) which would bring in another 20K GBP but that would not count as it hasnt been in the bank for 6 months.

 

Me and the wife have a house in Thailand, although that is in her name and either way wouldnt count towards anything so moot point.  I want to keep the house so we have a base to return to if it failed back there so I wont be selling it.

 

I dont think I am a suitable candidate as a sponsor I guess?  

 

My only option as far as I can muster is to move back there alone, establish myself and establish provable paper trail, then apply further down the line.  I worry that by applying now and failing, it might affect our chances of securing a visit visa this summer if I decided to stay here and we both went back there for a holiday.  We have been back to the UK three times over the last 5 years and so I am confident we will be ok to get another visit visa if we want to, I dont want to jeopordize that in any way because worse ways on, we always know we can look forward to a few weeks holiday there once or twice a year.

 

I think my gut feeling on this is probably correct - a slim chance?

 

 

[UKresonant]

It's a difficult read for the financial requirements!

eg.

1. 11. In respect of cash savings the following must be provided:
   1. (a) personal bank statements showing that at least the level of cash savings relied upon in the application has been held in an account(s) in the name of the person or of the person and their partner jointly throughout the period of 6 months prior to the date of application.
   2. (b) A declaration by the account holder(s) of the source(s) of the cash savings.
2. 11A. In respect of cash savings:
   1. (a) The savings may be held in any form of bank/savings account (whether a current, deposit or investment account, provided by a financial institution regulated by the appropriate regulatory body for the country in which that institution is operating), provided that the account allows the savings to be accessed immediately (with or without a penalty for withdrawing funds without notice). This can include savings held in a pension savings account which can be immediately withdrawn.
   2. (b) Paid out competition winnings or a legacy which has been paid can contribute to cash savings.
   3. (c) Funds held as cash savings by the applicant, their partner or both jointly at the date of application can have been transferred from investments, stocks, shares, bonds or trust funds within the period of 6 months prior to the date of application, provided that:
      1. (i) The funds have been in the ownership and under the control of the applicant, their partner or both jointly for at least the period of 6 months prior to the date of application.
      2. (ii) The ownership of the funds in the form of investments, stocks, shares, bonds or trust funds; the cash value of the funds in that form at or before the beginning of the period of 6 months prior to the date of application; and the transfer of the funds into cash, are evidenced by a portfolio report or other relevant documentation from a financial institution regulated by the appropriate regulatory body for the country in which that institution is operating.
      3. (iii) The requirements of this Appendix in respect of the cash savings held at the date of application are met, except that the period of 6 months prior to the date of application in paragraph 11(a) will be reduced by the amount of that period in which the relevant funds were held in the form of investments, stocks, shares, bonds or trust funds.
      4. (iv) For the purposes of sub-paragraph 11A(c), “investments” includes funds held in an investment account or pension account or fund which does not meet the requirements of paragraphs 11 and 11A(a).

https://www.gov.uk/guidance/immigration-rules/immigration-rules-appendix-fm-se-family-members-specified-evidence

https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/826340/Appendix-FM-1-7-Financial-Requirement-ext_1.pdf

 

At least you have... 

a starter of £18k 18-16=2k divided by 2.5= £800!

going upto 25k 25-16=9k divided by 2.5= £3600...

So £15k of income that could be combined, still to establish, 

Any other savings in Thailand that could be used?

The car would generate another 20k so that would be (£8000) take it down to £7k income to establish.

Have you got any pension plans and your over 55, which could give you instant access to £17.5k tax free cash?

• 6 months is a long time if your waiting, but seems to fly past if your not!

Will your wife be sub-letting the house whilst your both gone? etc

 

(After reading that again, I'm hoping that 3c iv, may mean they would perhaps accept the value can be remain in a pension savings account in cash, after switching from investments to cash. so there is no need to transfer out to a bank account. As it can be instant access if over 55.....???

I'm just reading to try to be compliant, until the State Pension starts in about 10 years time, as a contingency option, should the subject arise,  in the distant future ????~)

Edited January 27, 2020 by UKresonant

[Johan2]

Downside of tax avoidance minimisation.

[Batty]

13 minutes ago, Johan2 said:

Downside of tax avoidance minimisation.

Upsides are pretty huge though.  And totaly legal.

 

Go preach to Amazon, Starbucks, Google instead of the little guy who paid UK taxes for 12 years while living on the other side of the world full time ????

[Johan2]

If you paid UK taxes then there wouldn't be a thread as you would have a paper trail. As for the larger parasites; doesn't make it right for the minor ones.

[UKresonant]

I was reading through the requirements again, and spotted something I had not taken in 

 

5.1.5 ....

 

....

• The gross amount of any specified non-employment income received by the applicant’s partner, the applicant or both jointly in the 12 months prior to the application, provided they continue to own any asset on which that income was based (e.g. property, shares) at the date of application;                                                                                                                         That's taken most of my concerns away ????

After reading through again, I think it may come down to;if and how you have defined your income element in your account(s), do you have a separate account for your income. If it's just all the trading and personal transactions just lumped together, you may struggle with that element. The devil will be in the detail...

 

4 hours ago, Johan2 said:

If you paid UK taxes then there wouldn't be a thread as you would have a paper trail. As for the larger parasites; doesn't make it right for the minor ones.

But if the income is not derived from the UK, can't really see your point, except that it would be convenient for the application.

(I pay all due taxes on UK derived income, and quite happy to do so)

I think the comparison with entities that derive income, but may not pay tax at a comparable proportional rate to the struggling high street vendors in the UK, does not seem to fit.

Perhaps you may imply that folk should all return to origin, if that is in the UK, since we are adversely affecting the UK balance of payments, whilst in Thailand continuously, using UK derived income. I would not think we want to go into that debate ????. I think the OP is now moving to contribute to the UK balance of payments, give him a medal. 

Anyway how can we help the OP? Anything positive to add, as the subject is of interest?

Edited January 27, 2020 by UKresonant

[Elad]

Hi Batty

Just a thought, what about doing a 2 year visit visa for your wife. That way your wife can spend six months per year in the UK with you, and it gives you 2 years to find a job that will meet the financial requirements for settlement.

[Batty]

20 hours ago, Johan2 said:

If you paid UK taxes then there wouldn't be a thread as you would have a paper trail. As for the larger parasites; doesn't make it right for the minor ones.

Johan lighten up a little - no need to jump on the thread and be all holier than thou. It just makes you look mean spirited and bitter. And your missing the point - I paid UK taxes untill deemed domicile a few years back, and then stopped. Perfectly legal and nothing imoral about it, although I am certain you would question the morality of it you seem like the sort of chap to do that. So, you know, jog on pal and find another thread to infest with your doom and gloom. Like a true parasite would ????

 

 

 

 

[Batty]

11 hours ago, Elad said:

Hi Batty

Just a thought, what about doing a 2 year visit visa for your wife. That way your wife can spend six months per year in the UK with you, and it gives you 2 years to find a job that will meet the financial requirements for settlement.

Thats actually a smashing idea the more I think about it. Would ease her in to UK life also, wean her off Thailand a little as apose to one big hit of settlement. Thanks Elad, not a bad idea that.

[Batty]

16 hours ago, UKresonant said:

I was reading through the requirements again, and spotted something I had not taken in 

 

5.1.5 ....

 

....

• The gross amount of any specified non-employment income received by the applicant’s partner, the applicant or both jointly in the 12 months prior to the application, provided they continue to own any asset on which that income was based (e.g. property, shares) at the date of application;                                                                                                                         That's taken most of my concerns away ????

After reading through again, I think it may come down to;if and how you have defined your income element in your account(s), do you have a separate account for your income. If it's just all the trading and personal transactions just lumped together, you may struggle with that element. The devil will be in the detail...

 

But if the income is not derived from the UK, can't really see your point, except that it would be convenient for the application.

(I pay all due taxes on UK derived income, and quite happy to do so)

I think the comparison with entities that derive income, but may not pay tax at a comparable proportional rate to the struggling high street vendors in the UK, does not seem to fit.

Perhaps you may imply that folk should all return to origin, if that is in the UK, since we are adversely affecting the UK balance of payments, whilst in Thailand continuously, using UK derived income. I would not think we want to go into that debate ????. I think the OP is now moving to contribute to the UK balance of payments, give him a medal. 

Anyway how can we help the OP? Anything positive to add, as the subject is of interest?

Mate thank you so much for the detailed suggestions - will reply properly when on laptop later