We Got Thieves Last Night On Our Property

[tartempion]

We moved into our new home less than 3 months ago. We are 1km out of the village, no next neighbours, but a few houses nearby. We just recently finished building a perimeter wall: 25% streetside with the traditional thai metal frames and a gate, 50% is wired fence with a small supporting wall and 25% is 2m high wall next to a piece of land withouth a house yet. There is a strong street light not far away and we have a backyard light on at night.

We do have a dog, but it's a puppet, our previous dog being poisonned before we moved over here and the puppet is sleeping inhouse until she will be adult.

I almost happened to be alone into the wee hours last night and wonder what I should have done if that was the case, but anyway, it was not because she returned unexpectedly early from Songkran with friends in the village.

We turned off the bedroom light around 22.30, airco running and I am half deaf, so have problems hearing what's going on outside. Less than 15 minutes later the wife went to the window and said: "ssst, kamoy in baan" I was confused, because "IN" the house means inside, but half understood she ment within our perimeter wall. She took her mobile and called her parents in the nearby village and told me to keep quit.

Here I disagreed, wrong or right???

I decided to scare them away, open light and window and shout at them.

I got as far as opening the light when the wife got mad at me: "why don't you listen to me, I want them in jail, my family is coming and you scare them away!!!!!!

Seems they went off over the wall, family came over, the wife got hysteric, shouting and running around the house, some neighbours came over hearing the commotions, the village head arrived, the police arrived last.

For the rest of the night I got scolded at: she is saying "this is Thailand , you don't know thai people, thieves will kill you as a dog, why you don't listen to me etc etc.

Well I do have a problem with staying hidden in a room waiting for some help to arrive.

Then I might be wrong and maybe I should have obeyed her.

Then the vast majotity of people on this board are farangs, so it is a tricky question: what to do when you know thieves are within the perimeter of your property?

We will need to think about improving security: we did decide to add barbed wire on top of the wall, considered lights with sensors, but a dog running around will make that useless, a second dog (thinking dogs sleeping outside need company)

What were they trying to achieve? Run off with our (fairly new) motorbikes or car (always locked) How would they do that? Cut the lock of the gate and run off? Cut the fence and get out via the fields with a motorbike? Gte into the house and claim money whilst life threatening us with knives or a gun? (we hardly keep any cash in house, max 10k, but then that is still a lot of money for those who have nothing)

This in not my home country, so she has a point or two.

I do remember my home village, where thieves broke in at night at neighbours, found the keys to the car, took some paintings and jewellery and left with the car. When they woke up in the morning....

[mikethevigoman]

We moved into our new home less than 3 months ago. We are 1km out of the village, no next neighbours, but a few houses nearby. We just recently finished building a perimeter wall: 25% streetside with the traditional thai metal frames and a gate, 50% is wired fence with a small supporting wall and 25% is 2m high wall next to a piece of land withouth a house yet. There is a strong street light not far away and we have a backyard light on at night.

We do have a dog, but it's a puppet, our previous dog being poisonned before we moved over here and the puppet is sleeping inhouse until she will be adult.

I almost happened to be alone into the wee hours last night and wonder what I should have done if that was the case, but anyway, it was not because she returned unexpectedly early from Songkran with friends in the village.

We turned off the bedroom light around 22.30, airco running and I am half deaf, so have problems hearing what's going on outside. Less than 15 minutes later the wife went to the window and said: "ssst, kamoy in baan" I was confused, because "IN" the house means inside, but half understood she ment within our perimeter wall. She took her mobile and called her parents in the nearby village and told me to keep quit.

Here I disagreed, wrong or right???

I decided to scare them away, open light and window and shout at them.

I got as far as opening the light when the wife got mad at me: "why don't you listen to me, I want them in jail, my family is coming and you scare them away!!!!!!

Seems they went off over the wall, family came over, the wife got hysteric, shouting and running around the house, some neighbours came over hearing the commotions, the village head arrived, the police arrived last.

For the rest of the night I got scolded at: she is saying "this is Thailand , you don't know thai people, thieves will kill you as a dog, why you don't listen to me etc etc.

Well I do have a problem with staying hidden in a room waiting for some help to arrive.

Then I might be wrong and maybe I should have obeyed her.

Then the vast majotity of people on this board are farangs, so it is a tricky question: what to do when you know thieves are within the perimeter of your property?

We will need to think about improving security: we did decide to add barbed wire on top of the wall, considered lights with sensors, but a dog running around will make that useless, a second dog (thinking dogs sleeping outside need company)

What were they trying to achieve? Run off with our (fairly new) motorbikes or car (always locked) How would they do that? Cut the lock of the gate and run off? Cut the fence and get out via the fields with a motorbike? Gte into the house and claim money whilst life threatening us with knives or a gun? (we hardly keep any cash in house, max 10k, but then that is still a lot of money for those who have nothing)

This in not my home country, so she has a point or two.

I do remember my home village, where thieves broke in at night at neighbours, found the keys to the car, took some paintings and jewellery and left with the car. When they woke up in the morning....

Tricky one,. i like you would have made some nose, put a light on and hope they left,. if you make your house like a fortress this will send out the wrong signals i fear,. like you have a lot to protect ?. what is a lot to a thai ? 10.000 baht ! . all sorts of things could have hapened ,scary,.

[Neeranam]

Listen to your wife.

Buy a few big dogs.

Buy a gun.

Pay someone to sleep in your garden(no much).

[chicagogato]

Get a big dog and cement broken glass to the top of your wall. I've seen this at many homes in PP Cambodia. Seems to work.

[LoveDaBlues]

Get a big dog and cement broken glass to the top of your wall. I've seen this at many homes in PP Cambodia. Seems to work.

There's a few places in my village with the broken glass topping the wall. Really looks nice.

[aussiestyle1983]

Like others have said, use the broken glass, buy a few big dogs, pay someone to sleep in the garden at night, buy a gun and buy something that would let you quiclky dig a 6 ft deep whole in the back yard!

[taxexile]

i would have taken the wifes advice.

they might have been armed in some way , and / or really nasty types , you just dont know.

if you dont like the look of broken glass , then plant some spiny / thorny bushes all the way around the inside of the perimeter wall to make it hard or impossible to get over.

[Heng]

That broken glass thing robs your own children (if you have them) of the childhood pleasure of climbing walls.

You can get halogen spotlights from relatively cheap to expensive at Home Pro. Just 1 can light up an avg. yard, 3-4 for larger than avg. Wire them up so that your family can turn these on at once from each floor of your house, and perhaps from the front and the back. Don't forget to plan ahead access for bulb changing. 10 meter tall poles will require some kind of 10 meter tall access. Just under balconey railings is fairly easy to get to. If the burglars keep approaching your house with the lights on,... they aren't burglars.

Firearms as the last line of defense.... as typically burglars aren't armed here (yes, that is changing somewhat) and you can't just shoot them in your yard unless you're prepared to set up your crime scene before the cops get there (and actually many cops advise this).

Edited April 14, 2007 by Heng

[Tywais]

You can get halogen spotlights from relatively cheap to expensive at Home Pro. Just 1 can light up an avg. yard, 3-4 for larger than avg. Wire them up so that your family can turn these on at once from each floor of your house,

To add to that, I would attach them to motion detectors also (inexpensive), possibly combined with an audible alarm.

[Heng]

One's results may vary on that one. You can end up with an annoying light show if you have dogs or cats or live in areas with dense insect and/or gecko populations. Agree with the audible manual alarm though.

[Tywais]

One's results may vary on that one. You can end up with an annoying light show if you have dogs or cats or live in areas with dense insect and/or gecko populations. Agree with the audible manual alarm though.

That's true. I looked into them for use at our laboratory due to a rash of break ins stealing computers/parts. Found some nice ones that combine ultrasonic with infrared (heat) detection that can be adjusted to the environment. Filters out all the critters. Also, perhaps the addition of outdoor cctv cameras (even the fake ones can be useful as a deterrent). These are passive methods to ward off potential thieves as apposed to active ones (guns, etc.).

[mikethevigoman]

That broken glass thing robs your own children (if you have them) of the childhood pleasure of climbing walls.

You can get halogen spotlights from relatively cheap to expensive at Home Pro. Just 1 can light up an avg. yard, 3-4 for larger than avg. Wire them up so that your family can turn these on at once from each floor of your house, and perhaps from the front and the back. Don't forget to plan ahead access for bulb changing. 10 meter tall poles will require some kind of 10 meter tall access. Just under balconey railings is fairly easy to get to. If the burglars keep approaching your house with the lights on,... they aren't burglars.

Firearms as the last line of defense.... as typically burglars aren't armed here (yes, that is changing somewhat) and you can't just shoot them in your yard unless you're prepared to set up your crime scene before the cops get there (and actually many cops advise this).

if a potential robber thinks you have a gun so will he !

[ColPyat]

Firearms as the last line of defense.... as typically burglars aren't armed here (yes, that is changing somewhat) and you can't just shoot them in your yard unless you're prepared to set up your crime scene before the cops get there (and actually many cops advise this).

Very true.

To the OP:

Listen to your wife. Yes, this is Thailand, and you will never know if intruders are armed or not, so you should assume that they are. Illegal guns are very cheap, only a few thousand Baht. Living away from the village, especially as a Farang, is not the safest thing to do.

I have lived like this for two years, and i started having those problems. In the end i moved out because i neither wanted to take up the offers of locals for guns, nor was it a permanent solution of having family members staying with us for protection in a place that wasn't even our own.

My neighbors there have fired every few days their guns to show to anybody that they are armed and willing to defend themselves. This is an option which for Farang is very difficult as unless on PR you will not get gun permits. Shooting intruders may even get you a longer jail sentence than the intruders themselves would get. And i doubt that you would want to put yourself into the situation of having to shoot somebody.

Setting up a crime scene takes experience and calculation, it needs a legal gun, and an illegal gun you have to put into the hand of the dead intruder (and for this to succeed you have to kill him). And with advancing forensics here it is not as easy as it once was. Gun powder residue tests, etc. are now standard procedure.

And after you will have to deal with possible revenge attacks by his relatives.

The best solution would be, as this seems to be your property, to build a second house, and move some of your relatives there permanently. Or move out. Otherwise the attempts will not stop.

Edited April 14, 2007 by ColPyat

[tartempion]

<The best solution would be, as this seems to be your property, to build a second house, and move some of your relatives there permanently. Or move out. Otherwise the attempts will not stop.>

A second house for the aging parents is part of the plan, budget for 2008....not very happy with the thought though....

Wat you are saying is the thieves know who we are?

Then they will know the family as well, then they will know we have them as protection.

Anyway, barbed wire on top of the wall was requested a few days ago when they finished the metal fence.

A second dog will be added soon.

More ligthing will be installed next week, we are discussing what/where.

Moving OUT???

No way, I just moved IN and I like hot issaan villages.

[ColPyat]

Wat you are saying is the thieves know who we are?

Then they will know the family as well, then they will know we have them as protection.

Yes, they will know who you are, and target your house specifically.

Aging parents though, unless armed, are not much of a defense or deterrent, i fear.

I also liked very much the village i stayed in, great to life in Bangkok's vicinity, but surrounded by water and jungle. But after a while i decided that the benefits of that were offset by the constant thread of intruders targeting us. We even knew who they were.

[oooooo]

handle it the texas way

shotguns do the job

[sutnyod]

If it wasn't just some youngsters after songkran pocket-money, you are in for another attempt during the rainy season. When it rains heavily, even a guard cannot help you. You mention that only one side of your property does not have a house and that is the only side with a full wall. I find your design very reasonable: it is never good to wall oneself in, because once the perpetrators have managed to climb the wall, no neighbour can see you or what is going on in your garden. So it's actually a good thing you have half-wall half-fence on the other sides. Keep good relations to your neighbours; they will certainly do some spying for you (given you are probably the only entertainment apart from TV they have). Exchange phone numbers with them in case you have not done that yet. Good luck.

[onzestan]

Befriend the local police.

Spread the rumour that you will shoot the balls of anyone that enters your house.

Any dog you get make sure it doesn't accept food from strangers.

Have a camera with a strong flash handy.

Other than that I wouldn't make my house look like a fortress, if thieves want to get in they will, no matter what safety precautions you take, and it would be a constant reminder for you and your family that you're not safe there, which can be a real damper on your wellbeing.

Planting thorny bushes (bougainville grows very rapidly)inside the perimeter as another member suggested is also a very good idea. Worked for a friend of mine.

Goodluck to you and your family

onzestan

[larvidchr]

There was a few very nasty deaths here in Pattaya last year during home intrusions, yuo must always assume they are armed, and if it is drug addicts they do not behave in a calculated manner. So take your wifes advise, do not interfer unless it becomes a matter of life and death.

Get the sensor lights, and some audible alarm, always have a working mobile telf. in your bedroom, and most importently make your bedroom a sort of safe room, deadbolts on the bedroom door, secure the windows aso. so it will take the perps long time to break their way in to the room.

For self defence, (if you do not want a gun) get the biggest can of pepperspray you can get, they are sold everywhere here in Pattaya if you ask for it, and something like a baseballbat, these two things because you dont want to get within armsreach of the burglers so they can reach you with knifes, and peppersprayed in the eyes they cant se where they shoot/stab, the pepperspray have a reach of at least 3 yards if it is a good one.

But again make your bedroom your safe room, this will give Police/fameli extra time to come to your aid.

[goldfish]

That broken glass thing robs your own children (if you have them) of the childhood pleasure of climbing walls.

Yeah, it kinda robs a few cats of the ability to walk as well!

[Heng]

[markr]

handle it the texas way

shotguns do the job

Yes guns are great, but you need a deterent rather than the abillity to kill someone if the shit hits the fan, guns should NOT be taken lightly, without experience you will probably do more harm than good or end up getting shot yourself,

Good luck and be careful!

Ps If you do choose to get one, get some lessons on how to use it first!

Mark

[pumpuiman]

I agree that pepper spray is a good idea.

I have seen it in action, I never realized so much fluid can come from a persons face!! Absolutely incapacitating for a good ten minutes or so.

One important thing to know, I was instructed by a U.S. policeman friend...never warn your attacker of your intention/possession of the spray. Don't threaten to use it....just point and spray at the eyes and chest.

A warning allows the attacker to close his eyes and hold his breath. This could allow him to get close enough to you to do you harm.

Keep some handy in the bedroom, and the car.

Remember....don't hesitate, just spray immediately.

[Heng]

Get an extra large can of pepper spray for when there are 2-3 of them too. And if possible, see if you can get them to line up and come at you from the same direction. And don't forget to have a plan B for when the spray starts to wear off.

[blizzard]

dont you open yourself up to liability issues putting broken glass on top of your walls.......the robbers might get cut or something.

oops, thailand not same same as america.

good luck man!

[larvidchr]

Get an extra large can of pepper spray for when there are 2-3 of them too. And if possible, see if you can get them to line up and come at you from the same direction. And don't forget to have a plan B for when the spray starts to wear off.

If somebody is coming through your bedroom door they are lined up allready and you dont wait for the effect to wear of, thats why you have a baseballbat

Bring a couple of your mates and i will be happy to demonstrate how it works

seriusly pepperspray is a brilliant lawenforcement/selfdefence tool if you want to use less than lethal force.

Be safe.

[Heng]

Get an extra large can of pepper spray for when there are 2-3 of them too. And if possible, see if you can get them to line up and come at you from the same direction. And don't forget to have a plan B for when the spray starts to wear off.

If somebody is coming through your bedroom door they are lined up allready and you dont wait for the effect to wear of, thats why you have a baseballbat

Bring a couple of your mates and i will be happy to demonstrate how it works

seriusly pepperspray is a brilliant lawenforcement/selfdefence tool if you want to use less than lethal force.

Be safe.

Agree it can be effective against single attackers... but IMO less so against multiple attackers and certainly less so against those who are high or drunk. Not to mention, it also may have a multiplying factor to how angry your attacker(s) are. Also, many folks misunderstand that one should be rather accurate with spray bursts (directly to the face and eyes if possible) and that YES, your attacker can still possibly grab you, shoot you, or knife you while being sprayed. They don't just all automatically drop to ground crying for their mommies while waiting for you to baseball bat them. That was my point.

[Pink Mist]

electric fence, installed discretely and in such a way that they have to contact it.

[ColPyat]

Agree it can be effective against single attackers... but IMO less so against multiple attackers and certainly less so against those who are high or drunk. Not to mention, it also may have a multiplying factor to how angry your attacker(s) are. Also, many folks misunderstand that one should be rather accurate with spray bursts (directly to the face and eyes if possible) and that YES, your attacker can still possibly grab you, shoot you, or knife you while being sprayed. They don't just all automatically drop to ground crying for their mommies while waiting for you to baseball bat them. That was my point.

And pepperspray might very well go off in ones own face when:

1: wind direction is not observed

2: fan blowing direction is not observed

3: in closed environments fumes will affect you as well

4: as with all weapons a more skilled and determined attacker (worse with multiple attackers) can disarm one and use the weapon on the defender. And he will be a lot more pissed off than before.

Just try and see how pepperspray works on yourself. You may find out that when not directly targeted in the eye and face may leave you with burning eyes, but still a lot of freedom of movement.

All these fantasies about weapons do not take into account that real life situations are not exactly like movies, and don't automatically make one a winner especially against multiple attackers, who very possibly can be more determined and skilled. Weapons require skills and experience.

Weapons can escalate situations easily, and there are far better forms of prevention.

Such as:

Know you environment, and make risk assessments, such as:

-Understand that Thailand has a burglary problem, including and especially violent burglaries, so don't live in the sticks away from other houses, as appealing as that might sound at first.

-don't show off your wealth, especially if you are farang, who generally is not part of a complex Thai peer group system. Don't build a huge house in an area where others have no huge houses, don't have the most expensive cars when everybody else around you can' afford them.

-just try not to stick out any more than you already do as a westerner, try to adapt

-don't give people a reason to hate you, don't be stupidly generous, don't be too stingy, try to become part of the community, learn the language, the customs.

-don't just assume that every Thai who smiles at you must be a good and honest person because he's Thai and Buddhist.

Should be common sense.

[terry57]

Befriend the local police.

Spread the rumour that you will shoot the balls of anyone that enters your house.

Any dog you get make sure it doesn't accept food from strangers.

Have a camera with a strong flash handy.

Other than that I wouldn't make my house look like a fortress, if thieves want to get in they will, no matter what safety precautions you take, and it would be a constant reminder for you and your family that you're not safe there, which can be a real damper on your wellbeing.

Planting thorny bushes (bougainville grows very rapidly)inside the perimeter as another member suggested is also a very good idea. Worked for a friend of mine.

Goodluck to you and your family

onzestan

stan's got some good idea's.

it sort of takes the gloss of things when one has to barracade ones self inside there bleeding house.

i mean one comes to thailand to live a nice life and now has to worry about this bollicks.

i suppose thats the price one has to pay if he wants to live isolated away from other punters but even so, you should not have to worry about this stuff.

i was in cape town, south africa and the way people had to fortify there houses made me feel sick.

such a beautiful city ruined by the peoples fear of being robbed and at worse killed.

coming from australia we are not used to such extreme measures and i could not wait to get out of there.

anyway mate,

do whatever you have to do to survive but try not to use a gun as you could very possibly end up in the big tiger.

you after all is said and done, you are only a farang in this country and you will always be on the loosing end of the law.

pepper spray, baseball bat, 2 dogs, mobile phone and safe bedroom sounds good to me.

oh yes, being friendly with the police will also come in handy.